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HEY GAIL posted:i thought i would get the Exsurge when i googled "prayers against demons," i didn't know i was loading up a trip to loving crazytown: iirc the answer is, actually, florida e: also as clearly established in Scratch v. Stone the devil is considered an American national so i guess anywhere? StashAugustine fucked around with this message at 15:49 on Feb 13, 2017 |
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Feb 13, 2017 15:43
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StashAugustine posted:e: also as clearly established in Scratch v. Stone the devil is considered an American national Well that's somehow not surprising at all
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Feb 13, 2017 15:57
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System Metternich posted:Well that's somehow not surprising at all The Devil and Daniel Webster posted:“Pressed or not, you shall not have this man!” he thundered. “Mr. Stone is an American citizen, and no American citizen may be forced into the service of a foreign prince. We fought England for that in ’12 and we’ll fight all hell for it again!”
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Feb 13, 2017 16:06
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 Hell yeah, you tell 'em Republican Jesus! Matt. 25:41-46 posted:Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels: For I was an hungred, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not. Aw, Actual Jesus doesn't let us have any fun.
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Feb 13, 2017 17:12
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Having said your peace, is it more likely that Cookies is just trolling?
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Feb 13, 2017 18:50
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anything is possible but that's a drat good troll if he is one, like someone would need to do a lot of research about drugs and bipolar disorders to even begin posting like him, let alone get to the "i'm a prophet" stuff
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Feb 13, 2017 19:29
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Yeah it's...definitely either a manic episode or the world's best character actor.
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Feb 13, 2017 20:00
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I LIKE COOKIE posted:ugh you guys are making me upset. I guess a mentally ill persons opinion will never be treated as equal here. of all places, The Christianity thread. I'm gunna take a break for tonight and go do something else I love for a while because this isnt making me happy anymore. People are pointing out that what you're sincerely describing does not sound like how anyone in the Bible describes their experience with divine revelation, but it does sound like how people describe manic episodes. If what you're experiencing is of God, medication and therapy won't make it go away. If not, you should want it to go away; God is truth, and so if we want to know God we should want to know the truth, even if the truth doesn't make us happy, even if a delusion is harmless and enjoyable. That said, whatever ends up being the source of your experiences, I do want to thank you: all of the discussion has led me to recall, and reflect on, a moment when I believe God spoke to me in actual words; it shaped what I've done with my life for the fifteen years since, and I don't often enough spend time remembering what that moment was like. I've been having a rough few months - it seems like at least one person in my house has been sick every day since November, politics are gloomy, and the next time I see my own psychiatrist I probably need to get my meds adjusted - and spending time with that memory has helped me put one foot in front of the other, the past few days.
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Feb 13, 2017 22:16
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The Phlegmatist posted:
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Feb 13, 2017 22:29
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HEY GAIL posted:heaven does not have a wall. Hell does, though. Guess what happened to it. "pretty sure that was exactly what hell said to christ and look how that ended up"-an orthobro arguing against immigration, probably
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Feb 13, 2017 22:34
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Bel_Canto posted:"pretty sure that they are also the only orthobros who really got the jonah story, and all mentions of Leviathan
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Feb 13, 2017 22:39
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TIL that there used to be the custom in some parts of Europe of burying the Alleluia after the first Vespers of the Septuagesima, and that this tradition is still observed by some!quote:In the Medieval churches of Western Europe, various customs arose around the final “Alleluia” which concludes First Vespers of Septuagesima. Especially in the French and Germanic lands, this often included writing the word “Alleluia” on a cloth or parchment, placing this in a catafalque, and burying it as at a funeral, to be uncovered after the joy of Easter Sunday. This act would be accompanied by hymns and canticles, most notably the hymn Alleluia, dulce carmen (O sweet song, alleluia), of French origin. The pre-Tridentine Germanic missals even included a Sequence bidding farewell to “Alleluia” on Septuagesima, Cantemus cuncti melodum nunc alleluia (Let us all now sing the melodious alleluia)   That's a pretty cool custom, I have to say, wonderfully theatralic. We'll be getting a new priest this summer, maybe I should ask him to reintroduce that one here too 
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Feb 13, 2017 23:04
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i have never heard of that, even from when i was catholic--grew up in a Hispanic area, not one influenced by French or German customs
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Feb 13, 2017 23:20
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System Metternich posted:TIL that there used to be the custom in some parts of Europe of burying the Alleluia after the first Vespers of the Septuagesima, and that this tradition is still observed by some! I know a priest that burns the alleluia in effigy every Septuagesima. But he is rather eccentric.
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Feb 13, 2017 23:33
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speaking of regional things, metternich, do you guys have a Mass for the Dead if 2 Nov falls on a Sunday?
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Feb 13, 2017 23:39
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aww yeah, you know a man who wears those kinds of vestments loves celebrating the EF Mass
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Feb 13, 2017 23:42
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HEY GAIL posted:speaking of regional things, metternich, do you guys have a Mass for the Dead if 2 Nov falls on a Sunday? Pretty sure we do, yeah. I looked it up in the liturgical calendar just to be sure, and for 2019 (when this will happen next) All Souls' Day is celebrated on 2 Nov as always.
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Feb 13, 2017 23:52
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 Any orthogoons care to explain the meaning of this icon.
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Feb 14, 2017 03:29
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I'm not sure that can really be an icon, given it's blatant characterization of the father? I'm not sure if I'm more disturbed by the violation of this stricture, or by the father's odd haircut.
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Feb 14, 2017 03:39
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CountFosco posted:I'm not sure that can really be an icon, given it's blatant characterization of the father? https://russianicons.wordpress.com/tag/god-the-father/
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Feb 14, 2017 04:15
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CountFosco posted:I'm not sure that can really be an icon, given it's blatant characterization of the father? Dunno, looks like god to me. I see God every time I shoot heroin into my eyeballs and he looks just like that.
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Feb 14, 2017 04:18
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I think I'm going to go ahead and take the next step to joining the Eastern Orthodox tradition. Coming back to Christianity from being a pretty lame excuse for an atheist has been a very strange experience, as I've had to swallow my intellectual pride for adhering myself to a tradition commonly believed to be anti-intellectual but at the same time I cannot deny the positive aspects it has had on my attitude and perspective on the world. I think for quite a bit of it my "atheism" came from a place of egoism, where I congratulated myself for stoically accepting the hard truth of a meaningless universe. Obviously, this was not a rational position, as a truth claim does not depend on whether it is hard or easy to come to terms with. It's been an interesting path from mainline Congregationalism to atheism to Orthodoxy. A painful, passionate path.
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Feb 14, 2017 04:55
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CountFosco posted:I think I'm going to go ahead and take the next step to joining the Eastern Orthodox tradition. This post spoke to me so I prayed about it. Why do we have this notion that religion is anti-intellectual? Well, maybe a religion telling you the answer to all great questions is "God", makes us distrust them, because that is lazy thinking. Jumping to conclusions and writing every mystery of the universe off as God's work is Sloth. Science is amazing. It should not be a battle between science and religion, because science will win that battle every day of the week. Science is science. Experiments can be repeated, and logical conclusions can be drawn. Religion is based off faith, or trust. It makes me sad to think that a man of science has no trust in God because of religion. What even is Religion? Man's interpretation of God's teachings? "Man" (religion) is obviously doing something wrong if most of the world's population is turning away from religion, and turning to atheism.
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Feb 14, 2017 05:11
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Well, probably mostly because a significant minority of American religious organizations have deliberately allied themselves with anti-intellectualism, and provided a lot of the political power and impetus for regressive social movements. They make a lot of enemies, and it's easy for that to become your mental representation of what "religion" means, especially if your family doesn't practice anything themselves.
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Feb 14, 2017 05:19
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HEY GAIL posted:it's technically unkosher but people have been doing it since the middle ages and if you're orthodox long customary usage means a thing is fine, so... this article was awesome, thanks yeah I guess depictions of the Father or the Holy Spirit were anathemized by the Russian Orthodox Church but that never stopped anyone
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Feb 14, 2017 05:32
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You should be in a prison in Manila. gently caress off from this thread. In fact, gently caress off from the forums, and seek mental help before you hurt more people.
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Feb 14, 2017 05:44
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The Phlegmatist posted:this article was awesome, thanks
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Feb 14, 2017 05:46
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Tuxedo Catfish posted:Well, probably mostly because a significant minority of American religious organizations have deliberately allied themselves with anti-intellectualism, and provided a lot of the political power and impetus for regressive social movements. They make a lot of enemies, and it's easy for that to become your mental representation of what "religion" means, especially if your family doesn't practice anything themselves. Right! The answer I came up with after praying was "religion is full of sin." But I thought that was too simple an answer so I thought I'd approach the question from a different angle that much easier for the average person to fully comprehend. I am starting to realize that I am giving lazy answers too, which is causing distrust in my message. I accuse you of Slothful lazy thinking, when really it is me who's being Sloth. I think I will slowly learn to become more patient and less snappy. We can only change ourselves!
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Feb 14, 2017 05:57
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my dad posted:You should be in a prison in Manila. Sorry you feel that way, dad. Stop judging me by my mistakes. Only God can judge me.
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Feb 14, 2017 05:58
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brah you beat a woman. Eat my dick.
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Feb 14, 2017 06:10
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I am curious what we all think of the phrase "only God can judge me". I see it said a lot, but it doesn't really strike true for me. Obviously, God is the ultimate judge, but in judging a person, I feel as though I am simply exercising my moral sense. I believe in my morality because I believe it is God-sent. If I truly refrained from judging others, wouldn't I be denying the validity of my own moral system? I mean, I still try my best to love all, but it seems like exercising your moral sense is an imperative part of having morality. Like, if I don't "judge" a person (i.e. if i don't ascribe value to a moral judgment), do I really believe in the weight of my own moral convictions?
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Feb 14, 2017 06:21
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HEY GAIL posted:brah you beat a woman. Eat my dick. If I eat your dick, would you forgive me? Re: only God can judge me. I just made a post about Judging in my thread in ask/tell, but I'll repeat it here. Anyone who uses "only God can judge me" as a way to brush off others concerns about sinful acts is using God as an excuse the do wrong. That heresy right? Or sacrilege? I'm still learning the holy vocab so excuse my ignorance, maybe it's desecration? Anyways. Having morals and using your own morals to cast judgement are two separate things. When you judge someone, your basically just searching for reasons as to why you are Better, or greater. It's Pride. It's looking down on the wicked. Instead of hating the wicked, why not try and love them? Has it ever occurred to any of you that the most FUBAR people on this earth have never experienced love before? Probably not even once their whole loves? Zero love. Give them what the NEED. They need love. If the world keeps giving a person hate, that person has no reason but to hate the world. Stop looking down onothers. Do it for Jesus. The sinning is getting waaaay out of control, that's why God is back. To bring peace to us all.
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Feb 14, 2017 06:32
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mythomanic posted:I am curious what we all think of the phrase "only God can judge me". I see it said a lot, but it doesn't really strike true for me. Obviously, God is the ultimate judge, but in judging a person, I feel as though I am simply exercising my moral sense. I believe in my morality because I believe it is God-sent. If I truly refrained from judging others, wouldn't I be denying the validity of my own moral system? I mean, I still try my best to love all, but it seems like exercising your moral sense is an imperative part of having morality. Like, if I don't "judge" a person (i.e. if i don't ascribe value to a moral judgment), do I really believe in the weight of my own moral convictions? a) Judging that an action is wrong is possible but there may or may not be mitigating circumstances you don't know about. (I've joked before that I'm a limited universalist- everyone's guaranteed to go to Heaven except me; since I know when I did something wrong but anyone else who knows) b) There happens to be a pretty strong correlation between "people who throw around judgements" and "people who are also assholes."
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Feb 14, 2017 06:36
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I LIKE COOKIE posted:When you judge someone, your basically just searching for reasons as to why you are Better, or greater. It's Pride. It's looking down on the wicked. Instead of hating the wicked, why not try and love them? You're ascribing intent to my actions. We should be clear about what we mean about "judging". If I observe someone's actions or behavior and say to myself, "That is bad behavior; people should not behave that way," then I'm not hating the wicked. I'm observing and noting wicked behavior so that I may behave more correctly. I think it's through witnessing and processing the actions of others that we discern our own moral standings. You're quick to point out people in this thread's mortal sins, but I suppose it's different when you consider yourself a prophet. I LIKE COOKIE posted:that's why God is back. Never left. God is risen.
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Feb 14, 2017 06:42
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It comes from James 4:12. "There is only one Lawgiver and Judge, the one who is able to save and destroy. But you—who are you to judge your neighbor?" But in its context of what it's talking about, it refers to judging the fate of someone's eternal soul. This is...actually a sin in Catholicism. It's called presumption. In St. Paul's epistles there are some examples of temporal judgment. You can tell someone they're sinning. You can tell someone that what they're doing is wrong and even cut them off from church for a while (1 Cor. 5.) But you can't tell someone they're going to hell. So in that sense, yes, Christians do indeed have license to judge people's actions.
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Feb 14, 2017 06:46
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I LIKE COOKIE posted:This post spoke to me so I prayed about it. Let me preface this by saying the following: please visit your therapist and priest and tell them all of this stuff you're spouting. You should read Gould on religion vs. science, I plug this constantly but it's a fantastic essay about the convergence of science and religion: http://www.stephenjaygould.org/library/gould_noma.html As a PhD scientist, religion and science are not contradictory at all. Honestly, your posting is spiraling off into strange fallacies and you're not even addressing Christianity anymore. You aren't making sense. Seek help, please. edit: I'm not trying to be patronizing here, we have posters struggling with bipolar telling you that you need to consult a mental health professional. To be absolutely blunt, you are not mentally well and sincerely need to seek help for your condition. That doesn't negate your experiences with the divine at all. You just need to consider your religious experience from a sober, considered point of view. Pellisworth fucked around with this message at 07:26 on Feb 14, 2017 |
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Feb 14, 2017 07:22
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I am seeking help, I just have a busy schedule and have to get through this work week first. If 100 different people tell me to do something then maybe I should consider listening, even if I do not agree. We are all blind to our own issues and problems, including me. Anyways, yeah, we can drop the therapy talk now because you already won that debate, so we can let it go. Please And yeah I do go off on tangents. I try my best to keep it relevant, but it's hard when you have a lot to say and only 2 minutes to say it. I'm just trying to do right by God, In the only way I know how, is all.
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Feb 14, 2017 09:10
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CountFosco posted:I think for quite a bit of it my "atheism" came from a place of egoism, where I congratulated myself for stoically accepting the hard truth of a meaningless universe. Obviously, this was not a rational position, as a truth claim does not depend on whether it is hard or easy to come to terms with. If the Universe possesses a meaning it's hidden enough to be meaningless to those inside it. And how is it not a rational position that there is no divinity? I don't mean that in the horrible "dark enlightenment" way of claiming that everything "rational" is good. But, how do you come to the idea that none belief is not a rational one? I'd be fascinated to hear more if you want to share, and if not then that is absolutely fine. Best of luck! I LIKE COOKIE posted:Stop judging me by my mistakes. Only God can judge me. Not true, because if God is this vague "life force" thing you keep talking about, then I have enough spark of the divine to say "You need to get psychological help!" Josef bugman fucked around with this message at 09:40 on Feb 14, 2017 |
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Feb 14, 2017 09:37
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Your right, everyone can judge me. But it's literally God's job to judge us. We all need to stop trying to do God's job! He doesn't like that Edit: Hey don't edit your post after I respond. That's not cool. I guess that's why we have quote though, so you can't change it. On well. When your mind is out of responses, it just circles back to what you know to be flawed about me, my mental health  Going from a friendly debate about God to belittling others. Tsk tsk I like to think I have thick skin but this is honestly starting to hurt my feelings a little bit. Can we all stop attacking me because I'm Bipolar? It's cruel and it hurts to he told that your broken... Please, stop This thread is not about me, can we please keep it about God? That's all I ask. I LIKE COOKIE fucked around with this message at 10:07 on Feb 14, 2017 |
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Feb 14, 2017 09:50
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Josef bugman posted:If the Universe possesses a meaning it's hidden enough to be meaningless to those inside it. Being an atheist because being man enough to face a meaningless universe makes you feel good is not a rational position, regardless of whether or not there is a god. And I'd argue perceiving meaning is pretty natural for a human being, and you only get to the meaningless universe through materialism or other philosophical routes.
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Feb 14, 2017 10:35
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