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It does seem kind of unhelpful.
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Feb 3, 2017 01:05
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He does have this tweet complaining about lack of time for parliamentary discussion: https://twitter.com/ChrisLeslieMP/status/824584393956134913
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Feb 3, 2017 01:08
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Musical chairs in Rotherham, where the Lib Dems have gained a council ward (for Orgreave!) off Labour, who in turn gained a council ward from UKIP. Rotherham is, of course, one of UKIP's relative strongholds due to UKIP jumping on the grooming scandal like it was going out of fashion. This "UKIP are a threat to Labour" argument seems to pushed by the media with no basis in fact, although that much was obvious when the Guardian was claiming UKIP has a chance in Copeland. TinTower fucked around with this message at 01:14 on Feb 3, 2017 |
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Feb 3, 2017 01:11
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Both party representatives on This Week taking the opportunity to bash Corbyn despite agreeing with his three line whip. Derek Hatton, the guest, tells Andrew Neil that the only reason he was invited on was because he was expected to bash Corbyn after writing a critical article about him.
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Feb 3, 2017 01:21
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Corbyn is very bashable, tbf.
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Feb 3, 2017 01:24
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TinTower posted:Musical chairs in Rotherham, where the Lib Dems have gained a council ward (for Orgreave!) off Labour, who in turn gained a council ward from UKIP.
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Feb 3, 2017 01:32
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TinTower posted:This "UKIP are a threat to Labour" argument seems to pushed by the media with no basis in fact, although that much was obvious when the Guardian was claiming UKIP has a chance in Copeland. UKIP could very easily be a threat to Labour if they had anything resembling a meaningful ground game, but they don't. They're reportedly very poorly organised and have few significant campaigning strategies. Their profile as a party was and is tied to Farage's personal popularity among its members and it seems to have had the side-effect of convincing them that they don't need to put any of the leg-work in because the People's Nige is just such a Classic Legend victory will fall into their laps any day now. Wheat Loaf fucked around with this message at 01:36 on Feb 3, 2017 |
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Feb 3, 2017 01:33
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Wheat Loaf posted:They're reportedly very poorly organised Well the favourite for leadership handed in his paperwork too late, the winner quit after a few days, and Nuttall lied on his candidacy application. I think it's past 'reportedly'.
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Feb 3, 2017 01:38
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Also interesting to note: the turnout in the ward Labour lost was higher than the turnout in which they won.
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Feb 3, 2017 01:43
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I'm more interested in finding out why people support the liberals in 2017.
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Feb 3, 2017 01:46
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TinTower posted:Also interesting to note: the turnout in the ward Labour lost was higher than the turnout in which they won. 19% vs 32%. Council elections are a poor indicator of anything at the national level, comparing the turnouts to say one result is more significant than another is trying pretty desperately hard to make the Lib Dems look good/Labour look bad. I certainly wouldn't characterise it as 'interesting'.
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Feb 3, 2017 01:51
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Namtab posted:I'm more interested in finding out why people support the liberals in 2017. Sheer desperation. jabby posted:19% vs 32%. Council elections are a poor indicator of anything at the national level, comparing the turnouts to say one result is more significant than another is trying pretty desperately hard to make the Lib Dems look good/Labour look bad. I certainly wouldn't characterise it as 'interesting'. You're replying to someone who posts about student politics so I'm sure she finds council politics absolutely thrilling. 19% would be a record turnout for most student elections after all. Lord of the Llamas fucked around with this message at 01:56 on Feb 3, 2017 |
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Feb 3, 2017 01:54
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One positive contribution from Harriet Harman tonight - pointing out that Diane Abbott said she was going to vote to trigger Article 50 on Question Time last week. So the idea she deliberately avoided the vote in order to maintain some air of mystery about her position doesn't seem very likely.
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Feb 3, 2017 02:00
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Namtab posted:I'm more interested in finding out why people support the liberals in 2017. Maybe people think the opposition should oppose the tories and their brexit instead of just opposing shaving and wearing ties.
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Feb 3, 2017 02:02
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jabby posted:19% vs 32%. Council elections are a poor indicator of anything at the national level, comparing the turnouts to say one result is more significant than another is trying pretty desperately hard to make the Lib Dems look good/Labour look bad. I certainly wouldn't characterise it as 'interesting'. It's the same council area. hakimashou posted:Maybe people think the opposition should oppose the tories and their brexit instead of just opposing shaving and wearing ties. Don't forget singing the national anthem.
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Feb 3, 2017 02:08
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Namtab posted:I Dont know who Chris Leslie is but he's rammed in All The Amendments, so that parliament will get like 5 minutes to discuss each. Can't people who want to soften brexit coordinate these things? Chris Leslie is the former Shadow Chancellor for a couple of months under Harriet Harman's temporary leadership. Notable for never rebelling against the government, even once, between 1997 & 2005, when he lost his seat to Philip Davies, probably the biggest shithead in parliament. Close to Gordon Brown, close to Ed Balls, his wife runs Labour Tomorrow which basically exists to oppose Corbyn's economic ideas. Top bloke basically. hakimashou posted:Maybe people think the opposition should oppose the tories and their brexit instead of just opposing shaving and wearing ties. Oh my gosh you're a bad troll. I mean, come on. You really need to at least base your nonsense in reality. "Oppose the tories" as the reason people support the Liberals. Hah. That's a good one. You've definitely thought that one through.
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Feb 3, 2017 02:26
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forkboy84 posted:Oh my gosh you're a bad troll. I mean, come on. You really need to at least base your nonsense in reality. "Oppose the tories" as the reason people support the Liberals. Hah. That's a good one. You've definitely thought that one through. Technically, they've managed to communicate that idea of opposition better. It's not that they oppose the Tories, it's that they've done better marketing around that identity than Labour. Which really speaks more about Labour than it does the Libdems. PS I don't think the situation is hopeless though. I think Corbyn should go on a heroquest to mend this broken reality ASAP. If we sacrifice enough lamb to Chalana Arroy we might get out of this yet. Pochoclo fucked around with this message at 02:38 on Feb 3, 2017 |
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Feb 3, 2017 02:32
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Pochoclo posted:Technically, they've managed to communicate that idea of opposition better. It's not that they oppose the Tories, it's that they've done better marketing around that identity than Labour. This is mostly only true regarding Brexit though, and even then it's at least partly to improve their electoral success. There's always this as a reminder: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jTLR8R9JXz4
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Feb 3, 2017 02:42
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I think you mean https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ltlX2Ggupuc
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Feb 3, 2017 02:48
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Private Speech posted:This is mostly only true regarding Brexit though, and even then it's at least partly to improve their electoral success. I mean they're not bad promises, the only problem is that it's so drat obvious that he's lying.
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Feb 3, 2017 02:51
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Pochoclo posted:I mean they're not bad promises, the only problem is that it's so drat obvious that he's lying. It wasn't very much in 2010. Back then this thread was full of lib dem voters. e: And it still was far more optimistic/content time than today, I get a bit sad watching that video now. It's funny how a lot of the complaints about the then Labour government seem so, dunno, meaningless. Barely anyone expected things to get quite this bad even when the Tories formed the government, they really did a number on the country since. This is a pretty typical sample of 5 consecutive posts from the 2010 election thread. To be fair though there were plenty of leftists as well and I was only lurking then, but very few people actually supported Labour. Iamthegibbons posted:The Lib Dems are something of a federal party and they are split into two distinct camps. There are the left-leaning liberal socialists, and there are the laissez-faire style libertarianism guys. The socialists tend to have a strangehold on the partys main policies, and this is why most of their manifesto has policies in this line. ZoDiAC_ posted:Is there any point in strategic voting? I doubt there is for me, I live in a safe Lab seat but want to vote Liberal since 1) they actually reflect my views more than the other two parties and 2) though I wouldn't mind labour getting in again, I'd really rather not vote for them. ConanThe3rd posted:I'm voting Lib Dem because my Constituency (E. Dunbartonshire) has been doing quite well with our Local MP, thanks. Kara Thrace posted:This too, is my first General Election and I am thinking of just voting for Labour. I've had them for most of my life and to be honest, I don't see anything wrong with it. All I know is that if the Conservatives get in, things would not be any better. I am so desensitized to British politics I just don't give a poo poo who gets in. They're all the same but at least Labour doesn't have a smug oval office as leader and an annoying cabinet. ranathari posted:Fallon posted: Private Speech fucked around with this message at 03:31 on Feb 3, 2017 |
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Feb 3, 2017 02:56
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I don't think there's been a party in history that's more consistently underperformed media expectations than ukip
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Feb 3, 2017 04:30
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David Hockney has redesigned The Sun's masthead
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Feb 3, 2017 05:03
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Liberal democrats are mostly voted for by people who would have voted Tory but are still holding a grudge over "What Maggie did to the unions and the mines".
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Feb 3, 2017 08:23
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https://twitter.com/davey/status/827300019699085312 so this is where we are as a country. good to know. ukmt: i go to the supermarket and a banana is straight
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Feb 3, 2017 09:08
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I once talked to someone who claimed to have voted leave because "Everything is done on computers now"
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Feb 3, 2017 09:26
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My father in law didn't say he voted leave (we're in Scotland and he's an SNP man) but did say that Brexit was because of gay men kissing on Eastenders.
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Feb 3, 2017 09:27
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I imagine I would vote for the Lib Dems if I lived on the mainland because I consider myself neither a conservative nor a socialist.  I mostly vote for the Alliance Party here, since they're the most normal. It's usually Alliance first, UUP second and then it depends on what mood I'm in when I get to the polling station.
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Feb 3, 2017 09:28
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Or hardcore liberals whose main concern is opposing authoritarianism. That's never a majority position though because on its own it isn't a policy platform. The lib dems are ok: they're a third party in a major democracy that isn't extremist. Their role is really to be someone you can vote for, in years when a tiebreaker is needed, that doesn't impose a crazy agenda on the two main parties. They perform this role fine as far as I can see: the worst of the coalition was "there were policies we didn't like and the junior coalition partner gave up some of its (main) campaign promises," whereas the fail state of politics is "political norms are totally disregarded and massive, life-changing decisions are taken on a whim," which is what we have now and probably what we would have had with an extreme right or left wing party in the LDs' place.
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Feb 3, 2017 09:30
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LemonDrizzle posted:https://twitter.com/davey/status/827300019699085312 i don't think she was serious
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Feb 3, 2017 09:35
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Jose posted:i don't think she was serious she looked pretty serious
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Feb 3, 2017 09:35
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hookerbot 5000 posted:My father in law didn't say he voted leave (we're in Scotland and he's an SNP man) but did say that Brexit was because of gay men kissing on Eastenders. About 30% of SNP voters voted Leave IIRC so you can't assume he wasn't swayed by this reasoning himself.
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Feb 3, 2017 09:42
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Pissflaps posted:About 30% of SNP voters voted Leave IIRC so you can't assume he wasn't swayed by this reasoning himself. Oh yeah, but I think he'd be less likely to talk about it - he doesn't like doing or saying anything that suggests they aren't oracles of a better fairer Scotland.
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Feb 3, 2017 09:48
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Beefeater1980 posted:Or hardcore liberals whose main concern is opposing authoritarianism. That's never a majority position though because on its own it isn't a policy platform. The Lib Dems wholeheartedly backed a campaign of ideological austerity which has literally killed people, openly betrayed one of their main voting blocks (students) and were played like a cheap fiddle by Cameron on the PR referendum. This is coming from a former Lib Dem voter who voted for them in 2010. They could have backed out of the coalition early on when it was clear they were just along for the ride and probably been somewhat punished for it, but nowhere near the degree were hammered because Nick Clegg had to hang onto power for 5 years to assuage his ego MikeCrotch fucked around with this message at 09:54 on Feb 3, 2017 |
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Feb 3, 2017 09:50
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Jose posted:not sure what this has to do with the actor who played the teacher in ferris buellers day off being a pedo tbh Nothing, it's just therapeutic to point out when Tories are being dumb/disingenuous while making pretensions to intellectual authority
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Feb 3, 2017 09:50
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Beefeater1980 posted:the worst of the coalition was "there were policies we didn't like and the junior coalition partner gave up some of its (main) campaign promises," whereas the fail state of politics is "political norms are totally disregarded and massive, life-changing decisions are taken on a whim," which is what we have now and probably what we would have had with an extreme right or left wing party in the LDs' place. We have this now because of what the LD's did then. It didn't come out of nowhere, it came because the Tories were assisted into power. Assisted by LibDem MPs who'd campaigned in most of their constituencies on a 'vote for us to stop the Tories!' ticket. Coalition policies were also loving terrible (see: Iain Duncan Smith) and waving them away as "policies we didn't like" is ridiculous. A residents' parking scheme is a policy I don't like. Starving disabled people is something else. E: The Coalition cut local authority money by 40%. Oh dear me fucked around with this message at 10:03 on Feb 3, 2017 |
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Feb 3, 2017 09:59
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Ties should be opposed as vigorously as anime, they are terrible
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Feb 3, 2017 10:11
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And a good morning to you!
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Feb 3, 2017 10:14
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Gum posted:I don't think there's been a party in history that's more consistently underperformed media expectations than ukip Ukip isn't the sole reason for Brexit but it's certainly part of it
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Feb 3, 2017 10:16
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The leadership of the top two parties has historically indulged in the exact same rhetoric though, arguably for longer than Farage. It's not like he bent the narrative to his whim, he just helped pull it along, and stood to benefit the most from everything going to poo poo He's definitely got media skills, even before UKIP was popular he was pretty much guarantee a spot on any news report about anything if he wanted it. But the Tories and Labour to an extent set the scene and legitimised this scapegoating, UKIP was just more committed to running with it Hell maybe Boris Johnson is the most successful - he's credited with starting the whole 'lie about the bonkers EU' strain of journalism that completely took over and shaped people's views of what the EU actually does. What did he say, he enjoyed throwing these reports over the channel and hearing the crash on the other side? Well he definitely went big on that in the end
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Feb 3, 2017 10:33
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