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Spiffster posted:Let's just see if they can actually make an impact or just blow all the energy building up right now They already blew it by picking Perez
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Feb 25, 2017 21:35
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Hah, the concession to the sanders wing is deputy chair
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Feb 25, 2017 21:36
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Spiffster posted:Let's just see if they can actually make an impact or just blow all the energy building up right now Like I've said before, it helps the Dems and the resistance movement more generally a lot that there are actual real life elections happening this fall and they don't have to wait till next year. It gives a concrete thing to work on this very moment, even if it's only a couple states and a handful of special elections.
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Feb 25, 2017 21:36
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Having Ellison as the deputy chair means that they've talked about strategies, and it means that perez values his opinions and skills. That's absolutely a good sign. edit: remember that ellison and perez are friends.
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Feb 25, 2017 21:36
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We aren't asking the real question here, what does Susan Surandon think?
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Feb 25, 2017 21:38
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Chelb posted:Having Ellison as the deputy chair means that they've talked about strategies, and it means that perez values his opinions and skills. That's absolutely a good sign. But didn't value them enough to not do the establishment's bidding
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Feb 25, 2017 21:40
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Chelb posted:Having Ellison as the deputy chair means that they've talked about strategies, and it means that perez values his opinions and skills. That's absolutely a good sign. It's a good sign to people who pay attention to this poo poo, but to the 50% of the country that didn't vote (or the 25% that could vote and didn't, more accurately) it's just gonna remove any legitimacy Ellison had.
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Feb 25, 2017 21:41
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LORD OF BOOTY posted:It's a good sign to people who pay attention to this poo poo, but to the 50% of the country that didn't vote (or the 25% that could vote and didn't, more accurately) it's just gonna remove any legitimacy Ellison had. of the fifty percent of the country that didn't vote, only a tiny portion of that even know or care about the dnc. And I highly doubt that today will feature very prominently in the minds of those voters at the midterms or in 2020.
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Feb 25, 2017 21:44
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Perez and Ellison are both cool and good and Perez is still way left of basically every DNC chair since at least Howard Dean if not longer. The fact that they are going to be working together and get along well is also cool and good. Either one of them winning would have been perfectly okay. If Ellison had won we'd probably have Perez as vice-chair as well and it feels like they are both committed to uniting the party and are on the same page. On the list of things about the Democratic Party to be worrying about right now, Perez over Ellison is about 30th on the list at most I feel like.
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Feb 25, 2017 21:44
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The Democrats don't want my vote. That's fine. They've always wanted it in theory but not enough to work for it. It creates more work for those of us trying to fix the broken right wing Democrats, but it's not like it was ever going to be easy.
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Feb 25, 2017 21:45
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I feel comfortable predicting that Bernie Sanders and various other progressive-wing figures will make statements saying that while they're disappointed Ellison didn't win they are heartened by the close cooperation between the two and looks forward to working with them and a revitalized Democratic Party to ensure that all Americans are represented, not just the one percent, and that Donald Trump and the Republican agenda are defeated at every turn from here to 2020. I also predict that this will have zero impact on anyone who has already decided to be outraged. Honest question, are such warm and unifying statements (like those both leading chair candidates were making from the word go) simply viewed as the insincere gestures of politicians?
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Feb 25, 2017 21:45
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"Lead with our values" what more idpol to shill for corporations Like Bernie said, this party has to make it clear that it will stand up to the 1%. Nothing Perez said in his speech makes me confident he will do that.
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Feb 25, 2017 21:45
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Fraction Jackson posted:Perez and Ellison are both cool and good and Perez is still way left of basically every DNC chair since at least Howard Dean if not longer. The fact that they are going to be working together and get along well is also cool and good. Either one of them winning would have been perfectly okay. If Ellison had won we'd probably have Perez as vice-chair as well and it feels like they are both committed to uniting the party and are on the same page. Yeah. It seems real clear to me that Perez and Ellison are going to work in tandem here.
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Feb 25, 2017 21:46
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its cool and good we lose ellison in congress so that the establishment has an empty suit to tell him to shut up when they please. also cool and good that islamophobia won the day. gently caress the dems
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Feb 25, 2017 21:46
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"It's a good thing that we gave you some ceremonial power instead of all of it! Why are you angry????????"
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Feb 25, 2017 21:47
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cool and good I keep repeating to myself
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Feb 25, 2017 21:47
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Condiv posted:its cool and good we lose ellison in congress so that the establishment has an empty suit to tell him to shut up when they please. also cool and good that islamophobia won the day. gently caress the dems Yep, they've learned nothing. Switching my party registration to independent.
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Feb 25, 2017 21:48
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Condiv posted:its cool and good we lose ellison in congress so that the establishment has an empty suit to tell him to shut up when they please. also cool and good that islamophobia won the day. gently caress the dems this... was going to happen anyway?
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Feb 25, 2017 21:48
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"Sure we lost to an orange clown who can't read but we're giving you the whole drat DEPUTY chairman seat you drat, dirty Bernie bros!"
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Feb 25, 2017 21:48
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Mostly Lurking posted:"Sure we lost to an orange clown who can't read but we're giving you the whole drat DEPUTY chairman seat you drat, dirty Bernie bros!" If this was a pointless sop meant to neutralize all that is good in the Democratic Party, then why did Keith Ellison, only honest and virtuous candidate for chair, take it?
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Feb 25, 2017 21:49
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Hahaha gently caress the DNC forever and ever, such a lovely worthless party.
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Feb 25, 2017 21:49
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Quorum posted:this... was going to happen anyway? but now he has a censor named perez
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Feb 25, 2017 21:50
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So what's the silver lining with Perez as DNC chair?
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Feb 25, 2017 21:50
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nachos posted:Hah, the concession to the sanders wing is deputy chair This seems like Perez's promise to not be as bad as DWS was. If it happens again and he gets tossed, it's Ellison that replaces him(??) That said, I would join DSA if my state had a chapter. Oh well!
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Feb 25, 2017 21:50
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Confounding Factor posted:So what's the silver lining with Perez as DNC chair? Establishment types get to pat themselves on the back and then do nothing different
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Feb 25, 2017 21:52
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Confounding Factor posted:So what's the silver lining with Perez as DNC chair? More third way bullshit and pandering to the business wing. In other words, nothing of value and more guaranteed losses and worthless lip service to the genuine progressives. gently caress the democrats forever. They deserve the GOP boot at their throats.
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Feb 25, 2017 21:52
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Quorum posted:If this was a pointless sop meant to neutralize all that is good in the Democratic Party, then why did Keith Ellison, only honest and virtuous candidate for chair, take it? Presumably because they made a deal over dinner ten days ago that for the sake of party unity, whoever lost would accept the deputy spot. https://twitter.com/theRza2u/status/835588730823958528
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Feb 25, 2017 21:52
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Huge_Midget posted:More third way bullshit and pandering to the business wing. In other words, nothing of value and more guaranteed losses and worthless lip service to the genuine progressives. it's not gonna be on their throats anymore. cause the dems will be dead soon, made illegal by the 2018 republican constitutional convention. gg dems
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Feb 25, 2017 21:53
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Confounding Factor posted:So what's the silver lining with Perez as DNC chair? He's committed to working closely with Ellison, and has quite a lot of experience reforming broken institutions, having essentially rebuilt key sections of the Department of Labor from pointless appendages into powerful forces for aiding American workers. What matters now is what they actually do now they're both in. And, of course, some have already made up their minds that it will all be counterproductive corporate shillery. Those people will change their minds, or not, based upon the policy changes coming down the pipe. My only hope is that efforts to reform the party from the local level up don't cease because some people get the idea that it's all pointless, when in fact this is the perfect illustration that it's not; only a few delegates changed would have changed the outcome, and that's exactly what installing new local, then state, then national party committee officials does.
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Feb 25, 2017 21:53
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Confounding Factor posted:So what's the silver lining with Perez as DNC chair? If I had to pick one, it would be something along the lines of: even if you subscribe to establishment nefariosity, the fact that the establishment pick was a hell of a bulldog as Labor Secretary and running on an overhaul platform similar to that of the Sanders commie is a pretty big sign that they did not, in fact, learn literally nothing from the election. Anyone open to the idea that Perez is not a worthless establishment tool should instead read Quorum's post. Goatse James Bond fucked around with this message at 21:56 on Feb 25, 2017 |
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Feb 25, 2017 21:54
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If Perez is seen to be helping the Indivisible groups and people active in local races I think he'll be fine. Attending dinners to raise money for candidates isn't seen as nearly as helpful by the people out there at the moment as sending a Tweet out putting some Republican in an unsafe district on blast for loving over Vets or starving kids to cut taxes for GE
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Feb 25, 2017 21:55
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Huge_Midget posted:More third way bullshit and pandering to the business wing. In other words, nothing of value and more guaranteed losses and worthless lip service to the genuine progressives. I agree with all that but my only counterpoint to that is the Democratic Party is the only relevant party that can stop conservatives from taking power. I hate to vote for a party that is merely a block to conservatism instead of pushing for bold progressive ideas and policies, but what else do we have? It's like I sympathize with the whole Bernie or bust mentality, but what other choice do you have right now?
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Feb 25, 2017 21:55
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Confounding Factor posted:I agree with all that but my only counterpoint to that is the Democratic Party is the only relevant party that can stop conservatives from taking power. well, by voting for dems as a block to conservatism, you ensure they'll never be anything else (also that they'll get more conservative).
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Feb 25, 2017 21:57
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Confounding Factor posted:I agree with all that but my only counterpoint to that is the Democratic Party is the only relevant party that can stop conservatives from taking power. It's foolish to believe that people won't just stay home and let the country be destroyed if they don't feel pandered to
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Feb 25, 2017 21:57
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Condiv posted:well, by voting for dems as a block to conservatism, you ensure they'll never be anything else (also that they'll get more conservative). Counterpoint: you cannot simultaneously hold the view that not voting for democrats so that they lose to republicans makes them chase your vote and become more liberal, and also the view that Perez is a corporate stooge who won't do any progressive reforms Unless maybe you think that the problem was people didn't not vote for the Democrats hard enough?
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Feb 25, 2017 21:58
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Epic High Five posted:It's foolish to believe that people won't just stay home and let the country be destroyed if they don't feel pandered to Yeah but the number of idiots who will stay home over the DNC chair in 2018 is far fewer than will swing the election.
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Feb 25, 2017 21:59
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Quorum posted:He's committed to working closely with Ellison, and has quite a lot of experience reforming broken institutions, having essentially rebuilt key sections of the Department of Labor from pointless appendages into powerful forces for aiding American workers. What matters now is what they actually do now they're both in. It's too late. The dems couldn't even throw the bone of Keith as chair. They love money too much.
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Feb 25, 2017 21:59
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Trabisnikof posted:Yeah but the number of idiots who will stay home over the DNC chair in 2018 is far fewer than will swing the election. The Bernie wing obsesses about the DNC and their goings on like nobody ever has before. I'm extremely hesitant to brush this off as minor news
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Feb 25, 2017 22:00
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The Democrats are such utter worthless sacks of shits that they let an Orange Hitler into office and doubled down by putting a neoliberal hack into the DNC Chair position. This party deserves to burn. I won’t be voting for them so long as they refuse to change.
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Feb 25, 2017 22:00
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I ran this one through the time warp from 2009...Confounding Factor posted:I agree with all that but my only counterpoint to that is the Republican Party is the only relevant party that can stop liberals from taking power.
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Feb 25, 2017 22:01
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