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At least on my part that was down to not understanding that the 27 turns to nightfall wasn't a hard limit on the game at first. As a result I pushed for the morning assault that got chopped to bits piecemeal.
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Mar 6, 2017 09:09
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my dad posted:Random question: How good would this ruleset be (with minor modifications) for a game set in the USA Civil War? There are WWII and Modern versions of the rules, but I'm not sure they would work backwards. There should be more wargames that force you to write your battle plan before the game and then make you stick to it.
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Mar 6, 2017 09:20
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I feel like Crazycryodude accurately guessing what we would do, and even though he was continually ignored you guys still won is proof that this scenario had some balance issues.
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Mar 6, 2017 09:31
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Crazycryodude was right about a couple of things, but that doesn't mean we would magically have answers to all the problems if we listened. We were able to won because of your blunder of sending in troops piecemeal to the objective, and simultaneously keeping a large force stationary just outside the reach of the same objective. While you won all the meeting engagements in the game, you totally whiffed on actually capitalizing on your success, and were strangely indecisive til the last moments.
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Mar 6, 2017 09:50
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I don't think the balance of the map was unduly skewed. The French did well to overcome the outrageous German advantage in firepower, and our worst performances came down to misunderstandings and unfortunate orders. Our biggest missed opportunity was allowing 6th Division to settle in for 18 hours and accomplish nothing besides pasting 2 unfortunate infantry companies. We were quite lucky that the German opening was ultra-hosed. 96e and 98e, our insane bayonet chargers, did almost nothing to St. Croissants defenders, but managed to rout a really confused German Brigade that was caught in between St. C and Baguette. If things hadn't worked out that way, we would have lost 2 brigades for no gain whatsoever. The biggest factor in their loss was how St. C was basically surrounded on all sides by German forces. We didn't have anything in the pre-battle orders that could call off those attacks.  54e had orders that really made me nervous. Their path took them into Bois de Baguette, but instead of deploying along the forest, their orders had them marching with half the brigade on each end of the forest, sideswiping Baguette. They were in a bad spot, but I think they only routed as quick as they did because they were split in two and exposed to boot.  The poor 119e, had orders to advance into a small forest, but ended up deploying all of its infantry companies completely outside of cover. In effect, they burst out of the woods directly into the sights of a zillion German MGs and infantry and were turned into dust.  These, and along with my dad's wild ride, were the worst exchanges made by our side. On the whole, I think the French units were quite capable. I think our strategy of distinguishing "support" and "assault" brigades was sound, but as things turned out, all of our "assault" brigades were obliterated in the first 6 hours and three of them (96, 98, 54) were routed for little gain. After that, we lost the ability to make concentrated assaults, until our cavalry and BEF reinforcements arrived. None of this is meant to be shaming or anything, but just a counter to the argument that the French only had a chance because the Germans hosed up. For the later battles on Dejeuner especially, we were far too passive with out unengaged forces, and overly optimistic with our active forces. We took more of our own forces out of the fight, figuratively speaking, than the Germans managed to kill. Slim Jim Pickens fucked around with this message at 10:45 on Mar 6, 2017 |
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Mar 6, 2017 10:15
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quote:And to the 175th Reserve Brigade (AbortRetryFail) Just want to state for the record the 175th were entirely under Tehan's command until he had to be relieved due to internet problems, the only order I ended up giving them was "Looks good, keep at it". Prior to that I was just the 98th Brigade Commander. AbortRetryFail fucked around with this message at 11:59 on Mar 6, 2017 |
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Mar 6, 2017 11:56
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Who commanded the french unit initially moving onto La Oeuf? Looking back on it I don't think my jägers stood a chance, but considering that we eventually consolidated, I guess I held them up for a while 
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Mar 6, 2017 12:34
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Our artillery use was turbofucked. I'm pretty sure the heavy guns did not fire once. We should have moved more deliberately. Guess the initial rush with orders to 19D to ignore enemy units can sort of be put into this category. I swallowed hard when I saw the ending map. As I understand Mon Pere literally saved us the (shameful) win with his suicide. Otherwise we would have been party wiped, doubly so if the French had concentrated on a flank rather than an all-around assault.
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Mar 6, 2017 14:38
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Tias posted:Who commanded the french unit initially moving onto La Oeuf? Looking back on it I don't think my jägers stood a chance, but considering that we eventually consolidated, I guess I held them up for a while The cav was me, the inf was Hunt, which was serving as a sort of reserve. Also that's a good point about the French orders. Not a single brigade as far as I can tell had successfully written contingency plans for the strength of the German position around St. C and the way they'd deployed. Just because we'd considered it in our overall planning didn't mean we'd truly incorporated thought about what we'd need to do and not do in case purple. Even my obsessive orders which took me forever to write whiffed when presented with enemies from that direction. I do think that Croissant was the German objective to lose though, it's not like the French orders were a collective fit of elan larping madness, they were a conscious choice in response to the knowledge that we would not get to croissant first. I will point out that our failure to consider the case of the DZs existed, but it was more that we considered that the plan would be fine without realizing early contact would pull the supporting elements apart. Also, objectives that compelled attack and enemies with three times the expected MGs was a Rude surprise.
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Mar 6, 2017 14:50
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Signups for 1914 Round 2: From La Dand to Effyaders, are now open. Here is the map. Further explanation of the various terrain features is available in either thread, but new for this round. Most importantly, waterways, some with bridges! On the left, a canal; in the middle, a shallow, fordable river; on the right, a deep river. Changes of elevation are much less important than round St Croissant, but the hill spotting rules have been tweaked, and there is also a depression on the left of the map and a sunken road, the Chemin Creux. (There are a few unnamed features that you are welcome to submit names for in here.) Also, you will get to play with indirect artillery fire for the first time! All this and more, if you consider Northern France for your holidays this autumn! Players intending to sign up may read either thread, up to and including the clearly-marked introduction post for Round 2, at which point you must go no further. Choose your side and sign up by posting in their thread. The observer thread remains open to both sides, for the time being, and I encourage players who sign up in a thread to also post in here to let people know which side they're taking. We are going to need a lot of commanders, and part 1 has shown how vital it is to have plenty of other players waiting in reserve. Don't be discouraged if there's already 10 or more signups for your preferred side! There may well be a chance for you to get into the game very quickly. Warning: these links go directly to my intro posts for Round 2: you can go back from them, but not forward. Entente thread German thread These links, on the other hand, go to the OP of both threads. Entente OP German OP (For the observers, I am probably going to wargame at least one scenario for a poo poo-or-bust French attack on St Croissant, based on the finishing positions, during the week once the observer thread closes for good.) Trin Tragula fucked around with this message at 15:44 on Mar 6, 2017 |
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Mar 6, 2017 14:55
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That little hamlet to the northwest of La Dand is clearly Cinqueprouts
aphid_licker fucked around with this message at 15:10 on Mar 6, 2017 |
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Mar 6, 2017 15:00
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Hey Frenchies, are we keeping the gang together?
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Mar 6, 2017 15:04
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I'm in, but I'm trying to decide what role, and what side. I'm leaning towards German because they won last time and my DC:B LP teammates are all there but I'm an incurable Anglophile and love the French language.
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Mar 6, 2017 15:13
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Trin Tragula posted:On the subject of Cryo ... dude needs to take a corps command next time he plays. Well, if you insist
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Mar 6, 2017 15:16
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xthetenth posted:Hey Frenchies, are we keeping the gang together? Naturellement! Mon Pere will you be returning to lead us in gloire une autre fois?
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Mar 6, 2017 15:25
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xthetenth posted:Hey Frenchies, are we keeping the gang together? I'm absolutely for, regardless of the position I get.
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Mar 6, 2017 15:26
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aphid_licker posted:That little hamlet to the northwest of La Dand is clearly Cinqueprouts No, that one is clearly called Courses Coloniales, and the other is Les Guignols.
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Mar 6, 2017 15:32
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xthetenth posted:Hey Frenchies, are we keeping the gang together? Oui, monsieur! The two bridges over the deep river are the Ponts de Brouillerie et Querelle
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Mar 6, 2017 15:44
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xthetenth posted:Hey Frenchies, are we keeping the gang together? It is time to hammer the Boche once again.
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Mar 6, 2017 15:46
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Heck yeah for getting the band back together.Crazycryodude posted:Well, if you insist Mon pere is dead, non?  Come be a corps commander!It might actually be better to have you on staff to poke holes in the scenario and challenge assumptions whichever side you're on. Honestly given the state of French morale you might be better off staying German despite my blatant poaching attempts. xthetenth fucked around with this message at 15:50 on Mar 6, 2017 |
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Mar 6, 2017 15:46
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some of my dreadful poetry didn't get posted in this thread from the entente thread, I'll make sure to rectify that mistake now:l'Sabbat Noir posted:Généraux réunis dans leurs masses Gommier Rouge posted:Maman et papa et Denny ont vu le défilé défilé à Puckapunyal attributed to Indochinese colonial troops
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Mar 6, 2017 15:54
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Sounds fun I guess.
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Mar 6, 2017 15:54
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Ich bin ein Berliner.
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Mar 6, 2017 16:07
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Let's go Germany
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Mar 6, 2017 16:12
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Flesnolk posted:Ich bin ein Berliner. I feel personally betrayed, you were cool to hang out with. (Have fun, and good luck!)
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Mar 6, 2017 16:25
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I still don'tw get the rules and I don't want to gently caress up like I did in Grey's game, so, ugh, you can take the glory, guys.
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Mar 6, 2017 16:27
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JcDent posted:I still don'tw get the rules and I don't want to gently caress up like I did in Grey's game, so, ugh, you can take the glory, guys. Join us as a staff officer, then. It's fun having more people in the roll20 chat, and really, the gently caress ups are part of the fun.
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Mar 6, 2017 16:29
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JcDent posted:I still don'tw get the rules and I don't want to gently caress up like I did in Grey's game, so, ugh, you can take the glory, guys. Seconding that non-playing staff officers who want to restrict themselves to one thread and give advice and opinions without having to command their own brigade are more than welcome.
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Mar 6, 2017 16:30
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xthetenth posted:I feel personally betrayed, you were cool to hang out with. (Have fun, and good luck!) Who knows, maybe I'll defect! It'll be fun to chat again when the round ends.
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Mar 6, 2017 16:32
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Fine, joining the French staff! Is the roll20 link in the entente thread?
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Mar 6, 2017 16:32
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JcDent posted:Fine, joining the French staff! Is the roll20 link in the entente thread? Here's the link, for your benefit and that of the observers: https://app.roll20.net/join/2004056/9ONgKg Just post your roll20 username in the Entente thread so that I can GM you.
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Mar 6, 2017 16:34
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Trin Tragula posted:Seconding that non-playing staff officers who want to restrict themselves to one thread and give advice and opinions without having to command their own brigade are more than welcome. Slim Jim was one of the most useful people on the French staff and he didn't command a brigade, there's a lot of roles for people like that. Also you'd be surprised how many people messed up with the rules.
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Mar 6, 2017 16:41
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steinrokkan posted:Again, these imagined difficulties are the result of your narrow focus, rather than of inherent problems with the scenario. As you can see from the events that transpired later in the day, it was up to French to merely pick a better time for their assault to entirely eviscerate the defenses. Both sides suffered a lot from not having any god drat patience at all. To clear the air for a moment. Speaking for myself (and I think for the whole French team), this was a very fun game to play. Trin did a HUGE number of things right. The scale of the map and the relative force size was excellent. The speed of updates was great. I’m amazed at how fast Trin was able to process so many complex moves with basically no errors. Trin created a scenario that passed the single biggest test of this kind of game: it was fun. I enjoyed it greatly and look forwards to the next time around. But like every other red-blooded goon, I enjoy having a fighting chance at outright winning. And looking back on things, I do feel that, given the roads, the deployment zones and the objectives – the French team’s path to victory was fundamentally narrower than the German team’s. Could the French have won? Sure. But to do so, the French had to pitch a perfect game in the face of some very real difficulties. The Germans had a much easier go of things. Firstly, the location of the objectives heavily favored a team deploying in the NE corner of the map. The roads gave the German team a direct route to Saint Croissant. Would anyone like to seriously dispute that getting the Saint Croissant first was not extremely advantageous to the Germans? And would anybody with a ruler and a map like to contend that the French could have the gotten there first? Given the terrain, the French were going to have to assault Saint Croissant, while the Germans would have the luxury of defending it. And that is the crux of why this battle favored the Germans. Secondly, there’s an imbalance between offense and defense inherent in c.1914 warfare. This is historical and it is one thing the Spearhead rules simulate extremely well. Whoever gets to strategic ground first will probably keep it. A) Machine guns and heavy artillery are king at this point – and they are tools well-suited for the defense. The Germans, as they did in history, had more of both. That let them chop up every French infantry attack against them. B) Urban terrain, wire, and entrenchments give the defender a big advantage. By getting to Saint Croissant first, the Germans could get into cover and concealment in town. Every hour the French spent waiting for a "better time" and marshaling a large-scale attack meant the Germans had more time to dig in, neutralizing the power of the French's limited MGs and 75mms to support such an attack. C) Organization and communication favor the defender, not the attacker. In Spearhead, attackers have to create detailed and highly coordinated plans built on guesswork and exacting timetables. Defenders get to sit there and shoot. I don't mind being the underdog. I just like knowing I'm the underdog beforehand, something I hope future games will be a little more open about. Unless this round was some kind of Kobiyashi Maru scheme on Trin's part. 
Bacarruda fucked around with this message at 17:54 on Mar 6, 2017 |
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Mar 6, 2017 17:50
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Hey Trin, got any way to contact you if I don't have PMs?
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Mar 6, 2017 17:52
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Tevery Best posted:Hey Trin, got any way to contact you if I don't have PMs? makersley.com/war , send me an email via the contact page, mourn for the lost time that means I'm still struggling to get any kind of update schedule together
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Mar 6, 2017 17:54
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Hello, I saw Trin's recruitment post over in Trad Games and would like to expose myself to the horrors of
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Mar 6, 2017 18:16
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grassy gnoll posted:Hello, I saw Trin's recruitment post over in Trad Games and would like to expose myself to the horrors of Come on by the Roll 20! Much plotting is happening.
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Mar 6, 2017 18:20
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grassy gnoll posted:Hello, I saw Trin's recruitment post over in Trad Games and would like to expose myself to the horrors of Welcome aboard. Post in the Entente thread to confirm, and make a roll20 account if you don't have one and post the username in the thread while you're at it.
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Mar 6, 2017 18:20
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Welcome. It would be much appreciated if you could take a nice full brigade and march it at some entrenched machine guns for me.
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Mar 6, 2017 18:21
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| # ? May 9, 2024 13:45 |
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my dad posted:Join us as a staff officer, then. It's fun having more people in the roll20 chat, and really, the gently caress ups are part of the fun. Trin Tragula posted:Seconding that non-playing staff officers who want to restrict themselves to one thread and give advice and opinions without having to command their own brigade are more than welcome. Shucks, if you can join in without having to learn the ruleset first I might as well give it a pop. Is either side short?
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Mar 6, 2017 18:47
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