|
inthesto posted:She's obsessed with the player self-insert and barely wears anything. That's literally all it takes. I usually tossed her with Vaike because the biggest asshats in the cast deserve each other. Then again, I've soured on Awakening in general. A lot of the supports still make me laugh, but in retrospect it's a painfully sexist game in a lot of ways and most characters are one quirk or personality gimmick taken to absurd extremes. Cordelia, Sumia, and Olivia are not much better than Tharja.
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 04:38
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 8, 2024 06:47 |
|
|
Tae posted:
'I was young and dumb and figured out it would be stupid to walk through all of Nohr to save you. Then I saw a flying horse and got a much better idea!'  Dancer's are great to have around because the only time they're not useful is when you've messed up really hard. I keep thinking to toss Felicia on the bench but I'm reminded that 'waitaminute, she's a healer and a ninja. Two healers is good. Azama you're a third wheel, get on that bench and stay there!  'Tharja is cool because she takes 'I'm a spooky witch!' and uses it as her way of doing things rather than being all that she is. By doing things that aren't evil/spooky witch things.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 04:44
|
|
|
BlazeEmblem posted:She is a dancer, and gains EXP when she dances. She isn't stealing chances for EXP from other characters. She steals EXP opportunities by taking up a deployment slot. If you're deploying Azura, that's one less unit you can bring along for levelling. Tae posted:C Support No, this is not just in her supports; Felicia is one of the worst cooks in the entire army, and gives some of the worst modifiers in the Mess Hall to prove it. Others on her tier are Rinkah (apparently burns it into literal inedibility), Setsuna (probably doesn't pay attention), Hinoka (apparently too busy with combat training to learn to cook... but still probably the best in this list), and, oddly enough, Reina (she seems like she'd be pretty good in the kitchen, but no such luck- she's just as bad as Felicia). Tae posted:
Well, I suppose that's something to be said in favor of consequences of events in this game.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 04:45
|
|
|
I just had Hinoka cook a meal in my BR file and it came out delicious, so your mileage may vary. And really, you'll almost never get the chance to have all deployed units gain exp equally. And considering one of those slots is typically a healer, who doesn't get much by being paired, might as well make a slot a dancer so other units can gain more experience. Also her support gain rate is so slow it'll take her forever to marry someone. So you're going to have to put the work in sooner or later.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 04:49
|
|
|
Tae posted:Man, people do not want Reina The only reason I voted for her is because she has the highest level and I am one of those weird people who like to keep his parties levels on par with each other unless I plan to permanently bench someone.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 05:01
|
|
|
ApplesandOranges posted:I just had Hinoka cook a meal in my BR file and it came out delicious, so your mileage may vary. I'm just going from wikis; while it's certainly POSSIBLE for meals to turn out well regardless, some characters do better ON AVERAGE than others (for example, Mozu is one of the best cooks in the game, generally giving the second-best modifier possible, and even SHE can screw it up). ApplesandOranges posted:And really, you'll almost never get the chance to have all deployed units gain exp equally. And considering one of those slots is typically a healer, who doesn't get much by being paired, might as well make a slot a dancer so other units can gain more experience. Obviously you can't keep everyone's levels even unless you cap them, but that doesn't give you an excuse to outright NEGLECT units, I say. If you deploy someone, then you're probably gonna use them, right? And frankly, I've never been all that fond of units whose only purpose is to give their turns to someone else, especially if said units are frail. I'd rather have someone else capable of fighting well along, really; while the damage output and movement speed may fall off a bit compared to one REALLY strong unit getting two turns, it does give you another potential tank, if you pick right (or at least someone who ISN'T liable to be one-shotted by a stiff breeze). ApplesandOranges posted:Also her support gain rate is so slow it'll take her forever to marry someone. So you're going to have to put the work in sooner or later. I think the support gain rates might've had the challenges in mind; I'm pretty sure there literally are not enough maps in the game to pair everyone up.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 05:03
|
|
|
Oh boy, oh boy. We get to reclass people soonish! I wonder who (Mozu) we get to move from one class to another? Also, Reina might get less votes if she had more support partners.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 05:06
|
|
|
Cythereal posted:Then again, I've soured on Awakening in general. A lot of the supports still make me laugh, but in retrospect it's a painfully sexist game in a lot of ways and most characters are one quirk or personality gimmick taken to absurd extremes. Cordelia, Sumia, and Olivia are not much better than Tharja.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 05:26
|
|
|
Cythereal posted:Then again, I've soured on Awakening in general. A lot of the supports still make me laugh, but in retrospect it's a painfully sexist game in a lot of ways and most characters are one quirk or personality gimmick taken to absurd extremes. Cordelia, Sumia, and Olivia are not much better than Tharja. Out of curiosity what makes the game painfully sexist?
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 05:31
|
|
|
Endorph posted:yeah, the ways like 'letting women be physical classes without making them be statistically inferior' and 'retconning the 'only men can wield the falchion' thing and presenting a woman as the future of the franchise in a metatextual sense' You're not wrong, but there were still gender exclusive classes playing to stereotypes, including a literal Bride class.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 05:32
|
|
|
ohmygorgon posted:You're not wrong, but there were still gender exclusive classes playing to stereotypes, including a literal Bride class.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 05:34
|
|
|
ohmygorgon posted:You're not wrong, but there were still gender exclusive classes playing to stereotypes, including a literal Bride class. 1. That was dlc. 2. The most powerful skill in the game comes from a female exclusive class.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 05:36
|
|
|
CptWedgie posted:Obviously you can't keep everyone's levels even unless you cap them, but that doesn't give you an excuse to outright NEGLECT units, Not every unit gets enough XP to stay competitive with the enemies. Someone will have to get benched. This has been a thing since like FE3 or FE5. 1 had units that were basically replaceable, 2 had a small pool of recruits and 4 let you deploy everyone. Not too sure about FE3 or FE5, but series tradition probably solidified there. Grinding is not really a "core" part of FE. Grinding only exists in 4 out of 14 games, although boss abuse and arena abuse have been around for a while. Fire Emblem has been a game where you pick and choose units for a long time. So, it's nothing surprising to see some units get neglected and get benched. We've already benched Subaki, Hinata and someone else probably. Are you saying that a player shouldn't just take their stuff and never bother deploying them again if they don't want to use them?
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 05:37
|
|
|
CptWedgie posted:She steals EXP opportunities by taking up a deployment slot. If you're deploying Azura, that's one less unit you can bring along for levelling. If she's effectively a second Corrin by taking up that deployment slot then by all means let her take that second slot. That's the real power of dancers, is letting your strong offensive units go twice. They're almost ALWAYS a good idea to have around from a sheer tactical standpoint. There was little point in late-game Awakening because of Galeforce but in Birthright you don't have the liberty of deploying nine characters that can take two actions to go along with your mandatory deploy. Using your dancers has never been a bad idea in any fire emblem (even if Olivia only gets by due to having access to galeforce). You can't really think of the games like FFT or Disgaea where an EXP sponge is a thing, because a unit that is good at their job is more important than one that might turn out good if you drag them around, since you have to rely on random level ups. Dancers have a utility that no other class in the series really carries. Endorph posted:pretty much everyone i know who got that dlc got it so they could put their self-insert robin in it and put them next to chrom/gaius/henry I got it because it made levelling up my streetpass army of 10 Robins faster.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 05:37
|
|
|
you can either bring Corrin + 9 units to level or Corrin + Azura + 8 units to level, one of whom gets twice as much XP per turn There's literally no reason not to bring your dancer. Naturally I voted to leave Azura behind.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 05:47
|
|
|
Hinoka being last is good because all she wants to do is shank nohrians but the plot won't let her
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 05:51
|
|
|
Endorph posted:yeah, the ways like 'letting women be physical classes without making them be statistically inferior' and 'retconning the 'only men can wield the falchion' thing and presenting a woman as the future of the franchise in a metatextual sense' Pretty sure he was just talking personalities, not mechanically (which is, as you said, making a LOT of progress- hell, this game, in particular, actually has formerly gender-locked classes such as Pegasus Knights being opened to everyone!). Of course, my biggest problem with Awakening: Chrom's strangled support list. I mean, I can get some characters being incompatible (as an example: For the life of me I just can NOT figure out how Vaike and Miriel would even get together), but what about Cordelia? Her crush on him is so obvious that it's pointed out in nearly all of her other supports, but can they support? Of COURSE not, that'd take away from the unnecessary drama and pointless angst! And it's not like she couldn't muster the will to confess, either, since some of her other S-ranks have HER as the initiator. Sumia's support options being similarly scarce is another pet peeve, albeit a lesser one since she's second on my list of most hated characters in the game (beaten only by Cynthia); I mean, I get that she's supposed to be Chrom's "canon" wife, but I don't see their chemistry (as I already mentioned, I ship Chrom with Sully), and they missed out on an incredible amount of potential character development by only giving her 5 supports with men COUNTING THE MALE AVATAR (out of 14)... and sadly, I'm not even exaggerating. Mysticblade posted:Not every unit gets enough XP to stay competitive with the enemies. Someone will have to get benched. This has been a thing since like FE3 or FE5. 1 had units that were basically replaceable, 2 had a small pool of recruits and 4 let you deploy everyone. Not too sure about FE3 or FE5, but series tradition probably solidified there. I'm not saying you should go out of your way to grind EVERYONE to 20/20 (not discouraging it either, mind- my mindset is "if the mechanic exists and was obviously intended, exploit the hell out of it"), just that you should at LEAST learn not to rely on your dancer excessively; they've invariably been frail, so one wrong move or mistimed RNG screw and you end up losing them forever, which would screw your strategy over. I mean, yeah, the series has been more lenient on that front lately, but as I understand it the majority of players go with Classic and mock Casual players for not playing how it "should" be played. Besides, what if the deployment capacity increases beyond the A-team's size without any new recruits to fill the empty spaces? If we go with the "A-team to such an extent that everyone else is dead weight" strategy, then we're gonna have to either go into future battles undermanned (inadvisable) or take a grind break (time-consuming). Frankly, I'd rather go with Option C, which is the "make sure enough people are levelled that we don't NEED to do either of those" option (individually below par, but not as much so as "pick a team and stick with it"). Again, I'm not advocating levelling EVERYONE, just... say, one or two people beyond the good units up to credible levels? Tyty posted:If she's effectively a second Corrin by taking up that deployment slot then by all means let her take that second slot. That's the real power of dancers, is letting your strong offensive units go twice. They're almost ALWAYS a good idea to have around from a sheer tactical standpoint. There was little point in late-game Awakening because of Galeforce but in Birthright you don't have the liberty of deploying nine characters that can take two actions to go along with your mandatory deploy. Frankly, I'd rather have a second Corrin (or other heavy-hitter of choice) full stop. On a related note, I'd say that a certain skill means Azura is even LESS important than Olivia is in Awakening, if only because it's entirely possible (easy, even) to get it on your entire army: Replicate literally allows your unit to be in two places at once, and they don't even have to be anywhere near each other. Sure, damage is shared between both instances of the unit, but considering the results you can get the benefits outweigh the risks I say... and I'm not alone, considering just how popular it is online, especially in conjunction with Renewal. True, they're both level 15 skills on promoted classes, but in normal gameplay that won't stop anyone.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 06:02
|
|
|
CptWedgie posted:I'm not saying you should go out of your way to grind EVERYONE to 20/20 (not discouraging it either, mind- my mindset is "if the mechanic exists and was obviously intended, exploit the hell out of it"), just that you should at LEAST learn not to rely on your dancer excessively; they've invariably been frail, so one wrong move or mistimed RNG screw and you end up losing them forever, which would screw your strategy over. I mean, yeah, the series has been more lenient on that front lately, but as I understand it the majority of players go with Classic and mock Casual players for not playing how it "should" be played. I don't understand your logic with overuse of a Dancer. Your strategy is never going to be screwed over if your strategy includes don't let the dancer get hit, something that isn't particularly hard. I don't understand why you think it is such a horrible thing to have a unit that can't shrug off every attack. And at a certain point it is not possible to have 2 different great units, because units are unique enough that some are just going to be so much better. Instead of having 1 Corrin, and 1 unit that is almost as good, but not quite there, why not just use Corrin twice? Not having a dancer just removes a strategical option that can never be replaced by any other unit. As for your deployment worries, it is not that difficult to catch a weaker unit up, any of the permabenched characters, outside of maybe Hayato, and even that is questionable, could jump in this chapter and be caught up by the end. And going undermanned has been a viable, at times over rewarding, way to play fire emblem, and using 2 units is probably the easiest way to beat Birthright.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 06:24
|
|
|
On the Tharja chat - you guys are missing that she's also a really powerful character mechanically. Give her a Nosferatu, keep her in Dark Mage/Sorcerer and you can throw her into legions of bad guys and she'll murder them all and come out unscathed. Granted, I married her on my playthroughs so I might be somewhat biased. Dancers are great, always use dancers.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 06:29
|
|
|
CptWedgie posted:Pretty sure he was just talking personalities, not mechanically (which is, as you said, making a LOT of progress- hell, this game, in particular, actually has formerly gender-locked classes such as Pegasus Knights being opened to everyone!). Of course, my biggest problem with Awakening: Chrom's strangled support list. I mean, I can get some characters being incompatible (as an example: For the life of me I just can NOT figure out how Vaike and Miriel would even get together), but what about Cordelia? Her crush on him is so obvious that it's pointed out in nearly all of her other supports, but can they support? Of COURSE not, that'd take away from the unnecessary drama and pointless angst! And it's not like she couldn't muster the will to confess, either, since some of her other S-ranks have HER as the initiator. It kind of is! There's a DLC conversation with Chrom if Cordelia's unmarried. She tries to spit out the whole "Hey, Chrom! I like you!" thing, and basically passes out from stress. Chrom assumes she's got a serious medical condition and ends the scene by yelling for a cleric. Like the saying goes, them as asks don't get.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 06:34
|
|
|
Yeah, the additional utility of a dancer is far more useful than an extra combat unit. In exchange for being unable to deploy your least useful combat/support unit for the mission, a dancer can at the very least make your best unit move twice. That's before you get into things like using it to rush a boss, dancing twice per turn with Shelter, etc. Birthright in particular is a great game to 'lowman', for want of a better term, with only 5-6 functionally invincible units who are the only ones to see combat, their pairup bots, and your support units like Azura and staffers.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 06:40
|
|
|
While it's kind of corny writing, I do think Xander is probably the only interesting character so far in the game. Maybe my time with JRPGs has made me so conditioned to the idea that the "strict, serious character who secretly has a soft side" is only reserved for the designated waifu character that the idea of someone like Xander having that personality is interesting to be, but I don't know. He's not crazy as gently caress like Camilia or as one dimensional as Elise. I'm interested in seeing how he pans out in the other paths. Also thanks for this LP, Tae. This LP has gotten me to start playing Awakening again and I feel stupid hearing people describing it as an easy entry into the series when I'm struggling on hard, but maybe I'm just rusty. I'm having fun, though, and I'm enjoying seeing how they changed things around in Fates, mechanically at least, especially the toned down growths.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 06:49
|
|
|
ohmygorgon posted:I don't understand your logic with overuse of a Dancer. Your strategy is never going to be screwed over if your strategy includes don't let the dancer get hit, something that isn't particularly hard. I don't understand why you think it is such a horrible thing to have a unit that can't shrug off every attack. And at a certain point it is not possible to have 2 different great units, because units are unique enough that some are just going to be so much better. Instead of having 1 Corrin, and 1 unit that is almost as good, but not quite there, why not just use Corrin twice? Not having a dancer just removes a strategical option that can never be replaced by any other unit. You seem to be missing the fact that the people you'll most want to give extra turns to will be in the heaviest combat zones 90% of the time, and you can't always protect your dancer adequately that close to the enemy even if you CAN wall them off; for example, archers and other 2-range-capable enemies will prioritize your dancer above literally everyone else, almost GUARANTEED (certain exceptions may admittedly apply, but if the enemy CAN kill someone they WILL, and Azura's at the most risk of that in most circumstances). And you're kinda misunderstanding what I said: I'm not saying they need to be INVINCIBLE; they just need to be capable of surviving at least ONE hit... which Azura isn't. Besides, Azura's plenty high level right now (she is literally the highest-level unit on Tae's team), and she doesn't really NEED to be high-level (or even up-to-date) to fulfill her primary function; I'm not advocating dropping her PERMANENTLY, just, as you said, bringing in one of the other units instead of her for a map or two and train them so they can at least COMPETE. chiasaur11 posted:It kind of is! This just seems like a tacked-on excuse for why she doesn't get a support with him which they came up with after the fact; as I said, she has S-ranks where SHE confesses FIRST, so why couldn't they write something as simple as her finally getting up the nerve to at least talk to Chrom? Or hell, have the Avatar play matchmaker from Chrom's end of the equation? I like the idea of Robin telling Chrom something's bothering Cordelia and she won't tell anyone what it is while conveniently omitting the fact that everyone can see it. I think it'd be perfectly in-character for Chrom to not stop until she gives an answer he's satisfied with, and- in true Fire Emblem tradition- fall for her along the way.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 06:51
|
|
|
CptWedgie posted:Besides, Azura's plenty high level right now (she is literally the highest-level unit on Tae's team), and she doesn't really NEED to be high-level (or even up-to-date) to fulfill her primary function; I'm not advocating dropping her PERMANENTLY, just, as you said, bringing in one of the other units instead of her for a map or two and train them so they can at least COMPETE. Is this your first SRPG LP or something The last thing on anyone's mind when party voting is optimization
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 06:56
|
|
|
CptWedgie posted:This just seems like a tacked-on excuse for why she doesn't get a support with him which they came up with after the fact; as I said, she has S-ranks where SHE confesses FIRST, so why couldn't they write something as simple as her finally getting up the nerve to at least talk to Chrom? Or hell, have the Avatar play matchmaker from Chrom's end of the equation? I like the idea of Robin telling Chrom something's bothering Cordelia and she won't tell anyone what it is while conveniently omitting the fact that everyone can see it. I think it'd be perfectly in-character for Chrom to not stop until she gives an answer he's satisfied with, and- in true Fire Emblem tradition- fall for her along the way. Because Awakening is Fire Emblem: Greatest Hits and she's the Catria to Sumia's Caeda.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 06:57
|
|
|
TheKingofSprings posted:Because Awakening is Fire Emblem: Greatest Hits and she's the Catria to Sumia's Caeda. That doesn't give an in-character explanation; as I said, the "passes out from trying to talk to Chrom, who remains oblivious" thing sounds like an excuse they made up after programming the game (which, so far as I can see, it literally is, because the DLC was made AFTER the game was released), and doesn't entirely mesh with her character as shown in supports, which seem to portray her as more "girl with crush who doesn't know how to confess" than "so shy she faints when complimented" (Gregor, for example, has her actively attempting to get Chrom's attention... poorly, admittedly, but TRYING, with the S-rank being HER confessing to GREGOR rather than vice versa). It really seems that literally the only reason they didn't give Cordelia a support with Chrom is, as you said, going too far on her Catria expy-ness. And as I said, it'd be trivial to come up with a way to get a support started between them, such as my "Robin started it by siccing Chrom on her with a convenient half-truth" idea.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 07:09
|
|
|
CptWedgie posted:You seem to be missing the fact that the people you'll most want to give extra turns to will be in the heaviest combat zones 90% of the time, and you can't always protect your dancer adequately that close to the enemy even if you CAN wall them off; for example, archers and other 2-range-capable enemies will prioritize your dancer above literally everyone else, almost GUARANTEED (certain exceptions may admittedly apply, but if the enemy CAN kill someone they WILL, and Azura's at the most risk of that in most circumstances). And you're kinda misunderstanding what I said: I'm not saying they need to be INVINCIBLE; they just need to be capable of surviving at least ONE hit... which Azura isn't. I'm genuinely curious to see how you play this game if you think that 90% of the time, you are in a situation where it would difficult to keep Azura safe. I find it difficult to imagine Azura being in danger during Enemy Phase, even in the open field, heavy enemy rushdown design of Birthright, and in the other two routes, keeping Azura safe is even less of an issue. The fact remains, a unit does not need to take a hit if they do not get hit in the first place. I also didn't bring up the ease to catch units up to say that they should. I said that in response to you thinking the LP could be put in a situation where grinding would be necessary. I'm saying it is so easy to catch units up, that if the deployment numbers went up enough to the point where weak units might have to get deployed, there would be no issue, they can get caught up. I'm sure Tae is keeping deployment counts in mind when it comes deciding if a unit is gone for good. Even if that is not the case, like I said, going undermanned is hardly inadvisable, if the end goal is beat the game. If you are saying that the units should be brought back because you just want to see them in action, you should just give up on that, people kept voting them out, so their is no reason to keep them around to be voted out more. If Azura is a high level, that means she is being used a lot. Why would you not want to continue using a unit you use a lot? If the other units are worth using, they will get used, but there are only so many units that can get EXP. Azura doesn't even have much effect on how much EXP deployed units are getting, in the sense that she gets her EXP differently, so the idea that she is stealing EXP from other units is already dubious.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 07:32
|
|
|
ohmygorgon posted:I'm genuinely curious to see how you play this game if you think that 90% of the time, you are in a situation where it would difficult to keep Azura safe. I find it difficult to imagine Azura being in danger during Enemy Phase, even in the open field, heavy enemy rushdown design of Birthright, and in the other two routes, keeping Azura safe is even less of an issue. The fact remains, a unit does not need to take a hit if they do not get hit in the first place. I'll admit that I tend to think of independence before synergy, but in my experience protecting your back-row units is nowhere near as easy as you say even with a full team, and I'm more inclined to believe personal experience than someone else's word. ohmygorgon posted:I also didn't bring up the ease to catch units up to say that they should. I said that in response to you thinking the LP could be put in a situation where grinding would be necessary. I'm saying it is so easy to catch units up, that if the deployment numbers went up enough to the point where weak units might have to get deployed, there would be no issue, they can get caught up. I'm sure Tae is keeping deployment counts in mind when it comes deciding if a unit is gone for good. Even if that is not the case, like I said, going undermanned is hardly inadvisable, if the end goal is beat the game. If you are saying that the units should be brought back because you just want to see them in action, you should just give up on that, people kept voting them out, so their is no reason to keep them around to be voted out more. Never doing challenge maps is not necessarily a good approach to keeping units viable, especially since we keep switching them out at inopportune times. And going with less than a full team is inadvisable when the vast majority of your available units are either underlevelled or rear-liners (or, in Azama's case, both). ohmygorgon posted:If Azura is a high level, that means she is being used a lot. Why would you not want to continue using a unit you use a lot? If the other units are worth using, they will get used, but there are only so many units that can get EXP. Azura doesn't even have much effect on how much EXP deployed units are getting, in the sense that she gets her EXP differently, so the idea that she is stealing EXP from other units is already dubious. As I said, Azura doesn't NEED to be high level, she NEEDS to give her turns to other units- that's the entire POINT of her class! Also as I said, she steals experience by her mere presence, in the sense that you could be giving the deployment slot to someone ELSE.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 07:53
|
|
|
the thing that bugs me about all of the Nohrians is that they don't seem to respect Corrin. They absolutely refuse to understand what he did, and treat him like a child, or maybe a pet. I am kinda predisposed to dislike the Nohrian royals, because I don't like when media makes excuses for people that choose to follow evil people. at best the Nohrians are enablers. well, and Elise appears to just be a moron.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 07:54
|
|
|
At this point, enough people have disagreed with you and so many points have been made that there is little reason to continue this conversation. I'll say you should just accept the fact that units aren't coming back, and trust that there will be no issue, it's not like Tae only has one try every chapter. It's Birthright on hard, there is always a way to succeed.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 08:00
|
|
|
Their love for King Garon is as stupidly bad anime as it gets. We could have had a story about a family trying to navigate their political intrigues or we could just have them all know it's wrong to follow him and then weakly justify it and act like a bunch of jerks at the same time. Everyone treats Corrin like poo poo, at any rate.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 08:03
|
|
|
ohmygorgon posted:At this point, enough people have disagreed with you and so many points have been made that there is little reason to continue this conversation. I'll say you should just accept the fact that units aren't coming back, and trust that there will be no issue, it's not like Tae only has one try every chapter. It's Birthright on hard, there is always a way to succeed. I never said "bring back the perma-benched characters" in the first place. (And what happened to "SA doesn't like Azura" anyway? I'm pretty sure this thread's ALWAYS deployed her.) That said, it does, indeed, seem we'll never agree on this, albeit not for the reasons you seem to think: I'm only asking for at least ONE stage where Azura is NOT deployed, while you're all going "DANCER!!! USE 4EVR!!1!one!" Yes, yes, Dancers are good if used properly, I KNOW. That doesn't mean they're THAT good, especially with the survivability concerns I brought up before (and no, I still don't buy that bit about "it doesn't matter if she doesn't get attacked" because THE ENEMY PRIORITIZES HER OVER EVERYONE ELSE). And no, I am never going to stop voting for benching Azura until endgame unless it actually happens at least once; in fact, I'm half-tempted to veto her in future playthroughs to the best of my (likely nonexistent because "USE DANCER 4EVR!" bandwagon) ability just because I'm SICK of her.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 08:14
|
|
|
If you're that worried about Azura taking damage, you can protect her with the Shelter skill from a Cavalier like Silas.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 08:26
|
|
|
You're, uh, pretty heavily invested in Waifu Simulator Let's Plays, huh? (Unit deployment isn't a big deal)
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 08:42
|
|
|
Wallet Inspector posted:If you're that worried about Azura taking damage, you can protect her with the Shelter skill from a Cavalier like Silas. I never equip that one; all my skill slots are taken up by more IMMEDIATELY useful skills (such as giving Corrin Dragon Fang). On top of never deploying Azura in the first place, of course, but that's an entirely different topic. Blue Labrador posted:You're, uh, pretty heavily invested in Waifu Simulator Let's Plays, huh? Actually, I just think that Azura's being overrepresented here, and I'm annoyed by this thread's apparent hypocrisy (when Azura first joined I was told that she was unpopular on this forum; however, this thread has refused to let her so much as sit a single battle out). I honestly feel that it takes more strategy to win when you can't just say "oh, that didn't go how I wanted, DO-OVER!" or "my most powerful unit isn't useful enough so now he has two actions a turn!" Of course, I also feel that certain abilities make her completely redundant, but I've already said why.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 08:55
|
|
|
I don't think azura being unpopular as a character has anything to do with her utility as a unit. Shelter is a perfectly good defensive skill, and putting it on Silas doesn't mean you have to stop putting Dragon Fang on Corrin. What else would you have on him? Luna and Aegis are his two best alternative skills, and that still leaves you space for a skill that lets you quickly pull someone into a pair up and out of danger. I also have no idea how you're ending up in a situation where Azura is constantly in grave danger because it's quite simple to press X and then maintain a defensive line of some sort so that she never has to see combat unless you want her to.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 09:04
|
|
|
SC Bracer posted:I don't think azura being unpopular as a character has anything to do with her utility as a unit. Perfectly understandable; I mean, I'm not too fond of Saizo as a CHARACTER, but I can't deny his effectiveness as a UNIT. That said, deploying her every map for 9 stages straight? She isn't THAT good, and, to throw others' arguments back at them (yes, I know I'm being spiteful with this, and I'm sorry about it), she isn't NECESSARY to win any of the stages she has shown up in. SC Bracer posted:Shelter is a perfectly good defensive skill, and putting it on Silas doesn't mean you have to stop putting Dragon Fang on Corrin. What else would you have on him? Luna and Aegis are his two best alternative skills, and that still leaves you space for a skill that lets you quickly pull someone into a pair up and out of danger. I also have no idea how you're ending up in a situation where Azura is constantly in grave danger because it's quite simple to press X and then maintain a defensive line of some sort so that she never has to see combat unless you want her to. I have already made references to my units knowing skills that they can't learn in their innate class sets, so you should stop making assumptions on what he does and does not know; I was just using Corrin's Dragon Fang as an example because it has already been seen in the LP, I'm not going fishing for a different example, and I don't like talking about skills that haven't at least been discussed in an update yet. As to the defensive line, it's kinda hard to keep her out of the way (or make a proper line) when my primary method of combat is counter-baiting (and thus at least 95% of my kills happen on the enemy phase, with my units being deliberately in as many enemies' ranges as possible and often 5-8 spaces away from safety- yes, this only works that way when the unit is stronger than the enemies; I already said I exploit the grinding capability, didn't I?).
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 09:27
|
|
|
I'm giving a warning to stop, like seriously dude. I've played more fates than anyone here, I know how to navigate votes.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 10:31
|
|
|
CptWedgie posted:I think the support gain rates might've had the challenges in mind; I'm pretty sure there literally are not enough maps in the game to pair everyone up. There definitely are if you're not just feeding to kills to one pair. Even on Conquest, which has limited maps, I was able to get everyone paired up. Really, Azura's fine as a unit. Even if you think Sing is weak as a mechanic, she can give +3 Spd to her target once she hits level 10, and her Personal gives some small healing every turn to units around her.That counts for something, especially if you don't have a Falcon Knight for the map. The fact that she can actually attack (which is something pretty much every dancer prior to Awakening wish they could do) is nice, and unlike Olivia, Azura can actually hurt things. If people in the thread want Azura to be used, fine. If Tae really feels that he wants people to stop Azura, he can step in.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 10:53
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 8, 2024 06:47 |
|
|
Tae posted:I'm giving a warning to stop, like seriously dude. I've played more fates than anyone here, I know how to navigate votes. you could beat birthright with nothing but captured generics (I should know, I've done it) and those dudes are almost always worse than actual units.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 18:04
|
|