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BONGHITZ posted:I have no dlcs. Does anybody know what this means?
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Apr 21, 2017 00:01
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Node posted:Does anybody know what this means? He has not bought any of the DLCs (e.g., Art of War, Mandate of Heaven, etc.) for this game.
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Apr 21, 2017 00:02
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Arrhythmia posted:He has not bought any of the DLCs (e.g., Art of War, Mandate of Heaven, etc.) for this game. Somebody's missing the Common Sense DLC.
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Apr 21, 2017 00:03
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Incomprehensible.
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Apr 21, 2017 00:03
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Arrhythmia posted:He has not bought any of the DLCs (e.g., Art of War, Mandate of Heaven, etc.) for this game. I don't think it's Monday bud
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Apr 21, 2017 00:07
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The answer to his problem is actually to buy Common Sense, because Paradox, through the patches and mechanics changes, made playing outside of Europe a miserable experience without the ability to increase development. As Kilwa, you want to conquer Mutapa, develop the gold mines, and generate institutions through development. If you're a vanilla player, then I guess you're just hosed.
Dr. Video Games 0031 fucked around with this message at 00:11 on Apr 21, 2017 |
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Apr 21, 2017 00:07
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Arrhythmia posted:He has not bought any of the DLCs (e.g., Art of War, Mandate of Heaven, etc.) for this game. ??? 
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Apr 21, 2017 00:13
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Do New World gold mines not deplete or something? I don't get the "your gold mine will have an X chance of depleting, halving production" message when I upgrade Mexico.
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Apr 21, 2017 00:17
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Node posted:??? i was kind of hoping to do the joke where someone says something ridiculous, and then someone else goes "huh? what do you mean?" and then a third person says the ridiculous thing again, but louder or with better enunciation. i guess it didn't work out this time.
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Apr 21, 2017 00:29
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Luigi Thirty posted:Do New World gold mines not deplete or something? I don't get the "your gold mine will have an X chance of depleting, halving production" message when I upgrade Mexico. Is it your province or a subject's? I definitely had that message when I did a First Come First Serve run starting in Mexico. Maybe the message doesn't appear if you're developing a subject's province? Alternatively, if you're playing a native American nation then they don't value gold until after reforming, so that could have something to do with it.
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Apr 21, 2017 00:38
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Mountaineer posted:Is it your province or a subject's? I definitely had that message when I did a First Come First Serve run starting in Mexico. Maybe the message doesn't appear if you're developing a subject's province? Alternatively, if you're playing a native American nation then they don't value gold until after reforming, so that could have something to do with it. It's my province. I don't know, maybe it's because I'm pre-reformed Nahuatl. Aztec starts with a 7 production gold province.
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Apr 21, 2017 00:40
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Luigi Thirty posted:It's my province. I don't know, maybe it's because I'm pre-reformed Nahuatl. Aztec starts with a 7 production gold province. Unreformed religions don't get the bonus income from gold provinces.
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Apr 21, 2017 00:41
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Well shows how often I play the New World
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Apr 21, 2017 00:51
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Node posted:Unreformed religions don't get the bonus income from gold provinces. Do they still have the % chance to collapse?
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Apr 21, 2017 00:52
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Dirk the Average posted:Do they still have the % chance to collapse? I don't know. I doubt it, since he didn't get the message. Can anyone please tell me how you view how many provinces you have, outside of the load menu? I forgot how.
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Apr 21, 2017 01:02
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Node posted:I don't know. I doubt it, since he didn't get the message. Ledger -> Armies -> hover over your force limit
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Apr 21, 2017 01:03
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dang, well I guess ill just have to wait for a sale or something.
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Apr 21, 2017 01:02
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Node posted:I don't know. I doubt it, since he didn't get the message. IIRC hovering over development on the economic tab.
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Apr 21, 2017 01:04
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"Show Strength" from the Humiliate Rival CB does not count towards the Humiliate Rival age goal. 
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Apr 21, 2017 02:33
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So, uh, has anyone ever had an AI Byzantines actually win against the ottomans? I've been playing a custom in the random new world, and just after I saved to go to bed I went observer and had a gander at europe and the byzantines have eaten the ottomans. Looking at their alliances tab they've got hungary and a huge muscovy as allies, which I guess might've been how it went down.
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Apr 21, 2017 02:38
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 Consulate of the Pyrenees  Bonus unaesthetic Switzersnake down through Florence into Umbria. I wonder how dumb it will look when I integrate Aragon with that wasteland in the way?
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Apr 21, 2017 03:24
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So what's the current Wallachia strategy? Ally Hungary and hope for the best?
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Apr 21, 2017 03:38
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You could probably do something similar to the 1.19 Byzantium strategy, unless they broke that in 1.20, which I doubt. Basically reroll games until Albania and Hungary ally, then after the Ottomans declare on Albania (which they should do in the first few years, if not then reroll), ally them and they should call you in. Then you + Albania + Hungary can beat up on the Ottomans. You'd probably have to be very aggressive to get enough land to separate peace your way out though- as Byzantium you can rely on Albania returning cores to you in the peace treaty, but you don't have any for that as Wallachia. Still it's probably doable.
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Apr 21, 2017 03:48
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Kind of a longshot, but does anyone know what version I should roll back to in order to play kilwa without hurting myself? I have no dlcs.
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Apr 21, 2017 04:19
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1.17 is the patch before institutions got added.
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Apr 21, 2017 04:35
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BONGHITZ posted:Kind of a longshot, but does anyone know what version I should roll back to in order to play kilwa without hurting myself? I have no dlcs. 1.00
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Apr 21, 2017 04:35
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Koramei posted:1.17 is the patch before institutions got added. With 1.17, westernization will be a much easier path to tech parity than trying to get institutions while being unable to develop. You'll still be unable to develop the numerous gold mines, but the land may be wealthy enough as is and you probably shouldn't have a problem with money as long as you stay under force limits.
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Apr 21, 2017 05:08
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Azuren posted:
 "Swiss Iberia" Called it good there. 153 provinces, Germanic cultural union, no ports ever. Last war was trying to feed Spanish Gascony to French France, who decided they didn't want it after all. France ended up an OPM in Picardy and ended up with its capital in Panama. I was trying to help them out since I felt bad for stealing, uh, France from them  We ended up allies again after a couple hundred AE.
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Apr 21, 2017 06:08
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Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:With 1.17, westernization will be a much easier path to tech parity than trying to get institutions while being unable to develop. You'll still be unable to develop the numerous gold mines, but the land may be wealthy enough as is and you probably shouldn't have a problem with money as long as you stay under force limits. Nah, institutions are still easier even if you can't develop your provinces. Remember that westernizing meant spending thousands of monarch points and 10+ years dealing with lovely events and rebels. There are lots of other ways to get institutions without developing. Kilwa doesn't start with Feudalism, but it's present in the Horn of Africa, so it spreads pretty quickly. For Colonialsim, you can try getting it to spawn in your country by sailing around the Cape and discovering South America, and if that doesn't work you can set up a colonial nation there. Global Trade, Manufactories, and Enlightenment all come from buildings, so those are easy. Renaissance and Printing Press would be the only tough ones. They do spread fairly quickly to East Africa through Venice to Crete to Alexandria, and you can expedite that process by conquering provinces along that direction.
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Apr 21, 2017 06:10
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Has anyone from Paradox mentioned anything about balancing Absolutism? It's an OK concept but due to the cap being based on your government type it's basically a huge "gently caress republics". Their penalties to maximum Absolutism makes republics absolutely poo poo as soon as the Age of Absolutism starts.
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Apr 21, 2017 08:16
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Fister Roboto posted:Nah, institutions are still easier even if you can't develop your provinces. Remember that westernizing meant spending thousands of monarch points and 10+ years dealing with lovely events and rebels. There are lots of other ways to get institutions without developing. Kilwa doesn't start with Feudalism, but it's present in the Horn of Africa, so it spreads pretty quickly. For Colonialsim, you can try getting it to spawn in your country by sailing around the Cape and discovering South America, and if that doesn't work you can set up a colonial nation there. Global Trade, Manufactories, and Enlightenment all come from buildings, so those are easy. Renaissance and Printing Press would be the only tough ones. They do spread fairly quickly to East Africa through Venice to Crete to Alexandria, and you can expedite that process by conquering provinces along that direction. So every time you play as a non-European, you have to play in the exact same way, take exploration, conquer the same provinces, and hope for good RNG on institution spawns. I dunno man, those are a lot of hoops to jump through just for tech parity, and doesn't sound very fun. The old westernization system was flawed but at least it didn't pigeonhole you so thoroughly or rely much on RNG. I think institutions with Common Sense enabled just make more sense and are a much simpler and more open ended way to interact with the system, but without common sense it's just frustrating. RabidWeasel posted:Has anyone from Paradox mentioned anything about balancing Absolutism? It's an OK concept but due to the cap being based on your government type it's basically a huge "gently caress republics". Their penalties to maximum Absolutism makes republics absolutely poo poo as soon as the Age of Absolutism starts. Someone at Paradox has a real grudge against republics. They've been getting worse and worse with every new feature added to the game. Every single penalty affects republics disproportionately strongly. Like, republican tradition is harder to get than legitimacy, yet there are quite a few penalties that have the same hit to both. I've seen some events that add a republican tradition hit without even having a legitimacy hit for monarchies. Then there's stuff like the nobles estate being disabled for republics, and this new low absolution cap. Being able to pick and grow your ruler isn't even especially good anymore now that disinheriting and abdicating are things. They really need to think about how to make republics more tantalizing because right now they just kinda suck. Dr. Video Games 0031 fucked around with this message at 08:34 on Apr 21, 2017 |
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Apr 21, 2017 08:32
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Reeman made a pretty compelling argument for Republics being on-average better than monarchies, but that was in 1.19.
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Apr 21, 2017 08:37
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Having permanent 6/6/4ish (depending on events) ruler is pretty good.
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Apr 21, 2017 08:42
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QuarkJets posted:Reeman made a pretty compelling argument for Republics being on-average better than monarchies, but that was in 1.19. I think the quality of a monarchy is essentially as high as your ability to farm prestige in your current position. Prestige's primary purpose is now for heir rerolling, and if you're able to reroll often then I don't think there's any doubt about monarchies being better. And if you're not, republics probably give you better rulers on average but I wonder how that washes out with the inability to milk the nobles for mil power and generals. The absolution cap settles the debate without question though.
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Apr 21, 2017 08:42
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Azuren posted:
French France will rise again! 
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Apr 21, 2017 08:45
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Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:I think the quality of a monarchy is essentially as high as your ability to farm prestige in your current position. Prestige's primary purpose is now for heir rerolling, and if you're able to reroll often then I don't think there's any doubt about monarchies being better. And if you're not, republics probably give you better rulers on average but I wonder how that washes out with the inability to milk the nobles for mil power and generals. If you take mil focus and always elect mil rulers as a republic you can maintain max Rep tradition and have near permanent 6/6/6 rulers and still be ahead on mil tech with a deluge of excess mil points to roll the dice on Generals.
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Apr 21, 2017 09:09
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OoohU posted:If you take mil focus and always elect mil rulers as a republic you can maintain max Rep tradition and have near permanent 6/6/6 rulers and still be ahead on mil tech with a deluge of excess mil points to roll the dice on Generals. I've never been able to pull this off. The "near-permanent" 6/6/6 rulers are only at those stats for like two out of their seven or so election cycles, if I'm lucky. And I typically end up hovering around 50 republican tradition, unable to go much higher. I don't doubt that on average you still get better stats than your average monarchy, but by how much really?
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Apr 21, 2017 09:19
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Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:I think the quality of a monarchy is essentially as high as your ability to farm prestige in your current position. Prestige's primary purpose is now for heir rerolling, and if you're able to reroll often then I don't think there's any doubt about monarchies being better. And if you're not, republics probably give you better rulers on average but I wonder how that washes out with the inability to milk the nobles for mil power and generals. You can't really guarantee that you're going to have a great ruler even if you're constantly rerolling, though. The PDF is centered on 9 stats, and while you may sometimes roll the nuts and hit a 6/6/5 heir you're also going to sometimes have to settle on an heir who may have a less-than-optimal stat total or stat allocation. The highs are high but the lows can real, real low. With the ability to reroll heirs, Reeman's analysis places the average closer to 12 when the player engages in "aggressive disinheriting" with perfect clairvoyant knowledge of when to stop rerolling (aka to avoid rolling a good-ish heir into a bad heir, or rolling right before a monarch dies). This is sort of like saying "before Rights of Man the average ruler was 3/3/3, the most optimistic result from rerolling dynasties can place the average at 4/4/4" But Rights of Man also made it so that Republics can buy Republican Tradition on the cheap, so your elected rulers are pretty much limited to their natural life span. It's not hard to wind up with old 6/6/6 rulers in a Republic, the only downside being that your "heir" is going to start off low before building up a big stat pool. Taking that into account, this places the average Republic stat allocation closer to 15, which is still higher than monarchies even with the ability to reroll. You're losing a few dozen mil points per year from having to buy RT, but your overall MP generation throughout a game will be higher in most games, and you don't have to spend Prestige (which has kind of become a nice currency to have around for various things, although rerolling heirs is definitely the most valuable option). The loss of the Nobility estate I feel is balanced by Republics not losing stability on leader death and being able to choose the stat allocation of new rulers In 1.20, Absolutism does seem like a pretty big gut punch to Republics. That's brutal
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Apr 21, 2017 09:21
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What's Hordes unit composition, once artillery is factored in? I usually go with equal inf/cav up to max combat width, but honestly can't tell what artillery I need. Is it max width minus 2-4 like for western units? Do you end up with 12/12/20 inf/cav/art? Or just a couple art to support sieges?
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Apr 21, 2017 09:56
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Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:I've never been able to pull this off. The "near-permanent" 6/6/6 rulers are only at those stats for like two out of their seven or so election cycles, if I'm lucky. And I typically end up hovering around 50 republican tradition, unable to go much higher. I don't doubt that on average you still get better stats than your average monarchy, but by how much really? You just press the button that turns mil points into republican tradition. Two presses every four years keeps RT stable, before counting any extra RT gain, RT given from events, etc.
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Apr 21, 2017 11:13
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