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ThinkTank posted:Of course, these are pro-athletes we're talking about. You don't get to the NHL by coasting on talent alone (Kovalev excepted). Players are required to commit full time from the age of 12 Still, Gostisbehere isn't some rookie who dominated junior and is now struggling at the pro level. He's had success in the NHL, some would say a great deal of it. He's having a sophmore slump, but they happen. Nothing has changed from his rookie season in regards to work ethic, training, etc. (or at least we can assume he hasn't suddenly decided to start hanging out at strip clubs and chugging codeine). So why has the team suddenly decided he's not trying hard enough? Why wasn't that identified last year? And if it was, why did the team feel they had to modify a successful formula? Why is it that apparently coasting on talent worked one year, then isn't close to good enough the next? Rotten Cookies posted:e:f,b.
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Feb 8, 2017 20:48
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grack posted:Dipietro's hip problems forced him to try and adopt a new style as more of a standup goalie and he could not make it work. Dan Blackburn briefly tried playing with two blockers after a nerve injury in his arm/shoulder mean the couldn't use his glove hand properly. Didn't really work out, as expected e: Kovy's problem was that he played the stereotypical Russian try not to give up the puck ever and always make something out of nothing style that drives NHL coaches crazy. He'd probably fit in better in today's NHL but he still did a lot of turning the puck over in bad spots because he was always trying to stick handle through everyone or make an amazing play when a simple one would have been better. That said, he was talented enough to make it work for his career and yeah it wasn't that he coasted on his talent that was an issue.
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Feb 8, 2017 20:58
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https://twitter.com/BuckeyeStHockey/status/829367523976085506 4.5/5, would've been perfect had it been a Stone Cold imitation. a false posted:no, i don't think that he literally said that. https://twitter.com/Aportzline/status/829180402258554880
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Feb 8, 2017 21:12
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This needs to be part of any Kovalev discussion https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IuwFAmqVNSQ
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Feb 8, 2017 21:34
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Spring Break My Heart posted:Kovalev didn't coast on talent, if such a thing is even possible. While he certainly had great physical ability (which required him being in great shape, which he always was) it's not as if he just woke up one day as a great stickhandler and shooter, they were skills he worked on constantly at a level that put even other NHLers to shame. Kovalev's issues were different, and really it's mostly nitpicking a guy who was a very productive NHLer for 20 years. Kovalev's reputation is as much a victim of the dumber aspects of NHL culture as anyone. Kovalev's was a great player, his reputation is pretty much a mish-mash of people Don-Cherry-picking reasons for disliking him for being Russian. He defied a lot of the usual criticisms: -He's lazy/out-of shape (see: that ultra-long shift where Mike Keenan wouldn't let him come to the bench and he kept going hard) -He's not a winner (he won the cup early in his career) -He's not clutch (he was the third leading scorer on that cup team) -He's not physical (he was big and strong and even nasty at times) -He's inconsistent (no more than most similar scorers) -He doesn't work hard/quite on the play (see: that neverending shift, again)
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Feb 8, 2017 21:36
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No, more than most similar scorers!
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Feb 8, 2017 21:41
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Zodijackylite posted:Kovalev's was a great player, his reputation is pretty much a mish-mash of people Don-Cherry-picking reasons for disliking him for being Russian. He defied a lot of the usual criticisms: Not to mention this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AI7KeY-DmNU&t=17s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q4jnzrPOqVQ Show me any other player that can do a onehanded backhand top-shelf like that.
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Feb 8, 2017 21:45
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I mean, I'd think one of the guys in your avatar?
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Feb 8, 2017 21:51
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Eh I think the biggest criticism I can think of with Kovalev is that if he was a smarter player he could have been considered one of the greats. All the physical tools were there and he could do pretty much anything any of the top players in the league could do, often better than they could, but but he didn't necessarily apply them as well as some other players. It's like...Crosby is the best in the league not because he's obviously the most physically talented player in the league...I think there are a lot of players you could say are on Crosby's level in terms of the outright talent department, but he's so good at just playing the game and knowing what to do or knowing how to take advantage of his opponents and use his skills to their best advantage. Kovalev didn't quite get that, at least consistently.
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Feb 8, 2017 21:57
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BSH has the full transcript of what Hak said about AMac and Ghost. It's a bit more reasonable than i thought when the quick summaries came out
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Feb 8, 2017 22:01
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Levitate posted:Eh I think the biggest criticism I can think of with Kovalev is that if he was a smarter player he could have been considered one of the greats. All the physical tools were there and he could do pretty much anything any of the top players in the league could do, often better than they could, but but he didn't necessarily apply them as well as some other players. It's like...Crosby is the best in the league not because he's obviously the most physically talented player in the league...I think there are a lot of players you could say are on Crosby's level in terms of the outright talent department, but he's so good at just playing the game and knowing what to do or knowing how to take advantage of his opponents and use his skills to their best advantage. Kovalev didn't quite get that, at least consistently. Processing the game at high speeds is a talent imo and it's one most of the truly great players have. I also think it's something playmakers maybe get undue credit for when the all time great goalscorers have it too. Like Ovechkin knows exactly when to jump into a spot and unleash his one-timer. And Lemieux was famously good at appearing out of seemingly thin air at the exact point where a juicy rebound was popping out.
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Feb 8, 2017 22:08
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Ginette Reno posted:Processing the game at high speeds is a talent imo and it's one most of the truly great players have. I also think it's something playmakers maybe get undue credit for when the all time great goalscorers have it too. Like Ovechkin knows exactly when to jump into a spot and unleash his one-timer. And Lemieux was famously good at appearing out of seemingly thin air at the exact point where a juicy rebound was popping out. Yeah pretty much. Kovalev wasn't bad at it, he wasn't "dumb", but he wasn't on the level of the truly great players
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Feb 8, 2017 22:11
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See Iafrate, Al for another example of a player who had the physical ability to be one of the best of all time but whose brain didn't work quite as well as the rest of him
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Feb 8, 2017 22:24
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Full credit for this goes to Teemu Pokemon:quote:At least the Wings have Justin Abdelkader to skate 18 minutes a night
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Feb 8, 2017 22:33
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Levitate posted:Eh I think the biggest criticism I can think of with Kovalev is that if he was a smarter player he could have been considered one of the greats. All the physical tools were there and he could do pretty much anything any of the top players in the league could do, often better than they could, but but he didn't necessarily apply them as well as some other players. It's like...Crosby is the best in the league not because he's obviously the most physically talented player in the league...I think there are a lot of players you could say are on Crosby's level in terms of the outright talent department, but he's so good at just playing the game and knowing what to do or knowing how to take advantage of his opponents and use his skills to their best advantage. Kovalev didn't quite get that, at least consistently. I also don't agree with that assessment of Crosby. Physically he is both a top tier skater and freakishly strong, and he has one of the best skillsets of any player in history with elite as hell passing, stickhandling, shooting, etc.
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Feb 8, 2017 22:53
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bewbies posted:See Iafrate, Al for another example of a player who had the physical ability to be one of the best of all time but whose brain didn't work quite as well as the rest of him Smoking between periods probably didn't help.
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Feb 8, 2017 22:59
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bewbies posted:See Iafrate, Al for another example of a player who had the physical ability to be one of the best of all time but whose brain didn't work quite as well as the rest of him Yep, checks out. "Empty net goals are for faggots"
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Feb 8, 2017 23:04
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So Ive been in bed for the last 1.5 days due to a horrible flu and just got up to see the news about Boston doing something comically dumb, so now Im feeling better.
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Feb 8, 2017 23:17
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If you have NHL Network, they're showing a half-hour documentary on "Slapshot" for its 40th anniversary at 8PM, followed by an airing of the movie
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Feb 8, 2017 23:18
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Also Stoeten is an awful hack and I dunno why the Athletic would hire him, but goddamn I can't wait for Dellow truthbombs.
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Feb 8, 2017 23:28
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You know how they say it's always darkest before dawn? I have a feeling the only way the Habs will win The Cup again is to have the Leafs win it first. Both Boston and Toronto winning before them would pretty much be as dark as it gets. Unless Vegas wins in which case it's bullet time.
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Feb 9, 2017 01:59
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https://twitter.com/StapeNewsday/status/829519139790282752 why would you do this
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Feb 9, 2017 03:38
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Join us in LAS, Marty. It's never too late.
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Feb 9, 2017 03:41
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Yeah, must be really tough having a team so far down there in last place. Truly, we can all feel for Habs fans. Amazing they'll be a lottery team again this year. That's what, 3 years in a row? Just awful.
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Feb 9, 2017 03:44
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JoelJoel posted:Yeah, must be really tough having a team so far down there in last place. Truly, we can all feel for Habs fans. Amazing they'll be a lottery team again this year. That's what, 3 years in a row? Just awful. *habs win the cup* habs fans: noooo we're never gonna get rid of therrien now!!
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Feb 9, 2017 03:54
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Levitate posted:Dan Blackburn briefly tried playing with two blockers after a nerve injury in his arm/shoulder mean the couldn't use his glove hand properly. Didn't really work out, as expected Sometimes he turned the puck over in really good spots: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W3CcEOH6W0A
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Feb 9, 2017 03:57
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Random thought: the NHL should ban back to back games where the travel time is > 4 hours via /car/, maybe 5. No US/Canada back to backs either.
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Feb 9, 2017 04:38
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RAS related. Charles Barkley got arrested at the garden tonight for yelling at James Dolan and then getting into it with security. Shadow Ninja 64 posted:You must mean Charles Oakley. Whoops! That's what I meant. And thanks. Matt Zerella fucked around with this message at 04:49 on Feb 9, 2017 |
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Feb 9, 2017 04:43
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You must mean Charles Oakley. Also nice name change.
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Feb 9, 2017 04:45
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DJExile posted:If you have NHL Network, they're showing a half-hour documentary on "Slapshot" for its 40th anniversary at 8PM, followed by an airing of the movie Is there anywhere that streams NHL Network? We dropped DirecTV and have PSVUE now, it's literally the only thing I miss. Would love if VUE streamed it, but nope.
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Feb 9, 2017 04:51
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The Blackhawks are back, baby.
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Feb 9, 2017 05:25
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Pornographic Memory posted:*habs win the cup* He couldn't coach a much better Pens team to win the Cup, he sure as poo poo isn't coaching this team to anything but a first round exit.
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Feb 9, 2017 06:51
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Perhaps Alex Galchenyuk is just better than Sidney Crosby.
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Feb 9, 2017 06:53
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Also way to have no memory, thread. Remember last season? "lol you're undefeated and you're complaining!!" and then the Habs didn't make the playoff because without a .935+ Carey Price, this team is nothing.
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Feb 9, 2017 06:56
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Roberto Luongo, at 959 games, is about to pass Ed Belfour (963) to have played the third most games as a goaltender. I miss Lou 
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Feb 9, 2017 07:07
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Suspicious posted:Also way to have no memory, thread. Remember last season? "lol you're undefeated and you're complaining!!" and then the Habs didn't make the playoff because without a .935+ Carey Price, this team is nothing. And two seasons ago when they were top if the east. Definitely worth complaining about all the time. I mean having the best goalie in the world is so horrible because he could get injured.
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Feb 9, 2017 07:10
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JoelJoel posted:And two seasons ago when they were top if the east. Definitely worth complaining about all the time. I mean having the best goalie in the world is so horrible because he could get injured.
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Feb 9, 2017 07:19
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JoelJoel posted:And two seasons ago when they were top if the east. Definitely worth complaining about all the time. I mean having the best goalie in the world is so horrible because he could get injured. Hey look, if Dallas stapled Lehtonen and Niemi together they might almost be as good as Price, if Price was on day four of a four day bender and had lost feeling in his catching hand.
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Feb 9, 2017 07:22
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He's not injured right now, he's playing ordinarily and surprise the team isn't winning. Man how can people whose team's sole strategy is "completely and entirely rely on the goaltender posting a .935 SV% to win any game even against bottom feeders" complain about anything! They're first in the mighty Atlantic division!!!
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Feb 9, 2017 07:24
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grack posted:Hey look, if Dallas stapled Lehtonen and Niemi together they might almost be as good as Price, if Price was on day four of a four day bender and had lost feeling in his catching hand. Such a procedure sounds like it would have a pretty decent chance of one or both of them dying on the operating table. So, yeah, worth a try! Or two! gently caress, sew Nill in there too for kicks.
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Feb 9, 2017 07:25
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