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SwissArmyDruid posted:I suspected that it wasn't actually true, as the Jaguar-based consoles are still single-channel. To find that games of any stripe would use quad-channel meaningfully when they don't even have access to dual-channel in a significant percentage of cases would have been a truly surprising revelation. How are they single channel? They've got much bigger than the 64-bit bus that PCs communicate with RAM through. DDR4-3200 tops out at 25.6 GB/s per channel, so ~100GB/s in quad channel. Meanwhile the PS4 has 176GB/s of memory bandwidth, more than 50% more than quad channel DDR4-3200 and about 5x as much bandwidth as dual channel DDR4-2133!!
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Jan 16, 2017 15:59
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SwissArmyDruid posted:I suspected that it wasn't actually true, as the Jaguar-based consoles are still single-channel. To find that games of any stripe would use quad-channel meaningfully when they don't even have access to dual-channel in a significant percentage of cases would have been a truly surprising revelation.
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Jan 16, 2017 16:04
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SwissArmyDruid posted:Blame intel for not making a processor that significantly outdoes the 2600K. You want to kill upgrades among enthusiasts, that's the way to do it. Relevant
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Jan 16, 2017 16:14
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Uh, since when do games care about or "utilize" the amount of memory channels? Unless the game looks up system information, it's none the wiser about the memory layout.
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Jan 16, 2017 16:20
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FaustianQ posted:Well worry no more, apparently Zen natively supports DDR4 3200 through AMP, and DDR4 4000 through overclocking.  good time to buy ddr4-3200 right now!
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Jan 16, 2017 16:22
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Combat Pretzel posted:Uh, since when do games care about or "utilize" the amount of memory channels? Unless the game looks up system information, it's none the wiser about the memory layout. Whenever they read things from memory?
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Jan 16, 2017 16:29
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ohgodwhat posted:Whenever they read things from memory? Point was, games don't give a poo poo about memory architecture on the PC. There's no code suddenly deciding to throttle the framerate because oops there's dual or quad channel. Neither is there code that tries to guess the interleaving and align things accordingly. Just because performance considerations were made for console systems, which happen to have single channel memory and related bandwidth caps, doesn't mean there isn't anything to be had on higher end systems. The case of FO4 shows that there's situations where you're bandwidth and not CPU limited (--edit: Yes, bandwidth, because default memory timings scale almost linearly with frequencies, so latency doesn't really change). Probably applies to more games that stream or generate world geometry, plus related assets, on the fly. Combat Pretzel fucked around with this message at 17:00 on Jan 16, 2017 |
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Jan 16, 2017 16:57
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Sorry, I really did misread you. I thought you were implying games had to be programmed specifically to use dual or quad channel memory to see any improvements above single channel memory.
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Jan 16, 2017 17:02
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SwissArmyDruid posted:You want to kill upgrades among enthusiasts, that's the way to do it. Let's go, enthusiasts are like audiophiles, ie. the worst.
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Jan 16, 2017 17:02
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To get some articles for SwissArmyDruid to beat people with, the Digital Foundries testing of Fallout 4 is probably what Anime Schoolgirl was thinking of, but that testing is going from 1600 to 2400 which is just moving up from what I'd consider actually slow RAM to something modern (Hello, I'm still using DDR2-800). Here's one comparing averages and minimums over 2133, 2666, and 3200; and two vs four sticks on TechBuyersGuru for a lot of the games other people were claiming were memory dependent. Also AnandTech but that was three gpu revisions ago, drat. I'd be willing to say that beyond 2666 is the point of diminishing returns for modern RAM. Though there are some 3200 sticks with much more competitive timings at 14-14-14-34 now, but nobody has bothered benching them that I can find. Unhappy Meal fucked around with this message at 23:35 on Jan 16, 2017 |
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Jan 16, 2017 17:03
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Boiled Water posted:Let's go, enthusiasts are like audiophiles, ie. the worst. Audiophiles make anything in consumer PC look like real bargain.
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Jan 16, 2017 17:54
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Sidesaddle Cavalry posted:
Looks like G. Skill still makes the cheapest DDR4 3200 with 14 CAS, even though the price has gone up a little in the past few months. I'm super happy I got it when 16GB was only $105.
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Jan 16, 2017 23:17
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SwissArmyDruid posted:I suspected that it wasn't actually true, as the Jaguar-based consoles are still single-channel. I read this and thought to myself, "Uhh, didn't the Atari Jaguar console die 2 decades ago?"
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Jan 17, 2017 08:01
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Palladium posted:Audiophiles make anything in consumer PC look like real bargain. Exactly. The dudes that buy the fastest CPU and GPU every year or do stupid things like quad SLI are paying in the hundreds to low thousands for for marginal, but measurable (and sometimes even perceptible!) performance improvements. Audiophiles will pay tens of thousands for poo poo that doesn't do a goddamn thing.
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Jan 17, 2017 08:03
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Boiled Water posted:Let's go, enthusiasts are like audiophiles, ie. the worst. Except that both basically finance cheaper parts for you, since the companies can use their stupidly disproportionate profit margins to reduce the margins on the components you buy.
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Jan 17, 2017 09:16
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Nam Taf posted:Except that both basically finance cheaper parts for you, since the companies can use their stupidly disproportionate profit margins to reduce the margins on the components you buy. Or just pay the executives/shareholders more.
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Jan 17, 2017 09:27
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Platystemon posted:Or just pay the executives/shareholders more. Or that, but I'm an idealist.
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Jan 17, 2017 10:37
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Nam Taf posted:Except that both basically finance cheaper parts for you, since the companies can use their stupidly disproportionate profit margins to reduce the margins on the components you buy. nope this cost is shared amongst datacenters
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Jan 17, 2017 11:09
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billions are spent on server chips and mobile chips and AMD is finally doing one of the right things by targeting the former, intel cutting out features from chips they have a sales volume of literal rectal pennies from is just pettiness from getting owned by fsb overclocking for years
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Jan 17, 2017 12:45
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Tell that to Kyle Bennett. 
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Jan 17, 2017 12:55
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pettiness loves pettiness why else did you think a piss goblin got elected
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Jan 17, 2017 13:00
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Yeah, sure, I guess? SwissArmyDruid fucked around with this message at 13:09 on Jan 17, 2017 |
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Jan 17, 2017 13:07
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in short, intel bad
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Jan 17, 2017 13:23
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Just as AMD prepares to release a competitive CPU and GPU combo to take the market by storm and secure its future, the economy collapses. Someone make a smiley that's Charlie Brown trying to kick a football except it's AMD and marketshare.
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Jan 17, 2017 16:36
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In the grim darkness of the far future, MAKE MORE CORES
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Jan 17, 2017 18:01
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[UNSOLICITED OPINIONS ON INTEL???]
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Jan 17, 2017 18:06
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VostokProgram posted:In the grim darkness of the far future, MAKE MORE CORES Finally, the massive parallelism we were promised with Itanium. (da team red wunz go fasta!)
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Jan 17, 2017 18:56
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I'm still not 100% sure Itanium actually existed or if it was just a fever dream I had once.
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Jan 17, 2017 19:44
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FaustianQ posted:Just as AMD prepares to release a competitive CPU and GPU combo to take the market by storm and secure its future, the economy collapses.
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Jan 17, 2017 19:56
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Which, as it has been noted, AMD has been cutting deals with several large Chinese outfits over the past few months. edit: https://twitter.com/killyourfm/status/821152304237686784 I have to go buy an MPB now. SwissArmyDruid fucked around with this message at 21:42 on Jan 17, 2017 |
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Jan 17, 2017 21:19
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SwissArmyDruid posted:Which, as it has been noted, AMD has been cutting deals with several large Chinese outfits over the past few months. Couldn't Razer or any other OEM just make a touchbar for PC and we can all do the same neato stuff without having to overspend on a pretty yet underwhelming Mac? Crap they could just sell a Touchbar separate and made the entire laptop pointless.
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Jan 17, 2017 21:50
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EdEddnEddy posted:Couldn't Razer or any other OEM just make a touchbar for PC and we can all do the same neato stuff without having to overspend on a pretty yet underwhelming Mac? I'm not actually buying an MBP, it was a joke. To answer your question with some sincerity, however, remember the Optimus Maximus keyboard and how well that has done?
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Jan 18, 2017 00:57
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Haven't full-color touch panels been a thing for extravagant keyboards for years?
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Jan 18, 2017 01:02
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just one panel usually instead of a bunch of $15 lcd panels
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Jan 18, 2017 01:35
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SwissArmyDruid posted:I'm not actually buying an MBP, it was a joke. To answer your question with some sincerity, however, remember the Optimus Maximus keyboard and how well that has done? Realistically, considering Apple sued the poo poo out of Samsung over crap like pinch zoom I'm willing to bet they have enough patents to prevent someone else trying the same design. I also think it is just extremely gimicky, looks great in tech demos but I doubt it is a real productivity deal breaker (productivity on OS X  ).
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Jan 18, 2017 01:41
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Yea that keyboard was awesome, but a bit like a super niche on top of the niche Logitech G19 screen. (That I do still love) Wasn't it almost always sold out though even at its price? And the Razor laptop (Blade Pro?) With the fancy LCD Touchpad/Screen was also pretty cool, but it was paired with dated at launch hardware that wasn't updated until recently with the new Pro, but also lost it's LCD. The LCD would have been fine to keep, just not paired to crappy low end dedicated graphics and generation old CPU. Ugh Razer trying to Be apple I guess lol. Though as far as niche things go with them then, I'd take that 3 4K screen beast over a little lcd touchbar gimmick anyday. I really do hope they make that system a reality. Also speaking of crazy laptops, has there been any word on a release date on that Acer behemoth with the 21" Curved Widescreen with SLI 1080's?
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Jan 18, 2017 04:55
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EdEddnEddy posted:Couldn't Razer or any other OEM just make a touchbar for PC and we can all do the same neato stuff without having to overspend on a pretty yet underwhelming Mac? Realistically, any peripheral like that has a chicken/egg problem of apps supporting it properly before it can be any good. It would need a heavyweight stakeholder in the platform to push it, and Apple is great at getting developers on their platforms to support whatever their weird new idea is, even if it turns out to be a bad idea long-term. On Windows, something like that pushed by Microsoft would never get as much support because Windows devs largely don't give a poo poo about what Microsoft would like them to support. More broadly, I'm also skeptical about the ergonomics of a screen-near-the-keyboard when used at a desk, because if you have decent posture your eyes are looking much further away from the keyboard. But, this is the AMD thread, so, carry on!
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Jan 18, 2017 05:21
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cbirdsong posted:Realistically, any peripheral like that has a chicken/egg problem of apps supporting it properly before it can be any good. It would need a heavyweight stakeholder in the platform to push it, and Apple is great at getting developers on their platforms to support whatever their weird new idea is, even if it turns out to be a bad idea long-term. On Windows, something like that pushed by Microsoft would never get as much support because Windows devs largely don't give a poo poo about what Microsoft would like them to support. More broadly, I'm also skeptical about the ergonomics of a screen-near-the-keyboard when used at a desk, because if you have decent posture your eyes are looking much further away from the keyboard. Making a desktop touchbar articulate wouldn't be a crazy idea in that case. Similar to the way the G15 was tilted a bit or the G19 was on a adjustable hinge. They weren't touch surfaces but both were used in desktop environments so it's not a complete crazy idea. I just am one of those who like everything to have a screen and more screens = better.
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Jan 18, 2017 06:48
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I mean, depending on user configurability, it could be pretty rad. Dock a Photoshop toolbar/favorites to it, macros, swipe through it for F* functionality, push style notifications /quick responses, all sorts of neat stuff. I would probably load tiled dickbutts on there as a wallpaper though.
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Jan 18, 2017 06:53
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SwissArmyDruid posted:Which, as it has been noted, AMD has been cutting deals with several large Chinese outfits over the past few months. steve rider?
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