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I've only ever read Heroes of the Equinox, but I really enjoyed it. Actually, it probably had a decent amount to do with my tastes in comics since I found it in the school library and of course had to read it because I'd finished all the Asterix and there were titties in it. I don't recall it being particularly wordy, but there were definitely ideas behind it that it wanted to explore more than just being an action space-opera. One of the things that stuck with me was the cool lettering the alien heroes had for their own languages.
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Jan 26, 2017 09:06
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Zachack posted:Sort of a crosspost from the digital comics thread but Comixology has all(?) of Valerian on sale right now for a pretty good price - I think the cart shows around $75 for the whole thing. Any opinions on the series? quote:e (I've been reading an old Bilal short comic and it seems super-rooted in something that has not aged), and sometimes obnoxiously "whimsical".
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Jan 26, 2017 18:59
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Alhazred posted:If you're reading the american version you're probably reading the censored version. That being said, it's a pretty fun comic and enormously influential. I haven't read any of it, and don't know if the comixology versions are censored. And I wasn't referring to Bilal as whimsical, that was a separate issue.
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Jan 26, 2017 19:38
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Teenage Fansub posted:ell, if you took away all the villains who were originally sexual predators, there wouldn't be any Teen Titan bad guys left to use! Then in the 1980s he joined the Suicide Squad because he wanted to actually succeed at something and be liked, but instead he just ends up dying. Then he comes back in the 1990s as a being of pure light who is mad at having been a joke and then dying and no one really caring. *THEN* from 2006-2010 Brad Meltzer/Dan DiDio/etc. decide to retcon that he was originally a vicious murderer and rapist who got brain damaged in an attempted brainwashing which is why he kept losing to the Teen Titans. Now that his memory is restored, he really likes raping people AND he wants to rape teenagers. Then he dies yet again. Then he hasn't been a rapist in any of the weird N52/cartoon/etc. versions, so he's really only been a sexual predator for about five years late in his 50+ year existence as a fictional character. It's *probably* something they could politely pave over with enough time/effort. Deathstroke though
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Jan 26, 2017 20:02
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Edge & Christian posted:Then he hasn't been a rapist in any of the weird N52/cartoon/etc. versions, so he's really only been a sexual predator for about five years late in his 50+ year existence as a fictional character. It's *probably* something they could politely pave over with enough time/effort. Yeah, and eventually people will stop calling Hank Pym a wife beater.
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Jan 26, 2017 20:10
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It's still the same Hank Pym so you're not wrong to still call him that.
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Jan 26, 2017 20:28
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The difference is Hank Pym was defined very early on as the dude who hit his wife, if he'd just been a superhero for a few decades and then someone wrote a story where he hit his wife, it wouldn't be such a defining moment. Like how nobody primarily thinks of Wolverine as a caveman with no nose despite that being a thing for about as long as Dr. Light was a rapist. But it's DC so it's just a matter of time until he's raping someone or having his arm ripped off by the hot new villain Dr. Rape
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Jan 26, 2017 20:49
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purple death ray posted:The difference is Hank Pym was defined very early on as the dude who hit his wife, if he'd just been a superhero for a few decades and then someone wrote a story where he hit his wife, it wouldn't be such a defining moment. Like how nobody primarily thinks of Wolverine as a caveman with no nose despite that being a thing for about as long as Dr. Light was a rapist. Yeah, Peter Parker has hit Mary Jane (and she was pregnant at the time) as many times as Han Pym hit Janet, but no one talks about that because it happened during the 90's. Also during The Clone Saga, so I think most of the people who read it have also suppressed it from their minds.
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Jan 26, 2017 20:56
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purple death ray posted:The difference is Hank Pym was defined very early on as the dude who hit his wife, if he'd just been a superhero for a few decades and then someone wrote a story where he hit his wife, it wouldn't be such a defining moment. Like how nobody primarily thinks of Wolverine as a caveman with no nose despite that being a thing for about as long as Dr. Light was a rapist. Then the Ultimates basically reintroduced the original Avengers to a new generation and they amplified the poo poo out of "Hank Pym, Wifebeater" and then the mainline Marvel Universe re-prosecuted that moment at least three times in the course of a decade so yes, it became his defining thing. It's kind of like how a lot of people still look at the sort of DO YOU THINK THIS A STANDS FOR FRANCE? Ultimates version of cranky old man Cap and think that is the traditional/main version of Captain America, except at least Steve Rogers has a bunch of movies and the very popular Ed Brubaker run to serve as counterbalance/direct repudiation of that version of the character, but Hank Pym doesn't have any of that because no one is reading 1980s Roger Stern/Steve Englehart Avengers (or the Clone Saga for Wife Beatin' Pete, or Ostrander Suicide Squad for rape-free Doctor Light) On the other hand, more people have watched Teen Titans Go than have read Identity Crisis (or subsequent DC One Year Greater stories) or have read the Judas Contract for that matter, so it's possible that Dr Light and Deathstroke's sex crimes that have been essentially retconned away could fade. Edge & Christian fucked around with this message at 21:03 on Jan 26, 2017 |
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Jan 26, 2017 20:58
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Aphrodite posted:It's still the same Hank Pym so you're not wrong to still call him that.
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Jan 26, 2017 21:07
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Well "Hank Pym: Wifebeater" was a well worn joke back in Wizard in the early 90s so I don't think you can blame the ultimate universe on that one. I think it's more that Hank is a lovely character with little to no personality beyond "nerd, can't stick with a superhero identity, hits his wife". So that's all anybody remembers about him.
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Jan 26, 2017 21:17
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At the time that Peter hit MJ he wasn't the "real" Peter and it was part of the plan to tarnish Pete and put Ben in his place.
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Jan 26, 2017 21:24
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I have disgustingly seen quite a few blame Terra for Deathstroke having sex with her, so at this point I'd rather forget about that aspect of both characters entirely along with the rest of New Teen Titans' use of rape.
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Jan 26, 2017 21:31
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Edge & Christian posted:I mean technically in the comics Doctor Light was just an ineffectual Justice League villain starting in 1962, then sort of got adopted as the ineffectual Teen Titans villain with the idea that maybe he couldn't stop the adults, but teenagers wouldn't stand a chance. He kept on losing to progressively weaker teams/characters until he was literally defeated by non-superhero children in a backup story. I thought according the Suicide Squad Dr. Light was originally a hero but then someone killed the original hero and used the Dr. Light stuff to become a villain (who ends up getting haunted by the original hero Dr. Light).
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Jan 26, 2017 22:02
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Rhyno posted:At the time that Peter hit MJ he wasn't the "real" Peter and it was part of the plan to tarnish Pete and put Ben in his place.
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Jan 26, 2017 22:02
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The reason is that Peter is one of the most popular superheroes ever and Hank is a B-lister at best.
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Jan 26, 2017 22:04
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Yeah I can name like 5 incredibly iconic things Peter did in the Ditko/Lee run alone, Hank has done 2 iconic things in 50 years and one of them was beating the poo poo out of his wife.
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Jan 26, 2017 22:08
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If anyone reads the latest Saga and doesn't feel anything, they are officially dead. Like probably have no heartbeat or pulse, which leads me to question on they read the comic in the first place.
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Jan 26, 2017 23:06
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Lurdiak posted:Yeah I can name like 5 incredibly iconic things Peter did in the Ditko/Lee run alone, Hank has done 2 iconic things in 50 years and one of them was beating the poo poo out of his wife. What is the other thing? Ultron, right?
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Jan 26, 2017 23:53
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purple death ray posted:Well "Hank Pym: Wifebeater" was a well worn joke back in Wizard in the early 90s so I don't think you can blame the ultimate universe on that one. I think it's more that Hank is a lovely character with little to no personality beyond "nerd, can't stick with a superhero identity, hits his wife". So that's all anybody remembers about him. Also Hank Pym isn't a lovely personality free character at all but again, there are literally tons of characters that had good stories told about them, fell into disuse/misuse, were treated like jokes, and then rehabbed in the 21st century. It's about half of Marvel's line-up right now. If you asked most fans prior to Marvel Knights (which was basically Marvel's first concerted attempt to elevate b/c-listers) the vast majority of them would either barely recognize the following characters or think they were kind of lovely characters with little to no personality besides [something really reductive]: Black Panther Luke Cage Misty Knight Sam Wilson Carol Danvers Sam Wilson Doctor Strange Patsy Walker Moon Knight Hercules Iron Fist Vision Namor Mockingbird James Rhodes Monica Rambeau Sunspot Squirrel Girl literally anyone from Guardians of the Galaxy There were also plenty of other characters who had lovely recent comic books that probably 'ruined' them forever in the lens of the late 1990s: Deadpool, Punisher, Ghost Rider, Nick Fury, Iron Man, Thor, Hawkeye, the Fantastic Four, Daredevil, etc. but those mostly fall under the "no one remembers noseless Wolverine" clause. But lo and behold one or more writers decided that maybe they cared about these characters and now some of them are at least mildly popular? Madkal posted:I thought according the Suicide Squad Dr. Light was originally a hero but then someone killed the original hero and used the Dr. Light stuff to become a villain (who ends up getting haunted by the original hero Dr. Light). Edge & Christian fucked around with this message at 23:58 on Jan 26, 2017 |
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Jan 26, 2017 23:55
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Edge & Christian posted:
Thanks for the clarification. Just read that issue recently and thought it made for a humourous origin story.
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Jan 26, 2017 23:59
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purple death ray posted:What is the other thing? Ultron, right? Didn't Nu52 do a thing where Dr. Light was a good guy without powers or something, and then he got powers and died but came back but was still a good guy?
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Jan 27, 2017 00:39
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He was a good guy recruited into Amanda Waller's secret anti-Justice League League and got his head melted off by Superman, who was set off by having a female Atom (secretly from the evil Earth 3) stomping around, tugging things in his brain. Then we got Forever Evil  He stayed dead. I think he had a wife he kept mentioning, so I expected her to take over, but it didn't happen.
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Jan 27, 2017 01:29
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purple death ray posted:The difference is Hank Pym was defined very early on as the dude who hit his wife, if he'd just been a superhero for a few decades and then someone wrote a story where he hit his wife, it wouldn't be such a defining moment. Hank Pym has been around since before Avengers #1 in 1963. Hank hit Janet in Avengers 213 in 1981. Did Hank beat the poo poo out of Janet in the Ultimates? Because in 213 it was a backhand that left her with a blackeye. I don't think that counts as beating the poo poo out of someone.
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Jan 27, 2017 01:43
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Let's discuss granularities in domestic violence itt
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Jan 27, 2017 01:49
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Perpetrators of domestic violence (no need for granularities) in the Marvel Universe: Hank Pym Peter Parker Wolverine Reed Richards Susan Storm/Richards Johnny Storm Ben Grimm Clint Barton Matt Murdock Tony Stark Thor Odinson Luke Cage probably everyone
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Jan 27, 2017 02:10
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Heathen posted:Did Hank beat the poo poo out of Janet in the Ultimates? Because in 213 it was a backhand that left her with a blackeye. I don't think that counts as beating the poo poo out of someone. In Ultimates he repeatedly beat and tortured her, getting the ants involved when she shrunk to hide from him. This is because Mark Millar wrote it. In regular continuity he gave her a black eye, and that's enough of a beating for me.
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Jan 27, 2017 02:10
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List of murderous "superheroes": Punisher Wolverine Hawkeye Deadpool Spider-Man Superman Wonder Woman Thanos etc
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Jan 27, 2017 02:12
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Edge & Christian posted:Perpetrators of domestic violence (no need for granularities) in the Marvel Universe:  The sixties was a different, terrible time.
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Jan 27, 2017 02:16
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Edge & Christian posted:List of murderous "superheroes": Killing and murder are different things.
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Jan 27, 2017 02:20
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Rhyno posted:A local "man" has announced intends to sue various public places in town because they will not allow him to wear his full Batman costume on their property. He has been asked to remove his mask at theaters, malls, banks, stores etc. Why is he suing? Is he trying to review what being Batman is like, and has to go to a divorce hearing?
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Jan 27, 2017 02:20
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Heathen posted:Hank Pym has been around since before Avengers #1 in 1963. Halfway through the incredibly popular (at the time) first volume of Ultimates, yeah. The issue was titled Giant Man vs the Wasp.  Unironic trigger warning for severe spousal abuse/domestic violence:      
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Jan 27, 2017 02:24
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I don't know why, but the pesticide part is what disturbs me the most to think about in that scene.
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Jan 27, 2017 02:35
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I hate Mark Millar.
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Jan 27, 2017 03:13
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Rhyno posted:I hate Mark Millar. Better or worse than Dan Slott?
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Jan 27, 2017 03:23
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WickedHate posted:Better or worse than Dan Slott? About even.
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Jan 27, 2017 03:24
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Between this and what happens with Blob and the whole Pietro/Wanda situation I'm still fine with not reading anything from the Ultimate line.
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Jan 27, 2017 03:31
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Heathen posted:Between this and what happens with Blob and the whole Pietro/Wanda situation I'm still fine with not reading anything from the Ultimate line. That was Jeph Loeb who seems to have recovered from being a shithead.
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Jan 27, 2017 03:33
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Christ that scene is so loving gross And you know millar was actually enjoying writing that scene
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Jan 27, 2017 03:35
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It's not just the physical abuse, either—Pym serves up a cornucopia of deplorable poo poo there. He starts by basically slut-shaming; then tells her that being a minority is shameful and she had god drat well hope she can keep passing; then hits her for not respecting him enough; then, after his "oh no, I never meant to, baby darling let me help" fails, he accuses her of starting the fight; and, moreover, that she always does starts the fights (but "ends up worse" from them). On a technical level, it's actually an impressively authentic depiction of an abusive, controlling husband/partner. I have no loving idea why anyone thought it was a good thing to put in a goddamn Avengers comic, but there you go.
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Jan 27, 2017 04:36
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