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Brony Hunter posted:Starting a new game soon, and one of my players is requesting to play a melee class that uses illusions and trickery and "debuffs" rather than raw martial ability. Anyone got any ideas for playbooks? The only ones I know of are the Ninja and maybe the Walker or Assassin.
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Nov 5, 2016 13:48
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Brony Hunter posted:Starting a new game soon, and one of my players is requesting to play a melee class that uses illusions and trickery and "debuffs" rather than raw martial ability. Anyone got any ideas for playbooks? I'd probably suggest either the Spellsword or the Masked Mage. Although the masked mage isn't quite that fighty, especially with its low damage die. But you could always combine the two, because the Spellsword has a starting move that lets it poach a magic-using move from another playbook, letting you steal the illusion generating move from masked mage!
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Nov 5, 2016 13:48
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In the end, I decided the why was less important than the immediate threats. Based on what the players have been interested in, I'm setting up 3 dangers: a religious faction who claim to be the new path of Truth, a faction of Undead who try to assimilate everyone, eliminating the need to worry about things like the weather or food, and the weird weather itself. I think that what exactly happened to the gods will keep coming out in play.
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Nov 5, 2016 14:25
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Gameko posted:Well, my first session of dungeon world went OK. The players were down with a post apocalyptic setting, and in true dungeon world fashion we're still collectively figuring out what that means. Write your theories as questions that you can explore. "Did the Gods ascend to another plane? Were they all murdered? Was it a divine war that ended in mutual destruction? Are they just fed up with us and abandoned us?" Also don't be afraid of cliches, especially when improvising. They act as cultural common ground that you and the players can riff on and make your own. Good answers will almost always arrive organically if you explore the questions at the table and follow your groups excitement and interest around. Human brains are pattern recognition machines, if you keep an eye out for enforcing what has already been established, you'll regularly come out with something that both makes sense and surprises you as the GM at the same time.
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Nov 5, 2016 23:18
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madadric posted:Write your theories as questions that you can explore. All of this is excellent advise.
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Nov 13, 2016 10:02
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So are they ever going to finish Juntu's and Inglorious? It's been, like, years at this point.
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Nov 28, 2016 19:46
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madadric posted:Write your theories as questions that you can explore. "Why did the gods abandon the Earth?" is way more pointed and gives more direction to play than just basically asking "What happened to the gods?" and forcing your players to figure everything out on their own. The latter is like giving the players a blank sheet of paper, the former is drawing maps and leaving blanks.
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Nov 28, 2016 22:16
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BinaryDoubts posted:So are they ever going to finish Juntu's and Inglorious? It's been, like, years at this point. Given how they handled the Immolator - I think it was about a year after originally advertised for one character class that they had finished and already sent out to people who donated to a charity - I wouldn't really hold my breath.
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Nov 30, 2016 23:10
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SO I'm not sure if this is better placed here or in the PbtA thread but I figured since it's about a DW product specifically I'm better off asking in this thread... So I'm about to start running a game for my usual gaming group and wanted to run Legacy: Life Among the Ruins. I've run Dungeon World for them before and they've enjoyed it, the only problem is I know a few of my players generally prefer a bit more crunch in their systems than L:LAtR offers with its character creation options. Enter Class Warfare. I figure the heavier customization options CW offers will be a very nice compromise as far as crunch vs fluff goes. So my basic plan is to use Dungeon World stats and character creation rules for the character level and Legacy rules and the family playbooks for the Family level. The only hitch in this plan is that I need to modify Class Warfare a bit to fit into the more modern, post-apocalyptic setting I'm working with. I think I've done a decent job so far: Rogues and Warriors remain pretty much unchanged, Adventurers, Magicians and Disciples have been replaced with Explorers, Diplomats and Techies. I've shifted a few specialties around to fit in with the new archetypes and have adapted some existing classes from Legacy and third party sources to the Class Warfare system to fill in the gaps. The only thing I'm hitting a wall on is the race options, for diplomats especially. The setting I'm working with has a bunch of different non-human races (No humans at all, actually) so race options need to be a thing. I've been filling in the details as I go thus far by just adapting race options from the existing playbooks and class options but there are a few cases where I'm going to have to invent race options out of whole cloth and I just can't seem to think of anything appropriate. Basically: Anyone have any advice on coming up with custom race options? I'm at sort of a loss.
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Dec 3, 2016 19:48
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While it's not a direct solution to your specific problem, Inverse World solved this pretty handily by replacing Race with Drive and decoupling race from class entirely. The only advantages to taking a specific race are all in-fiction.
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Dec 3, 2016 20:41
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EscortMission posted:While it's not a direct solution to your specific problem, Inverse World solved this pretty handily by replacing Race with Drive and decoupling race from class entirely. The only advantages to taking a specific race are all in-fiction. Yeah, pretty much the only reason I'm actually using races specifically is because the fact that there are a bunch of non-human races is important to the setting itself: It's a fantasy world where the non-human creations of humanity are trying to rebuild civilization after all the humans disappeared and everything went to hell
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Dec 3, 2016 20:46
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KingKalamari posted:Yeah, pretty much the only reason I'm actually using races specifically is because the fact that there are a bunch of non-human races is important to the setting itself: It's a fantasy world where the non-human creations of humanity are trying to rebuild civilization after all the humans disappeared and everything went to hell Replace the race rules with Heritage Moves from Planarch Codex: Dark Heart of The Dreamer. It's free at the link.
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Dec 3, 2016 23:47
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KingKalamari posted:Basically: Anyone have any advice on coming up with custom race options? I'm at sort of a loss. Are you having trouble coming up with races, or coming up with abilities to fit pre-existing races? How non-human are the races, something like humans with gills that can breathe under water? Or is it more like Fish men, not at all human looking in form and function? I find that when coming up with mechanical things whole cloth, I like to work backwards by thinking of cool mechanical functions, and then explaining them after the fact with details and characterization in setting. I'd love to give you some more suggestions but I am sorta lost when it comes to your setting. Can you compare it loosely to a book/movie/comic? e: the above is a great resource as well, the Planarch Codex stuff is real ace.
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Dec 4, 2016 11:23
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TheTofuShop posted:Are you having trouble coming up with races, or coming up with abilities to fit pre-existing races? How non-human are the races, something like humans with gills that can breathe under water? Or is it more like Fish men, not at all human looking in form and function? I'm actually having trouble coming up with something to compare it to... It's sort of a post-post-apocalyptic setting, if that's a thing? Basically the idea was there was an advanced society of humans that had gotten to the point that they could genetically engineer other forms of life and used them as servants, then one day every single human on the planet vanished and the entire planet spontaneously went all Day After Tomorrow on the stuff that was left behind. The game I'm running takes place 900 years after that with the genetically engineered races having created their own civilization on top of the ruins of humanity. Maybe like a less silly version of Adventure Time possibly? The monstrous races are sort of an even mix of the two extremes you described: A few of them are basically humanoid just with some extra bits of weirdness thrown in (Head tentacles, horns, claws and the like) mixed in with some decidedly non-human races (Sapient octopi, blobs of jelly, centaurs)
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Dec 6, 2016 03:33
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Finally got a chance to run Dungeon World as a one shot adventure last night, and I think I'm in love. Everything went pretty smoothly and everyone had an awesome time. Our characters were: Bjorn Ironfist, dwarven Priest of The Crusader, a holy god of light and defender against evil. His longtime companion, the human Paladin Thaddeus. Also a follower of The Crusader. He and Bjorn have been through many battles. Their ward, Cinderclaw the Salamander. An immolator who was taken under Bjorn's wing when his fire powers destroyed his village and caused him to become outcast. The three had travelled to the new frontier of the Cursed Continent, where their church had sent out the call for heroes to defend settlements against the many dangers of the new world. I started them out inside an ancient ruin that had been converted to a church of the Crusader, but was under attack by forces of the "Sleeping Empire." Since I hadn't done much prep, I decided to let the players choose their facts when they did spout lore. So we decided the Sleeping Empire was a secret organization attempting to subvert civilization through assassination and necromantic magic. There was some sort of ancient power in this ruin that they were after. Their zombies were at the gates of the temple, and a shadowy assassin had already slipped inside! Thaddeus took on the assassin while Bjorn rallied the survivors inside the temple to retreat to the lower levels, although he had to contend with a troublesome warrior who didn't want to follow orders. Cinderclaw held off the zombie horde with his fiery magic, but may have accidentally started a major fire outside in the process... Cinderclaw also used his powers to reveal the troublesome warrior's deepest desires- to serve Dis, the living city of iron, in exchange for great power... They barricaded themselves deeper inside the temple, but now had to find their way to the central chamber, hoping to beat the Sleeping Empire to whatever lay inside. More spout lore happened, and they decided the ruin was an incredibly ancient tomb, where many underground races had fought battles in the past. Bjorn was able to decipher some of the runes on the walls and lead them deeper within. They had to pass through a large cavern swarming with Cloakers, which almost caught Bjorn unaware. Cinderclaw realized he had some cans of oil in his adventuring gear, and used it as fuel to create a shield of fire above the survivor's heads, preventing the cloakers from dropping on them. Afterwards they had to fight their way over a cracked bridge as pale things from the deep attempted to drag them into the darkness! Bjorn cast protective wards on the group and helped the NPCs accross while Thaddeus and Cinderclaw engaged in combat with the unnaturally strong pale-things. Spout lore on the pale things revealed some cool information- they detect prey with a sort of sonar, so could be confused by loud noises. Bjorn also knew legends of them- they were very sad creatures, the last of a once great race who had dwindled and been reduced to monsters. Finally the group made it to the central chamber, but were separated from the main group when they failed to traverse crumbling tunnel safely. This also resulted in a fun moment where Thaddeus got his boot stuck, but used adventuring gear for a spare set of boots. He lost the original boot and now has in his inventory "spare left boot", which he later used as a weapon. They were set upon by more zombies, assassins, and their mysterious leader. Bjorn held the zombies off with divine wards and Cinderclaw battered the assassins with waves of fire- all to give Thaddeus a chance to charge the leader and best him in single combat! However Thaddeus may have brought trouble on himself as the leader's dying words left some sort of curse on him... Inside the chamber lay three massive sarcophagi, containing the decayed bodies of ancient giants. Cinderclaw burned their bodies as tribute to the Great Flame. From the bodies the group took three great crowns, which resonate with magical power. They reunited with the other survivors and made their way to the surface. The Sleeping Empire forces had retreated, but a large portion of the town was in ruin from the fire that had swept through it. And then it was 4 in the morning, so we called it a night. So basically it was super fun, and I was surprised how easy it was to run without any prep at all. My players really enjoyed themselves too! Everything flowed nicely, we barely had to check rules, and there was almost no downtime from fun action or roleplaying. I did want some advice on a couple things though. The immolator has a power that lets him shape metal into any mundane objects, which seemed a bit unfair to the other characters when he would just turn one piece of adventuring gear into another. He also kept asking if he could forge armour out of any metal that was lying around, which also seemed a bit too powerful to me, and unfair to the Paladin who starts with armour as a major part of his class. The other thing I was having trouble with was combat. Maybe I need to do more hard moves, but it felt like I would set things up and then players would escape with high rolls on defy danger and not face too many consequences. In general the players were rolling high all game, so I didn't have many chances to use monster moves and it felt like the creatures weren't very threatening as a result. Also Thaddeus has boatloads of HP and armour, and with Bjorn healing him constantly (Bjorn has +3 to invocations or some large bonus like that) he could pretty much tank through anything. I didn't want to just take items away or do tons of damage to them without giving them a chance to escape it, but maybe I need to be more harsh on them? Another problem I had is that it felt like most characters just used the same move a lot. Thaddeus pretty much only did Hack and Slash (although he got a bit of use out of I am the Law), and Bjorn used invocation pretty much every time he had an action, since it's so powerful. It didn't bother us too much since we could describe the action in various ways, like Thaddeus slashing with his sword, or instead kicking a pale thing off a cliff. But he did at one point say "yep using hack and slash again, cause that's all I do!" So I'd like to avoid that sort of thing in the future.
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Dec 23, 2016 21:32
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The way to keep the PCs from using the same moves over and over again is to have the NPCs' actions change the fictional landscape such that the move isn't appropriate/possible. So the Tentacular Slime monster grabs Thaddeus by the sword arm - how does he get free? Or the Vorpal Harpy swoops down into Bjorn's face, attempting to tear out his eyes - can't really cast an invocation in that situation, so what does he do? In most cases this is going to be some form of "Defy Danger," but it will often be done with a stat the character doesn't necessarily excel in, which gives you more opportunities for fuckery. These aren't hard moves (the Tentacular Slime isn't tearing Thaddues' arm from its socket, the Vorpal Harpy hasn't actually ripped out Bjorn's eyes...yet), but they set up the situation and allow the fictional situation to push the PCs into taking actions that are more than just "I swing my sword again." I find that lighting people on fire or coating them in acid is a fantastic way to get them to concentrate on self-preservation. And if they don't, don't be afraid to make the hard move that you've just set up. "OK, you're on fire. What's that you say? You want to ignore the flames, gut through the pain, and swing your sword at the evil sorcerer again? OK, cool, but that sounds like Defy Danger using CON to me - hit that move and you can swing without penalty. But even if you succeed you'll still take 4 HP of damage, because your poo poo's on fire, yo."
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Dec 26, 2016 02:11
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Are there any offshoots in the Apocalypse / Dungeon World engines that have really good insanity mechanics? We're looking for something to hack into our World of Dungeons game. I'm just looking for examples I can tweak. Found a few via Google but figured I'd get a broader range asking here.
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Jan 1, 2017 04:54
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The stress mechanics of Blades in the Dark would fit nicely but that's also how that game does damage and THE core mechanic of that game.
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Jan 1, 2017 06:57
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Insanity mechanics are weird in PbTA, because stats are so simple and a -1 to a roll is staggering. There isn't a "roll to see if" thing. A few options: *Corruption from Urban Shadows. *Adjectives that flavor failure. *Offering XP when someone makes a mistake driven by psychosis.
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Jan 3, 2017 00:41
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Overemotional Robot posted:Are there any offshoots in the Apocalypse / Dungeon World engines that have really good insanity mechanics? We're looking for something to hack into our World of Dungeons game. I'm just looking for examples I can tweak. Found a few via Google but figured I'd get a broader range asking here. There's a PBTA hack of Delta Green called Foxtrot Orange that has Sanity mechanics. Would you mind sharing us a story about your World of Dungeons game? I'm interested to find out how it holds up in actual play given the paucity of mechanics and the extremely short description of what spellcasting is like.
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Jan 3, 2017 01:12
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With WOD you could set up a San stat for doing mythos stuff like using eldritch spirits for spells or resisting insanity, and just have real freaky consequences for failure. There's only Defy Danger in WOD and it uses gold=xp so custom moves wouldn't work, but it fits well with the character disposability, skills, abilities and magic system. There's also Black Stars Rise, which is a horror game with an interesting approach to damage (Basically Moves get damaged and turned into an inferior version) and you can develop specific insanities from failing those. It's not a perfect system since having specific, yet random insanities often doesn't fit with what's going on, but it's an interesting twist on the formula. Wrestlepig fucked around with this message at 23:17 on Jan 3, 2017 |
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Jan 3, 2017 01:36
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Re: Juntu and Inglorious - "We've incorporated all Inglorious changes and are just in the laborious process of production. We work mostly with part-time artists so we try to be respectful of their schedules and let them do things on their own time. Once we have everything we'll send it out." Honestly I've never really cared too much about actually getting/using either (especially as I've moved on from DW as my system of choice), but good that they're still coming out. Eventually.
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Jan 5, 2017 00:26
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I'm going to be running a DW game in the near future because the book was a solid read and the system seems very fun. It's looking like the setting will be very early final fantasy influenced (crystals and poo poo that are linked to classes/playbooks), are there any suggestions on what playbooks to run that would fit that thematic strongly? The core ones seem fine as a starting point, but I'm definitely open to suggestion, and any new DM advice for DW.
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Jan 8, 2017 02:58
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Some of the best advice for running any PBtA game is to actually read Apocalypse World itself. There's a ton of fantastic advice in there about how these sorts of games are actually run/played.
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Jan 8, 2017 04:17
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So how do I get better enounters to encourage the bard in my group to do more than sit in the back of fights and buff our Paladin and Barb? Just have more threats get past them? Or are there things I can do to try to make him use his class more in fights?
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Jan 11, 2017 00:57
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The Glumslinger posted:So how do I get better enounters to encourage the bard in my group to do more than sit in the back of fights and buff our Paladin and Barb? Just have more threats get past them? Or are there things I can do to try to make him use his class more in fights? Throw obstacles near him that only he can react to, or that singing won't solve. "Being in the back, you notice a trap door opens above, with an assassin ready to spring out and shank the unaware paladin in the blink of an eye. What do you do?" "The constant singing you're providing is working wonders, as well as echoing loudly and attracting more attention. Two of the archers in the back steel their gaze on you, and you can hear footsteps of reinforcements coming near the door just behind you!"
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Jan 11, 2017 02:28
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The Glumslinger posted:So how do I get better enounters to encourage the bard in my group to do more than sit in the back of fights and buff our Paladin and Barb? Just have more threats get past them? Or are there things I can do to try to make him use his class more in fights? Is the Bard bored and looking for more to do, or enjoying their support role? Perhaps introduce a rival they can have battle of the bards/dueling banjos/rap battle scene with.
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Jan 12, 2017 01:47
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OK, so I know that levels don't work the same way as in normal D&D, but is a troll too much to throw at a level one group as a dungeon boss? I know that the danger of monsters in DW comes from how you run them and what you have the do, but I worry that I might have to tone it down so much that it wouldn't be a cool fight. Alternately, any ideas for a more reasonable level 1 boss that would conceivably be in a cave/dungeon? I was having trouble finding much I liked in the DW book
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Jan 19, 2017 20:25
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The Glumslinger posted:OK, so I know that levels don't work the same way as in normal D&D, but is a troll too much to throw at a level one group as a dungeon boss? I know that the danger of monsters in DW comes from how you run them and what you have the do, but I worry that I might have to tone it down so much that it wouldn't be a cool fight. My response to this is just to quote you, "levels don't work the same way as in normal D&D." :P Dungeon World characters don't gain HP as they level, there are no attack bonuses or AC to scale against, damage stays fairly constant, and so on. The only problem I could see is that a level 1 party is less likely to have access to sources of fire or acid damage, and regeneration is the coolest part of the troll. What I would recommend is you set up hints that a troll is coming and give them opportunities to get their hands on sources of fire and acid damage -- for a cost, of course.
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Jan 19, 2017 21:04
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admanb posted:My response to this is just to quote you, "levels don't work the same way as in normal D&D." :P Dungeon World characters don't gain HP as they level, there are no attack bonuses or AC to scale against, damage stays fairly constant, and so on. Yeah, I think I might just table the troll for now and just go with a buffed up orc or goblin or something, and save the troll for when I can make it more of the star of a battle, rather than just the thing at the end of the dungeon.
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Jan 19, 2017 21:09
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Guys, my dice let me down. I got enough failure xp last night to get to lvl 3. The rest of my group hasn't hit 2 yet. I am the worst bard.
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Jan 21, 2017 19:21
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lokipunk posted:Guys, my dice let me down. I got enough failure xp last night to get to lvl 3. The rest of my group hasn't hit 2 yet. I am the worst bard. As long as you don't end up as the most experienced bard in the graveyard.
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Jan 21, 2017 22:59
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OK, so I ended up running an Gelatinous Cube, and my PCs killed it in 3 hits. I know that the way they killed it should have been punished in the fiction (they basically stood as far from it as they could and basically swung their swords with their wrists), but I didn't know how to transfer that into anything mechanical of why they would do less damage. Is that just a thing sometimes when they roll super well that things that clearly go against a reasonable fiction just work because the dice said they did a ton of damage? Maybe I just had trouble because I didn't really envision what the cube could do to fight back since they all clearly knew to not get close to it. On the plus side, I was able to get the bard in my group much more active in combat this time, by changing the shape of the room I used for the encounter so he couldn't just hide in the back playing his lute the entire time, and he managed to get a lot of fighting done (and managed to steal the magical weapon from a bad guy, because of course he did).
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Jan 23, 2017 23:49
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The Glumslinger posted:OK, so I ended up running an Gelatinous Cube, and my PCs killed it in 3 hits. I know that the way they killed it should have been punished in the fiction (they basically stood as far from it as they could and basically swung their swords with their wrists), but I didn't know how to transfer that into anything mechanical of why they would do less damage. Is that just a thing sometimes when they roll super well that things that clearly go against a reasonable fiction just work because the dice said they did a ton of damage? Maybe I just had trouble because I didn't really envision what the cube could do to fight back since they all clearly knew to not get close to it. Remember that they don't get to decide when they're hack and slashing, you do. If you don't think their method of attack should be able to hurt the cube, it can't.
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Jan 24, 2017 00:21
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Bog-standard gelatinous cubes are a pretty lovely D&D monster, tbh. You need to give them a huge environmental advantage or unexpected capabilities (like sudden bursts of speed or a ranged attack) to be at all threatening. That said, it's certainly in your right to respond to "I stand as far back as possible and whip my sword back and forth like a whip" with "and you expect that to do what, exactly?" admanb fucked around with this message at 00:36 on Jan 24, 2017 |
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Jan 24, 2017 00:30
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The Glumslinger posted:OK, so I ended up running an Gelatinous Cube, and my PCs killed it in 3 hits. I know that the way they killed it should have been punished in the fiction (they basically stood as far from it as they could and basically swung their swords with their wrists), but I didn't know how to transfer that into anything mechanical of why they would do less damage. Is that just a thing sometimes when they roll super well that things that clearly go against a reasonable fiction just work because the dice said they did a ton of damage? Maybe I just had trouble because I didn't really envision what the cube could do to fight back since they all clearly knew to not get close to it. There should be no way for the players to roll Hack & Slash in such a way that the monster can't hit back because the move inherently contains the risk of a counterattack. They say "I stand way back and whip my sword back and forward with a wrist motion" and you say "Your sword tip draws little creases in the cube" and there's no dice rolling happening. Make it clear in your descriptions that there's no risk-free way to hit it with a hand weapon. "The cube inexorably moves towards you, forcing you to back up to maintain a safe distance, what do you do?" They come up with a clever way to damage or disable it, or they get close enough to carve chunks off and risk getting hit back, or they run away. The fiction comes first. If they're trying to do something that won't work, don't roll dice. Elector_Nerdlingen fucked around with this message at 01:17 on Jan 24, 2017 |
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Jan 24, 2017 01:11
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Well, if they roll three straight 10+s (which it sounds like is what happened) then they will successfully H&S without danger. If you want a monster to be particularly threatening they need to be taking actions in between the H&S rolls. Stuff like, "you bury your sword in the gel and start to feel a burst of electricity pumping from the massive cube through your sword and into your body" and then force a DD Dex/Str/Con (depending on how they choose to resist) to avoid taking damage, losing their weapon, or worse.
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Jan 24, 2017 01:22
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If a slashing weapon feasibly would do no damage, then they don't roll H&S, period. You say "your sword swings are inefective, it molds back into place" and because they ignored a fictional danger (swinging a bladed weapon around at a cube of jelly) you can make as hard of a move as you like. From, "As you fall back, you notice the cave is starting to shake. It must be seeping into the cracks." to "Your wild slashing splatters some acid onto your friend. They take dX damage." or even "The acid eats away at your sword. It is now a short sword, and you're going to have to sharpen it before it's effective again." That's what I thought about posting when you talked about bringing in the troll. Mechanically, a troll is not much harder to kill than an orc. Fictionally, there's a world of difference. And that's where moves come in. If they're not triggering the moves in the fiction, then they can't roll. So to take that troll battle as an example, assuming a LotR cave troll: It's running around the room, smashing into things. You can't really hurt it if you're running around at its feet swinging swords at its knees. It's too fast and powerful. You need to somehow immobilize it, get on top of it, find a weak spot, or find a quiet place to set up a bow shot (which might also require finding a weak spot).
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Jan 24, 2017 03:29
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ImpactVector posted:If a slashing weapon feasibly would do no damage, then they don't roll H&S, period. You say "your sword swings are inefective, it molds back into place" and because they ignored a fictional danger (swinging a bladed weapon around at a cube of jelly) you can make as hard of a move as you like. Thanks everyone for the advice, I'm still pretty new at DMing, so this is very good advice. A lot of it really is just learning how to interpret the rules and how to enforce the fiction, what kinds of things I can do that aren't just arbitrary dick moves
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Jan 24, 2017 04:12
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The Glumslinger posted:Thanks everyone for the advice, I'm still pretty new at DMing, so this is very good advice. A lot of it really is just learning how to interpret the rules and how to enforce the fiction, what kinds of things I can do that aren't just arbitrary dick moves In your head, "enforcing the fiction" will often sound like arbitrary dick moves. Because there's nothing in the rules that says a gelatinous cube can force you to roll a Defy Danger every time you so much as poke it with a sword, but if it fits the fiction, do it.
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Jan 24, 2017 04:22
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