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paternity suitor
Aug 2, 2016

KetTarma posted:

We have "Wiring Engineer" as both a title and an entire department where I work. Probably 60% of electrical engineers where I work are titled as wiring engineers.

Where do you work?

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KetTarma
Jul 25, 2003

Suffer not the lobbyist to live.

paternity suitor posted:

Where do you work?

Aerospace manufacturing

Watermelon Daiquiri
Jul 10, 2010
I TRIED TO BAIT THE TXPOL THREAD WITH THE WORLD'S WORST POSSIBLE TAKE AND ALL I GOT WAS THIS STUPID AVATAR.

CarForumPoster posted:

If they're long they can become antennas and theres always the risk for snags on installation and maintenance...but once you qual a CCA don't gently caress with it. That's like aerospace 101.

Yeah, that's under the 'EM' umbrella lol. I guess I was assuming 'boards' meant something a bit smaller than the SMUs we have in our test heads and testers-- definitely larger than an arduino, but not much larger than a mini-itx mobo or something like that with maybe ~6-8cm tops of length. If I still had that neato antenna modelling program (4 something?) I found a couple years ago I'd try to model it for shits and giggles, but that was lost with my old xp vm.

ch3cooh
Jun 26, 2006

Any of y'all work in process automation and PI controller tuning? I'm trying to optimize the use of automatic driller and trying to understand why it won't work the way I want it to.

Edit: OK more details now that I have some time. The automatic driller on the rig that I supervise has four parameters that it controls. They are Rate of Penetration (ROP), Weight on Bit (WOB), Rotary Torque, and On Bottom vs. Off Bottom Pressure Differential (DIFF). It uses these parameters to control the speed of the drawworks (essentially ROP). WOB, Torque, and DIFF also have gain values that can be adjusted. The problem I am running into is that when the system is limited by the ROP setpoint, the other 3 parameters are not stable causing downhole vibrations that damage the bit and other tools. Ideally I want the system to be WOB limited, but it is not possible to disable the ROP limiter.

So I figured we could functionally turn the ROP limiter off by setting it to such a high value that it would never be the controlling loop. This worked well, for a while. This is what it looked like when we were drilling in a consistent formation. Things were stable and downhole vibrations were relatively low.


But then we would drill into something softer and things would go a bit haywire. WOB would decrease rapidly so the drum would speed up, but then the WOB would start to increase and overshoot the limiter. So the drum would stop turning, causing a large decrease in WOB, so the drum would speed up...


These large fluctuations in WOB also damage bits pretty quickly. We tried low gain settings and high gain settings. We also tried lowering the WOB set point to try to catch the drum before it sped up too much. But even then it would overshoot and get into the same cycle.

Do any of you folks have suggestions on if we can do something with the gain values to try to minimize this?

ch3cooh fucked around with this message at 21:52 on Jan 8, 2017

CarForumPoster
Jun 26, 2013

⚡POWER⚡

ch3cooh posted:

Any of y'all work in process automation and PI controller tuning? I'm trying to optimize the use of automatic driller and trying to understand why it won't work the way I want it to.

Edit: OK more details now that I have some time. The automatic driller on the rig that I supervise has four parameters that it controls. They are Rate of Penetration (ROP), Weight on Bit (WOB), Rotary Torque, and On Bottom vs. Off Bottom Pressure Differential (DIFF). It uses these parameters to control the speed of the drawworks (essentially ROP). WOB, Torque, and DIFF also have gain values that can be adjusted. The problem I am running into is that when the system is limited by the ROP setpoint, the other 3 parameters are not stable causing downhole vibrations that damage the bit and other tools. Ideally I want the system to be WOB limited, but it is not possible to disable the ROP limiter.

So I figured we could functionally turn the ROP limiter off by setting it to such a high value that it would never be the controlling loop. This worked well, for a while. This is what it looked like when we were drilling in a consistent formation. Things were stable and downhole vibrations were relatively low.


But then we would drill into something softer and things would go a bit haywire. WOB would decrease rapidly so the drum would speed up, but then the WOB would start to increase and overshoot the limiter. So the drum would stop turning, causing a large decrease in WOB, so the drum would speed up...


These large fluctuations in WOB also damage bits pretty quickly. We tried low gain settings and high gain settings. We also tried lowering the WOB set point to try to catch the drum before it sped up too much. But even then it would overshoot and get into the same cycle.

Do any of you folks have suggestions on if we can do something with the gain values to try to minimize this?

I dont work in that field but I did work in manufacturing. If the values can be changed fairly easily and starting/stopping doesnt hugely affect parameters: Run a Design of Experiments (probably response surface method) of parameters, punch the values into JMP (or minitab or whatever) and run the optimum values based on the parameter weights and difficulty of changes you set. If you arent sure how to do this, JMP has really good videos. (I dont work for JMP but their videos taught me DOE 101 and it let me make a lot of data driven process decisions with otherwise noisy data.)

Watermelon Daiquiri
Jul 10, 2010
I TRIED TO BAIT THE TXPOL THREAD WITH THE WORLD'S WORST POSSIBLE TAKE AND ALL I GOT WAS THIS STUPID AVATAR.
I heartily second jmp-- I even used my still current student status to buy a one year sub to it for ~40 bucks to use on my own ends :P

CarForumPoster
Jun 26, 2013

⚡POWER⚡

Watermelon Daiquiri posted:

I heartily second jmp-- I even used my still current student status to buy a one year sub to it for ~40 bucks to use on my own ends :P

Thats a pretty sweet deal. Its just so easy to use. As long as you know basic domains of the problem you're trying to solve, which is looks like you do from your post, a DOE is a way to solve this problem quickly without actually understanding it that well until it is over. (aka every DOE in manufacturing)

illcendiary
Dec 4, 2005

Damn, this is good coffee.

ch3cooh posted:

Any of y'all work in process automation and PI controller tuning? I'm trying to optimize the use of automatic driller and trying to understand why it won't work the way I want it to.

Edit: OK more details now that I have some time. The automatic driller on the rig that I supervise has four parameters that it controls. They are Rate of Penetration (ROP), Weight on Bit (WOB), Rotary Torque, and On Bottom vs. Off Bottom Pressure Differential (DIFF). It uses these parameters to control the speed of the drawworks (essentially ROP). WOB, Torque, and DIFF also have gain values that can be adjusted. The problem I am running into is that when the system is limited by the ROP setpoint, the other 3 parameters are not stable causing downhole vibrations that damage the bit and other tools. Ideally I want the system to be WOB limited, but it is not possible to disable the ROP limiter.

So I figured we could functionally turn the ROP limiter off by setting it to such a high value that it would never be the controlling loop. This worked well, for a while. This is what it looked like when we were drilling in a consistent formation. Things were stable and downhole vibrations were relatively low.


But then we would drill into something softer and things would go a bit haywire. WOB would decrease rapidly so the drum would speed up, but then the WOB would start to increase and overshoot the limiter. So the drum would stop turning, causing a large decrease in WOB, so the drum would speed up...


These large fluctuations in WOB also damage bits pretty quickly. We tried low gain settings and high gain settings. We also tried lowering the WOB set point to try to catch the drum before it sped up too much. But even then it would overshoot and get into the same cycle.

Do any of you folks have suggestions on if we can do something with the gain values to try to minimize this?

I don't have anything in terms of suggestions but boy does this bring back some memories (being a former bit designer). Was a lot of fun getting yelled at in the company man's trailer for our allegedly crappy designs, then getting the Pason data and seeing the crap that the autodriller was putting the bits through.

GCValentine
Oct 25, 2007
Important Event
Hey engineer thread, I was wondering if you guys have any advice for a former physicist turned unemployed graduate attempting to get an engineering job. I have been looking for a while now with spotty luck.

As far as my background, I have a master of science in physics with a few years experience running a research project primarily under my own direction. I was an experimental researcher doing work in semiconductor process design/materials science. Practical skills include vacuum systems, thin film depositions, lots of metrology techniques, and a fair amount of programming experience for someone not doing computational physics. Now that academia has finally gotten moving I will have 2 papers published as a primary author so hopefully adding those to my resume will help a bit.

Notably I have never done an internship with an engineering company, just research internships. Is this something that recruiters will just eliminate you right away for? Does anyone have experience attempting to get an off-season internship?

Watermelon Daiquiri
Jul 10, 2010
I TRIED TO BAIT THE TXPOL THREAD WITH THE WORLD'S WORST POSSIBLE TAKE AND ALL I GOT WAS THIS STUPID AVATAR.
Do you live near any semiconductor fabs?

Pryor on Fire
May 14, 2013

they don't know all alien abduction experiences can be explained by people thinking saving private ryan was a documentary

Watermelon Daiquiri posted:

Do you live near any semiconductor fabs?

BFC quote of the year 2017 we got that out of the way quick amazing year chaps this future owns

GCValentine
Oct 25, 2007
Important Event

Watermelon Daiquiri posted:

Do you live near any semiconductor fabs?

There are a couple, and also a few places doing very closely related work. One of the IC fabs scheduled me for an on site interview and then canceled while the other has not had any postings for engineers.

One of the closely related companies has had me in for two interviews at this point, and possibly another interview soon, but I think they prefer to hire their interns.

Watermelon Daiquiri
Jul 10, 2010
I TRIED TO BAIT THE TXPOL THREAD WITH THE WORLD'S WORST POSSIBLE TAKE AND ALL I GOT WAS THIS STUPID AVATAR.

GCValentine posted:

There are a couple, and also a few places doing very closely related work. One of the IC fabs scheduled me for an on site interview and then canceled while the other has not had any postings for engineers.

One of the closely related companies has had me in for two interviews at this point, and possibly another interview soon, but I think they prefer to hire their interns.

Yeah, a lot of places do. Most if not all in fact (in pretty much every industry for that matter), but they still have no issue looking at other things. Getting an 'offseason' internship will be difficult since places generally just stick to college schedules. Have you looked at co-op positions?



Pryor on Fire posted:

BFC quote of the year 2017 we got that out of the way quick amazing year chaps this future owns

I was asking because depending on which ones, I could give them advice specific to the fab... Don't be a dick.

KetTarma
Jul 25, 2003

Suffer not the lobbyist to live.

GCValentine posted:

Hey engineer thread, I was wondering if you guys have any advice for a former physicist turned unemployed graduate attempting to get an engineering job. I have been looking for a while now with spotty luck.

As far as my background, I have a master of science in physics with a few years experience running a research project primarily under my own direction. I was an experimental researcher doing work in semiconductor process design/materials science. Practical skills include vacuum systems, thin film depositions, lots of metrology techniques, and a fair amount of programming experience for someone not doing computational physics. Now that academia has finally gotten moving I will have 2 papers published as a primary author so hopefully adding those to my resume will help a bit.

Notably I have never done an internship with an engineering company, just research internships. Is this something that recruiters will just eliminate you right away for? Does anyone have experience attempting to get an off-season internship?

Why are you looking for internships if you are not a student? That'll eliminate you at most companies for internships/coops right off the bat. vvvv- same here. Engineering degree required to have the word "engineer" in your title.

KetTarma fucked around with this message at 01:19 on Jan 18, 2017

spf3million
Sep 27, 2007

hit 'em with the rhythm
I don't know anything about your industry but I'd imagine you'll have better luck getting a master's degree in the engineering discipline of your choice prior to applying for engineering jobs. I work with a bunch of chemical and mechanical engineers and while we are no smarter than the non-engineers employed here, the engineering jobs all specifically require engineering degrees for one to be considered.

GCValentine
Oct 25, 2007
Important Event

Saint Fu posted:

I don't know anything about your industry but I'd imagine you'll have better luck getting a master's degree in the engineering discipline of your choice prior to applying for engineering jobs. I work with a bunch of chemical and mechanical engineers and while we are no smarter than the non-engineers employed here, the engineering jobs all specifically require engineering degrees for one to be considered.

It sounds like that may be the case. I have been able to get back in contact with some of my recruiters now that things are gearing up again after the holidays. Does anyone have experience with entry level contract work? Pay is very low but it is for a major company, are there any standards for how someone gets moved into a regular position? I believe the position is a 6 month open-ended contract.

CarForumPoster
Jun 26, 2013

⚡POWER⚡

GCValentine posted:

Hey engineer thread, I was wondering if you guys have any advice for a former physicist turned unemployed graduate attempting to get an engineering job. I have been looking for a while now with spotty luck.

As far as my background, I have a master of science in physics with a few years experience running a research project primarily under my own direction. I was an experimental researcher doing work in semiconductor process design/materials science. Practical skills include vacuum systems, thin film depositions, lots of metrology techniques, and a fair amount of programming experience for someone not doing computational physics. Now that academia has finally gotten moving I will have 2 papers published as a primary author so hopefully adding those to my resume will help a bit.

Notably I have never done an internship with an engineering company, just research internships. Is this something that recruiters will just eliminate you right away for? Does anyone have experience attempting to get an off-season internship?

A friend was in a nearly identical situation and ended up at a semiconductor fab. Another company I know of, NVE, does wafer level processing and employs Physics majors as engineers although usually PhDs. Some smaller companies may surprise you. Try to look for small companies like them in addition to the Qualcomms and Triquints of the world.

Especially look for RF/magnetism based companies, I dont know many engineers who are good what for diddling the electric air pixies even as EEs but physics people tend to get that stuff.

Some Small companies that'd probably consider you:
http://www.emc-rflabs.com/
http://www.nve.com/careers.php

Murgos
Oct 21, 2010
Don't listen to those guys, they are all full of non-sense.

Every single computer hardware design job will have the following statement in the requirements:

(This one is from the first result for "computer hardware engineer" off indeed.com which just so happened to be from Broadcom)
"Requires a BS degree in Electrical/Computer Engineering or a related discipline with at least 5 years of experience in chip industry"

Physics is a related discipline and you have experience in the industry. Go ahead and apply.

No you don't need the word engineer in your degree. I have a number of colleagues who have physics degrees instead of engineering degrees, it's fine.

e: For the internship question you are fine there too. I've known several corporations to hire people in as interns who were not currently attending college. It's a great way to check someone out. I personally was hired into a position this way after graduation.

Murgos fucked around with this message at 18:55 on Jan 18, 2017

paternity suitor
Aug 2, 2016

Out of my department of about 30 RF engineers, we had one guy who was a physicist, but he was a PhD. We also had a meteorology PhD! If I was a hiring manager, I wouldn't care if the degree was physics or engineering, although I feel like the older spergy set has a bias against physicists because they view them as "not practical" people who just want to play in the sandbox. That's just the impression I got from some. gently caress those guys anyway.

Vaporware
May 22, 2004

Still not here yet.

ch3cooh posted:

Any of y'all work in process automation and PI controller tuning? I'm trying to optimize the use of automatic driller and trying to understand why it won't work the way I want it to.

Do any of you folks have suggestions on if we can do something with the gain values to try to minimize this?
whoops that's what I get for not checking the forums for a couple weeks.

Are you working only with gain? P-only/bang-bang? because you started with saying PI control, and everything you said sounds like the reset/integral isn't tuned properly. Also, your torque gain is pretty high at 1. Did you try a lower torque gain?

As cop-out of an answer it is, you might want to talk to the vendor and get someone out to tune it for you.

Murgos
Oct 21, 2010
If you really wanted to prep undergrads for the real world they should probably make a semester of MS Project & PowerPoint required for graduation.

Vaporware
May 22, 2004

Still not here yet.
formatting PDFs and installing printer drivers 101

GCValentine
Oct 25, 2007
Important Event
Thanks for the advice everyone, I now have a pretty good offer from a place where I had interviewed for two positions and was going to interview for a third next week. All of their starting positions are off-shifts but I have weekday evenings so it shouldn't be too bad. Saves me from being a grossly underemployed optical microscopy contractor, probably.

CarForumPoster posted:

A friend was in a nearly identical situation and ended up at a semiconductor fab. Another company I know of, NVE, does wafer level processing and employs Physics majors as engineers although usually PhDs. Some smaller companies may surprise you. Try to look for small companies like them in addition to the Qualcomms and Triquints of the world.

Especially look for RF/magnetism based companies, I dont know many engineers who are good what for diddling the electric air pixies even as EEs but physics people tend to get that stuff.

Some Small companies that'd probably consider you:
http://www.emc-rflabs.com/
http://www.nve.com/careers.php

NVE is actually local and I had never heard of them, thanks for the tip.

CarForumPoster
Jun 26, 2013

⚡POWER⚡

GCValentine posted:

Thanks for the advice everyone, I now have a pretty good offer from a place where I had interviewed for two positions and was going to interview for a third next week. All of their starting positions are off-shifts but I have weekday evenings so it shouldn't be too bad. Saves me from being a grossly underemployed optical microscopy contractor, probably.


NVE is actually local and I had never heard of them, thanks for the tip.

MSP is a pretty good place to be in that position in. Lots of engineering and not that many people want to live there. (Despite it being a nice area with nice people)

CarForumPoster
Jun 26, 2013

⚡POWER⚡
Anyone work at a company that will give you IR&D money to work on a project you come up with or 20% time where you're expected to actually deliver something and it involves a pitch? What are your experiences/advice/thoughts?

CarForumPoster fucked around with this message at 04:17 on Jan 25, 2017

Murgos
Oct 21, 2010

CarForumPoster posted:

Anyone work at a company that will give you IR&D money to work on a project you come up with or 20% time where you're expected to actually deliver something and it involves a pitch? What are your experiences/advice/thoughts?

We used to fund lots of little projects which usually would result in a conference paper or something similar but after a management change they decided that they weren't really getting anything out of that and so switched to funding 5-10ish large internal projects a year. The competition is pretty fierce and you need to run it as you would something deliverable to a customer but where before maybe you could get 25-30k now they might award a couple of million for a really outstanding (deliverable) concept.

A lot of old timers were upset that their paid conference tour schedule was cut but the new way is much better from an ROI POV.

Frankston
Jul 27, 2010


I have an interview for an internship coming up at a steel company and I need to prepare a 15 minute presentation on a real-world example of a steel component failing, the repercussions, how it could have been prevented, etc etc. Can anyone suggest any such examples I could start looking at?

Noctone
Oct 25, 2005

XO til we overdose..
9/11 :v:

Jeffrey of YOSPOS
Dec 22, 2005

GET LOSE, YOU CAN'T COMPARE WITH MY POWERS
Tacoma Narrows is pretty crazy but I'm not sure it's really the steel that failed.

Thoguh
Nov 8, 2002

College Slice
.

Thoguh fucked around with this message at 16:28 on Aug 10, 2023

Zuph
Jul 24, 2003
Zupht0r 6000 Turbo Type-R

Frankston posted:

I have an interview for an internship coming up at a steel company and I need to prepare a 15 minute presentation on a real-world example of a steel component failing, the repercussions, how it could have been prevented, etc etc. Can anyone suggest any such examples I could start looking at?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyatt_Regency_walkway_collapse This was a case study in my engineering ethics course.

E:f,b

Hello Sailor
May 3, 2006

we're all mad here

I assume locality has something to do with it, since I had the first half of my degree in Kansas City and am taking the second still in Missouri (MS&T), but Hyatt Regency is the example of "things gone wrong" that it seems like everyone uses.

e: That bridge collapse in 2007 up in Minneapolis would be good. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I-35W_Mississippi_River_bridge

Hello Sailor fucked around with this message at 16:17 on Feb 22, 2017

Frankston
Jul 27, 2010


Thanks for the suggestions guys, the Hyatt walkway was the one that came to mind initially. I'll check them out.

Thoguh
Nov 8, 2002

College Slice
.

Thoguh fucked around with this message at 16:28 on Aug 10, 2023

neibbo
Jul 18, 2003

Yes, mein Fuhrer... I mean.. Mr. President
The December 2015 closure of the Forth Road Bridge between Edinburgh and Fife might be another example to consider that's a little less well known. I think the gist of it was they discovered a large crack in a steel truss during an inspection and determined it was because a pin seized up. They claimed afterwards that the only way they would have had a shot at detecting the pin seizing before it manifested as cracks in the steel was by using newfangled structural health monitoring equipment which might make for an interesting talking point.

Hed
Mar 31, 2004

Fun Shoe
A close friend who was president of the Missouri Society of Professional Engineers at one point marveled that it was one of the few times the state revoked licenses... apparently it's really hard to get them to take action

Chillyrabbit
Oct 24, 2012

The only sword wielding rabbit on the internet



Ultra Carp

Frankston posted:

I have an interview for an internship coming up at a steel company and I need to prepare a 15 minute presentation on a real-world example of a steel component failing, the repercussions, how it could have been prevented, etc etc. Can anyone suggest any such examples I could start looking at?

Elliot Lake Mall Collapse Steel is rusting from the snow and salt leaking through the roof and maintenance is ignored before the roof falls in.

The Chairman
Jun 30, 2003

But you forget, mon ami, that there is evil everywhere under the sun
If you want a non-building example, the 2002 Amtrak derailment in Crescent City, Florida (tracks buckled due to excess thermal expansion and no stress relief) or the 2015 SpaceX Falcon 9 explosion (steel strut holding a helium tank in place failed at 1/5 its rated capacity).

icecreamjesus
Jul 12, 2016

CarForumPoster posted:

Anyone work at a company that will give you IR&D money to work on a project you come up with or 20% time where you're expected to actually deliver something and it involves a pitch? What are your experiences/advice/thoughts?

Use a lot of key words like "machine learning", and "data science" for example. Find something that you can improve on that is already in use or could be in use if it was better or something similar to use as an analogy. Be good at speaking in front of a group and getting the people with money to like you. Also have some clear benefit that your project would provide and any kind of deliverables, like a research/feasibility paper or a widget. That's been working for me.

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Murgos
Oct 21, 2010
"Big Data" has worked pretty well recently but I feel is losing some of its mojo.

"Neuromorphic" is the new hotness.

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