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BlindSite posted:Yeah most of the anger comes from the overlap between people who are on assistance who are also smokers/dopers/boozers. I mean, "why are people poor" and "why do poor people seem to make so many bad decisions" are questions with tons of research and pretty solidly founded answers that fly in the face of the gutfeels that most Americans cling to, including (especially) our most closely-held national myths like the myth of the rugged individualist or the myth of equal opportunity. MY NIGGA D-LINK posted:I will never understand how we can spend over a trillion dollars on an unwinnable perpetual war, but somehow it's bad and wrong to give single moms and and the innocent kids of addicts (if you can't somehow muster the empathy for addicts themselves) a couple hundred bucks per month for groceries. Because someone is cheating, and getting away with it, and that's unfair. It's wrong that I have to buy my own groceries with my hard-earned dollars while the government gives my taxes to some lazy shitbag cheater who just keeps making bad decisions. That's the narrative and it's an incredibly difficult perception to alter. You can't accomplish it with facts because it's not a facts-based opinion to begin with, it's a story, and the only way to counter a story is with a better story.
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Apr 27, 2017 02:07
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Like seriously you have to ask yourself how many dead kids are acceptable to have perfect compliance v. how much abuse is acceptable to have fed kids. Again, food costs nothing. It's a politics problem not an economics one. I don't care about moving zeros around an xcel spreadsheet when it comes to people starving. The levels of abuse that are acceptable at the corporate level, or on wallstreet, or in literally any other billion or trillion dollar industry absolutely dwarf the absolute worst case, fox news, grandpa fw:fw:fw: email possible. If the end game is someone getting more food for themselves or their kid than they would have without, that's fine. There's also like really wonkish economics papers where micro transactions like drug deals are actually good for the economy (look up the concept of velocity of money) and the financial return on SNAP is something ridiculous like 2 dollars for every 1 dollar of investment I mean it's loving nuts how good SNAP is. Now, as far as them buying a bunch of poo poo at the gas station, this is a three pronged issue, and all three of these things resonate with one another. 1. People don't know better. People literally have no idea how to eat healthy, what macros are, what natural food is, etc. Jamie Oliver did a documentary about food in west virgina where the kids didn't know what tomatoes were, but they knew what ketchup is. The homes didn't have refrigerators, but they had freezers because they just ate oven baked pizza. It is an education problem. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bGYs4KS_djg 2. Gas stations serve as the closest thing to grocery stories in many communities. I mentioned this earlier that you have to get good grocery stores into depressed communities, using sticks, carrots, or both. I don't give a poo poo. People eat. That is non negotiable. If you want to read more about this there's a billion articles and they're easy to find. 3. People don't have time to cook. They have to eat poo poo food like this. They're called the working poor. Again, google that term. You'll get all the information you want. Now, some people might look at what I'm saying and say "fiz is a socialist." "Fiz is a statist." "Oh, he wants to feed people? He's ultra left." But i ask you, we got kids starving. Your president just cancelled meals on wheels, a program that costs as much as one of his golf vacations. You have people dying on the street. What do you call that? You have ideological purity? Can you feed that to people? You call me a socialist because I want to feed people. What do you call yourself because you don't?
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Apr 27, 2017 02:10
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ain't nothin' wrong with socialism
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Apr 27, 2017 02:16
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Leperflesh posted:
Do you lose sleep because a drug addict isn't sleeping hungry? Do you think someone gets addicted to meth because they have a lot going on? You think they're starving on the street because they have too many good life options to choose from? Tell you what son, you don't like the FizFashizzle Feeds America Act, I understand. Costs you about 3 dollars a month in federal taxes. Hell, that's a coffee. That's almost a large Macchiato. poo poo, you could buy a cheap beer with that. I'll make an exception for you. I'll make sure you get that three dollar refund every single month. It'll come in a big bright pink envelope, so every single person knows you ain't contributing to this. And every single month, each one of those worthless people you look down your nose at, I'll make sure they get a note that you specifically didn't fund this. And I'll make sure, just so we're clear, that every person in your congressional district gets that same note. No no, I'll do it for free. You'll get your three dollars, and I'll make sure everyone knows. i have a southern accent in this timeline.
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Apr 27, 2017 02:19
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Yeah, working retail for a few years introduced me to the sheer number of people who work 3+ retail jobs for 32 hours a week at each because of how hosed it is to be poor. And that's in comparatively okay areas, let alone places outside the north east where there's less state aid available. It's a loving mess to be poor in this country.
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Apr 27, 2017 02:18
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I think it really comes down to the parents if you think about it. Yours, mine, theirs. Anyway the draft is tomorrow!
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Apr 27, 2017 02:31
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Leperflesh posted:I mean, "why are people poor" and "why do poor people seem to make so many bad decisions" are questions with tons of research and pretty solidly founded answers that fly in the face of the gutfeels that most Americans cling to, including (especially) our most closely-held national myths like the myth of the rugged individualist or the myth of equal opportunity. Thats the problem with the diffusion of innovation. It took 80 years for sailors to be regularly given limes to stave off scurvy when it was discovered. Its getting quicker but its why I dont like the current state of political discussion anywhere in the western world. We're too busy having articles shoved down our throat about what an antifa is and why caitlin jenner is a hero and that ashley judd said gently caress trump at a march or something about fake news for any information on why certain welfare programs work and how to actually make it through. Eventually people tune out and vote for the guy who says better jobs and lower taxes. The most popular news website in australia had about 10 articles on the front page today 2 about trump, 4 about reality tv, and 2 each on celebrity gossip and travel destinations. Its not a surprise to me that most people dont understand these concepts.
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Apr 27, 2017 02:41
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TeeMerk posted:I think it really comes down to the parents if you think about it. Yours, mine, theirs. Parents, schools and society at large in that order is how childrens world views are largely formed. When the first fails its really hard for the other two to make up for the first but you have to make the effort.
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Apr 27, 2017 02:41
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I always enjoyed the arguments about nature vs. nurture when it came to ethics and morality, especially when you hit the realization that a person has no control over either of them. It throws a fun wrench into the arguments.
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Apr 27, 2017 02:54
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JIZZ DENOUEMENT posted:That sucks a lot. Sorry friend. Keep us updated on invisalign, I've heard very mixed reviews. If you'd like an honest review of Invisalign my moms been an Orthodontist for 36 years and actually helped them design it from phase 2.0 to 3.0.
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Apr 27, 2017 02:54
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swickles posted:I always enjoyed the arguments about nature vs. nurture when it came to ethics and morality, especially when you hit the realization that a person has no control over either of them. It throws a fun wrench into the arguments. I tend to lean more hobbesian than noble savage that said "People can be good, they can also be cunts" is about the only rock solid foundation for the nature of human behaviour imo.
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Apr 27, 2017 03:04
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BlindSite posted:Thats the problem with the diffusion of innovation. It took 80 years for sailors to be regularly given limes to stave off scurvy when it was discovered. Actually! There's a fascinating background to this! Here, this is a longer read but well worth it: http://idlewords.com/2010/03/scott_and_scurvy.htm It's about why the Scott expedition to the South Pole in 1911 was plagued by scurvy despite it being well known that limes prevented scurvy by the mid 18th century. quote:Now, I had been taught in school that scurvy had been conquered in 1747, when the Scottish physician James Lind proved in one of the first controlled medical experiments that citrus fruits were an effective cure for the disease. From that point on, we were told, the Royal Navy had required a daily dose of lime juice to be mixed in with sailors’ grog, and scurvy ceased to be a problem on long ocean voyages. Anyway I take your point though. The diffusion of innovation requires people to accept evidence that flies in the face of their convictions, and it's even harder when the evidence is unclear. In the case of limes, it was clear the limes prevented scurvy, but nobody actually knew why. When it comes to human decision-making, scientific evidence for how we do it flies in the face of what people "know" about how they make their own decisions, and it's still not completely clear why we're so good at some kinds of reasoning and so bad at others. Our stories make it worse. We have a very ingrained and very beloved and popular idea in America in particular that freedom is vital and essential. The narrative that government is a yoke on freedom is highly successful and intuitively correct for a lot of people. It may take hundreds of years before our society evolves to the point where we can fully embrace the idea that actually no, we aren't really rational in our decision making, everyone is dependent on the society they live in for practically everything, and taking care of one another doesn't make us weak.
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Apr 27, 2017 03:07
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SNAP should only be usable on gas station hot dogs. Also they have to not have buns. Maybe a lettuce wrap is OK. We will increase e the velocity of money along with the velocity of hot dogs as our gas stations feed a hungry nation. 7/11 dogs are ok but you have to be $1.50/$1.00 for them. We're not trying to encourage some 7/11 poo poo those are all staffed by immigrants
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Apr 27, 2017 03:10
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Phobeste posted:SNAP should only be usable on gas station hot dogs. Also they have to not have buns. Maybe a lettuce wrap is OK. We will increase e the velocity of money along with the velocity of hot dogs as our gas stations feed a hungry nation. What about condiments?
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Apr 27, 2017 03:16
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TeeMerk posted:What about condiments? Like I said, no buns but maybe lettuce.
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Apr 27, 2017 03:17
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Phobeste posted:Like I said, no buns but maybe lettuce. are you familiar with condiments
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Apr 27, 2017 03:24
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stop engaging the guy who cried because you don't like jam bands
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Apr 27, 2017 03:28
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Eli Wiggum posted:stop engaging the guy who cried because you don't like jam bands but i love phish and the grateful dead
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Apr 27, 2017 03:28
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TeeMerk posted:
 Also, let's pay people a living wage. No, people lose their jobs. No, the price of things won't skyrocket. They already did this poo poo what, 10, 15 years ago? I was working a lovely mall job when the minimum wage went from 4.25 an hour to 7.25. Nobody I knew lost their jobs and prices didn't jump. Like, this is in living memory for most people. How loving stupid do we have to be to make the argument otherwise? Quiet Feet fucked around with this message at 03:31 on Apr 27, 2017 |
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Apr 27, 2017 03:28
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Spoeank posted:are you familiar with condiments Yeah sure they're the part of the sandwich that isn't the main filling, that's extraneous. I'm not saying they're bad, there's a lot of condiments I like - lettuce, tomato, ketchup, mustard, buns, relish, hell even onions if you want to get real chicago about it. Just not appropriate for SNAP funded hot dogs
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Apr 27, 2017 03:29
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A bun is not a condiment what the hell It's a key component in making a hot dog a sandwich
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Apr 27, 2017 03:30
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Well, if you break it down to the core of what a hot dog is, it's the dog. You refer to the bare dog as a hot dog, you don't refer to some chopped up beef sitting on a grill as a cheesesteak even if you've put some cheese on it already. Condiments are whatever's extraneous. Same thing goes for a hamburger, but for something like a hero or sub where the bread defines it it wouldn't.
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Apr 27, 2017 03:36
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Can you burn bread
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Apr 27, 2017 03:40
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the condiments meme
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Apr 27, 2017 03:42
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Spoeank posted:but i love phish and the grateful dead
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Apr 27, 2017 03:56
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I confused a regular band that improvs their songs with what apparently is another thing called jam bands. As far as instruments, much like Prince I play all of them. I was also a point guard in high school ama.
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Apr 27, 2017 04:12
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At this point I'm fairly positive you don't know what music is.
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Apr 27, 2017 04:14
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TeeMerk posted:I confused a regular band that improvs their songs with what apparently is another thing called jam bands. Were you as selfish as Russell Westbrook.
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Apr 27, 2017 04:14
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Touch of Gray is a great song. I've never heard anything else I like from the Dead.
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Apr 27, 2017 04:15
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i hit the logout button from inside of the reply box on here and now i'm back
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Apr 27, 2017 04:16
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No Irish Need Imply posted:At this point I'm fairly positive you don't know what music is. I'm glad the Bengals lost.
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Apr 27, 2017 04:23
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My buddy got smoked by a car after we got out of work yesterday while he was on his bicycle and now he's close to death. Cool week everybody
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Apr 27, 2017 04:25
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TeeMerk posted:I confused a regular band that improvs their songs with what apparently is another thing called jam bands. Did you and the other basketball players play music together Where you a slamma jamma band
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Apr 27, 2017 04:36
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Detroit_Dogg posted:My buddy got smoked by a car after we got out of work yesterday while he was on his bicycle and now he's close to death. Cool week everybody gently caress. Sorry man.
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Apr 27, 2017 04:38
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Kalli posted:Touch of Gray is a great song. this.
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Apr 27, 2017 04:41
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JPrime posted:this. I mean yeah anyone who grew up to classic rock or whatever knows this to be true. Maybe it's a class of 95 thing.
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Apr 27, 2017 04:49
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Detroit_Dogg posted:My buddy got smoked by a car after we got out of work yesterday while he was on his bicycle and now he's close to death. Cool week everybody 
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Apr 27, 2017 04:50
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Detroit_Dogg posted:My buddy got smoked by a car after we got out of work yesterday while he was on his bicycle and now he's close to death. Cool week everybody
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Apr 27, 2017 04:53
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bicycles are stupid. bicycle unfriendly roads are even more stupid. I'm going to track down the car that was involved in the accident and light in on fire regardless
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Apr 27, 2017 05:02
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Detroit_Dogg posted:bicycles are stupid. bicycle unfriendly roads are even more stupid. I'm going to track down the car that was involved in the accident and light in on fire regardless Wait was it a hit and run thing? Regardless I hope your buddy comes through and these dumb car/bicycle things seem to happen way too often.
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Apr 27, 2017 05:07
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