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ShootaBoy posted:Part of the reason the non lethal stuff in Dishonored 1 feels tacked on is because it totally is. That's only for the non-lethal options for the bosses.
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Apr 30, 2017 18:31
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FactsAreUseless posted:You can also kill about a quarter of the enemies and stay in low chaos, which is a lot. I recall somebody checking the numbers and if you deal with all of the primary targets non-lethally, as well as take the low chaos side mission options, you can murder a full 80% of the game and still finish in low chaos.
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Apr 30, 2017 20:46
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Whenever I get an urge to play dishonoured again I stop myself because i'll never be as good as this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vKyT19o-Nl8
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Apr 30, 2017 21:42
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Guy Mann posted:That's only for the non-lethal options for the bosses. Naw, it was definitely tacked on. You had a choke and sleep darts, both really boring and pretty unreliable. Dishonoured 2 was designed from the ground-up to accomodate both options have much more variety, and it really shows.
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Apr 30, 2017 22:22
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Still don't get why they didn't just respond "there isn't one" and move on.
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Apr 30, 2017 22:25
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RagnarokAngel posted:Its really bizzare because somehow it's become part of the cultural expectation that you offer both options and the result is the non lethal option is generally more frustrating and means I'm not using the majority of the games weapons, but I end up feel like I'm being judged by the game for not using the non lethal options. This is pretty much the issue; by having a non-lethal route you make a tacit admission that you don't have to use violence which makes players make an automatic judgement call that they shouldn't be using it, even if the game doesn't meaningfully discourage it. It also doesn't help that in many games non-lethal is often, stupendously better than lethal alternatives such as leaving no residue and being quieter than lethal options. Guy Mann posted:People complained about Mirror's Edge letting you use guns so in Mirror's Edge Catalyst they removed the option entire entirely and then people complained about that. To be fair here, I think the complaint was "guns suck to use, why are their guns here if you make them terrible" and the correct solution would have either been to integrate gunplay as another fluid, quick moving system like the platforming so it wasn't jarring or do the actual smart thing and get rid of combat all together instead of trapping you in rooms with enemies to beat up with annoying regularity. Also, that and probably a half-dozen other design decisions I wouldn't have done for a Mirror's Edge sequel.
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Apr 30, 2017 22:30
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poptart_fairy posted:Naw, it was definitely tacked on. You had a choke and sleep darts, both really boring and pretty unreliable. Dishonoured 2 was designed from the ground-up to accomodate both options have much more variety, and it really shows. I feel like lethal is lots more fun and better designed than non lethal, just like dishonored 1
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Apr 30, 2017 22:33
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Well yeah, shanking motherfuckers.
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Apr 30, 2017 22:44
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Was Metal Gear Solid 2 the first stealth game to do that? To explicitly offer nonlethal options? It made a lot of sense in that game because it was an extra challenge. The dart gun is a little worse in every way than a silenced pistol, and guys wake up from it pretty quickly, and IIRC they don't just go "that was weird" they freak out and call it in. So it emphasizes the part of the game where almost anything you do to anyone puts you on a fairly short timer before the riot squad shows up to stomp on your balls
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Apr 30, 2017 23:07
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swamp waste posted:Was Metal Gear Solid 2 the first stealth game to do that? To explicitly offer nonlethal options? It made a lot of sense in that game because it was an extra challenge. The dart gun is a little worse in every way than a silenced pistol, and guys wake up from it pretty quickly, and IIRC they don't just go "that was weird" they freak out and call it in. So it emphasizes the part of the game where almost anything you do to anyone puts you on a fairly short timer before the riot squad shows up to stomp on your balls Somewhere a Thief-fan is crying in their bed.
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Apr 30, 2017 23:10
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Yeah I never played that because it wasn't on consoles haha. Did Thief give you nonlethal ways to take guys out, or did it just not force you to kill em?
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Apr 30, 2017 23:51
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IIRC, lethal in Thief was faster and more reliable but noisier because guys screamed as they went down. Non-lethal was quieter, but slower and required you getting right up on a guy to blackjack him.
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May 1, 2017 00:03
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IIRC in Thief the nonlethal takedowns were generally a lot quieter, but guards would wake up eventually.
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May 1, 2017 00:02
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FactsAreUseless posted:You're playing Dishonored wrong. What makes Dishonored good is being seen, then trying to figure out a way to escape and re-approach the situation without having to kill a ton of people. It's a game that gives you a lot of options to keep going when things go wrong, which is the most exciting part of the game. You can also kill about a quarter of the enemies and stay in low chaos, which is a lot. Actually that's exactly what I did for my first playthrough. I loved the way I could escape from enemies with teleporting around and poo poo. It was just when I decided to do the Ghost playthrough and the game hosed me over in ways unrelated to anything I did that pissed me off.
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May 1, 2017 00:04
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swamp waste posted:Yeah I never played that because it wasn't on consoles haha. Did Thief give you nonlethal ways to take guys out, or did it just not force you to kill em? Thief had two melee weapons, the blackjack that could knock out most people if they weren't aware of you, or piddly amounts of damage if they were aware of you (so if they found someone unconscious/dead and are looking for you, you could knock them out because they don't know if you're still around. If they had seen you and were actively chasing you or "searching" for you, they would block the blackjack from the front and only take damage from behind), and the sword, which deals damage. You also had several types of arrows (regular, explosive, knockout gas, moss, water and noisemaker) for damage. The games were geared for stealth, and actively discouraged melee combat (enemies had more HP than you, and higher difficulties actually had "No killing" as an objective)... except that Thief 1 went heavy on forced melee combat later on against monsters. Thief 2 had robots instead of monsters, and was much more focused around, you know, being a thief. Plus you could "knock out" a robot by shooting it in the boiler cover with a water arrow, dousing the fire.
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May 1, 2017 00:24
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swamp waste posted:Was Metal Gear Solid 2 the first stealth game to do that? To explicitly offer nonlethal options? It made a lot of sense in that game because it was an extra challenge. The dart gun is a little worse in every way than a silenced pistol, and guys wake up from it pretty quickly, and IIRC they don't just go "that was weird" they freak out and call it in. So it emphasizes the part of the game where almost anything you do to anyone puts you on a fairly short timer before the riot squad shows up to stomp on your balls Nah, in MGS2 (and maybe all the Metal Gear games, possibly) they'l just be a little confused when they wake up and then go back on patrol, even if they saw you before you put them to sleep. Other guards who find them sleeping and wake them up don't even find it suspicious. I think they report in if you knock them out though (sleep and unconscious are two desperate, distinct states as far as the game is concerned). Personally I've found the tranq gun in the MGS games to be over-powered. It was especially powerful in MGS2 and TTS, since it came by default with a suppressor built in, it became a bit more balanced since MGS3 since suppressors wore out in later games.
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May 1, 2017 01:15
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One of these threads got me to install Binary Domain today and I discovered Steam Big Picture had PS4 controller support in it now. So I set up the controller to run and go to play and while the prompts in game give me xbox control prompts the PS4 is rigged up in the most insane way possible. The l2/r2 are camera up and down. Aim is the share button and shoot is the options button. Len has a new favorite as of 01:20 on May 1, 2017 |
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May 1, 2017 01:17
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Brazilianpeanutwar posted:Whenever I get an urge to play dishonoured again I stop myself because i'll never be as good as this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vKyT19o-Nl8 All of that guy's Dishonored videos are insane, the one I always think of is Kidnap Sokolov though.
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May 1, 2017 01:28
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I give up on Binary Domain because after loving with steam it does not want me to use the triggers to shoot.
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May 1, 2017 01:58
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Len posted:I give up on Binary Domain because after loving with steam it does not want me to use the triggers to shoot. that's what got me scratching my head too. i went with m+kb and it's been a fun ride so far. swamp waste posted:Was Metal Gear Solid 2 the first stealth game to do that? To explicitly offer nonlethal options? It made a lot of sense in that game because it was an extra challenge. The dart gun is a little worse in every way than a silenced pistol, and guys wake up from it pretty quickly, and IIRC they don't just go "that was weird" they freak out and call it in. So it emphasizes the part of the game where almost anything you do to anyone puts you on a fairly short timer before the riot squad shows up to stomp on your balls You could stash guys in lockers and I'm pretty sure it put them out indefinitely. The dart gun's effectiveness depended on locational damage. Headshots were instant knockouts and body or limb shots had delayed timers. One of the things I learned in MGSV was that headtranqing groups of guards was a bad idea because they'd immediately go into caution when one their own dropped. It was better to do bodyshots and delay their knockouts. Also, ever since MGS2 you could shoot out radios and remove a guard's ability to call for help.
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May 1, 2017 02:18
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Side note forums own Bobbin Threadbare has done all the thief games in a very good LP as well as a ~scathing~ LP of Thi4f. If you want to see how a pro does an all sneaky not killing run on the hardest difficulties Bobbin is yer man on lparchive.org
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May 1, 2017 06:18
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Yardbomb posted:All of that guy's Dishonored videos are insane, the one I always think of is Kidnap Sokolov though. Yeah they're pretty great, but then I got to the one set in the brothel where he makes a point of killing the (non-combatant) hookers and looking up their skirts. 
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May 1, 2017 11:26
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Feonir posted:Side note forums own Bobbin Threadbare has done all the thief games in a very good LP as well as a ~scathing~ LP of Thi4f. If you want to see how a pro does an all sneaky not killing run on the hardest difficulties Bobbin is yer man on lparchive.org Bobbin also does a rare thing for most LPers and shuts the gently caress up because these games are dripping with ambience and good sound design. He even keeps a calm and low voice so it isn't a major juxtaposition of LPer voice against quiet game
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May 1, 2017 12:09
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Perestroika posted:Yeah they're pretty great, but then I got to the one set in the brothel where he makes a point of killing the (non-combatant) hookers and looking up their skirts. Man, he must've got that one achievement in NIER: Automata in like three minutes.
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May 1, 2017 13:34
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Feonir posted:Did he not call Something Awful's own Dark ID a cultural ambassador to the west? I seem to recall that being a thing. In all its insane glory. I do not, do you have a link?
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May 1, 2017 15:30
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RareAcumen posted:Man, he must've got that one achievement in NIER: Automata in like three minutes. he jumped into the bathtube in Dishonored without even talking to piero
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May 1, 2017 16:36
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Moving it to an SSD reminded me why I stopped playing Planet Coaster before: the scenarios/missions I stopped at are annoying. One needs a certain amount of monthly ride income. Generally nothing shocking, except the gimmick is that you don't have a ton of rides (and no coasters, iirc), and your research is severely limited so there's only a few different rides. What better way to ruin ride income is by making your peeps bored because you only have three different rides! Another has a rather high shop income as a goal, a goal I've never been good at maximizing in RCT games. Most of the recommendations I've read for this scenario are "close the park, let it run closed for a while and reopen it.
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May 1, 2017 20:01
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Action Tortoise posted:he jumped into the bathtube in Dishonored without even talking to piero The bathtub thing is hilarious. It's the first game (that I know of) since How to be a Complete Bastard from the 1980s where you can get game over by having a bath. The irony being that the act in Dishonoured involves you being more of a bastard.
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May 1, 2017 20:14
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I finally fired up Elite: Dangerous after buying it on sale and the advanced combat tutorial is tearing me to shreds.  I just hopped into the game itself after a couple tries but goddamn, those ships tore me apart after killing the first one.
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May 1, 2017 22:00
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Bussamove posted:I finally fired up Elite: Dangerous after buying it on sale and the advanced combat tutorial is tearing me to shreds. You are very much not intended to complete the advanced combat tutorial. I don't even know why it's still on that menu, as it's one of the hardest challenges in that game.
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May 1, 2017 22:49
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DoubleNegative posted:You are very much not intended to complete the advanced combat tutorial. I don't even know why it's still on that menu, as it's one of the hardest challenges in that game. Thats good to hear. I kind of figured that was the case since you have your lovely starting ship against multiple ships with really bad weapons. Now I'm fumbling around trying to judge astrological distances and figuring out how everything works. But its fun!
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May 1, 2017 22:53
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inFamous: Second Son - the camera options are severely limited. most games will let you fine tune the sensitivity between 1 and 10 or 1 to 100. the camera here only has three speeds: slow, normal, and fast. fast never feels fast enough for my taste and when i'm trying to shoot down drones they outpace my aiming. it's weird that this is so limited when this is the only ps4 game i have that lets me choose to lock my fps to 30 or have the frame rate uncapped. - being an inFamous game, there's moral choices. the first one is pretty stupidly contrived and both sides of the conflict come off really dumb. since the main character is an annoying twentysomething, that makes sense. the other side is so mustache-twirling evil it hurts. i know i said before that morality games have to lean all the way in with evil characters to make it obvious to even the most clueless of people, but come oooooon.
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May 2, 2017 01:28
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Action Tortoise posted:inFamous: Second Son Having played it through both ways it's very much comic book morality, so it tends to be pretty drastic one way or the other. It's impressive how they manage to make the story work even when Delsyn's a total shitbird though.
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May 2, 2017 01:55
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I'm glad I'm not the only one futzing around with stealth in Dishonored 2. I try to sneak but generally I end up being spotted and knocking guys out when they come to investigate, then pretend I meant to rope-a-dope all along. I can't really put my finger on it, but I find Dishonored 2's levels just a bit of a pain to get around, where rooms you want to get to and stuff like that is just ever-so-conveniently barred by bloodfly hives, debris and barred windows.
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May 2, 2017 13:51
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It's better if people just realize dishonored 2 is not as good as dishonored 1
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May 2, 2017 15:15
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MisterBibs posted:Moving it to an SSD reminded me why I stopped playing Planet Coaster before: the scenarios/missions I stopped at are annoying. What pisses me off about Planet Coaster the most is the sheer lack of Ground Rides and ultimately the lack of variety. That's a good chunk of why the scenarios suck. There's less stuff in there there Roller Coaster Tycoon 3 base game, a game the same devs made 12 years ago. I throw up a guess to say there's less than half the ride content of RCT3. They only just patched in Go-Karts.
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May 2, 2017 15:47
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oldpainless posted:It's better if people just realize dishonored 2 is not as good as dishonored 1 Copy the slide knockout and some other powers from 2 into a re-release of 1. Better yet remake dark messiah. Get rid of that stupid loving morality system and letme subzero orcs off a massive cliff face again. Feonir has a new favorite as of 15:57 on May 2, 2017 |
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May 2, 2017 15:55
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I've been replaying Deus Ex Human Revolution and it annoys me to no end how the game rewards stealth gameplay much more than non-stealth gameplay. Both gameplay styles are viable, but: if I take down NPCs non-lethally I get experience for the takedown and for being non-lethal and for doing it without them noticing, and if I get through an area without being spotted I get extra experience for doing so. If however I want to go in guns blazing I get experience for taking down the NPCs and maybe for them not noticing me for the first enemy, but I can forget the extra non-lethal experience and stealth experience and ghost experience. As a result a stealth character levels up much more quickly than a non-stealth character.
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May 2, 2017 16:01
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Mikl posted:I've been replaying Deus Ex Human Revolution and it annoys me to no end how the game rewards stealth gameplay much more than non-stealth gameplay. I swear that if you stun them then alert someone, their buddy can wake them up and you can kill them again for more XP?
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May 2, 2017 16:34
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Mikl posted:I've been replaying Deus Ex Human Revolution and it annoys me to no end how the game rewards stealth gameplay much more than non-stealth gameplay.
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May 2, 2017 16:43
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