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Liquid Dinosaur
Dec 16, 2011

by Smythe

alf_pogs posted:

i want to like vaati's videos but his delivery is so ponderous and deliberate and his content so thoroughly covered elsewhere that i can't be bothered.

imho the best soulsborne lore piece is that "the paleblood hunt" document

That guy is the best because he's not doing a series of YouTube videos for a living, he just felt like writing 100 pages comprehensively going over every possible mystery in Bloodborne, and now he's out of the Souls lore game. Also it's easier to do Bloodborne because it's self contained and honestly mostly narratively coherent, with most questions answered.

Vaati needs to keep putting out content and if every reasonable theory has already been discussed, he needs to churn out some outlandish crap, usually involving Velka.

Liquid Dinosaur fucked around with this message at 02:02 on Apr 16, 2017

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hampig
Feb 11, 2004
...curioser and curioser...

This guy has Good Opinions.

e: Huh this only came out yesterday. Don't even agree with him all the time, still good opinions. Surprised he doesn't mention DS3 more, especially given if you reason through things like he does, DS3 is probably the best game in the series by a lot of these criteria. Suppose it's not the point of the video.

hampig fucked around with this message at 02:40 on Apr 16, 2017

SHY NUDIST GRRL
Feb 15, 2011

Communism will help more white people than anyone else. Any equal measures unfairly provide less to minority populations just because there's less of them. Democracy is truly the tyranny of the mob.

Lifegems suck. The reason he likes them are all valid. But keeping your stock up of them is stupid busy work and I never used them because I loving hate managing stock probably the same way he hates attrition. Just have it be a reusable item.

Internet Kraken
Apr 24, 2010

slightly amused
Yeah I like DS2 a ton but I actually hate the life gems. I just think they are an unnecessary once you get a good stock of estus. Then again I think the estus system introduced in DS1 is pure genius and one of the greatest game design choices ever made. He thinks Demon's Souls actually has a better healing mechanic. So, different strokes I guess.

hampig
Feb 11, 2004
...curioser and curioser...

Internet Kraken posted:

Yeah I like DS2 a ton but I actually hate the life gems. I just think they are an unnecessary once you get a good stock of estus. Then again I think the estus system introduced in DS1 is pure genius and one of the greatest game design choices ever made. He thinks Demon's Souls actually has a better healing mechanic. So, different strokes I guess.

Yeah I also prefer when there is a hard limit on estus healing, but give me 3's implementation any day.

LazyMaybe
Aug 18, 2013

oouagh

quote:

...because dying while healing, or dying because you were unable to heal because tactically it would have killed you, is just never fun or interesting.
:nono:

double nine
Aug 8, 2013

Uncle w Benefits posted:

The repair powder is so neat it should be a regular gesture.

From please

https://gfycat.com/DarkLegalKrill

Totally stealing this for pvp wins. Until I get sick of buying them.

Quantum of Phallus
Dec 27, 2010

SHY NUDIST GRRL posted:

Lifegems suck.

Especially how they didn't bother scaling them into any of the Ng+ modes at all so you're stuck buying regular life gems from the Majula Merchant that give you like one tiny bit of health.

uncle w benefits
Nov 1, 2010

hi, it's me, your uncle

double nine posted:

Totally stealing this for pvp wins. Until I get sick of buying them.

edit: original idea please dont steal

CuddlyZombie
Nov 6, 2005

I wuv your brains.

I'm only half an hour into the video but while I agree with him regarding lock-on and crowd control, and am sort of neutral about the whole armored knights thing, but his healing argument is all over the place. I'm not entirely sure what lifegems fix about his issues with healing mid-fight being too risky (you can slowly move while using them, maybe???) but I strongly disagree with his dismissal of attrition as well as finding opportunities during a boss-fight to heal as unfun mechanics. Maybe he doesn't like them, which I have no beef with, but he seems to be arguing that they are objectively unfun mechanics because some reviewers had a hard time with them.

When you're at low health and you know its not safe to heal and you have to dodge 3-4 attacks before you get a chance to back off and heal, that's really exciting and engaging to me. When you realize that you're going to take a hit during your current heal, but you can double-chug and rely on DS1/3's fast estus to survive at the expense of having to use up double your estus, that is a fun way of feeling like you hosed up without having to instantly die. If i remember right, double chugging in DS2 actually increases your recovery rate, and is something that is thankfully in that game, but he seems to overlook that entirely.


I also really disagree with his arguments about attrition, boss runs, and DS1's interconnectivity, but this post is wordy as it is.

CuddlyZombie
Nov 6, 2005

I wuv your brains.

That'll teach me to spend 6 minutes typing a reply without checking to see if anyone responded.

SHY NUDIST GRRL
Feb 15, 2011

Communism will help more white people than anyone else. Any equal measures unfairly provide less to minority populations just because there's less of them. Democracy is truly the tyranny of the mob.

That video gets a lot more fun the deeper in. poo poo talking matt and his exasperation with blight town is entertaining. And I agree that I don't like that warping is gated behind O&S who are a super hard fight and you might need to hit some blacksmiths in the mean time

Internet Kraken
Apr 24, 2010

slightly amused

Quantum of Phallus posted:

Especially how they didn't bother scaling them into any of the Ng+ modes at all so you're stuck buying regular life gems from the Majula Merchant that give you like one tiny bit of health.

TBF you could just crush multiple gems to heal faster. Not really viable for mid-battle healing but I never viewed life gems as being meant for that. DS2 very much encouraged you to only attempt to heal when you were sure you were safe, either because you killed everything or you knew you had a gap in the enemies attacks.

double nine posted:

Totally stealing this for pvp wins. Until I get sick of buying them.

One of my builds crushes a coin after every victory because its ~thematic~.

I would leave the coins for my victim but dropped items in DS3 despawn upon death.

SHY NUDIST GRRL
Feb 15, 2011

Communism will help more white people than anyone else. Any equal measures unfairly provide less to minority populations just because there's less of them. Democracy is truly the tyranny of the mob.

I can't believe I never questioned the Iron Keep elevator. I like to think now it's the character's failing memory only able to recreate the interesting parts of the journey

Fellatio del Toro
Mar 21, 2009

"The developers of dark souls 2 are teaching you something with their lessons of <pasting 5 enemies randomly in an bad, boring area>."

But boy these archers in the Taurus Demon fight, what's up with that??

Internet Kraken
Apr 24, 2010

slightly amused

Fellatio del Toro posted:

"The developers of dark souls 2 are teaching you something with their lessons of <pasting 5 enemies randomly in an bad, boring area>."

But boy these archers in the Taurus Demon fight, what's up with that??

His point was that the open area with several enemies has several approaches to it in which you can handle them. By comparison, a narrow bridge with some archers behind you has one objectively correct way to handle it and nothing else.

He didn't say one was better than the other. He was just pointing out that DS2 being different doesn't make it wrong.

SHY NUDIST GRRL
Feb 15, 2011

Communism will help more white people than anyone else. Any equal measures unfairly provide less to minority populations just because there's less of them. Democracy is truly the tyranny of the mob.

I did really like ds2 backstabbing animation.

Obligatum VII
May 5, 2014

Haunting you until no 8 arrives.

Nuebot posted:

Is that going to be a game where we have to play as a big clunky, overall frustrating to play as dragon while tiny dudes roll around our feet and chop our tails off?

I would no joke be really interesting in seeing someone take a swing at an action game that featuring a non-humanoid protagonist. I imagine drifting would be like, an actual pivotal part of your moveset in order to achieve fast turns. Dragon drifting.

Fellatio del Toro
Mar 21, 2009

Internet Kraken posted:

His point was that the open area with several enemies has several approaches to it in which you can handle them. By comparison, a narrow bridge with some archers behind you has one objectively correct way to handle it and nothing else.

He didn't say one was better than the other. He was just pointing out that DS2 being different doesn't make it wrong.

The archers are not a challenge to overcome, they're a big flashing sign telling you how to kill the boss.

New Concept Hole
Oct 10, 2012

東方動的
The only way to handle those archers in the Taurus Demon fight is to shoot aural decoy at the ceiling then throw a couple firebombs at the same spot.

C'mon FROM why didn't you add another way?!

SHY NUDIST GRRL
Feb 15, 2011

Communism will help more white people than anyone else. Any equal measures unfairly provide less to minority populations just because there's less of them. Democracy is truly the tyranny of the mob.

Fellatio del Toro posted:

The archers are not a challenge to overcome, they're a big flashing sign telling you how to kill the boss.

Or at least where to fight it.

Node
May 20, 2001

KICKED IN THE COOTER
:dings:
Taco Defender

Obligatum VII posted:

I would no joke be really interesting in seeing someone take a swing at an action game that featuring a non-humanoid protagonist. I imagine drifting would be like, an actual pivotal part of your moveset in order to achieve fast turns. Dragon drifting.

I'd be the Undead Burg drake that just chills on a bridge and breathes fire on newbies.

hampig
Feb 11, 2004
...curioser and curioser...
I'd like a dark souls game where you can invade as a pack of bonewheel skeletons.

An invasion mechanic where you invade into the body of designated (red eye?) NPCs might be legitimately cool.

Internet Kraken
Apr 24, 2010

slightly amused

Fellatio del Toro posted:

The archers are not a challenge to overcome, they're a big flashing sign telling you how to kill the boss.

Yeah and that's why I said neither of those are bad design. The point though was that Dark Souls 1 mostly features narrow areas with enemies placed in them in which you have a limited of ways to approach through the level itself. DS2 gives you more room the work with and more ways for the encounter to play out as a result. Not necessarily better, given that sometimes one finely crafted experience is better than a large number of more randomized ones.

The point is its not just sticking a bunch of enemies in a room because they didn't have other ideas. Its because they were trying something DS1 didn't do much of.

Fellatio del Toro
Mar 21, 2009

I never criticized that point, just the way that he's inventing all of these dumb "lessons" that the developers tried to "teach" you so that when you got to the joke fight you would know not to use the lovely camera system that points at the floor when fighting an enemy on the same plane as you.

LazyMaybe
Aug 18, 2013

oouagh

Fellatio del Toro posted:

The archers are not a challenge to overcome, they're a big flashing sign telling you how to kill the boss.
They don't tell you to use lightning pine resin and get between his legs though

Node
May 20, 2001

KICKED IN THE COOTER
:dings:
Taco Defender
I wish there was a gimmick covenant in DS3, like Gravelords or Ratbros, except they worked. I loved the idea of those covenants, but you'll never actually get an invasion or be invaded. I know The Ringed City sorta has one, but that isn't as fun as the concepts of the other ones I mentioned.

Sum Gai
Mar 23, 2013

Node posted:

I wish there was a gimmick covenant in DS3, like Gravelords or Ratbros, except they worked. I loved the idea of those covenants, but you'll never actually get an invasion or be invaded. I know The Ringed City sorta has one, but that isn't as fun as the concepts of the other ones I mentioned.

I got summoned a fair amount in Doors/Grave of Saints.

Fellatio del Toro
Mar 21, 2009

I've never not been immediately double invaded after Pontiff :shrug:

Node
May 20, 2001

KICKED IN THE COOTER
:dings:
Taco Defender

Fellatio del Toro posted:

I've never not been immediately double invaded after Pontiff :shrug:

That isn't the kind of invasion I'm talking about. Those are regular invasions, from Aldrich's covenant. I mean gimmicks, like how Gravelords put a sign down in their own world, and someone elses world would get poisoned with tons of black phantoms, which they would have to get rid of by finding the invasion sign and killing the Gravelord.

Internet Kraken
Apr 24, 2010

slightly amused
Aldrich Faithful and Farron Watchdogs aren't really gimmicks. They are just covenants that can only invade a specific area two at a time.

I did a lot of Rat Broing on DS2 launch and it was super fun. I'm sad there wasn't anything like it in DS3.

skasion
Feb 13, 2012

Why don't you perform zazen, facing a wall?

Node posted:

I wish there was a gimmick covenant in DS3, like Gravelords or Ratbros, except they worked. I loved the idea of those covenants, but you'll never actually get an invasion or be invaded. I know The Ringed City sorta has one, but that isn't as fun as the concepts of the other ones I mentioned.

Rats worked fine in that summoners could get a lot of bites and anyone in the zones ran a decent risk of getting summoned, the problem is that the areas weren't fit for purpose. I assume they envisioned rat multiplayer as working like a gauntlet where the rat leads the summon through the traps he has set up, harassing them as they try to escape. Grave of Saints is tiny and extremely easy to just run through even if all the traps/rats are loose, so hosts resorted to sitting right in front of the spawn because there was no chance of getting the kill otherwise unless the summon was completely clueless. Doors on the other hand is relatively big and open and will take a little while to get through even if you know what you're doing, but the spawn location is so disadvantageous that if the summoner wants to kill the summon right away it is very easy to do it. Crucial point is that neither zone habitually led to a fun experience for the summon, and because neither zone is mandatory or has any super compelling rewards the flow of summons dried up. Then all the ratfucks got bored and moved on to other covenants.

Node
May 20, 2001

KICKED IN THE COOTER
:dings:
Taco Defender
What the gently caress, I'm jealous as hell that you people got the Rat covenant working. I must have gotten into Dark Souls 2 too late, when everybody was Way of Blue, Blue Cops, or Dickwraiths.

Vermain
Sep 5, 2006



IronicDongz posted:

They don't tell you to use lightning pine resin and get between his legs though

Twin Dragonriders is an obnoxious fight because of how doing this one thing makes the fight about ten thousand times easier, but your chance of actually figuring it out short of pure luck or watching a speedrun is practically nil. The only other boss that comes to mind that can destroy terrain is Scorpioness, and that's three zones and a completely different terrain type away.

Sum Gai
Mar 23, 2013

skasion posted:

Doors on the other hand is relatively big and open and will take a little while to get through even if you know what you're doing, but the spawn location is so disadvantageous that if the summoner wants to kill the summon right away it is very easy to do it. Crucial point is that neither zone habitually led to a fun experience for the summon, and because neither zone is mandatory or has any super compelling rewards the flow of summons dried up.

Yeah... making it to the Doors bonfire was always satisfying when it happened, though.

Sum Gai fucked around with this message at 04:51 on Apr 16, 2017

Professor of Cats
Mar 22, 2009

Confession: I rage quit DSII and never went back. This was before I knew everyone else wasn't a fan.


Years later, I do not regret my decision. Praise the sun.

Yorkshire Pudding
Nov 24, 2006



That is the correct way to play DS2.

SHY NUDIST GRRL
Feb 15, 2011

Communism will help more white people than anyone else. Any equal measures unfairly provide less to minority populations just because there's less of them. Democracy is truly the tyranny of the mob.

Oh and I never knew you could drop the second dragonrider how the gently caress was I supposed to know I could do that?

Not that matt isn't clearly poo poo at dark souls

Vermain
Sep 5, 2006



Professor of Cats posted:

Confession: I rage quit DSII and never went back. This was before I knew everyone else wasn't a fan.


Years later, I do not regret my decision. Praise the sun.

Conversely, I also rage quit the game, came back after like half a year, found out that the game was actually pretty fun and proceeded to have an immensely enjoyable experience.

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Internet Kraken
Apr 24, 2010

slightly amused
Its almost like DS2 is fun :monocle:

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