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dscruffy1 posted:What kills you on the second floor? Seems like it's probably regular enemies, is there one in particular that is causing issues? Usually attrition. Lead Maidens for certain. But just a series of mistakes. My biggest issue is I still am not completely 100% with the dodge roll's i-frames, and frequently juke myself into getting hit when bullets are coming in multiple waves. I'm wondering if I end up perhaps taking a break between floors with the new Save and Quit mechanic, I can do better. Take a break, relax my muscles and return. The Floor One bosses that I've face haven't been too bad. Though fatigue is my biggest enemy there. Just before making that post I ended up eating two hits from Gatling Gull that I can just attribute to fatigue.
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Feb 2, 2017 12:07
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When I have that problem in similar games I find that artificially increasing the difficulty on yourself can help a lot. Try arbitrarily using only the pistol for a while, or every other room you enter you spend ten seconds (or more!) just dodging. What would probably be ideal would be if you could fix the elevator because that lets you both reduce fatigue and get back into higher difficulties faster, but the elevator fixes seem like a major pain from what I've seen. After a while stop doing the challenge stuff and the regular stuff should fatigue you less.
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Feb 2, 2017 13:52
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SkyTalon2314 posted:Usually attrition. Lead Maidens for certain. But just a series of mistakes. You have I-frames right up until you hit the ground. It takes a little getting used to, but that's where the frames stop.
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Feb 2, 2017 14:04
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With the elevator repairman, do you need both the master rounds and whatever he is looking for (IE, 3 keys, 100+ casings and master rounds)? Or do the master rounds help in some other way?
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Feb 2, 2017 18:47
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CzarChasm posted:With the elevator repairman, do you need both the master casings and whatever he is looking for? You need everything he's asking for at that moment. If he wants 3 keys and 120 casings, and you go short on the casings to get the keys, you're outta luck unless you still have rooms to make up the difference. e: In other words, if he wants a master round, keys, and casings and you're short on any of them, he won't take whatever you've got and you'll have to either make up the difference on the floor or do it another run. Ignatius M. Meen fucked around with this message at 18:54 on Feb 2, 2017 |
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Feb 2, 2017 18:50
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Right, but what I've seen he doesn't ask for master rounds specifically. He'll say "To fix this I need X Keys and X casings" and then, if you have a master round on you he says "Oh, you have a level 1 master round! It's just what I need! Can I have it?" From that wording it sounds like he would still fix it with the Keys and casings, and giving him the master round would be an extra.
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Feb 2, 2017 19:03
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My understanding is to fix a floor he will need [X], [Y], and [Z] where any of those variables can be multiple items. Like Keys and Casings, if you show up with Z while he's asking for X he'll ask for it as well, but to fulfill a value you need to have everything in it. So you can't give him just keys or just casings because he's asking for both at the same time.
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Feb 2, 2017 19:08
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You always need a master round to power the elevator, but the tinker will ask you for it whenever you have it since it's generally the hardest part to get.
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Feb 2, 2017 19:16
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CzarChasm posted:Right, but what I've seen he doesn't ask for master rounds specifically. He'll say "To fix this I need X Keys and X casings" and then, if you have a master round on you he says "Oh, you have a level 1 master round! It's just what I need! Can I have it?" Looking it up on the wiki, everything except Hegemony credits can be given to him before he asks for them, so if one of the things he needs is keys and another is casings and you have the casings, he'll take them ahead of time; if it's a package deal of keys and casings, though, you need both of them in the right quantities whether or not he's asking for them right now. Also I now know that the bucket I kicked off was actually a helmet. I should feel bad for Ms. Goblin but knowing how continuing to be a jerk to her ends I don't.
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Feb 2, 2017 19:28
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dscruffy1 posted:I know for sure I've gotten 1, 2, 3, and 5. I may have gotten 4 on one run, but I haven't gotten them all in a single run for the LP yet. There's a special unlockable for that. Why not a cursed run? 
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Feb 2, 2017 19:32
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Hunter's the best for affording the key/casing requirement I think; Junior adds a lot of casings and keys to a run if you're lucky so you can still get chests without feeling a squeeze from not buying anything at the shop. I think Junior once found 20 casings for me from a room on the first floor.
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Feb 2, 2017 19:49
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I had trouble with lead maidens too. I've managed to get to a point where I can kill them without taking a hit but that usually involves busting out better guns. Was I the only one who was brick walled in terms of progress by the maidens? They're not that scary once you figure them out. Although that one layout with the horizontal hallway and three cells on the top and three on the bottom with the buffer in the cell protected by the maiden was made by a sadist I'm starting to clear out the hollow now that I'm past the second floor since the mine isn't really all that bad once you're used too it. Was anyone else brick walled by the maidens?
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Feb 2, 2017 20:21
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The trick to beating maidens is that you need to play balls to the wall. If you are trying to hold back against them at max range you are putting yourself at a disadvantage because their bullets have two stages. The first one is easy to predict, the second one is a lot harder. You can dodge the first phase since it is always the same pattern and then once they start to converge on you, if you are close, you will have a much greater chance to find your perfect escape window. Now this bit of advice isn't perfect. Obviously it does not work in cramped rooms, which to be fair is really a minority of Lead Maiden encounters. Most of them happen in big open rooms specifically with that sort of thing in mind. The other thing to keep in mind is other enemies but you won't need to worry about that until the lower floors most of the time.
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Feb 2, 2017 21:00
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I just realized that the statue in the very first room of the gungeon is that of the gunslinger Lich.
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Feb 3, 2017 03:08
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Adding to my previous post, I have now actually cleared the game for the first time, including my first past (The Marine) in 56 deaths! I'm still really bad, but this thread has taught me the most important mantra. Don't use keys on brown chests (unless you know it's the item chest). Oh, and don't give up hope. But I think the chest thing is a bit more accurate.
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Feb 3, 2017 03:26
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You know, I thought it was a hyperbole about how good higher level chests can be until I had 2 brown chests and no guns in the shop. I mistakenly decided to gamble on the contents therein and almost died to basic enemies I opened up my brown chests to find the Lower Case A and an ammolet. The LCA is a gimmick weapon with ~1k rounds that sends out streams of letters that spell out "BULLET". Amusing, but it does significantly less damage than the starting pistols, which I didn't realize until I beat Gatling Gull and got a few rooms into the second floor and was having knock-down, drag-out fights with shotgunkin
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Feb 3, 2017 04:19
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The Door Frame posted:You know, I thought it was a hyperbole about how good higher level chests can be until I had 2 brown chests and no guns in the shop. I mistakenly decided to gamble on the contents therein and almost died to basic enemies Lower case r, actually. I got that on my first run when I bought the game this weekend, laughed, then immediately died to the Bullet King.
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Feb 3, 2017 04:41
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I find that the [ b u l l e t ] sound effect vastly outweighs how terrible the 'r' is.
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Feb 3, 2017 05:00
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The badness of most brown chest guns is outweighed by how funny they are and how nice the few decent ones can get with the right passives. I'll take even the blunderbuss and bouncy bullets any day over one extra key.
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Feb 3, 2017 05:29
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The lower case r is not THAT bad. The bullets are pretty accurate. Course I generally play as the pilot....almost anything is better than his starting pistol 
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Feb 3, 2017 05:33
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Eh, I knew I should have just called it "The Dumb Alphabet Gun" instead. It was hilarious to use at first and it carries an ungodly amount of ammo, but I was spending so much time pulling the trigger that even the "BLAM" that pops out of bullet impacts started to lose its charm. I think finding out that it did so little after fighting Gatling Gull may have been what soured me so much, though... Gatling Gull and the Beholster are the bosses I have the most trouble with right now. 65 deaths and I'm almost ready to take on the 4th floor bosses. And probably ragequit for another week or two after mashing my face against them As for characters, I used to love the Pilot for his money and lockpick shenanigans, but the better I got, the more I started to like the Hunter. I feel like she's the most effective Gungeoneer, despite the Marine looking better on paper
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Feb 3, 2017 06:18
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Hunter is really stable because she has a weapon that lets you easily clear floor 1/2 boss and if you luck out into better boss killer, it still clears rooms nicely. Marine is better if you have some luck in the run, as his passive makes stuff just that little bit better, but does not help that much if you don't have good guns for it to improve.
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Feb 3, 2017 14:32
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The Hunter definitely seems like the best starting character, at the very least. I've spent all my time with the game so far playing as her. Solid starting weapons and Junior is an animal (both literally and figuratively).
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Feb 3, 2017 14:51
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I must be the only one that digs the convict, then. Yeah, her starting pistol only has 5 shots, but it does decent enough damage and has a relatively quick reload time, and the shotgun is nice to have as a backup. The real kicker, for me, is the molotov starter, where I can just say "Oh, look a densely packed sphere of angry things, time to set them all on fire." and walk away. I just like having the extra damage, but YMMV. 
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Feb 3, 2017 16:27
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The way I see it, Marine is good until you learn to dodge and shoot. Hunter is good for learning lower floors After that it's just whackadoo fun times forever
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Feb 3, 2017 17:05
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The Door Frame posted:Eh, I knew I should have just called it "The Dumb Alphabet Gun" instead. It was hilarious to use at first and it carries an ungodly amount of ammo, but I was spending so much time pulling the trigger that even the "BLAM" that pops out of bullet impacts started to lose its charm. I think finding out that it did so little after fighting Gatling Gull may have been what soured me so much, though... Just wait. Once you fully complete the elevator challenges and beat the boss rush, you unlock an active item that has synergy with the Lower Case R and boosts its damage by an incredible 25%. Also hunter is the best character by far. The only time I ever play anyone else is if I'm forcing myself to play someone else due to playing the hunter so much.
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Feb 3, 2017 17:39
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Good news, I recorded another run where I died! I didn't even make it to Bullet Hell. Even better news, I forgot to record video! So I'll record again soon with the Convict. 
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Feb 3, 2017 22:03
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Dooky Dingo posted:I must be the only one that digs the convict, then. I love the convict's starting pistol, it's actually pretty competitive if you get some accuracy upgrades. Definitely my favorite starting character, it's hard to deal with the other starting pistols after using her.
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Feb 3, 2017 22:37
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Trick Question posted:I love the convict's starting pistol, it's actually pretty competitive if you get some accuracy upgrades. Definitely my favorite starting character, it's hard to deal with the other starting pistols after using her. +1 I think the convict has the best sidearm out of all the starting characters. That being said I kinda wish she had the Cigarettes as her active item instead of the Molotov Cocktail. I mean, you can see her smoking in the breach if you hang around for a bit, it only makes sense! In more mechanical term it would have made for some fun synergy with Enraging Photo and added some interesting risk vrs reward management.
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Feb 3, 2017 23:03
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Yeah it's really good as starters go. Best non-secret starter gun might actually be the cultist's; the spread is equal with the marine's, it outranges the other guns, deals as much damage per hit as the convict's, and it shoots/reloads almost as fast as the convict's. It'll never knock anything into a pit or get any respect though.
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Feb 4, 2017 00:56
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The Door Frame posted:Eh, I knew I should have just called it "The Dumb Alphabet Gun" instead. It was hilarious to use at first and it carries an ungodly amount of ammo, but I was spending so much time pulling the trigger that even the "BLAM" that pops out of bullet impacts started to lose its charm. I think finding out that it did so little after fighting Gatling Gull may have been what soured me so much, though... Otherwise his two charge shots can be easily dodged away from and the missiles are easily dodged as well. I assume it's just the spray of bullets is what's tripping you up there. And I think for the Beholster, my best advice is just keep at range from him. As he starts in the center, he'll start to fire and gradually push you towards one wall; when it gets too close for comfort, then just maybe wait for it's eye beam attack and use that to rush to the opposing far side. Then just rinse and repeat once he gets too close again.
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Feb 4, 2017 02:32
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I've managed to deliver my second Bullet component - The one from the icy abyss. No more will I have to repeatedly fire my starter gun and watch where the shell casings land to figure out the invisible floor. Also, it may be a Rank D, but I really like the sling. Especially after duct taping a banana to it.
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Feb 4, 2017 03:45
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discworld is all I read posted:I've found what really helps with Gatling Gull is being able to tell the difference between his two bullet sprays. If he does push forward while doing his spray then it's fairly easy to remain stationary as well and just weave through the bullet pattern, and in reality I think only maybe a couple of the bullets will be heading directly toward you. If he does decide to start walking forward while shooting then he'll start to fire out more bullets in a more varied pattern. The best idea with that is to not try to outrun the spread because he'll try to predict ahead of time where you'll head and he'll start to send bullets ahead of you which will box you in. Instead try to not make him turn so much and just try to dodge the bullets outside of the cone he initially sends out. Gatling Gull isn't really predictive; he shoots a spread back and forth in a limited fixed arc and then if you get outside that arc he turns to shoot in the arc that you're in. It's very similar to how Gun Nuts work, but because he doesn't just fire a single wide spread of bullets (and instead shoots a random-looking back and forth spray across the arc continuously) it can look like he's leading you when in reality he's just spraying back and forth and turning to follow you. If he's shooting on the "left" side of his arc, and then you move around him clockwise, he'll continue his sweep from whatever side he was on so it looks like he suddenly turns 45 degrees and aims at you and then starts leading you, because the "left" side of his arc suddenly changed and now he's probably sweeping to the "right".
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Feb 4, 2017 03:50
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Whooo got all 5 master rounds and as a bonus killed the hunter's past. The scrambler is really, really good with the backup holster (fires an extra shot when you reload - effectively doubles the firepower of single shot guns).
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Feb 4, 2017 03:59
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There are a lot of items that seriously increase the power of single shot weapons.
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Feb 4, 2017 04:01
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Elfface posted:No more will I have to repeatedly fire my starter gun and watch where the shell casings land to figure out the invisible floor. That's a cool trick.
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Feb 4, 2017 06:55
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Elfface posted:I've managed to deliver my second Bullet component - The one from the icy abyss. No more will I have to repeatedly fire my starter gun and watch where the shell casings land to figure out the invisible floor. The sling by itself is great for floor 1 & 2 bosses. Upgraded, it can be great for the others, too.
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Feb 4, 2017 07:59
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The Sling + Double Vision absolutely chumps most bosses, including the Lich, in my experience. It's only real purpose is to kill bosses, actually, since it does 2.5x damage to them compared to using it on anything else.
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Feb 4, 2017 08:20
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I don't know if your still taking challenge run suggestions but if so I'd like to suggest a Never Back Down challenge. Which has the simple rule of when you find the boss room you have to fight the boss right then.
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Feb 4, 2017 15:06
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ZeusCannon posted:I don't know if your still taking challenge run suggestions but if so I'd like to suggest a Never Back Down challenge. Which has the simple rule of when you find the boss room you have to fight the boss right then. Pretty sure that was already suggested, but I have some ideas. Melee-only: This is only possible after the caped bulletkin-related secret character is unlocked and probably only sane after Casey is too, but the only boss that's got a real time limit with the starting melee weapon alone is the Wallmonger as opposed to the endurance limit of every other boss. That said I can't fathom how exhausting trying to kill the High Dragun or Lich would be with just 14 damage a swing and dodging perfectly all the time so probably don't attempt this unless you see Casey in the shop on a run with the secret guy. Jester: Anything that a person off the street could say is definitely a gun just by looking at it cannot be used on enemies. Anything else is fair game (even bows, but the sillier, the better). Lots more options here for boss killing so it shouldn't need any caveats.
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Feb 4, 2017 17:15
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