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Jota posted:Philly seems like just about the only team that could offer good value for Lillard and would possibly want him. What's fair value for Lillard? As a Blazers fan I would probably want Okafor, TJ, the LAL pick, and the SAC pick. Noel doesn't make sense since he's about to get paid and overlaps in skillset with Nurkic. Simmons would be amazing but Philly isn't going to let him go I don't think.
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Feb 21, 2017 22:33
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Hashtag Banterzone posted:What's fair value for Lillard? That seems waaaaay too much.
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Feb 21, 2017 22:34
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Hashtag Banterzone posted:What's fair value for Lillard?
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Feb 21, 2017 22:36
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Hashtag Banterzone posted:What's fair value for Lillard? I think that is wildly overvaluing a PG who isn't a great passer, has a sub-45 FG%, isn't a great 3-point shooter, and plays no defense.
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Feb 21, 2017 22:36
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roundmidnight posted:I think that is wildly overvaluing a PG who isn't a great passer, has a sub-45 FG%, isn't a great 3-point shooter, and plays no defense. Huh, I could have sworn Lillard was a much better 3 point shooter than he actually is
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Feb 21, 2017 22:40
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The Glumslinger posted:Huh, I could have sworn Lillard was a much better 3 point shooter than he actually is He just takes a million of them, nails a few really tough ones, and they look really cool when they go in.
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Feb 21, 2017 22:41
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Lillard is really good at shooting off the dribble, but he probably tries to do it too much.Rick posted:To be fair, no, they weren't. The Lakers had zero centers and SFs on their roster, and the closest things to superstars in Barnes and Whiteside wanted to play for winning teams. They paid literal market value for a non-D league level unrestricted free agents. The combination of those two for 34 mil a year over 4 years is not a great signing. It's not catastrophic, but it wasn't good. Plus Mozgov was immediately signed, they pulled a Vlade taking that deal ASAP. Like, go get Gerald Henderson and Ezeli and spend 1/3 or less.Or James Johnson and Tyley Zeller. I dunno, lots of gross choices but they cost a lot less. Like I said, I don't think its totally horrible, if your committed to a rebuild those guys are worth while because they can help your guys grow and ride the bench without a problem, but obviously the Lakers weren't committed to the rebuild.
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Feb 21, 2017 22:42
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Lillard in the East easily makes the all star team for the next few years I think. Okafor plus whatever pick gets us Fultz or Ball
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Feb 21, 2017 22:44
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roundmidnight posted:He just takes a million of them, nails a few really tough ones, and they look really cool when they go in. Oh, the old Kobe strat Kobe probably would have shot 2% or 3% better on his career if he didn't take so many dumbass 3 pointers Also, sounds like Magic is super committed to trading Lou and there are rumors that multiple teams are offering a first round pick for him. Take the loving pick and run
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Feb 21, 2017 22:45
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Hashtag Banterzone posted:What's fair value for Lillard? I like Lillard, but there's no way Philly gives up this much to add a $100+ million, ball dominant guard who doesn't play defense when they probably will be able to draft at least one of Fultz, Ball, Smith, Ntkilina and have them on a rookie contract.
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Feb 21, 2017 22:48
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I forgot Colangelo is in charge of the 76ers. I now demand Simmons, Okafor, and both picks
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Feb 21, 2017 22:51
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Lockback posted:Lillard is really good at shooting off the dribble, but he probably tries to do it too much. It's not like there was another center who matched the "could kind of play offense" criteria the Lakers were looking for. And why make a gross choice that costs less when you have the money to spend? And I mean even if you don't like the contracts, is it a reason to get rid of Kupchak like Tae is implying?
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Feb 21, 2017 22:51
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The mozgov signing was an obviously terrible move and defending it will make you look really bad.
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Feb 21, 2017 22:52
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mike- posted:The mozgov signing was an obviously terrible move and defending it will make you look really bad. It was bad, but it was market value bad
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Feb 21, 2017 22:54
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mike- posted:The mozgov signing was an obviously terrible move and defending it will make you look really bad. Wow great counterargument to the points I made. Can I interest you in a website https://www.reddit.com/r/lakers/
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Feb 21, 2017 22:55
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The Glumslinger posted:It was bad, but it was market value bad I don't think this is much of an excuse and I wish some other team would have paid mozgov his "market value" instead of the lakers.
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Feb 21, 2017 22:56
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Rick posted:Wow great counterargument to the points I made. Can I interest you in a website https://www.reddit.com/r/lakers/ It was a dumb take, but no need to be rude mike- posted:I don't think this is much of an excuse and I wish some other team would have paid mozgov his "market value" instead of the lakers. I mean Biyombo, Mahimi, and Noah got a similar deal and putting up similar numbers or worse The Glumslinger fucked around with this message at 23:00 on Feb 21, 2017 |
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Feb 21, 2017 22:56
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This week in vague headlines, from the Chron: Rockets may target versatile player for depth at multiple positions Also this week: Morey needs breast reduction surgery  
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Feb 21, 2017 23:00
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roundmidnight posted:I think that is wildly overvaluing a PG who isn't a great passer, has a sub-45 FG%, isn't a great 3-point shooter, and plays no defense. LOL
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Feb 21, 2017 23:01
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zelah posted:Lillard in the East easily makes the all star team for the next few years I think. IT, Kyrie, Wall, Lowry are all better than Lillard. Kemba probably too
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Feb 21, 2017 23:02
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The Glumslinger posted:It was a dumb take, but no need to be rude
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Feb 21, 2017 23:02
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I love Trade deadline time because it puts on full display around here how different fans and people view players around the league.
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Feb 21, 2017 23:03
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https://twitter.com/ramonashelburne/status/834079854307975168 drat Kings killed f5 season
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Feb 21, 2017 23:04
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Cool Buff Man posted:IT, Kyrie, Wall, Lowry are all better than Lillard. Kemba probably too Neither IT nor Wall were obviously better than him until IT made a huge leap this season (his age 27 season, which Lillard hasn't yet played). I've been unhappy with his play this season since a couple months into the season, although there are whispers that he's still hurt.
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Feb 21, 2017 23:06
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Away all Goats posted:https://twitter.com/ramonashelburne/status/834079854307975168 Not many teams have a player with steph potential so this shouldn't matter
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Feb 21, 2017 23:08
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Fast Luck posted:It seems correct to me. Mozgov is a 20mpg warm 7' body to throw out there and they're paying him $15m for this year and three more. By the last couple years he'll probably be playing under 10mpg. Luol Deng is on the wrong side of 30 and has been declining for years, and they're paying him $18m this year and three more. By the last couple years he won't play at all. Mozgov has played about 20 minutes total the past month but no one could have seen that coming! Other than basically everyone who ridiculed the signing when it happened because bringing in a thirty year old plodding center with knee issues wasn't going to mesh with a young core that was envisioned to play up tempo basketball.
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Feb 21, 2017 23:09
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Papercut posted:Neither IT nor Wall were obviously better than him until IT made a huge leap this season (his age 27 season, which Lillard hasn't yet played). I'm just saying that the idea that he "easily makes the all-star game in the east" isn't all that realistic, there's definitely stiff competition
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Feb 21, 2017 23:09
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Problem with Lillard is Portlands position on the win curve w him, no obvious way to improve in short term. Lowers his trade value.
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Feb 21, 2017 23:11
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I think his performance would improve playing in the East and he's already on the cusp or making it every year in the West vs better guards. I don't think it's unreasonable.
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Feb 21, 2017 23:12
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mike- posted:Mozgov has played about 20 minutes total the past month but no one could have seen that coming! Other than basically everyone who ridiculed the signing when it happened because bringing in a thirty year old plodding center with knee issues wasn't going to mesh with a young core that was envisioned to play up tempo basketball. The bigger problem with mozgov is that he was clearly brought in to be a stop gap. Why they thought they needed to hand out a 4 year contract for a stop gap is what most people take exception to.
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Feb 21, 2017 23:13
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Rick posted:It's not like there was another center who matched the "could kind of play offense" criteria the Lakers were looking for. And why make a gross choice that costs less when you have the money to spend? No absolutely not. I think Kupchak was actually doing the right thing and is a top-end FO guy. The problem is he didn't have buy-in. Like I said, those guys are good if your "stealth tanking" (ie, not actually trying to tank but making sure you don't have veterans who are too good and take playing time from your young players). I'd rather take a gross twosome that I pay 10 million for than a bit-better-than-gross" twosome that I spend 34 million on. You and I are agreed that this was a bad move by the Lakers. They should have ridden out the rebuild a little longer, and the team was actually looking pretty good, even if they weren't quite ready to put up a lot of Ws yet. The Glumslinger posted:I mean Biyombo, Mahimi, and Noah got a similar deal and putting up similar numbers or worse "It's no worse than Noah's deal" is damning with pretty faint praise, but I agree that is was "market-bad" not a disaster.
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Feb 21, 2017 23:16
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The main problem I have is the years. The annual rate is whatever, everyone got bad contracts in the offseason, but if 4 years is what you needed to give to get those guys, pass on it. Center was a plentiful market if you're looking for stop-gaps. My other problem with the Deng signing is that they signed him to be an SF, when his best minutes was playing as a small ball 4 and the Lakers clearly weren't going to do that with a billion PF's.
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Feb 21, 2017 23:19
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http://www.spotrac.com/nba/portland-trail-blazers/evan-turner-6883/
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Feb 21, 2017 23:19
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Redgrendel2001 posted:I like Lillard, but there's no way Philly gives up this much to add a $100+ million, ball dominant guard who doesn't play defense when they probably will be able to draft at least one of Fultz, Ball, Smith, Ntkilina and have them on a rookie contract. Exactly. I want Magic to make a 'win soon' move that gets the Lakers out of the bottom three. I would very much like the sixers to have multiple top 10 picks (Ntilikina and Isaac please)
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Feb 21, 2017 23:19
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Drummond is almost certainly gone from the Pistons this week. Hopefully they'll get someone who doesn't mope after he misses a shot, and then has to sit out long stretches of time late in close games because he shoots free throws like Stevie Wonder.
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Feb 21, 2017 23:20
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The Mahinmi contract looks worse than the Evan Turner one at this point. ET's put up 1 winshare this year so far baby
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Feb 21, 2017 23:21
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Feb 21, 2017 23:22
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There are so many good guards coming out this year that I find it interesting that it seems like Sixers fans online have fallen in love with Frank Ntilikina, who I don't think any have ever actually seen play basketball. I mean not having seen someone play and having strong opinions on them is a big part of the draft process, but you'd figure they get more attached to someone in college with how many good US prospects there are.
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Feb 21, 2017 23:23
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Fast Luck posted:It seems correct to me. Mozgov is a 20mpg warm 7' body to throw out there and they're paying him $15m for this year and three more. By the last couple years he'll probably be playing under 10mpg. Luol Deng is on the wrong side of 30 and has been declining for years, and they're paying him $18m this year and three more. By the last couple years he won't play at all. The Lakers needed to fill these positions and they did so with players who--when you throw out the top of the class who didn't want to play for them anyway--are playing at or better than the production level of the rest of the class. And by all accounts, both guys are good locker room guys, which is what the Lakers desperately needed considering they are set to win less than 30 games this year and probably next year as well. It doesn't matter that the contracts are 3, 4 years, because one thing that's been proven over and over again, if you really need to, you can get out of any contract in the NBA. And like what do you think the Lakers should have been saving this money for? Have you looked at who's going to be a free agent next year? And do you really think guys are going to be moving en masse under the new CBA? Building through free agency while being a bad team is dead. If the Lakers didn't prove that over the last two years, should they just keep on proving it, or maybe try to do something else? And worse case scenario, if they need more money, and they can't trade them, they can stretch them. That's why Zach Lowe, Woj, all said before free agency last year "teams are just going to give guys the years because it's no longer considered an issue to get the last half of the contract off of the cap books" but somehow people are still surprised.
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Feb 21, 2017 23:25
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https://twitter.com/bball_ref/status/834167091083300866 when basketball reference is subtweeting you, poo poo's gone reaaaal sideways.
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Feb 21, 2017 23:30
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