|
21 Muns posted:Given the descriptions the writers of the Constitution gave for why they did various things, I've got to imagine they would have implemented [literally anything other than FPTP] if they'd thought of it. The Founders didn't specify FPTP or any other specific voting system. That was something left to the states to decide. The biggest reason why things don't match the ideal that was intended is the rise of the two party system.
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2017 00:30
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 25, 2024 21:56 |
|
|
Dilbro provides vital insight into the diseased MAGA brain.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2017 00:39
|
|
|
Shbobdb posted:Dilbro provides vital insight into the diseased MAGA brain. "Come in to my weird house's minaret-shaped-like-a-cartoon-head section. Try one of my Dilberitos (probably not bad even if expired?). I have enough microwaves to concurrently make ALL the popcorn you could ever want, no need to fight over who gets first bag. You're gonna have to check that sweater at the door, though! ... Have I ever told you about the time I literally stopped talking for months, until my wife and I divorced?"
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2017 00:44
|
|
|
Jurgan posted:The Founders didn't specify FPTP or any other specific voting system. That was something left to the states to decide. The biggest reason why things don't match the ideal that was intended is the rise of the two party system. Aka something that occurred in well under 20 years from the founding of the country, with most of them still alive for it.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2017 00:58
|
|
|
sweart gliwere posted:Have I ever told you about the time I literally stopped talking for months, until my wife and I divorced?" Wait what? Did he actually do that?
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2017 01:37
|
|
|
Easy Salmon Recipe posted:Wait what? Did he actually do that? His ex-wife is now his personal assistant. He's dating some 20-nothing Instagram social presence bikini model. i gotta admit, that's power move af tho
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2017 01:53
|
|
|
Dr Christmas posted:Back during the heyday of 9/11 trutherism, did Alex Jones display anything resembling sympathy towards Muslims? One time an Iranian called in and Jones apologized for his neocon government for trying to start a war with Iran.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2017 02:20
|
|
|
Phone posted:His ex-wife is now his personal assistant. He's dating some 20-nothing Instagram social presence bikini model. Ugh. That's horrific.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2017 02:37
|
|
|
Cardboard Box A posted:Bush era Alex Jones was to the left of Michael Moore. As an avid Alex Jones listener during much of the Bush years I remember his passionate defense of Muslims against the wave of bigotry they were facing at the time was one of the things that made him seem like a courageous truth-teller at the time. Alex Jones has always known his audience- which at the time was (in large part thanks to Loose Change) made up primarily of Millenials who had become disillusioned with the political system as a result of the Iraq War/general insanity of the Bush administration. Alex Jones changed his views on Muslims as his audience changed. I have always maintained that Alex Jones is a particular type of social predator and is 100% completely aware of what he is doing. Further Alex is not motivated by anything except an unbridled lust for godlike power and every move he has made for the past decade of his life has been in pursuit of that goal.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2017 03:37
|
|
|
Prester Jane posted:As an avid Alex Jones listener during much of the Bush years I remember his passionate defense of Muslims against the wave of bigotry they were facing at the time was one of the things that made him seem like a courageous truth-teller at the time. Goblinlike power maybe.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2017 03:38
|
|
|
Phone posted:His ex-wife is now his personal assistant. He's dating some 20-nothing Instagram social presence bikini model. I feel bad for the ex. Why the hell would you hang around that poo poo?
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2017 03:49
|
|
|
I enjoy Dilbro's contorted, motivated reasoning in defending everything the president does. Here's a vote to preserve the posts.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2017 04:09
|
|
|
fishmech posted:Aka something that occurred in well under 20 years from the founding of the country, with most of them still alive for it. And aka an inevitable result of FPTP and not of well-designed voting systems
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2017 04:40
|
|
|
Easy Salmon Recipe posted:I feel bad for the ex. Why the hell would you hang around that poo poo? He's probably got to drat much money. His books were lucrative, and he's still in a lot of newspapers. I don't know where else to ask this, so I'll ask here. Where the goddamn gently caress did "Kekistan" and all that garbage come from, aside from 4chan? And why the gently caress do the neo-Nazis think it's funny or witty in the slightest? It makes no sense, especially given how absolutely stupid it is. It's the new fedora Hot Topic, but for Nazi wannabe children. e - and now I look. It's Sargon, of course.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2017 04:53
|
|
|
21 Muns posted:And aka an inevitable result of FPTP and not of well-designed voting systems No, most voting systems result in 2 or 3 dominant parties that control the narrative and the vast majority of the votes, and the vast majority of leadership positions (e.g. Prime Minister in fully parliamentary systems, presidents in presidential/semi-presidential systems). This is simply because most legislation is pass or no pass, most decisions are yes or no. What does it matter that say, Australia, widely regarded as having the most accurate voting system across the two federal houses, has 12 parties in its senate (4 of which are in permanent coalition with each other) and 7 parties in their House (3 of which are in permanent coalition with each other)? Only 3% of the House of Reps there and 26% of the Senate are outside the 2 main parties/coalitions. And the last Prime Minister who didn't come from the Labour party or the Liberal party (leader of the coalition of the Liberal, National, and Liberal-National coalition) and its direct predecessor "United Australia" served in 1929! In case you're wondering, Australia uses the Single Transferable Vote for the federal Senate and Instant-Runoff for the federal House of Representatives.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2017 05:03
|
|
|
Manuel Calavera posted:He's probably got to drat much money. His books were lucrative, and he's still in a lot of newspapers. And I could honestly see him still giving her a lot of cash in the hopes that she'll like him. Adams strikes me as the type of dude who thinks "If I abuse a woman, get a hot girlfriend, and grow muscles, I'll be a Chad", but once he does, realizes that he's still the type of wimpy loser who thinks in terms of "chads", and other people can smell the reek of despair and low self-esteem on him, so he still gets treated like a whiny little bitch. Manuel Calavera posted:I don't know where else to ask this, so I'll ask here. Where the goddamn gently caress did "Kekistan" and all that garbage come from, aside from 4chan? And why the gently caress do the neo-Nazis think it's funny or witty in the slightest? It makes no sense, especially given how absolutely stupid it is. It's the new fedora Hot Topic, but for Nazi wannabe children. Because neo-nazis are brokebrained losers who can't actually think of anything witty, so they just repeat the stupidest things that they hear from others, hoping it comes off as humor. Since their compatriots are barely sentient troglodytes as well, they grunt and hoot whenever they recognize a word, and that passes for laughter. "Kek" is a term meaning "lol", which comes from World of Warcraft's language filter, which made anything said by the opposing faction come out as gibberish, so you couldn't really talk to each other. One of the few known translations was that "lol" came out of the filter as "kek". Since letting go of a meme would require emotional and mental growth, they still hang onto it, and that's where you get the idiotic "kekistan" "praise kek" and whatever other mental diarrhea they've passed back and forth between each other's mouths.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2017 13:23
|
|
|
Easy Salmon Recipe posted:And I could honestly see him still giving her a lot of cash in the hopes that she'll like him. Adams strikes me as the type of dude who thinks "If I abuse a woman, get a hot girlfriend, and grow muscles, I'll be a Chad", but once he does, realizes that he's still the type of wimpy loser who thinks in terms of "chads", and other people can smell the reek of despair and low self-esteem on him, so he still gets treated like a whiny little bitch. And then there's this: https://pepethefrogfaith.wordpress.com
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2017 13:51
|
|
|
That sounds about right, yes. That it's just regurgitated meme garbage because they're mental children. I mean look at this poo poo.quote:All proud furry Kekistanis should rise up and stand against the cancer of the normies! And if they put up a still resistance, we shall unleash our secret police, /pol/, upon them! And then this, some fucko defending it and saying "I'm a fascist, they're not fascists" quote:Neo-Nazi? How so? As a fascist myself barely any of these people are even close to being fascists, in fact, most are just regular liberals tired of people like you calling them neo-Nazis. You have two choices, educated yourself, or, you can go and keep acting like a child. By the Lord people like you are odd, your like the one kid who thinks he is more mature than everyone else but still can't figure out how to open up a pickle jar without asking for help from his dad. (Source, youtube comments on a video of a whiny furry "comedian") Mercedes Colomar fucked around with this message at 14:05 on Apr 18, 2017 |
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2017 14:03
|
|
|
Manuel Calavera posted:That sounds about right, yes. That it's just regurgitated meme garbage because they're mental children. I mean look at this poo poo. Throwing this out there, 4chan responds pretty shittly to anyone who tries to use them as a personal army. Usually just results in you getting doxxed then them photoshopping you with a dick in your mouth.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2017 15:55
|
|
|
Couple of pages back, but is it really the case that a lot of Trump voters voted for Obama previously? On my phone so I don't have it right now, but I saw something that showed the biggest issue was people not voting in 2016. The actual transfers to Trump from Obama weren't really a factor, it was a large group of voters deciding not to vote at all that shifted things, in keeping with the very low turnout and very different electorate demographics than previous elections. The piece I saw made a pretty compelling case that racism and xenophobia was the main reason for Trump's supporters turning out. I'm not sure how much trying to flip people matters compared to trying to convince the million+ people who didn't vote to come out again in 2018.
Beelzebufo fucked around with this message at 16:19 on Apr 18, 2017 |
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2017 16:14
|
|
|
Look at the cross-sectional of white voters in 2008, 2012, and 2016 and it'll paint a clearer picture. White suburbanites voted for Trump and he won by like 70k votes across 3 counties in 3 different states. Don't buy into the narrative that a bunch of poor idiot hick dumb fucks out in flyover country are the reason why Trump was voted in; it was that motherfucker up the street who is levered up to his eyeballs in consumer debt and has some opinions about where his tax dollars should go. There's a very strong contingent trying to put this solely on the poor working class and trying to rehabilitate them all over the news and whatnot, but it's all a fiction: poor people just straight up don't vote.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2017 16:24
|
|
|
Phone posted:Look at the cross-sectional of white voters in 2008, 2012, and 2016 and it'll paint a clearer picture. I don't actually think it was Hicks who voted him in, a lot of people like to frame racism as a vice of the poor and ignorant rather than living in the heart of US society. But given that the Democrats lost many more votes than the Republicans gained, that would seem to indicate that Clinton failed to convince a large portion of the rust belt Democratic base to come out. Are those 70k white suburbanites disillusioned Obama voters, or did they simply vote Republican like they always did. Romney got a majority of white votes too, from both genders. I'm not convinced people switching parties is the explanation for the election, is all. There are probably were a few soft conservative white people who could be swayed, but I'm not sure they made up the bulk of Trump's win. Beelzebufo fucked around with this message at 16:56 on Apr 18, 2017 |
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2017 16:42
|
|
|
Sedge and Bee posted:I don't actually think it was Hicks who voted him in, a lot of people like to frame racism as a vice of the poor and ignorant rather than living in the heart of US society. But given that the Democrats lost many more votes than the Republicans gained, that would seem to indicate that Clinton failed to convince a large portion of the rust belt Democratic base to come out. Are those 70k white suburbanites disillusioned Obama voters, or did they simply vote Republican like they always did. Romney got a majority of white votes too, from both genders. I'm not convinced people switching parties is the explanation for the election, is all. There are probably write a few soft conservative white people who could be swayed, but I'm not sure they made up the bulk of Trump's win. It's also a lot easier to sway white middle-class self-professed "moderates" with threats against their middling status than poor who have always had very little to lose.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2017 16:46
|
|
|
Sedge and Bee posted:I don't actually think it was Hicks who voted him in, a lot of people like to frame racism as a vice of the poor and ignorant rather than living in the heart of US society. But given that the Democrats lost many more votes than the Republicans gained, that would seem to indicate that Clinton failed to convince a large portion of the rust belt Democratic base to come out. Are those 70k white suburbanites disillusioned Obama voters, or did they simply vote Republican like they always did. Romney got a majority of white votes too, from both genders. I'm not convinced people switching parties is the explanation for the election, is all. There are probably were a few soft conservative white people who could be swayed, but I'm not sure they made up the bulk of Trump's win. I think it's less "disillusioned Obama voters" and more "Normally votes Republican but voted for Obama due to his charisma."
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2017 16:57
|
|
|
The problem is there's too many factors, because the race was so close and so close in very specific ways. So anyone with an axe to grind has a way to spin the number that works to their advantage. Me, I think sexism played a more massive role than most would guess, but not necessarily in the 3 key states that swung red.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2017 17:04
|
|
|
Sedge and Bee posted:I don't actually think it was Hicks who voted him in, a lot of people like to frame racism as a vice of the poor and ignorant rather than living in the heart of US society. But given that the Democrats lost many more votes than the Republicans gained, that would seem to indicate that Clinton failed to convince a large portion of the rust belt Democratic base to come out. Are those 70k white suburbanites disillusioned Obama voters, or did they simply vote Republican like they always did. Romney got a majority of white votes too, from both genders. I'm not convinced people switching parties is the explanation for the election, is all. There are probably were a few soft conservative white people who could be swayed, but I'm not sure they made up the bulk of Trump's win. I see it more of Clinton losing than Trump winning. She was a terrible candidate through and through, she didn't have any policies outside of the implicit "the same slow grinding of the proles". Also, the millisecond you start to look into how the DNC was handling things and some of the insane stories from the trail about the dumbest poo poo imaginable (see: Michigan asking for resources), you gain an appreciation for how broken and dumb the entire political apparatus is in the US; it's profoundly dumb, extremely extremely dumb. I was posting it a bunch in the old US Pol threads and probably here too, I highly recommend checking out Mark Blyth's talk (and post election talk) about Global Trumpism. Then watch Hypernormalization and face yourself to bloodshed.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2017 17:16
|
|
|
I crave death.   Master Shake posted:On Monday’s Mark Levin show, Ronald Reagan slammed through massive tax reform in 1981 and since then progressive Democrats and Republicans have unraveled most of it. We are told tax reform is impossible because the people who lord it over us say so. It is not just the Democrats but the Republicans that love this stuff. We don’t support the phony progressive income tax, which is really regressive. These taxes are really just a way to redistribute wealth. The vast majority of us who pay the federal income tax, support a fair tax or flat tax. It doesn’t take long to get to the 50% tax bracket after you add together all the taxes including, sales taxes, property taxes, and others. Yet when you look at the government and most states, they have massive debt. Our tax revenue doesn’t even come close to paying the trillion dollar debt. It seems the more we pay, the bigger the government gets and the less responsive the government becomes. In addition, we have to control spending borrowing and taxing. These are three things the Republican Party wants to stop but never does. We never fight he only time we took it to the left was during Reagan’s presidency. Reagan went over the heads of the media and Congress to the American people and got tax reform done. We allow the left to position the politics of this, but instead should be talking about unleashing our economy. After that, have you noticed conservatives who were Never-Trumpers praising President Trump when he embraces the establishment? Most of these people have revealed themselves as inside the beltway Republicrats. They praise Trump for hiring Reince Priebus, relying on Paul Ryan and relying on liberal democrats like Gary Cohn. Later, Trump is doing everything right when it comes to North Korea. America can’t ignore and pretend Kim Jong-un’s threat about launching nuclear missiles into our country isn’t a serious one. Finally, the praetorian guard media is trying to kill the Obama surveillance story as quickly as they can. This is the same reporting you get from the liberal media including, the New York Times, Associated Press and CNN.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2017 17:19
|
|
|
Nevvy Z posted:The problem is there's too many factors, because the race was so close and so close in very specific ways. So anyone with an axe to grind has a way to spin the number that works to their advantage. I've always heard it as "They genuinely believed Trump would improve things" to explain the massive shift in the rust belt, but given that the GOP has never improved conditions for the modern labor employee its probably down to an anti-immigrant or "America First" mentality they convinced themselves the GOP would promote.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2017 18:35
|
|
|
Xibanya posted:I crave death. Insane people posted:Liberal media. Associated Press. Reminder that the AP just reports facts without opinion or editorializing.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2017 20:14
|
|
|
Talmonis posted:Reminder that the AP just reports facts without opinion or editorializing. Truth, liberal bias, etc, etc.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2017 20:19
|
|
|
21 Muns posted:And aka an inevitable result of FPTP and not of well-designed voting systems To be fair they were dealing with information of the era, and FPTP ending up lovely is common knowledge now, but wasn't then.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2017 20:23
|
|
|
Easy Salmon Recipe posted:Because neo-nazis are brokebrained losers who can't actually think of anything witty, so they just repeat the stupidest things that they hear from others, hoping it comes off as humor. Since their compatriots are barely sentient troglodytes as well, they grunt and hoot whenever they recognize a word, and that passes for laughter. TBF, it actually comes from this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kek_(mythology) Also, it looks like the Murdochs are turning on Bill O'Reilly: http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2017/04/sources-the-murdochs-are-turning-against-bill-oreilly.html Have your champaign ready, folks.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2017 20:30
|
|
|
pentyne posted:I've always heard it as "They genuinely believed Trump would improve things" to explain the massive shift in the rust belt, but given that the GOP has never improved conditions for the modern labor employee its probably down to an anti-immigrant or "America First" mentality they convinced themselves the GOP would promote. It's important to remember how much Trump ran as not your typical Republican, supporting no cuts to Social Security and hyping how for example Clinton and the democrats haven't done anything to curtail the rules he add other rich people use to gently caress over everyone. Than Clinton thought it read a brilliant idea to try and distance Trump from typical Republicans. Trump's appeal was to racists And the Republican base is racist but make no mistakes he did run with with the language on the occasion of a reactionary FDR.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2017 21:09
|
|
|
https://twitter.com/MaryEmilyOHara/status/854406817111322624
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2017 21:38
|
|
|
New Bill O'Reilly Accuser Says He Called Her "Hot Chocolate" and Leered http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/bill-oreilly-accuser-says-he-called-her-hot-chocolate-leered-995158 quote:Bill O'Reilly used to leer at an African-American Fox News clerical worker and called her "hot chocolate," according to attorney Lisa Bloom, who helped the woman report the harassment to the network's hotline. Edit: Who knows what this actually means, but remember that Drudge was essentially publishing press releases at Ailes' whim during that whole shitstorm last year: https://twitter.com/DRUDGE/status/854429608086691840 Lester Shy fucked around with this message at 21:52 on Apr 18, 2017 |
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2017 21:41
|
|
|
Lester Shy posted:Edit: Who knows what this actually means, but remember that Drudge was essentially publishing press releases at Ailes' whim during that whole shitstorm last year: I don't think Bill is coming back from that vacation now.  I really hope criminal charges are pressed against him next.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2017 21:53
|
|
|
SeANMcBAY posted:I don't think Bill is coming back from that vacation now. I really hope criminals are pressed against him after that.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2017 22:23
|
|
|
SeANMcBAY posted:I really hope criminal charges are pressed against him next. Or maybe they could take his inevitable $40Million severance package and use it to build homeless shelters and soup kitchens across the country instead.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2017 22:25
|
|
|
O'Reilly seems to definitely be dead now, because the narrative is pushing so hard one way that bringing him back would become a story in and of itself. Even if Murdoch/Fox don't want to ditch him not ditching him is basically picking a fight in his defense at this stage. If Bill's vacation was real (it wasn't) it couldn't have been a worse move since the story hasn't blown over, people have just gotten used to a world without Bill O'Reilly. Now we just get to the part where he pretends he retired voluntarily and scum like Drudge paint him as the real victim. And we get to see what Fox does with his timeslot, because I really have no idea.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2017 22:26
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 25, 2024 21:56 |
|
|
STAC Goat posted:O'Reilly seems to definitely be dead now, because the narrative is pushing so hard one way that bringing him back would become a story in and of itself. Even if Murdoch/Fox don't want to ditch him not ditching him is basically picking a fight in his defense at this stage. They're gonna replace him with Jesse Watters and things will be 1000x worse than they were under O'Reilly because that is the general trajectory of the world.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2017 22:42
|
|