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Should it be legal for other people to assault you if they disagree with you? This poll is closed. |
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183 | 49.06% |
| No |
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190 | 50.94% |
| Total: | 328 votes | ||
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The idea that we need to treat all political perspectives as mere discourse, protected by the norms of civil conversation is a fine and good idea when the radical right isn't taking over the government and threatening to overturn all political norms. White nationalist ethnic cleansing has an extremely real threat of becoming an accepted view, and that cannot happen. The previous norms of politics are being upended, and it is our responsibility to force Nazis back into their hidey holes and bed sheets and let it be known that their views cannot be on the table for mainstream political discussion.
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Jan 22, 2017 23:31
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Shbobdb posted:Are you saying that being a Nazi is an intrinsic and inseparable aspect of a person's identity? That they have no choice in the matter and will simply always be Nazis? how's the racist tree thing work, is that like when you cut down the tree, dig up the stump, burn all the seeds, dig out a twelve-foot pit where the stump once stood and dump all the dirt into a blast furnace, then salt an ever-widening ring of soil around where the tree once stood in a kind of paranoid weekly ceremony until the county tells you to stop before you destroy every piece of property in the area because they're nazi sympathizers who don't understand
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Jan 22, 2017 23:32
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Doorknob Slobber posted:hate speech isn't mere speech Hate Speech isn't real, friend.
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Jan 22, 2017 23:33
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Arguing against the analogy is embarrassingly sophomoric drivel.
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Jan 22, 2017 23:34
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I'm pretty sure we all agree that if you were living in a Nazi-occupied country, it would be moral to murder Nazis. That means there's some kind of moral continuum here that has to do with the political context you live in.
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Jan 22, 2017 23:35
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The handwringers itt are exactly the kind of people who will ensure that fascism comes to power, not because they voted for them but because they treat it as a continuity of normalcy because you'd rather tacitly approve what should never be approved.
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Jan 22, 2017 23:35
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AARO posted:Arguing against the analogy is embarrassingly sophomoric drivel. You are embarassingly sophomoric drivel.
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Jan 22, 2017 23:35
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Pittsburgh Lambic posted:how's the racist tree thing work, is that like when you cut down the tree, dig up the stump, burn all the seeds, dig out a twelve-foot pit where the stump once stood and dump all the dirt into a blast furnace, then salt an ever-widening ring of soil around where the tree once stood in a kind of paranoid weekly ceremony until the county tells you to stop before you destroy every piece of property in the area because they're nazi sympathizers who don't understand I'd be cool with something like that. It's obviously something that needs doing. Maybe we can inter the ashes in some kind of yucca mountain site type thing so dumb basement dwelling nerds with deep-seated sexual issues don't dig up and rediscover it.
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Jan 22, 2017 23:36
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Pittsburgh Lambic posted:how's the racist tree thing work quote:The Racist Tree Ideally, you'd make the racist tree not racist, but simply shaming the racist tree so it can no longer act on its racism is positive social progress.
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Jan 22, 2017 23:38
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AARO posted:You people make the stupidest arguments. are you really trying to argue that your hypothetical gay man wouldn't be punched for being gay without outing himself because he's your hypothetical gay man and you set the rules for what happens to him? cause in your question you asked if he would be punched if he did not speak. and i listed a few that still fit with your scenario but disproved your supposition Condiv fucked around with this message at 23:42 on Jan 22, 2017 |
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Jan 22, 2017 23:39
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Jan 22, 2017 23:41
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Condiv posted:are you really trying to argue that your hypothetical gay man wouldn't be punched for being gay without outing himself because he's your hypothetical gay man and you set the rules for what happens to him? In the situation I set forth the reason he was punched was for stating that he was gay. It was not his being gay that triggered the punch, it was that he had spoken such.
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Jan 22, 2017 23:43
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Christ alive.
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Jan 22, 2017 23:44
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Punch the Nazi
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Jan 22, 2017 23:44
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AARO posted:In the situation I set forth the reason he was punched was for stating that he was gay. It was not his being gay that triggered the punch, it was that he had spoken such. In the situation you set forth he was punched for saying that he was gay, thus marking him as a member of the human category "gay", thus establishing that he is indeed gay. He wasn't punched for an idea, he was punched for who he was.
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Jan 22, 2017 23:45
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I will punch AARO
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Jan 22, 2017 23:51
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Calibanibal posted:I will punch AARO I'll hold him you hit him. 
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Jan 22, 2017 23:52
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Calibanibal posted:I will punch AARO here
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Jan 22, 2017 23:53
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Doorknob Slobber posted:I think a fallacy in US society that a lot of people(especially white liberals and conservatives) have bought into is this notion that all acts of violence are equally wrong. This idea is something you often see on TV and in movies. The fallacy is that all opinions are valid. That's what's being argued in the thread. That people are entitled to want to tear down the pillars of our society while hiding behind them.
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Jan 23, 2017 00:10
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SHY NUDIST GRRL posted:The fallacy is that all opinions are valid. That's what's being argued in the thread. That people are entitled to want to tear down the pillars of our society while hiding behind them. Not an empty quote. This is why Rust Belters love the idea of "Coastal Elites in their Ivory Towers" or "Starbucks/Limosine Liberals".
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Jan 23, 2017 00:15
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Did you know it was illegal to help slaves escape? committing a crime 
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Jan 23, 2017 00:58
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You can't punch Nazis, you'll be setting a poor example that will lead to more Nazi punching!
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Jan 23, 2017 01:19
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Ghost of Reagan Past posted:Did you know it was illegal to help slaves escape? didn't you know? if you help slaves escape it sets a precedent for stealing property, then you're embracing the norm of a lawless society. geez people, there's a reason we have these social and legal norms. <  >
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Jan 23, 2017 01:20
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You'll be tearing apart the social and political norms that Nazis themselves are diligently working to tear apart, even as a write this, if you punch Nazis! Better to let them do their work out in the open and in peace  After they're finished we can have a nice chat with them, if they're up for it.
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Jan 23, 2017 01:21
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yellowyams posted:didn't you know? if you help slaves escape it sets a precedent for stealing property, then you're embracing the norm of a lawless society. geez people, there's a reason we have these social and legal norms. 
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Jan 23, 2017 01:23
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Did you know if you post a bunch of straw man arguments you're a loving idiot?
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Jan 23, 2017 01:27
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AARO posted:Did you know if you post a bunch of straw man arguments you're a loving idiot?
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Jan 23, 2017 01:29
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Kilroy posted:Slippery slope arguments are okay though? All the arguments I have presented in this thread are iron clad and no one has even made a serious attempt to refute a single thing I've said.
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Jan 23, 2017 01:30
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AARO posted:All the arguments I have presented in this thread are iron clad and no one has even made a serious attempt to refute a single thing I've said. Nice meltdown.
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Jan 23, 2017 01:31
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AARO posted:Did you know if you post a bunch of straw man arguments you're a loving idiot? Did you know modern events have a historical context? It's a secret, don't tell anyone.
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Jan 23, 2017 01:34
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AARO posted:All the arguments I have presented in this thread are iron clad and no one has even made a serious attempt to refute a single thing I've said. laffo
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Jan 23, 2017 01:34
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AARO posted:All the arguments I have presented in this thread are iron clad and no one has even made a serious attempt to refute a single thing I've said. Or do you just mean that thinking a thing is true really hard ought to count for something when making an argument?
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Jan 23, 2017 01:36
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AARO posted:All the arguments I have presented in this thread are iron clad and no one has even made a serious attempt to refute a single thing I've said. it's your fault for assuming people wanted to discuss the issue rather than live out violent fantasies it makes more sense if you think of debate & discussion as being like dungeons & dragons except with nazis instead of orcs
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Jan 23, 2017 01:37
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Pittsburgh Lambic posted:it's your fault for assuming people wanted to discuss the issue rather than live out violent fantasies you have been consistently wrong on everything you've posted here, and every time you're gracefully retreated, saying "i don't know enough about this, i haven't read up on that". yet at no point of the discussion you've managed to make the mental connection to realize that, holy poo poo, maybe you should read some loving books before you dump your sophomoric mental ejaculations all over us. and now you actually post some smug "people here just don't think" poo poo.
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Jan 23, 2017 01:39
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Pittsburgh Lambic posted:it's your fault for assuming people wanted to discuss the issue rather than live out violent fantasies Seriously? If that's all this is I can totally respect that. It really does explain the lack of cogent responses.
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Jan 23, 2017 01:40
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Pittsburgh Lambic posted:it's your fault for assuming people wanted to discuss the issue rather than live out violent fantasies Hi, quick question, did you see the cartoon I posted earlier in the thread? Which side do you think you would have been on when that came out?
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Jan 23, 2017 01:41
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Pittsburgh Lambic posted:it's your fault for assuming people wanted to discuss the issue rather than live out violent fantasies
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Jan 23, 2017 01:43
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As someone living in a comfortable white suburb calling for peace and nonviolence, unlike Antifa and BLM protesters, I'm pretty sure I would have marched with MLK and fought against Hitler had I been living in those eras.
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Jan 23, 2017 01:44
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yellowyams posted:Hi, quick question, did you see the cartoon I posted earlier in the thread? Which side do you think you would have been on when that came out? nope i mean i don't like nazis but i like violence even less, and posters in the thread got kinda weird and tinfoil-ish about trump and the impending trump disasters, so it all just seems kind of silly from outsider's perspective to see people advocating fisticuffs and rebellion against the white supremacist capitalist patriarchy or w/e i'm supposed to call it
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Jan 23, 2017 01:53
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