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Knifegrab posted:416 got new, much better sights IMO. Thank god. Hooded sights are always terrible for first person aiming in shooters.
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Apr 19, 2017 18:21
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emanresu tnuocca posted:There are so many stupid little loopholes hackers use you know, from the behavior of the players he teleported it seems possible that they didn't actually teleport anywhere on their clients (they act oblivious), he just used the induced desync to render them on his client and shoot them, which would fool the server side hit registry. All games are client side for certain things with serverside registry/post-detection. Everything is lerped/interpolated. Basically the server tells your game where a player is and the engine then renders the enemy at that location. If you can hook into the engine you can move a players location to your own, you can give yourself unlimited ammo, you can up your engine speed (that is the fast running glitch you saw). Also some games will not drop packets but will instead queue them when you lose connection for a bit. All of that poo poo stew leads up to what we see in that video. He desyncs his client form teh server (lag switch) so the updated player positions won't interrupt the teleport. He then hooks into the engine and teleports enemy players to be in front of him. Due to the lerp/interpolation they will be doing whatever they were last doing before the lag switch which is why some of them are just running forever in one direction. He then unloads on them with his AK. Enemy death is not client side that only happens after a respnose to the server. He then undo's the lag switch and all the queued packages are then sent to the server at once, and they all say "I SHOT A GUY IN THE HEAD!" and the server goes "yeah this all seems legit" and then sends out the death response to all the players. There are a number of failings of detection/validation here. 1) The game has absolutely zero lag compensation/consideration. Typically speaking if a person somehow loses connection to a server, a game may simply toss a certain number of packets if the delay is past a threshold. Though this varies from title to title and can often be tweaked within the server settings, a delay >400ms is typically within the window of tossing. This game obviously has absolutely no concept of this idea. 2) The game performs absolutely no validation on both player position/movement, but also things like magazine size, and fire rate. 3) The game performs no validation on hit registration, it allows the client to be the decision maker in if a shot lands. This pertains to verifying both the attacker, and the victims position as well as any other varaibles associated with shots. Quite frankly some of this stuff is very tough to solve, but some of it is very simple, and for a MP game is a bare minimum. Its a bit concerning, expect this to get much worse before it gets better. Knifegrab fucked around with this message at 18:26 on Apr 19, 2017 |
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Apr 19, 2017 18:22
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funny Star Wars parody posted:Video game hacking is crazy interesting from a programming side is what I'm learning here One of the ways ARMA/DayZ hackers finally lost teleport hacks was because the game was continually transmitting to the master server (it had to update pretty much constantly so you couldn't alt-f4 in combat) the anticheat code would piggyback onto that. So for teleports it would just check your current position against your previous position and if you were moving too fast to be plausible in the game, it would kick you out. Of course, when this was introduced, they forgot the game had helicopters at one point. When they put helicopters back in the game, the anticheat would kick people out of the server because the speed at which the helicopter travelled triggered the antiteleport mechanic. When they would spawn into the server again, it would keep their last known altitude data, but they wouldn't have a parachute. So they'd spawn in midair and fall to their deaths.
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Apr 19, 2017 18:33
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Party Plane Jones posted:One of the ways ARMA/DayZ hackers finally lost teleport hacks was because the game was continually transmitting to the master server (it had to update pretty much constantly so you couldn't alt-f4 in combat) the anticheat code would piggyback onto that. So for teleports it would just check your current position against your previous position and if you were moving too fast to be plausible in the game, it would kick you out. 
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Apr 19, 2017 18:46
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What do you guys think about adding death-markers in the game? Obviously it would make the game much easier and a lot less tense since you'll have more information about who is alive/where the people are still alive will be (which is mostly why I bring it up). However, I think it would also allow for more strategic gameplay as opposed to hoping that the path you're taking is not into someone hiding behind a tree, 3rd person peeking you. The death-markers probably wouldn't be global as I think that would way too OP, and doesn't really make sense realistically. So I was thinking there could be a set distance (vision radius for example) where if someone's corpse enters that radius, it shows up on your minimap. GL in you games, friends.
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Apr 19, 2017 18:46
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Just got win #11 in Squad, it never gets less intense. Never. Also at this point I can have feels for the other squad and their poo poo luck with the RNG circle compounded by a boneheaded movement choice on their part. We were set up on a wall that ran parallel to their path to the last circle, caught the first guy out and then pincered the gently caress out of the last guy while our third gave cover fire to keep him behind his crates. Highlight of the match goes out to the rando who barged into our house, alone, while talking to his team with global chat set to on. Never peeked his corners or anything, just came bounding upstairs like he owned the joint. RIP my dude you the real MVP
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Apr 19, 2017 18:49
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Are you guys running into a lot of hackers? I haven't seen any AFAIK.
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Apr 19, 2017 18:52
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rap music posted:Are you guys running into a lot of hackers? I haven't seen any AFAIK. In my hundreds of deaths so far I think maybe 3 or 4 were shady enough that I questioned it. Other than that, no.
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Apr 19, 2017 18:52
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Party Plane Jones posted:One of the ways ARMA/DayZ hackers finally lost teleport hacks was because the game was continually transmitting to the master server (it had to update pretty much constantly so you couldn't alt-f4 in combat) the anticheat code would piggyback onto that. So for teleports it would just check your current position against your previous position and if you were moving too fast to be plausible in the game, it would kick you out. This is amazing.
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Apr 19, 2017 18:56
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I remember what finally made me give up on DayZ standalone: Group of 8 goons, dude teleports in and mocks us in local. He makes us all drop our weapons/put them away and then kills everybody. So long as the hacking in pub isn't at that level, poo poo should be good.
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Apr 19, 2017 19:08
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Yodzilla posted:This is amazing. One of the reasons why the DayZ servers eventually fractured into other hives (Lingor, paid custom servers with loadouts) is because of how untenable it was. It was a constant battle by server admins and BattlEye developers (DayZ was pretty much the testing ground for BattlEye being decent) versus Rocket being a complete moron. I mean, granted, you could if you really wanted to look through the server logs and see player loadouts and positions as they were reported. But the problem was, right around the last couple major hack waves, Rocket disabled server logging. Basically all of it. The only thing server admins would see was player connections and disconnections, meaning if there actually were hackers you couldn't figure out who they were. So BattlEye developers took the original server PBOs and made custom ones with all the logging turned back on and added their own little tweaks to it to give to the server admins still beta testing anticheats. If anybody played on the goon server at the time, there were a bunch of changes just to make poo poo quicker to test. Vehicles didn't need repairs (making so that you didn't have to look through 9 towns to find a tire), just gas; broken stuff like barbed wire and tank traps were never even loaded in the game from the master server. Eventually it came to the point where more and more servers were running custom code and finally everybody said "gently caress it" and the mod disintegrated into custom servers with donor spawn loadouts, different maps, and a whole host of other things. Party Plane Jones fucked around with this message at 19:15 on Apr 19, 2017 |
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Apr 19, 2017 19:10
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I'm on the same boat of "only a few of my deaths have seemed sketchy." And I play quite a bit.
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Apr 19, 2017 19:12
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Besides Rocket being Rocket, why did he disable server logging? A spiteful act against ppl messing with his vision?
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Apr 19, 2017 19:15
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always be closing posted:Besides Rocket being Rocket, why did he disable server logging? A spiteful act against ppl messing with his vision? Server admins were (admittedly you had to know what the hell you were looking at) using it to 'ghost' people so that they could be stream sniped constantly. edit: Dug up an old log file; here's basically what would get reported every second or two as it sent new info to the Hive. code:code:The player's current loadout. Position (you just just moved the digits over two so I was at 5, 104 in the in-game GPS system) Player ID (in the server hive system) and GUID. As you moved it would write your update your current info to the hive; when you died it would also write your info to the hive (you could actually just come back with all your poo poo if you knew somebody with access since every single player state forever per guid was stored server side) Party Plane Jones fucked around with this message at 19:37 on Apr 19, 2017 |
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Apr 19, 2017 19:16
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I've had a single death I would definitely attribute to hacking, other than that just good ol' fashioned me being stupid or the game being buggy. Actually a vast majority of my deaths are just me being stupid. I either wait way too long to move and someone is just standing on the inside of the white mowing down people coming in, or I leave the safety of a house I have perfectly locked down and good sight lines because I think there might be some tasty loot in that building over there.
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Apr 19, 2017 19:24
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There Might Be Some Tasty Loot Over There: The PUBG Story in theaters soon
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Apr 19, 2017 19:32
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Party Plane Jones posted:Server admins were (admittedly you had to know what the hell you were looking at) using it to 'ghost' people so that they could be stream sniped constantly. It was very abusable in general. Plenty of privatehives used the logs to implement 'admin maps' that were basically the same as the ESP hacks and allowed you to the see the position of every player, vehicle and tent across the map. Arguably it was a tossing the baby with the bathwater moment for Rocket but there was some logic there. On the server the goon squad used to frequent we'd often encounter suspect play from certain players but they weren't overtly hacking, after goons stopped playing there and I generally played alone I started teaming up with the server's admin and at that point he just frankly spoke about how he and the other admins just constantly gave intel to those guys. I mean, this is really so offtopic so I'll shut up about the Dead Game. PUBG has promise really, I haven't encountered any intrusive cheaters so far, I'm happy. emanresu tnuocca fucked around with this message at 19:41 on Apr 19, 2017 |
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Apr 19, 2017 19:34
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rap music posted:Are you guys running into a lot of hackers? I haven't seen any AFAIK. A single death seemed questionable to me, and even that was probably just bad info prior to the firefight.
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Apr 19, 2017 19:36
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emanresu tnuocca posted:PUBG has promise really, I haven't encountered and intrusive cheaters so far, I'm happy. Yeah, moving towards an entirely matchmaking based system negates a lot of the issues Arma had.
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Apr 19, 2017 19:40
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Geekslinger posted:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dFfPBfgitjY Wow, that desyncing / lag from the beginning when they are trying to melee is awful.
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Apr 19, 2017 19:41
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So for what it's worth, these cheaters are developing their own private hacks like the one from the video. There is a consensus among them that it's not worth their time/effort to release public cheats because battleye is apparently pretty good at staying on top of poo poo. The only things they're sharing are bits of code here and there but I didn't see any .exe prepackaged ready-to-go cheats. In fact they're pretty hostile to people asking "how do you do this?" Also the most interesting I read from one cheat developer was that apparently there are no LODs for any of the object meshes which is probably why the game is so taxing on resources.
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Apr 19, 2017 19:44
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afkmacro posted:There is a consensus among them that it's not worth their time/effort to release public cheats because battleye is apparently pretty good at staying on top of poo poo. There's no incentive to release public cheats for Battleye games when you can make custom cheats with 3 figure per month price tags for the top ARMA mods for streamers.
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Apr 19, 2017 19:46
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Did they change on the test servers how lightning in buildings work? Its really straining on the eyes now, and the loot now glowing like glowsticks is really headache inducing overlayed with the dark rooms.
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Apr 19, 2017 20:05
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Zoidomania posted:What do you guys think about adding death-markers in the game? Obviously it would make the game much easier and a lot less tense since you'll have more information about who is alive/where the people are still alive will be (which is mostly why I bring it up). However, I think it would also allow for more strategic gameplay as opposed to hoping that the path you're taking is not into someone hiding behind a tree, 3rd person peeking you. The death-markers probably wouldn't be global as I think that would way too OP, and doesn't really make sense realistically. So I was thinking there could be a set distance (vision radius for example) where if someone's corpse enters that radius, it shows up on your minimap. GL in you games, friends. I think you are supposed to watch and listen and use that information to decide which way might be clear.
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Apr 19, 2017 20:20
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afkmacro posted:Also the most interesting I read from one cheat developer was that apparently there are no LODs for any of the object meshes which is probably why the game is so taxing on resources. Kinda makes sense, though? I mean, if you can hide in a bush but be seen by someone 300m away because on their screen it's using a lower LOD mesh it kind of defeats a big part of the game.
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Apr 19, 2017 20:26
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afkmacro posted:Also the most interesting I read from one cheat developer was that apparently there are no LODs for any of the object meshes which is probably why the game is so taxing on resources. Akion posted:lower LOD mesh it kind of defeats a big part of the game. You are aware the lower LOD means lower tris amount? Which has in the end nothing to do whith how good you see someone in a bush if you do it properly.
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Apr 19, 2017 20:45
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Paradigmata posted:Not even remotly true, every object I saw so far has at least one different LOD. Also I am to 99.999% sure those LODs are not handmade but generated, which is clearly visible when you look at the house LODs and "book cases" If the bush renders differently at range wouldn't it? Like, on my screen the close up bush mesh covers me, but if you look at it from 300m away it renders not-quite-as-big or something. IDK I'm not a game designer so...
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Apr 19, 2017 20:52
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Akion posted:If the bush renders differently at range wouldn't it? You're right in that this often happens with lods but if done properly shouldn't be an issue. Doesn't mean they'd do it properly though...
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Apr 19, 2017 20:54
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Generally no, LODs don't remove parts of a model or geometry, they just reduce the level of detail. I'm sure there are exceptions but I imagine they're relatively rare or specialized. E: The real talking point is that the patch they're testing specifically works on this whole issue, and last page are some examples of the changes they've made.
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Apr 19, 2017 20:55
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Knifegrab posted:You're right in that this often happens with lods but if done properly shouldn't be an issue. Doesn't mean they'd do it properly though... I mean, to be fair early access games have way more tick marks in the "done hosed up" column than the "done right" column. I will say this game is doing a good job staying in the "done right" column so far.
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Apr 19, 2017 20:58
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Orv posted:Generally no, LODs don't remove parts of a model or geometry, they just reduce the level of detail. I'm sure there are exceptions but I imagine they're relatively rare or specialized. Actually its much more common than you think. Take trees/bushes as the perfect example, as it is present in a TON of games. You can typically witness the "pop" of tree lod. It already exists in this game in its current form. Next time you see pop note everything. A little opening between branches you could see through, can you still see through it after the pop? How is the silhoutte of the tree changed? Has it's shape morphed? Simple objects, like a car, are much easier for lod's to get right, but the more complex the shape, the more a lod has to sacrifice in accuracy to the parent detail.
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Apr 19, 2017 20:58
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Yeah you're right, I just don't think that it typically is enough of a change on the overall surface volume to get people killed in games like this, but maybe I'm just not paying enough attention. Not to mention that it's UE, which has the most wonderful legacy of pop in you could ask for.
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Apr 19, 2017 21:00
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Orv posted:Yeah you're right, I just don't think that it typically is enough of a change on the overall surface volume to get people killed in games like this, but maybe I'm just not paying enough attention. Its all a balancing act, and almost impossible to get completely perfect for things like trees. In a game where spotting is so paramount though it should be good, because being killed becase on my screen I am well within cover but on the enemies screen the billboard LOD replacement is for whatever reason not z-lifted and so I am just sitting on top of it would be really frustrating. The reverse is true as well, go with a flat canopy billboard at a distance and then I can snipe you from tree cover but you cannot locate me to return fire. Game design is hard.
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Apr 19, 2017 21:06
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Zoidomania posted:What do you guys think about adding death-markers in the game? Obviously it would make the game much easier and a lot less tense since you'll have more information about who is alive/where the people are still alive will be (which is mostly why I bring it up). However, I think it would also allow for more strategic gameplay as opposed to hoping that the path you're taking is not into someone hiding behind a tree, 3rd person peeking you. The death-markers probably wouldn't be global as I think that would way too OP, and doesn't really make sense realistically. So I was thinking there could be a set distance (vision radius for example) where if someone's corpse enters that radius, it shows up on your minimap. GL in you games, friends. I'm completely against this idea. It's already strategic enough right now by equipping a long scope and scouting out areas for broken windows and any loot boxes and just general situational awareness. I wouldn't want that to just be reduced to death markers or anything.
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Apr 19, 2017 21:26
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So, the Vector capacity is 13 rounds, 26 with an X-mag. Eeeeenteresting.
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Apr 19, 2017 21:29
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VulgarandStupid posted:So, the Vector capacity is 13 rounds, 26 with an X-mag. Eeeeenteresting. The gently caress? edit: apparently its true to life but I haven't ever seen Vector's using their stock mag in any other game. It's not like SMG extended mags in PUBG are especially uncommon either. Party Plane Jones fucked around with this message at 21:38 on Apr 19, 2017 |
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Apr 19, 2017 21:30
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taqueso posted:I think you are supposed to watch and listen and use that information to decide which way might be clear. Constellation I posted:I'm completely against this idea. It's already strategic enough right now by equipping a long scope and scouting out areas for broken windows and any loot boxes and just general situational awareness. I wouldn't want that to just be reduced to death markers or anything. Fair enough.
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Apr 19, 2017 21:32
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VulgarandStupid posted:So, the Vector capacity is 13 rounds, 26 with an X-mag. Eeeeenteresting. Yep, that's a real gun someone built. Also true to life, it basically magics your mag empty the moment you pull the trigger, so now we finally have a use for the ten trillion SMG mods and 45 ACP lying around.
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Apr 19, 2017 21:35
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The motorcycle is hilarious and thank god the capacity is 3 e- for you gearheads, I figured it would be a Ural type but it's more in the style of a modern BMW enduro
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Apr 19, 2017 21:39
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Nazzadan posted:I've had a single death I would definitely attribute to hacking, other than that just good ol' fashioned me being stupid or the game being buggy. i feel you man, first time i made it to the top 10, i died by getting ran over by my own car while hopping out. 
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Apr 19, 2017 21:43
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