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Hollismason posted:I'm sorry 30 seconds of the film were dedicated to some innocuous call backs and they held with tradition of having C3P0 and R2D2 appear in the film for like 1 line. You are some salty motherfuckers.
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Dec 18, 2016 04:44
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What I'm referring to as fanservice is more in the way of bringing back lots of characters and ideas (easter eggs I guess?) so that people like me can say "Hey, it's that guy!" I kept a count of everything I saw, it's mostly spoilery: *A lingering shot on blue milk at the beginning *The two guys who accost Luke in the Mos Eisly bar are on Jedha and say the line "you better watch yourself" *CG Tarkin that says some of the same exact lines with the same delivery, "one swift stroke," "you may fiah when ready" *Kyber crystals being a thing *Chirrut and Baze being "Guardians of the Whills" or something *Forest Whitaker being a character from Clone Wars and Rebels *Saw's rebels having a dancing twi'lek hologram, and playing an analog version of space chess *Constant usage of the word "hope" to tie thematically to calling the next movie A New Hope *Obligatory C3P0 and R2D2 shot *Darth Vader having a lava castle (actually this is really cool and is from the first draft of Empire Strikes Back) *Vader choking an Imperial officer, complete with one liner *A scene where Mon Mothma tells Bail Organa to send someone to contact Obi Wan, "I would trust her with my life,"  mention of Captain Antilles*Unused footage from A New Hope of some of the X Wing pilots *A guy designated as Red Five specifically so he can die and leave the spot vacant for Luke *Vader wrecking people in a scene straight out of Star Wars Battlefront or a fan film *Captain Antilles telling someone to prep the escape pods *CG Leia Then there's the obvious normal Star Wars stuff like "I have a bad feeling about this" and all the new TIE fighter designs and whatnot. From what I can tell the movie is really popular so far with the 501st and the fans focused on ships, props, costumes, etc. Soggy Cereal fucked around with this message at 05:01 on Dec 18, 2016 |
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Dec 18, 2016 04:45
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Neurolimal posted:She doesn't really need to be some sort of specialist. Most people aren't savants. She's there because she wants to find her family (and then fulfill her father and Saw's wishes). Her speech is bad because its supposed to be bad; her and cass awkwardly shift about beforehand, she delivers it in an uncinematic way, and everyone stands there agreeing but not being fired up. If you're asserting that she's meant to be incompetent then that's a whole mother story. How is someone who is able to do parkour and climb a hundred feet in the rain and kill storm troopers in a street fight incompetent?
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Dec 18, 2016 04:47
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I thought that CGI Tarkin was better than CGI Leia. Not that the former didn't have some faults, but the latter was like a botox nightmare.
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Dec 18, 2016 04:48
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Hollismason posted:It was pretty interesting that Everyone Dies. We get to see the Rebels actually do some guerilla style poo poo. Oh and Jyn is needed because they need to get the pilot from Saw, which was made pretty clear that the Rebellion and Saw were on bad terms and they figured she was the best chance to get the information from Saw. Also, Jyn changes her mind after seeing the holo message from her father and the devastating power of the Death Star. I am convinced people are just bad at watching movies. Everyones motives are well fleshed out and shown right there in the film.
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Dec 18, 2016 04:49
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I thought all of the CG actors looked terrible, but they're going to be until we get better at it, and we won't get better at it if we don't do it. So, it's fine that it sucks.
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Dec 18, 2016 04:52
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Soggy Cereal posted:Then there's the obvious normal Star Wars stuff like "I have a bad feeling about this" What I hated about this movies use of that line was how ashamed of it they were. The comic relief character said it and was shut down in the middle. It seemed so ungenuine and gross to use that references then be self conscious about it
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Dec 18, 2016 04:53
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Waffles Inc. posted:If you're asserting that she's meant to be incompetent then that's a whole mother story. How is someone who is able to do parkour and climb a hundred feet in the rain and kill storm troopers in a street fight incompetent? She's not incompetent, she's average for someone in her position. She manages to wack some drafted soldiers with limited-visibility helmets in the head with a stick. She doesn't parkour so much as climbs a ladder once and clumsily flops against a tower of hard drives.
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Dec 18, 2016 04:54
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Waffles Inc. posted:What I hated about this movies use of that line was how ashamed of it they were. The comic relief character said it and was shut down in the middle. It seemed so ungenuine and gross to use that references then be self conscious about it Yeah it's kind of like the end of Age of Ultron where Cap is not allowed to say "Avengers Assemble." I was fine with it but I can see how it would rub you that way.
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Dec 18, 2016 04:56
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Ash1138 posted:I thought that CGI Tarkin was better than CGI Leia. Not that the former didn't have some faults, but the latter was like a botox nightmare. I thought exactly the opposite, but mainly because with CGI Leia there wasn't enough time for me to register that her face was CGI'd like Tarkin's. At first I wondered if they'd just found a really good lookalike for her. And you see her face for all of like two seconds, whereas CGI Tarkin has just enough screen time in all of his appearances for your brain to realize there's something not quite right about the way his face moves.
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Dec 18, 2016 04:56
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Cyclomatic posted:Basically, Rogue One is Disney spending two hours jerking you off with references and nods to the Star Wars universe, showing you visual images that excite you as a fan, adding little tidbits of canon to tie up little minor plot points in other related works, etc. Well it's not surprising. You know that supposedly awesome shot of the Star Destroyer coming out of the shadow of the Death Star's dish? https://youtu.be/xMX4UIrzW0E?t=50s Turns out it's anime as gently caress.
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Dec 18, 2016 04:56
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Neurolimal posted:She's not incompetent, she's average for someone in her position. She manages to wack some drafted soldiers with limited-visibility helmets in the head with a stick. She doesn't parkour so much as climbs a ladder once and clumsily flops against a tower of hard drives. Average compared to who? She certainly seems better than the average joe soldiers we see. Is it your contention that she was explicitly meant to be untalented?
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Dec 18, 2016 04:57
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Waffles Inc. posted:The rebels were doing guerilla poo poo in the OT too--half of RotJ is guerilla poo poo. Also based on what we see in the film why are Forrest Whittaker and the rebellion on bad terms? Based on what we see why would Forrest Whittaker not have given the info once he knew it was legit? I don't think the movie asks us to feel bad about them dying. That's kind of the point- they don't matter, even to us; they're just grease in the wheels. They're not the main characters in their own story. Cooler and better dressed people with royal titles and secret lineages are going to go around the galaxy, having adventures and falling in love and discovering their destinies, never thinking once of these poor dumb bastards. I can't really give a good explanation for why I like this so much better than TFA, other than that I feel like the action and the spectacle are able to redeem this more than the characters are able redeem TFA.
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Dec 18, 2016 05:00
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Waffles Inc. posted:Average compared to who? She certainly seems better than the average joe soldiers we see. Is it your contention that she was explicitly meant to be untalented? How is she better than the average soldier? We see average soldiers kill stormtroopers, and both Jyn and average soldiers bite it. The only real instance of being above average was when she said she was a promising child soldier by the age of 16.
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Dec 18, 2016 05:01
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I don't think I'd mind Leia as much if she didn't have a line and you saw her from behind. The hood over her iconic hairstyle was a perfect nod to A New Hope, and we didn't need to see her face. They'd need to find a new shot to end on, but it wouldn't be as janky looking. Tarkin never really bothered me after the initial "oh that's weird" which I guess is a testament to the level of tech they were using. I eventually bought it and just let him do his thing. I do find it funny that CGI Tarkin seems to have more screentime here than the real one did.
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Dec 18, 2016 05:02
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Hollismason posted:Hrmmm so they made a Star Wars film that made people who like Star Wars happy because they enjoy watching Star Wars. In lieu of making an inherently good movie that people who don't specifically like Star Wars would like on the merits of the movie. Yes. That is exactly what they did. If you look closely, basically nobody is saying it is lovely fan service. People are saying it is A++ out of 10 fan service, but wasn't clearly labeled as fan service, and is rather poo poo as something that isn't fan service. Title should have been Rogue One: A Star Wars Fanservicing. That way people would have known if they wanted to give Disney their money or not. Talked to my mother today, and her reaction to seeing the movie is that she felt ripped off and isn't planning to see another Star Wars movie. She has liked Star Wars since the original came out. Which is the danger of fan service. It is inherently lovely content to anyone not super invested in the minutia, making it highly polarizing content since people who care more about plot tend to upset when they tune in and get blindsided by an entire installment that is nothing but mindless titillation, and the people who get off on the minutia are a pig in poo poo and think anyone who doesn't like it must be against the thing they like (when they are really just against the lack of plot). If you are not highly invested in the Tribe of Star Wars fandom, what does the movie really offer?
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Dec 18, 2016 05:03
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Cyclomatic posted:In lieu of making an inherently good movie that people who don't specifically like Star Wars would like on the merits of the movie. Yes. That is exactly what they did. I think it's okay to make a Star Wars movie that is about Star Wars, as long as it has something interesting to say about Star Wars.
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Dec 18, 2016 05:05
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I don't think you'd find that many people who have never seen Star Wars would be invested in seeing say, Attack of the Clones.
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Dec 18, 2016 05:06
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Along those same lines is what I don't get about that last Vader scene. We've seen him massacre people before in more evil ways, even. He killed unarmed politicians and children. Why did we need a Vader as Jason scene? What does it serve?
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Dec 18, 2016 05:07
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Zero VGS posted:Be careful not to CHOKE on your aspirations.... you see what I did there? It's funny because I'm force-choking you. I have literally no idea what you're talking about. Was it in a higher frame rate than normal movies? Because I didn't notice any difference.
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Dec 18, 2016 05:12
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General Dog posted:Seems like the Rebellion would be like most real-world rebellions- a coalition of a lot of different interests and factions who are united in wanting the Empire out of power. It's probably a mix of classic Old Republic liberals, libertarians, states' rights activists, conspiracy theorists, environmental nutjobs, religious extremists, with maybe a few corporate interests secretly funding them. I also enjoyed seeing a bit more about how the sausage was made with the Alliance and basically seeing the above brought to screen.
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Dec 18, 2016 05:12
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Waffles Inc. posted:Along those same lines is what I don't get about that last Vader scene. We've seen him massacre people before in more evil ways, even. He killed unarmed politicians and children. Why did we need a Vader as Jason scene? What does it serve? That scene is the entire film in microcosm, and it serves the same purpose as the rest of the movie - to depict something already known in an exciting way.
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Dec 18, 2016 05:13
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I think it's still a good sci-fi movie, it's just that you should also see A New Hope at some point. (not unreasonable for a spinoff prequel) It still has all the same style and aesthetic of Star Wars, which is great in and of itself. It looks like the original trilogy, just with more scope. Good effects, probably the best CG people ever seen even if it's not quite undetectable. Some good cinematography as well. Some commentary on war. Some simple character archetypes (blind monk, sarcastic robot, conflicted spy, ambitious officer) that are easy to latch onto for a casual viewer.
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Dec 18, 2016 05:13
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Waffles Inc. posted:Along those same lines is what I don't get about that last Vader scene. We've seen him massacre people before in more evil ways, even. He killed unarmed politicians and children. Why did we need a Vader as Jason scene? What does it serve? Basically everything after the nuke goes off is a coda, you could roll the credits over it. It's there because it's fun. As a coda to a story that's already ended, I like it.
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Dec 18, 2016 05:14
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Waffles Inc. posted:Along those same lines is what I don't get about that last Vader scene. We've seen him massacre people before in more evil ways, even. He killed unarmed politicians and children. Why did we need a Vader as Jason scene? What does it serve? A lot of people (including Obi-wan Kenobi!) don't really consider Anakin Skywalker and in-suit Darth Vader the same.
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Dec 18, 2016 05:16
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ImpAtom posted:A lot of people (including Obi-wan Kenobi!) don't really consider Anakin Skywalker and in-suit Darth Vader the same. Is he not Vader from the moment he is dubbed by the emperor to be Vader? Genuinely asking--is Non Suit Vader different from Suit Vader? And if they are distinct and this was an attempt at seeing Vader perform a massacre, why is that important?
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Dec 18, 2016 05:21
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Waffles Inc. posted:Is he not Vader from the moment he is dubbed by the emperor to be Vader? Genuinely asking--is Non Suit Vader different from Suit Vader? It's a reminder that however many Death Stars the good guys identify and destory, the battle for the galaxy is always going to be a spiritual battle. "For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the powers, against the world forces of this darkness, against the spiritual forces of wickedness in the heavenly places." "The ability to destroy a planet is insignificant compared to the power of the Force.
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Dec 18, 2016 05:24
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Waffles Inc. posted:Is he not Vader from the moment he is dubbed by the emperor to be Vader? Genuinely asking--is Non Suit Vader different from Suit Vader? Darth Vader, in a lot of people's minds, is the suit and the series backs this up. He is technically always Anakin Skywalker but Episode 3 ends with 'the birth of Darth Vader" (i.e: the suit) and RotJ has the helmet removed to show his return to being Anakin Skywalker instead of Darth Vader. It is of course purely symbolic but when you say Darth Vader people think of the imposing black suit and when they say Anakin Skywalker they think of the curly-haired guy and despite the fact they are the same person the films do a lot to treat them as 'different.' Waffles Inc. posted:And if they are distinct and this was an attempt at seeing Vader perform a massacre, why is that important? Honestly, it's purely the fact that suit-Vader has never done that onscreen outside of cartoons and stuff and fans have wanted to see it. It's probably unnecessary from anything but the perspective of pleasing the fans. (But so is a lot of Rogue One.)
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Dec 18, 2016 05:24
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General Dog posted:I don't think the movie asks us to feel bad about them dying. That's kind of the point- they don't matter, even to us; they're just grease in the wheels. They're not the main characters in their own story. Cooler and better dressed people with royal titles and secret lineages are going to go around the galaxy, having adventures and falling in love and discovering their destinies, never thinking once of these poor dumb bastards. Yes, just what a movie needs, characters you don't care about.
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Dec 18, 2016 05:25
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Waffles Inc. posted:Is he not Vader from the moment he is dubbed by the emperor to be Vader? Genuinely asking--is Non Suit Vader different from Suit Vader? You ask a lot of inane questions. Here are some more for you. Does Vader go through any traumatic experiences between being named Vader and being put in the suit? Is Vader a threatening figure when he shows up on the Tantive IV at the beginning of ANH? Is it useful to portray Vader as threatening at the end of this film? Are there any stakes involved in the stealing of the Death Star plans?
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Dec 18, 2016 05:27
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Magic Hate Ball posted:Yes, just what a movie needs, characters you don't care about. A movie doesn't need anything specifically
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Dec 18, 2016 05:27
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ImpAtom posted:Darth Vader, in a lot of people's minds, is the suit and the series backs this up. He is technically always Anakin Skywalker but Episode 3 ends with 'the birth of Darth Vader" (i.e: the suit) and RotJ has the helmet removed to show his return to being Anakin Skywalker instead of Darth Vader. So you're saying it's a worthwhile scene because it's a depiction of suit Vader murdering people and that was needed in this series?
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Dec 18, 2016 05:27
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Zero VGS posted:
You have mentioned this a few times and no one has responded. Are you being serious? It was a normal movie. I am 99% sure it was not running at 40 fps or whatever the hobbit was doing. I saw it twice and it looked fine both times. Maybe go to a different movie theater since yours seems to have a screen they bought from best buy and left the display settings on.
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Dec 18, 2016 05:28
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Magic Hate Ball posted:Yes, just what a movie needs, characters you don't care about. It's the fact that you dont need to care about them that makes you care about them. They're either average grunts or shady scumbags, they know this but still willingly die for a greater good. Even Donnie is just a more active and less spiritually powerful Ben.
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Dec 18, 2016 05:29
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Waffles Inc. posted:So you're saying it's a worthwhile scene because it's a depiction of suit Vader murdering people and that was needed in this series? A worthwhile scene in the context of this film? No, but this film has a lot of basically time-wasting scenes. A worthwhile scene in the context of what this film wants to be which is a "EU"-style sop to Star Wars fans filled with injokes and references made to clarify a small bit of minutia? Yeah, it's a good fit.
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Dec 18, 2016 05:29
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Neurolimal posted:It's the fact that you dont need to care about them that makes you care about them. They're either average grunts or shady scumbags, they know this but still willingly die for a greater good. Even Donnie is just a more active and less spiritually powerful Ben. I don't give a poo poo about them not because they're not royalty or high-ranking officials, but because they're hideously boring characters. If they were interesting characters I would have enjoyed the movie, but they're not, they're bland. There's a thousand great movies about average grunts and shady scumbags, Jyn and Cassian were dull cogs.
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Dec 18, 2016 05:34
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It's showing the bad evil lord as threatening in a way which underscores the value of the plans he is pursuing and which the characters just went through to get them. It's reflective of the whole final battle in that the rebels suffered heavy losses and only just succeeded in their goal in the face of a powerful Empire. In the context of the series, again it shows the power and ruthlessness of Vader and how much stronger the Empire is than the rebels and the odds they will have to overcome. It's not complicated really, and it's baffling to think it would be out of context.
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Dec 18, 2016 05:35
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Magic Hate Ball posted:I don't give a poo poo about them not because they're not royalty or high-ranking officials, but because they're hideously boring characters. If they were interesting characters I would have enjoyed the movie, but they're not, they're bland. There's a thousand great movies about average grunts and shady scumbags, Jyn and Cassian were dull cogs. They're not the entirety of the team though, which is very much an ensemble. Don't tell me you didn't love K2 and Donnie or I will blind myself and sense the truth within your heart
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Dec 18, 2016 05:39
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Magic Hate Ball posted:Yes, just what a movie needs, characters you don't care about. I didn't really care if any of them lived or died, but I was interested in whether they'd complete their mission and how they'd do it, and I found the resolution of that to be satisfying. If it didn't work for you on either level that's fine, but it's not like there's only one way for a movie to be engaging. Character's don't really have to grow, it's not the only mode of storytelling. Sometimes if they're just people you don't mind spending time with that's enough. General Dog fucked around with this message at 05:44 on Dec 18, 2016 |
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Dec 18, 2016 05:42
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If I'd known it was gonna be Wookiepedia Footnote: The Movie, I would've watched it in a different way.Neurolimal posted:They're not the entirety of the team though, which is very much an ensemble. Don't tell me you didn't love K2 and Donnie or I will blind myself and sense the truth within your heart Donnie Yen and his monk pal were the best characters in the movie, absolutely ("are you kidding!?"). K2 was okay but it felt like he had a more solid character arc that got cut out, and all we saw were the quips.
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Dec 18, 2016 05:43
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