NetRunner: More Unapproachable than a rezzed Curtain Wall

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AgentF: May 11, 2009

Dr. Angela Ziegler posted:

Netrunner discussion: what color is quetzel's dress?

Knowing the Android universe it probably shifts colours continuously.

That or it's actually a genetically modified patch of scales to complement her hair.

WFGuy posted:

You can't use the word 'orange' with the Netrunner community! You know how many Deus Ex fans there are in it? You'll be inundated with "It gave me lemon-lime!" responses all day!

AgentF fucked around with this message at 21:55 on Jan 11, 2017

# ? Jan 11, 2017 21:52

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# ? May 21, 2024 11:31

WE RIDE: Jul 29, 2003

Plavski posted:

There are good places like Stimhack ( http://stimhack.com/principles-of-corp-deckbuilding-winning-and-defending-netrunner-with-willingdone/ ) and good podcasts like Run Last Click which can specialise in helping people deckbuild.

A good way to learn can be looking at other decks built by other people and examining why the work the way they do. If you search on Netrunnerdb, you can filter by the packs you own. This will let you see only decks you can actually build. Find ones that look like fun and have good writeups. Look at the ways they put them together and see if you can make the playlines happen yourself. By understanding how to exploit ID strengths by looking at other examples, you'll get a better idea of the strengths and weaknesses of your own cards.

https://netrunnerdb.com/en/decklists/search#allowed_packs

Afriscipio posted:

There's a new article on Netrunners.co.uk about deck building.
http://netrunners.co.uk/art-deck-building/

Thanks guys! I've very much come at netrunner from a board gaming angle rather than a CCG angle (never played M:tG or anything like that), so these will be really helpful for a newbie, cheers.

# ? Jan 11, 2017 23:04

fozzy fosbourne: Apr 21, 2010

The feeling when you come back after months and learn Lukas has left us for a ccg

# ? Jan 12, 2017 04:19

Machai: Feb 21, 2013

Dr. Angela Ziegler posted:

Netrunner discussion: what color is quetzel's dress?

trick question, she is wearing a jumpsuit

# ? Jan 12, 2017 13:04

TheParadigm: Dec 10, 2009

Dr. Angela Ziegler posted:

Netrunner discussion: what color is quetzel's dress?

Trick question.

It is colored green and made of boom, just like my scorched earth policy.

# ? Jan 13, 2017 17:22

Cyberius: Sep 24, 2007; Totally Fake

The FFG guys messed up by not making card 120 a Terminal Operation.

# ? Jan 14, 2017 17:18

Plavski: Feb 1, 2006; I could be a revolutionary

Quorum got fully spoiled btw: http://imgur.com/gallery/rAC2Q https://netrunnerdb.com/en/set/qu

And no, Sifr wasn't mistranslated. Exciting times ahead!

# ? Jan 16, 2017 12:43

Zephro: Nov 23, 2000; I suppose I could part with one and still be feared...

I hope Psychokinesis turns out to be good.

I wonder if there's enough influence in Kit to run SIFR, Parasite and recursion. Between blowing up all the ICE and Kit's ability you could probably spend most of the game with Zu as your only installed breaker.

# ? Jan 16, 2017 13:39

Yithian: Jun 19, 2005

Three copies of Sifr, three Clone Chips and a single Parastie would cost you 9 of Rielle's 10 influence. Between Test Run and Self-Modifying Code you could probably make it happen but I don't know if you'd have enough influence left over for all the other stuff she'd need.

# ? Jan 16, 2017 14:26

Zephro: Nov 23, 2000; I suppose I could part with one and still be feared...

Yeah, that's basically where I've got to, though I'm wondering whether to go down to two SIFRs and add the Artist Colony / Fan Site package to give you a bit of game against rush decks and to save an influence point that could go on Legwork as well as R&DI. (The second SIFR would just be backup in case they're packing hardware destruction). Then add the usual Film Critic, Net Shield, NACH to prevent Corp shenanigans, a copy or two of Interdiction as a counter-current and some economy.

edit: something like this, though this is just a rough version I threw together in 10 minutes:

quote:

Rielle "Kit" Peddler: Transhuman

Event (10)
3x Dirty Laundry
1x Legwork ●●
1x Levy AR Lab Access
3x Sure Gamble
2x Test Run
3x Modded

Hardware (10)
3x Clone Chip ★★★
2x Deep Red ●●
1x Feedback Filter
1x Plascrete Carapace
3x R&D Interface

Resource (15)
3x Artist Colony
1x Beth Kilrain-Chang
3x Daily Casts
3x Fan Site
1x Film Critic
1x New Angeles City Hall
1x Same Old Thing

Icebreaker (3)
1x Inti
1x Pipeline
1x ZU.13 Key Master

Program (7)
1x Magnum Opus
1x Parasite ★ ●●
1x Paricia
3x Self-modifying Code

6 influence spent (max 10-4★=6, available 0)
45 cards (min 45)

The Colonies and Fan Sites can become SIFR food once you're set up. Though it might be worth finding room for 3 x Modded given that SIFR and Mopus cost 5 each and R&DI is 4. Double sentries / double barriers make you sad once you've exhausted your 8 parasites, but hopefully you've won before then.

edit: also I'm dumb, you don't need Kati and Mopus so I've swapped Kati and a Mopus for 3 x Modded.

Zephro fucked around with this message at 16:39 on Jan 16, 2017

# ? Jan 16, 2017 16:26

Yithian: Jun 19, 2005

You could always throw in a Levy AR Lab Access to double the fun

# ? Jan 16, 2017 16:32

Relyssa: Jul 29, 2012

Is a single parasite enough? I know influence is tight in Kit, but I'd be afraid of never seeing the parasite when I needed it.

# ? Jan 16, 2017 16:35

Zephro: Nov 23, 2000; I suppose I could part with one and still be feared...

Kaethela posted:

Is a single parasite enough? I know influence is tight in Kit, but I'd be afraid of never seeing the parasite when I needed it.

Well, between Test Run, SMC and Artist Colony you should be able to tutor it up reasonably quickly.

quote:

You could always throw in a Levy AR Lab Access to double the fun

Yeah, there's a LARLA in there.

# ? Jan 16, 2017 16:41

General Battuta: Feb 7, 2011; This is how you communicate with a fellow intelligence: you hurt it, you keep on hurting it, until you can distinguish the posts from the screams.

I quit this game way back during Spin when everything was sansan/astrotrain and I stopped having fun. I don't want to get back in due to the 947281005838 years of card and meta catch-up involved, but I'm curious. Did yellow ever get bad, did money-green ever get good?

# ? Jan 19, 2017 01:34

Yithian: Jun 19, 2005

Nope

# ? Jan 19, 2017 01:41

The Duchess Smackarse: May 8, 2012; by Lowtax

They made it so that astroscript is now a max 1-of in a deck instead of 3, which seems to have hurt yellow pretty good. I'm just getting into the game myself and there is a lot of variety in the decks I've seen played.

# ? Jan 19, 2017 01:41

General Battuta: Feb 7, 2011; This is how you communicate with a fellow intelligence: you hurt it, you keep on hurting it, until you can distinguish the posts from the screams.

Also did they ever make the game about ice breaking or is it still mostly about how to avoid advancing agendas or ever interacting with ice directly.

It always saddened me a little that the game has sooo much ice and yet most of the subroutines will barely ever fire - much of the time ice just reduces to a cost-to-break or a quick trick to bypass. So many of the strong archetypes when I played (both fast advance and anarch denial/destruction) seemed to be about bypassing the heart of the game.

# ? Jan 19, 2017 01:57

Cinnamon Bear: Aug 29, 2016; by FactsAreUseless

General Battuta posted:

Also did they ever make the game about ice breaking or is it still mostly about how to avoid advancing agendas or ever interacting with ice directly.

It always saddened me a little that the game has sooo much ice and yet most of the subroutines will barely ever fire - much of the time ice just reduces to a cost-to-break or a quick trick to bypass. So many of the strong archetypes when I played (both fast advance and anarch denial/destruction) seemed to be about bypassing the heart of the game.

It got worse as more decks simply went horizontal and didn't play any ice, and relied on massive costs to trash all the assets they were vomiting out

# ? Jan 19, 2017 02:06

Yithian: Jun 19, 2005

Now it's about trashing ice over and over until the Corp loses the will to live and concedes.

As Corp you basically just tag the runner and trade them 1-point agendas for 3-point agendas you intentionally let them steal.

# ? Jan 19, 2017 02:07

berenzen: Jan 23, 2012

Ehhh. If ICE fires in the late game, a lot of the time it's such a massive hit to the runner, so ICE will usually rarely ever fire unless it costs less to trash it than fire it. This is always been a thing.

berenzen fucked around with this message at 02:13 on Jan 19, 2017

# ? Jan 19, 2017 02:09

fomo sacer: Feb 14, 2007

General Battuta posted:

Also did they ever make the game about ice breaking or is it still mostly about how to avoid advancing agendas or ever interacting with ice directly.

There was a good 1.5-2 years where the arguably best decks in the game (well, the decks which dominated regionals and won worlds, at least) were based around advancing and scoring 4/2 and 5/3 agendas (and, later, some 3/2s when the faction changed) in a remote server. Luckily, a powerful hate card to that strategy was printed so we are once again saved from the tyranny of building scoring remotes.

# ? Jan 19, 2017 02:34

fomo sacer: Feb 14, 2007

Also once they printed the card that let you spend 2 clicks to make $13, big money weyland where you would try to score out all 7 points from a remote protected by just ashe and big ice was pretty good for a decent chunk of time as well.

# ? Jan 19, 2017 02:42

fozzy fosbourne: Apr 21, 2010

All this talk just makes me want to do some drafting.

# ? Jan 19, 2017 03:04

Midjack: Dec 24, 2007

fozzy fosbourne posted:

All this talk just makes me want to do some drafting.

- Lyndon B. Johnson, August 26, 1965

# ? Jan 19, 2017 03:28

Machai: Feb 21, 2013

fozzy fosbourne posted:

All this talk just makes me want to do some drafting.

just did a 1v1 draft for the first time tonight and boy did corp win easily. it can be pretty hard to get a decent breaker suite going in draft and also maybe have enough draw/tutoring to get it out at a decent speed. I think now with SIFR I might just do drafts with my friends instead or even just ban SIFR in our group.

I was able to draft both jacksons and the museum along with a mushin and like 5 trap assets. I played that one mushin like 5 times and used it plus TotL on a NAPD to finally score out while museum kept me from milling out. Then for the runner game all my breakers were on the bottom and the corp got a lot of drip economy out and just scored while I dug for breakers.

# ? Jan 19, 2017 04:36

fozzy fosbourne: Apr 21, 2010

Machai posted:

just did a 1v1 draft for the first time tonight and boy did corp win easily. it can be pretty hard to get a decent breaker suite going in draft and also maybe have enough draw/tutoring to get it out at a decent speed. I think now with SIFR I might just do drafts with my friends instead or even just ban SIFR in our group.

I was able to draft both jacksons and the museum along with a mushin and like 5 trap assets. I played that one mushin like 5 times and used it plus TotL on a NAPD to finally score out while museum kept me from milling out. Then for the runner game all my breakers were on the bottom and the corp got a lot of drip economy out and just scored while I dug for breakers.

Did you guys use the web app or a cube? Packs? Which drafting starters did you use?

# ? Jan 19, 2017 06:12

The Deleter: May 22, 2010

I don't know if people here ever need a reminder not to go on the Netrunner subreddit, but holy poo poo don't go on the Netrunner subreddit.

# ? Jan 19, 2017 10:25

Zephro: Nov 23, 2000; I suppose I could part with one and still be feared...

There was a good thread there the other day saying the biggest single problem for new Netrunner players was the relentlessly negativity of the Netrunner subreddit.

This thread is pretty down on the game too

# ? Jan 19, 2017 10:36

Yithian: Jun 19, 2005

I still enjoy playing but the designers' seeming laser focus on making ice irrelevant is really testing that.

Red Sand looks like it's going to be the shot in the arm that Weyland needs, at least.

# ? Jan 19, 2017 12:04

berenzen: Jan 23, 2012

Honestly, ICE is really kind of binary. Either it matters, or it doesn't, and it depends on who has control of the board state at that point. What's a 1-time cost of 4 credits for a corp can end up costing the runner 20-30 credits. So runners are forced to find ways to do 1 of 3 things. Break the ICE cheaply with shaper bullshit, bypass the ICE with criminal tricks, or destroy the ICE with anarch bullshit. This isn't new, and has always been a thing in the game. Big ICE needs ways to get around them inexpensively, otherwise you totally lock a runner out of the game. The whole reason why criminals are in a bad place in the meta right now is because there are a whole bunch of cheap to rez, expensive to break ICE, and criminals don't have enough tricks to be able to do it the whole game.

The only time that you should ever expect a subroutine to fire is when it's first rezzed, and the runner can't afford to break it or doesn't have the necessary breaker. After that, it becomes a check on the runner to see if they have enough credits and the requisite breaker, or some trick to get around it. If it was any more than that, the game either becomes needlessly complex or swings wildly in the corporations favour. Because if the runner has no way to get through something like a Janus, without bruteforcing it for a billion credits, then Blue Sun becomes ridiculously broken, because they have ways of getting the ability to rez crazy expensive ICE turn 2.

# ? Jan 19, 2017 12:34

Yithian: Jun 19, 2005

I don't really disagree with any of that but it does mean that big ice is basically just a trap for the corp. If big ice just gets bullshitted past and little ice is trivial to get past then I have to wonder how the corp is supposed to score agendas out of a remote. The answer used to be "with defensive upgrades like Ash or Caprice" but that gameplan doesn't really work anymore.

I guess my main complaint right now is that playing corp in the current meta just feels like I'm huddled in the corner begging the runner to stop hurting me and that feels awfully weird given the cyberpunk setting. Maybe that's what they intended for the Flashpoint cycle though.

# ? Jan 19, 2017 15:11

CodfishCartographer: Feb 23, 2010; Gadus Maprocephalus; Pillbug

Ice is binary, but ideally that binary state changes throughout the game and that�s what makes (made) ice interesting. When you�re new to netrunner and playing with other newbies, ice serves the purpose of shifting the balance of power back and forth. The pacing of the games tend to go:

Both players are at zero, and are trying to outpace the other. Balance of power is equal.
Corp gets some cheap binary ice out, locking out the runner. The runner is now focused on building up their rig to handle those defenses, and the corp has a chance to get a lead and score some agendas. Balance of power goes towards the corp.
The runner gets some of their rig up, and enough economy to start making runs without worrying about cheap ice. The corp goes on the backfoot to try and get better defenses while the runner gets to catch up / surpass the corp. Balance of power shifts to the runner.
Repeat steps 2 and 3 as the corp gets more economy for stronger ice, and the runner gets better economy to deal with it.
Eventually the corp gets really expensive endgame ice that will probably lock the runner out. However, the runner will probably have enough econ to make one or two runs, which will likely be enough to end the game. The balance of power here is, once again, equal. At this point the game is about analyzing risks and bluffs to try and trick your opponent into making a mistake.

I personally really loved this shifting power dynamic that was built into the game when I first started, but then as you get better and more serious about the game you realize the best way to play is to�kind of just ignore all of it and rush rush rush blow everything up

# ? Jan 19, 2017 17:28

The Duchess Smackarse: May 8, 2012; by Lowtax

Core set is the best set

# ? Jan 19, 2017 17:35

StashAugustine: Mar 24, 2013; Do not trust in hope- it will betray you! Only faith and hatred sustain.

Core set is loaded with a bunch of poo poo cards and is really inconsistent, and the best runner is Gabe with Parasites.

# ? Jan 19, 2017 17:46

The Duchess Smackarse: May 8, 2012; by Lowtax

Nah the best runner is Kate with 2 wyldsides

# ? Jan 19, 2017 18:39

Machai: Feb 21, 2013

fozzy fosbourne posted:

Did you guys use the web app or a cube? Packs? Which drafting starters did you use?

I used the "official" stimhack cube and the 1v1 9-grid rules listed here

# ? Jan 19, 2017 21:23

ZorajitZorajit: Sep 15, 2013; No static at all...

Huh, apparently people still enjoy playing Netrunner. Like these dorks from Reddit. Hey, whatever brings joy.

# ? Jan 19, 2017 22:05

Shrecknet: Jan 2, 2005

Holy poo poo CodeMarvelous's new stream uses Special Offer and Friends in High Places to hilarious effect in Spark.

# ? Jan 19, 2017 22:14

The Deleter: May 22, 2010

Dr. Angela Ziegler posted:

Holy poo poo CodeMarvelous's new stream uses Special Offer and Friends in High Places to hilarious effect in Spark.

I need to check this out. NBN Glacier is my other weakness besides Weyland.

# ? Jan 19, 2017 22:57

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# ? May 21, 2024 11:31

Relyssa: Jul 29, 2012

I gave that Sleeper Hold deck a try the other day and won two games in a row with it. The first by scoring six points and sleepers (watching the runner panic during their turn was the greatest thing ever) and the second by scoring out a GFI from hand.

# ? Jan 19, 2017 23:00

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Traditional Games > NetRunner: More Unapproachable than a rezzed Curtain Wall

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