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I believe this was behind a paywall until recently, so pardon if it's already been shared. Here are some of David Kanter's Ryzen thoughts: http://www.linleygroup.com/mpr/article.php?id=11666
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Feb 9, 2017 18:01
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Pryor on Fire posted:That's true, but I was just so underwhelmed by the upgrade from 2500k to 6700k, I noticed my new fan being quieter a lot more than any performance gains. Framerates barely budged: I thought I might be CPU limited on a 980 in games like Arma 3, nope not at all. Why did I spend all this money again? Doubling your core count isn't going to do anything for you in games either, so I don't know what you're expecting. A 6700k with any kind of an overclock is going to be significantly faster single threaded than an 8 core cpu anyhow. If you really wanted good gaming improvements over the 2500k then I hope you sprung for the fastest DDR4 you could find, because that's at least as good a gain as the CPU alone is, and probably more so if you had slow/early gen DDR3. (Also, spoiler, they're not going to magically pull huge ipc gains out of their hat every generation now that they've caught up to intel, because they'll be facing the exact same obstacles. Just, without, you know, the boat anchor of lovely construction cores). Seriously, I love talking myself in to realistically unneeded hardware purchases as much as any goon, but getting the self justification machine rolling over a CPU is, uh, really dumb even by those standards. If you're streaming and video encoding at home, then great, get more cores and enjoy, otherwise spend your money on anything else. Gwaihir fucked around with this message at 18:11 on Feb 9, 2017 |
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Feb 9, 2017 18:07
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Well, I'm still running an overclocked i5 750 and I was all set and ready to get a 7700K but I read this thread... Now I'm just sitting here waiting.
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Feb 9, 2017 18:16
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I don't even really game anymore, I was more just talking about that to illustrate how underwhelming a specific use case was when I upgraded to the 6700k. I can definitely put more cores to work and would love a chance to go from 4->8.
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Feb 9, 2017 18:19
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They're certainly not going to get another 40% IPC gain going forward but they've claimed that Zen+ would offer more than the typical 5% from Intel. There are definitely a lot of obstacles but I think the paltry performance gains we've seen going from the 2600k to the 6700k are just as much reflective of Intel just not caring much about the desktop market anymore for multiple reasons. Hopefully this competition from AMD will at least make them care a little bit about the desktop market even though it's too small of a market to spend a lot of resources catering to.
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Feb 9, 2017 18:19
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Has there been any leaks of Zen CPUs that are useful for laptops?
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Feb 9, 2017 18:21
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Waiting is smart at this point in time. And while more cores over 4 isn't a huge boost to gaming, it sure does make a noticeable gain on doing more than one thing while gaming. And bringing the core count up with comparable single core performance to HW/BW/SL is only going to be a good thing long term. Like the example they showed at their "Platfrom" event, when streaming with a 6700K vs Ryzen, the stream stuttered (whatever settings they were using, but possibly was all CPU based vs offloading to GPU Encoding) while the Ryzen machine kept humming away. Streamers and any other sort of multitasker probably would be really happy if Ryzen comes out at a great price with this many cores. Remember the old days of small amounts of ram, so you ALT+TAB and had to redraw the screen until you got to whatever other app or your desktop came up? I sort of picture the last bit of remaining multitasking bottleneck is the ability to have free cores left to allocate to what you aren't actively doing. The next step would be to see how everything does once games start using more than 4, but at that point, I think 8+ cores would be the norm so luckily, hardware should stay ahead of software. Also I can confirm from random visits into the verse, that Star Citizen does like lots of cores (4-6 separate cores per Task Manager?), but the old SB-E does handle it quite well. Though the games current limitation really is the storage transfer speed. IF you run it not on an SSD you are never going to see it run smooth. I bet it could even saturate a freaking PCI-E SSD but I don't have one to test with.
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Feb 9, 2017 18:27
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If Ryzen ends up this good I'll finally replace my Phenom II 1090t I mean hell it's going to be better than what I have anyway but goddamn where are the benchmarks 
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Feb 9, 2017 18:48
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EdEddnEddy posted:Waiting is smart at this point in time. And while more cores over 4 isn't a huge boost to gaming, it sure does make a noticeable gain on doing more than one thing while gaming. And bringing the core count up with comparable single core performance to HW/BW/SL is only going to be a good thing long term. Using star citizen as a gauge for anything is uhhhhhhh lol?
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Feb 9, 2017 19:06
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EdEddnEddy posted:Also I can confirm from random visits into the verse, that Star Citizen does like lots of cores (4-6 separate cores per Task Manager?), but the old SB-E does handle it quite well. Though the games current limitation really is the storage transfer speed. IF you run it not on an SSD you are never going to see it run smooth. I bet it could even saturate a freaking PCI-E SSD but I don't have one to test with.
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Feb 9, 2017 19:07
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Am I just a weirdo for just wanting 8 real cores and therefore don't really have a need for the 8c/16t parts - tossing whatever savings into a better GPU?
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Feb 9, 2017 19:21
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Combat Pretzel posted:A really terribly implemented game isn't exactly a datapoint worth considering, merely as an edge case to present the effect of having significant reserves. I understand that for sure. The game is nowhere near optimized, but considering the level of resources it does require isn't outside of the ballpark of future games in the next 5 years or so if technology does allow them to have that much excess from todays 4 core systems. Really if you can run Star Citizen well in its current form, it isn't a terrible metric to think that it shows you can run pretty much anything else well too. Kinda like the modern Crysis of old.
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Feb 9, 2017 19:25
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Gwaihir posted:Doubling your core count isn't going to do anything for you in games either, so I don't know what you're expecting. A 6700k with any kind of an overclock is going to be significantly faster single threaded than an 8 core cpu anyhow. Blah blah blah I don't care, I'm going to buy it anyway and there's nothing you can do to stop me!
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Feb 9, 2017 19:29
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Seamonster posted:Am I just a weirdo for just wanting 8 real cores and therefore don't really have a need for the 8c/16t parts - tossing whatever savings into a better GPU? I think you're looking for a market segment that doesn't exist. If you're doing something with a PC that benefits from 8 cores, it's going to benefit just as much from hyperthreading (or equivalent). There's no use case or market where one would want or need an 8 core chip but also not want HT capability.
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Feb 9, 2017 19:30
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Seamonster posted:Am I just a weirdo for just wanting 8 real cores and therefore don't really have a need for the 8c/16t parts - tossing whatever savings into a better GPU? What would be the use of turning Hyperthreading off? It's not a feature that's adding a ton of cost to the chip. You could probably turn it off if you wanted. HalloKitty fucked around with this message at 20:11 on Feb 9, 2017 |
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Feb 9, 2017 19:37
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EdEddnEddy posted:I understand that for sure. The game is nowhere near optimized, but considering the level of resources it does require isn't outside of the ballpark of future games in the next 5 years or so if technology does allow them to have that much excess from todays 4 core systems. Its a glorified tech demo at best let alone a "game" at this point and shoulf never be used as a benchmark for anything
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Feb 9, 2017 19:50
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i'm gonna be honest here, if you're expecting a boost in gaming performance over the 6700k or 4790k it's not here. if you want to do more interesting things than taxing your GPU to make pretty pictures it'll be worth it in a number of ways though
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Feb 9, 2017 20:16
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EdEddnEddy posted:I understand that for sure. The game is nowhere near optimized, but considering the level of resources it does require isn't outside of the ballpark of future games in the next 5 years or so if technology does allow them to have that much excess from todays 4 core systems. SC framerate is mostly server limited so its an incredibly bad tool to try and get an accurate reading on anything hardware wise. Also its entire production has been hilarious trainwreck, even now you have games that look much better than it, let alone in like 4 years when its actually out if they dont run out of money
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Feb 9, 2017 20:32
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I thought the hype around Ryzen was that it will drive processor prices down without sacrificing performance, and force Intel to compete and innovate again.
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Feb 9, 2017 20:32
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Sashimi posted:I thought the hype around Ryzen was that it will drive processor prices down without sacrificing performance, and force Intel to compete and innovate again. At one point perhaps, but when they demonstrated it being directly competitive with Broadwell-E, (at lower TDP!) it became a genuinely interesting chip in its own right.
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Feb 9, 2017 20:39
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For those of you wondering about benchmarks, don't forget this video of a Ryzen Engineering Sample beating a non-limited 6900K in handbrake encoding: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EsVNQYwlSAo
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Feb 9, 2017 21:29
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RyuHimora posted:For those of you wondering about benchmarks, don't forget this video of a Ryzen Engineering Sample beating a non-limited 6900K in handbrake encoding: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EsVNQYwlSAo Was confused with rendering
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Feb 9, 2017 21:30
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Both are, those are the single two poster children of why you want many cores in a desktop machine. e: Low resolution video encoding stops scaling perfectly with more cores, but high quality or 4k stuff scales ideally. Gwaihir fucked around with this message at 21:44 on Feb 9, 2017 |
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Feb 9, 2017 21:32
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Gwaihir posted:I think you're looking for a market segment that doesn't exist. If you're doing something with a PC that benefits from 8 cores, it's going to benefit just as much from hyperthreading (or equivalent). There's no use case or market where one would want or need an 8 core chip but also not want HT capability. More overclocking headroom, maybe? That'd help a bit with games. I mean, assuming an 8c/8t isn't just a part that's binned that way because it can't get even a little outside the TDP on the spec without getting all 2+2=chair, which is probably a bad assumption.
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Feb 9, 2017 22:14
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AMD said all Ryzen CPUs would be 3.4ghz+ base clock right?
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Feb 9, 2017 23:08
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I'm still on a 2500K@4.2 (Won't oc higher I tried) which is starting to show its age in some of the newer games so as a gamer what would be better: Ryzen with more and somewhat faster CPU cores or go with Kaby Lake with fewer CPU cores but said CPU cores are much faster?
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Feb 9, 2017 23:10
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spasticColon posted:I'm still on a 2500K@4.2 (Won't oc higher I tried) which is starting to show its age in some of the newer games so as a gamer what would be better: Ryzen with more and somewhat faster CPU cores or go with Kaby Lake with fewer CPU cores but said CPU cores are much faster? Wait for the reviews of ryzen and then pcik which is faster
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Feb 9, 2017 23:17
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Munkeymon posted:More overclocking headroom, maybe? That'd help a bit with games. I don't think HT has any TDP (notable) impact at all, same for OCability. But, it's also certainly not a big draw for games, because at best it's neutral performance wise and at worst it's a couple % slower than the same chip with HT disabled. HT's benefits are pretty exclusively in the productivity realm- aka the realm of why you would even buy an 8+ core CPU to begin with. spasticColon posted:I'm still on a 2500K@4.2 (Won't oc higher I tried) which is starting to show its age in some of the newer games so as a gamer what would be better: Ryzen with more and somewhat faster CPU cores or go with Kaby Lake with fewer CPU cores but said CPU cores are much faster? Well, aside from the obvious bit of no one having any benchmarks of ryzen to compare against, and no data on OC ability, the best upgrade for just gaming purposes is still going to be the highest clocked quad you can grab paired with the fastest RAM.
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Feb 9, 2017 23:18
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So how’s it looking for AMD in the portable market?
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Feb 9, 2017 23:19
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4chk3fWb6xI Not new new, but Gamers Nexus did a revisit on the 2500k. What's really interesting is that in several workloads and games, the 2600k stock was beating out the 2500k @ 4.5GHz. Hyperthreading alone has made the 2600k age even better than the 2500k, so keep that in mind when the same old arguments from the C2D vs. C2Q days of "games don't use x threads" come up.
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Feb 9, 2017 23:26
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But! But guys! Having more cores and hyprethreading be mainstream means you can use CPU PhysX without a perf hit! (I can see an _actual_ AMD fanboy saying this now.)
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Feb 9, 2017 23:28
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Platystemon posted:So how’s it looking for AMD in the portable market? Mid-late in the year mobile Zen + mobile Polaris 11/whatever will be available in laptops but no exact word on pricing or specs.
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Feb 9, 2017 23:29
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SwissArmyDruid posted:But! But guys! Having more cores and hyprethreading be mainstream means you can use CPU PhysX without a perf hit! Counterpoint: Not with AMD’s floating‐point performance. 
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Feb 9, 2017 23:31
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Platystemon posted:So how’s it looking for AMD in the portable market? more info on raven ridge should be coming out in the middle of the year, but they've said as much that they want to break into the ultrabook (5-15w) market at the very least with the APUs
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Feb 9, 2017 23:36
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Gwaihir posted:Well, aside from the obvious bit of no one having any benchmarks of ryzen to compare against, and no data on OC ability, the best upgrade for just gaming purposes is still going to be the highest clocked quad you can grab paired with the fastest RAM. So get a i7-7700K and pair it with some DDR4-4000 RAM?  PerrineClostermann posted:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4chk3fWb6xI I actually watched that video a few days ago and that's what got me thinking of getting an i7 chip this time over an i5 chip but then Ryzen is coming out soon and where are the goddamn benchmarks for it? 
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Feb 9, 2017 23:37
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fishmech posted:Has there been any leaks of Zen CPUs that are useful for laptops? Platystemon posted:So how’s it looking for AMD in the portable market? Not much info on Raven Ridge besides 2H2017 launch, but AMD being able to get a 3.4/3.7 octocore within 65W TDP bodes well for laptop parts.
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Feb 9, 2017 23:39
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SwissArmyDruid posted:But! But guys! Having more cores and hyprethreading be mainstream means you can use CPU PhysX without a perf hit! Brb, checking r/AMD. I bet I can find this argument on the front page.
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Feb 9, 2017 23:42
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I find the 8 cores to be interesting for streamers and the like, since you can run a x264/265 encoder with 2 cores and still have tons of muscle for the stream upload and the actual game.
Methylethylaldehyde fucked around with this message at 01:52 on Feb 10, 2017 |
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Feb 10, 2017 01:48
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Methylethylaldehyde posted:I find the 8 cores to be interesting for streamers and the like, since you can run a x264/265 encoder with 2 cores and still have tons of muscle for the stream upload and the actual game.
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Feb 10, 2017 02:08
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Anime Schoolgirl posted:also being able to actually encode 4k 60fps at a not unsustainably high bitrate on the same pc without buying a 1100 dollar ~enterprise~ card Basically this.
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Feb 10, 2017 02:12
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