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Regardless of the Yugo's quality or lack thereof, the fact that a Yugoslav company was able to get a car into the American market at all says something about the position of Yugoslavia during the later part of the Cold War.
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Jan 16, 2017 03:11
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Vincent Van Goatse posted:I was trying not to bring that up. Thanks a lot. The Lada Niva was fairly popular in Canada.
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Jan 16, 2017 03:33
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Vincent Van Goatse posted:I was trying not to bring that up. Thanks a lot. I'd argue that Yugo is a household name (among people of my generation, I doubt younger millenials know what it is) of a failed European import car. There were three of them on the block where I grew up; they all slowly fell apart and disappeared by 1995 or so.
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Jan 16, 2017 12:06
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david_a posted:To be fair, even Danes don't understand each other Skanish? I used to date a girl from Lund. Her friends made the same joke, that if was easier for them to understand each other when they all spoke English.
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Jan 16, 2017 13:57
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Grand Prize Winner posted:I'd argue that Yugo is a household name (among people of my generation, I doubt younger millenials know what it is) of a failed European import car. There were three of them on the block where I grew up; they all slowly fell apart and disappeared by 1995 or so. It had a hilarious cameo in Dragnet , with Dan Akroyd describung it as "the cutting edge kf Serbo-Croation technology.
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Jan 16, 2017 13:59
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SimonCat posted:Skanish? I used to date a girl from Lund. Her friends made the same joke, that if was easier for them to understand each other when they all spoke English. I will raid and pillage all your loving homes    Also, I believe it's "scanian" in English.
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Jan 16, 2017 15:29
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SimonCat posted:Skanish? I used to date a girl from Lund. Her friends made the same joke, that if was easier for them to understand each other when they all spoke English.
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Jan 16, 2017 15:43
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All scandi names turn really weird when anglicized, but I researched it and Skåne is definitely Scania, with the adjective form being scanian.
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Jan 16, 2017 16:27
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This debate is a real act of war.
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Jan 16, 2017 16:44
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WW2 Data Today we look at a number of obsolete bombs in the UK inventory. (At the time of the publication of the technical manual) What types of bombs are on display today? Which bomb was intended for air strips, anti-personnel attacks, and use against road transports? Which bomb was designed for Coastal Command, and what did they change for the Mk II? Which bomb was designed for attacks against heavily forested areas? All that and more at the blog!
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Jan 16, 2017 16:44
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steinrokkan posted:This debate is a real act of war. feedmegin posted:Knowing some French and Latin, I can get the gist of written Spanish fairly easily (though I wouldn't like to try and speak it or e.g. understand it on TV). It wouldn't surprise me at all if the same is true of Germanic languages, e.g. 'know English and German, mostly understand written Dutch'.
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Jan 16, 2017 16:52
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Agreed. Knowing both Danish and English allows me to get a great deal of German - But knowing just Danish, even if a great deal of germanicisms have crept into Danish, would make it a lot harder.
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Jan 16, 2017 20:22
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SimonCat posted:It had a hilarious cameo in Dragnet , with Dan Akroyd describung it as "the cutting edge kf Serbo-Croation technology. There was whole movie where every single car was a Yugo as part of the setting. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o8oQsYKaLhE
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Jan 16, 2017 22:30
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a kitten posted:There was whole movie where every single car was a Yugo as part of the setting. that's a good movie
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Jan 16, 2017 22:53
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Here yu go: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I1LxlZ8pTRg
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Jan 16, 2017 23:17
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Vincent Van Goatse posted:This is probably all very strange to someone who actually lives there. My good man, have you heard the good word of YuMex? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hSkwg8tyVSA My bar for "strange" is pretty drat high. Vincent Van Goatse posted:I imagine this had a lot to do with Tito's efforts to make Yugoslavia part of the Non-Aligned world instead of being Another Soviet Puppet Satellite. The various anti-partisan groups were way more easy to characterize as vulgar Nazi lackeys instead of misguided anti-Stalin idealists used and thrown away by the Nazis. The Chetniks were such a decentralized clusterfuck that it's actually hard to find a portrayal of them that you can't justify with something the Chetniks actually did. Bonus points for "Četniks" basically meaning "irregulars" or "guerillas", and also the name of a nationalist group with fascist tendencies (that happened to be very anti-Germany and pro-UK and pro-USA in its views unlike other similar groups. Also, culty edgelords who probably would have called themselves something like "da guerillaz" had they spoken English) that wasn't part of the "troops who refused to lay down their arms after capitulation" Chetniks who were the core of the WW2 Chetnik movement, but still merged with them pretty fast, which clusterfuckifies things further when you try to figure out who did what. I mean, the Chetniks deserve being given a fair shake without the layers of communist lies, but the general idea people have about the movement isn't too far from reality. Most of the lies are attempts to present them as a centralized Serbian organization where everything that was done was directly ordered by Draža Mihajlović, and the man himself was tarred with everything the communists needed someone to put the blame on, but even if the Chetniks didn't start out as murderous nationalist reactionaries who cozied up with the Nazis, they were exactly that by the end of the war. They did some really ghastly poo poo, and while they never got anywhere near the level of horrifying that the Ustaše were, that's, uh, probably among the lowest bars you can possibly set for wartime conduct. Most of my sympathy wrt Chetniks lies with average joes who joined up with whoever was fighting the Nazis in the places they lived, and that happened to be the Chetniks in their case. The rest of it is with people who couldn't magically predict that Tito wasn't going to turn Yugoslavia into Another Soviet Puppet Satellite under Stalin's merciful supervision (and Stalin was about as much of a fan of Yugoslavia and especially Serbia as he was a fan of Ukraine). The communists were the least bad option in that war, and I'd be a hypocrite if I didn't say I owe the very existence of my family to their fight, my ability to grow up in a place that wasn't a dirt poor mountain village to their initiatives, and my health and education to the policies they made which glorious capitalism hasn't managed to destroy (yet). But the lies, dear God, the lies they told every time they said anything. That having been said, I come from a family whose only contact with the Chetniks was via bullets, so I might be biased a bit.  The local communities' (in the areas my family is from) early interactions with the royal government and the Partizans went something like this: Holy poo poo, the Ustaše are coming! Somebody, anybody, heeeelp! Premature resistance against the occupying forces is only going to cause additional suffering. We must bide our time and wait for the right moment to strike. We are literally being exterminated right now you fancy Belgrade fucks, we can't wait! Putting up a fight now will bring almost certain doom. Sacrifices will have to be made. Go die in a fire you assholes! "Almost certain doom" sure as gently caress beats the alternative, we're not going to just lie there and wait for death! TO ARMS!... ...  Well, hello there.Speaking of Tito, to add one last thing: While I dislike even the historical Tito, complex man who had to make some really tough calls in extremely difficult situations, I have a personal grudge against Tito the legend - Tito who has been idealized, simplified, and reduced to BIG STRONG MAN WHO IS ALWAYS RIGHT AND MAKES GOOD THINGS HAPPEN BECAUSE HE IS A BIG STRONG MAN WHO IS SMARTER THAN YOU by posterity. Praise of Tito the legend makes my skin crawl, and I've yet to be in a situation where it wasn't the correct reaction. e: Also, I have no loving idea what's the deal with the "senator". I'm as baffled as you are e2: Wait, no, there actually was a senate, it was a product of king Aleksandar's dictatorship. Well, I did say my knowledge of Yugoslav history sucks.
my dad fucked around with this message at 01:44 on Jan 17, 2017 |
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Jan 17, 2017 00:46
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Grand Prize Winner posted:I'd argue that Yugo is a household name (among people of my generation, I doubt younger millenials know what it is) of a failed European import car. There were three of them on the block where I grew up; they all slowly fell apart and disappeared by 1995 or so. My point is that Average Americans have actually heard of the Yugo. Can you say the same about, say, the Wartburg or the Moskvitch?
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Jan 17, 2017 03:01
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i've heard of Aby Warburg, does that count?
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Jan 17, 2017 03:07
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Finally Watched the first episode of Our War. It's okay. They do fine with their budget. The steady cam definitely throws me off but the dang uav thermal vision is worse in my opinion. My question - were the British as inept and unhurried in preparing their defense of Mons as the show made it seem? Or did the budget and a lack of realism enhance that for me
FastestGunAlive fucked around with this message at 03:15 on Jan 17, 2017 |
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Jan 17, 2017 03:12
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Tito strikes me as a Balkan Simon Bolivar.
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Jan 17, 2017 03:16
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Raenir Salazar posted:Tito strikes me as a Balkan Simon Bolivar. I was under the impression that people liked and/or respected Bolivar, though.
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Jan 17, 2017 03:21
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Argus Zant posted:I was under the impression that people liked and/or respected Bolivar, though. I know almost nothing about Bolivar (he was a revolutionary of some sort, right? I'd appreciate a post about him), but a lot of people do like/respect Tito. It can just, uh, get complicated, especially when you take side effects of the cult of personality into account. As a somewhat extreme example, I've met a dude here in Serbia who loves Tito, Putin, and US marine corps, and thinks Trump winning was the best thing to happen to America, ever. Does worshipping Tito in a way that's likely to make him rise from the dead for the sole purpose of personally shipping you off to his Barren Island mini-gulag count as liking him? And before you ask, yes, the guy in question loves Warhammer 40k.
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Jan 17, 2017 03:42
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When I was a kid we had a Volkswagen Dasher that had the tires from a Yugo for some reason. They were loud as gently caress - you basically had to scream from the back of the car to be heard in the front. Later in life I realized that that was not the norm. Also, I was lucky to spend two weeks in Belgrade as a kid in the mid-eighties, as my parents were good college friends with the First Secretary to the US Ambassador there.
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Jan 17, 2017 03:53
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FastestGunAlive posted:Finally Watched the first episode of Our War. It's okay. They do fine with their budget. The steady cam definitely throws me off but the dang uav thermal vision is worse in my opinion. My question - were the British as inept and unhurried in preparing their defense of Mons as the show made it seem? Or did the budget and a lack of realism enhance that for me The pudding is somewhat over-egged, particularly with that final caption about humiliation, but they're basically right that less than 24 hours before the battle, everyone from Sir John French to Private Godley was expecting a 24-hour skirmish to guard the French left flank, with an advance and possible flanking movement to come tomorrow once the French had done the business against the Germans' leftmost army. (What do you mean, the aeroplane scouts say there's another army coming right for us? Must be some mistake. Wouldn't trust anyone with more than 1 horsepower under him, by Jove.) Which is why they were so sloppy with the bridges; they fully expected to be using them in the very near future. I've got far more of a problem with that bloody sapper not getting a good smack round the earhole each time he called his corporal "sir" than anything they showed about the strategic situation. (Godley's actions at the end? Almost completely accurate, except for a large compression of time; he actually defended the bridge on his own for about two hours. The rest of it, getting shot several times and he still didn't go down until everyone else had cleared off and he'd thrown the gun in the river, that's how it happened. That story is just full of things that look like ridiculous dramatic contrivances and aren't, like Lieutenant Steele being randomly Australian.) Trin Tragula fucked around with this message at 12:50 on Jan 17, 2017 |
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Jan 17, 2017 12:42
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Thanks. The corporal thing threw me off as well. Figured they had just got the wrong ranking on his uniform or that was some British custom until the end when they said he was a Lance Corporal
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Jan 17, 2017 12:53
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Argus Zant posted:I was under the impression that people liked and/or respected Bolivar, though. I'm also under the impression that Tito still has statues in the Former Yugoslavia; like he's sorta in the same category of Ho Chi Minh and Castro as Communist leaders that people still grudgingly respect. quote:he was a revolutionary of some sort, right? I'd appreciate a post about him You're in luck! He reminds me of Tito, or rather Tito from what I've read reminds me of him in that both were men deeply committed to their ideals; who made questionable decisions to consolidate their political power as a means of implementing their nation building projects and from which these projects failed to persist for long after their deaths. Gran Columbia did not long outlast Simon Bolivar.
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Jan 17, 2017 18:27
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Argus Zant posted:I was under the impression that people liked and/or respected Bolivar, though. Bolivar is popular, especially in Venezuela, since Chavez used him as a unifying figure and he was used heavily in propoganda. He did have a pretty amazing career. Someone said that Gran Columbia didn't survive past his lifetime, this is somewhat inaccurate since it was falling apart well before he died.
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Jan 17, 2017 18:52
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Raenir Salazar posted:I'm also under the impression that Tito still has statues in the Former Yugoslavia; like he's sorta in the same category of Ho Chi Minh and Castro as Communist leaders that people still grudgingly respect. And while today Bolivar is still universally respected, his name and legacy does get abused to legitimize awful poo poo, like the PSUV running Venezuela into the ground.
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Jan 17, 2017 18:59
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Raenir Salazar posted:I'm also under the impression that Tito still has statues in the Former Yugoslavia; like he's sorta in the same category of Ho Chi Minh and Castro as Communist leaders that people still grudgingly respect. One of the central squares in Zagreb is still named after him. Fun fact - same square was named Woodrow Wilson Square from 1919 to 1925.
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Jan 17, 2017 19:03
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david_a posted:Yes. I don't know if I've ever read the name of it in English, but Scanian does sound more correct. Lund has it's own special accent that's not quite the same as the stereotype. I'm from Österlen and we speak pro-tier Skånska down there. To make it remotely military history, Scania, the Swedish truck brand used In a lot of Swedish military vehicles, originated from Malmö and was named after the region. Lund has a scanian dialect, but considering 1/3 of the population is students from outside Lund as well as having a lot of work commuters, it is rather hard to find one with a original Lund accent.
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Jan 17, 2017 19:20
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PBUGQkpk3RE So that's fine for Norsemen but aren't there documented naked germanic maniacs that fought Romans?
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Jan 17, 2017 21:12
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DiHK posted:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PBUGQkpk3RE Polybius Book 2 posted:The Insubres and Boii wore their trousers and light cloaks, 8 but the Gaesatae had discarded these garments owing to their proud confidence in themselves, and stood naked, with nothing but their arms, in front of the whole army, thinking that thus they would be more efficient, as some of the ground was overgrown with brambles which would catch in their clothes and impede the use of their weapons. [...] Very terrifying too were the appearance and the gestures of the naked warriors in front, 8 all in the prime of life, and finely built men, and all in the leading companies richly adorned with gold torques and armlets. 9 The sight of them indeed dismayed the Romans [...] It ends up backfiring because it turns out javelins hurt more when you're not wearing clothes Translation taken from here
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Jan 17, 2017 21:22
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DiHK posted:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PBUGQkpk3RE Don't take this guy too seriously, his research basically consists of "what sounds like common sense to me, a LARPer?" Berserkers did exist in that there certainly existed weird warrior bands of Norse origin that performed their battle rituals and fought independently from others, they were even written about as part of the Varyag guard. Celts fighting naked save for ornaments have been described by plenty of authors. I remember a funny illustration from the noted academic work Horrible Histories that depicted a side by side comparison of the equipment of a fully armored legionary vs a nude Celt with only a bronze bracelet.
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Jan 17, 2017 21:27
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Elyv posted:It ends up backfiring because it turns out javelins hurt more when you're not wearing clothes I'd argue that javelins hurt exactly the same as when you're wearing normal, unarmored clothing as that text suggests. (Unless I'm terribly mistaken and the armor is either implied or mentioned elsewhere.)
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Jan 17, 2017 21:32
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Carcer posted:I'd argue that javelins hurt exactly the same as when you're wearing normal, unarmored clothing as that text suggests. (Unless I'm terribly mistaken and the armor is either implied or mentioned elsewhere.) same text: quote:But when the javelineers advanced, as is their usage, from the ranks of the Roman legions and began to hurl their javelins in well-aimed volleys, the Celts in the rear ranks indeed were well protected by their trousers and cloaks, 2 but it fell out far otherwise than they had expected with the naked men in front, and they found themselves in a very difficult and helpless predicament. 3 For the Gaulish shield does not cover the whole body; so that their nakedness was a disadvantage, and the bigger they were 5 the better chance had the missiles of going home.
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Jan 17, 2017 21:36
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Trin Tragula posted:The pudding is somewhat over-egged, particularly with that final caption about humiliation, but they're basically right that less than 24 hours before the battle, everyone from Sir John French to Private Godley was expecting a 24-hour skirmish to guard the French left flank, with an advance and possible flanking movement to come tomorrow once the French had done the business against the Germans' leftmost army. (What do you mean, the aeroplane scouts say there's another army coming right for us? Must be some mistake. Wouldn't trust anyone with more than 1 horsepower under him, by Jove.) Which is why they were so sloppy with the bridges; they fully expected to be using them in the very near future. I've got far more of a problem with that bloody sapper not getting a good smack round the earhole each time he called his corporal "sir" than anything they showed about the strategic situation. The only thing about the Godley part that annoyed me is the war movie trope of having the last stand guy shouting heroically over and over while being riddled with bullets in the middle of an extremely complex task. Like, I could be completely wrong here, and if so I mean no disrespect to anyone, but I'm guessing that the reality is closer to "clenched teeth and lunatic focus, courage, and professionalism" more than "shouting and slobbering all over oneself with manly ferocity." That, and yeah the shakey cam and thermal shenanigans were just silly.
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Jan 17, 2017 21:39
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Carcer posted:I'd argue that javelins hurt exactly the same as when you're wearing normal, unarmored clothing as that text suggests. (Unless I'm terribly mistaken and the armor is either implied or mentioned elsewhere.) Clothing can stop a lot more than you might think, especially incidental cuts and wounds. A javelin might slide off your cloak, or slice it a bit and miss your skin, whereas if you were barechested it might leave a nice cut that now makes it hard to use your swordarm. There are stories of the heavy wool greatcoats the russians wore in the crimean war stopping sword thrusts. it would make sense that naked warriors would really not like a situation where a lot of sharp and pointed objects are flying around and bouncing off shields at weird angles
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Jan 17, 2017 21:50
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"There are brambles so we decided to go naked" sounds like a very suspicious reasoning.
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Jan 17, 2017 21:52
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To be clear, I understand clothes protect against incidental cuts and bumps and bruises that you would accrue in combat otherwise, and that a good cloak can foil a javelin that might otherwise have hurt you with a glancing hit. I'm unfamiliar with exactly what garments the germans would be wearing there, but I doubt its anything that could deflect a direct hit from a javelin hurled at close range.
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Jan 17, 2017 22:15
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Nudity helps prevent wound infection. Always duel naked.
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Jan 17, 2017 22:23
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