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Julio Cruz posted:I instinctively dislike any film which has a character fight themselves/their twin/their clone/etc etc But Citadel was the best Mass Effect?  e: new page steal like I'm the Blade Runner trailer
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May 14, 2017 23:38
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because i come from the land down under where women glow and men plunder, i saw this on the weekend. really enjoyable, and visually a treat like prometheus. i'd say i enjoyed it about the same amount - the pacing is really weird, same as that film, and there's a cast of relatively under-developed characters, same as that film. covenant definitely benefits from prometheus' tone, though - it feels like less of a stylistic mash and more consistent throughout. to the guy who asked if there were Giger originals in David's lair: some of them are very similar. none of the bug sketches are Gigers (as far as i know,) but the sketchbook showing Shaw's experimentation looks to be slightly-edited versions of Giger works. Ridley also presents Shaw's corpse as the famous Giger ladyface - i don't know the actual title, although I'm sure Xenomrph will. okay here are things i liked: Oram is definitely an idiot, and a bad leader, but i feel like billy crudup's performance was so good that i wanted him to live despite that. from the start you know he's a bad leader - weylandco didn't see fit to put him as the captain because apparently they thought he was too close to a "fanatic" or an "extremist". even then, really the only outright stupid decision he makes is trusting david and looking into the egg. everything else seems pretty understandable: he's not the only one that wants to go visit the mysterious planet (in fact, daniels is the only one who visibly doesn't), he wants the crew to fix the ship before they do anything funeral related (which is sensible enough, but his delivery is woeful - when he's cross that they disregard him, he's not cross that they are having the funeral, but that they disobeyed him when he is so desperate for their attention.) anyways, his character was the only human one that didn't seem underdeveloped. Daniels is smart, Tennesee is a competent and cool risk-taker, Lope is a gay man with a goatee and an accent? but they don't really have much else going on. to me, it's fitting that Oram got the honor of playing host to David's ultimate triumph. on David: the Fassbender on Fassbender scenes were divisive even in the small group of friends i was with - afterwards it was those brief minutes that got the most discussion. i personally loved it and could watch a film in which Fassbender plays every character. there's a lot to think about and unpack, and i've been thinking about how David's expressions of love are all warped and wrong. the kiss David gives Walter is as close as he gets to traditionally romantic, but even then it's really odd and strange. David also tries to kiss Daniels at one point, and then pins her down, in the films rape-iest moment - says "this is how it is meant to go, right?" or something to that effect. his obsession with creation, and reproduction as an expression of creation, is really interesting. but his arch-villain statements are fantastic as well: "that's the spirit!" made me laugh out loud. also, when Oram shoots the neomorph, David's face transforms from being stoic into total anger and heartbreak. basically, i loved Fassbender in this from start to finish. the monsters were really good; i wish we saw more neomorphs being weirdos and chasing folks around. the one staring at Rosenthal when she's drinking at the pool was terrifically creepy. also "walking on two legs" xeno will always be way cooler than "running on all fours" xeno to me. this is definitely the most violent alien film, even after the abortion sequence in prometheus - the neomorph birthing sequences are the most visceral sci-fi violence in years. i also loved briefly seeing Shaw transformed into the famous Giger ladyface painting. i absolutely loved the ending too; bleakest horror film ending since The Mist. things i didn't like: the pacing is loving all over the place. at one point they say it'll take about seven weeks to fly to the planet, and them boom! with a smash cut, we are there immediately. even having a fade to black over the spaceship flying through space towards a distant speck would have communicated time passing better. so yeah, the time transpiring between cuts and shots is really uneven and hard to pinpoint. the trek up to the abandoned Engineer spaceship (and back to the lander again) felt pretty condensed, even if we did get a really cool Aguirre-esque mountain traversing shot. it feels often like we are being dropped into the middle of scenes, especially in the middle sequence in the engineer palace, and once they're back on the Covenant in space. also, don't use contemporary pop music Ridley!! the music in the shower scene near the end was really jarring and felt at-odds with the tone set by the film up to that point. Shaw distortedly singing John Denver was fine, but the contemporary sex music over the radio gives the impression of a specific "period" that the movie applies to, and i don't like that. ugh, i am explaining that badly but i can't think of another way to say it. the first alien film feels timeless because it doesn't have any of that nonsense in it. David being obsessed with older things, like Lawrence of Arabia and Wagner, feels entirely in keeping with the cultural snobbiness you would assume Weyland instilled in him. Ripley singing "you are my lucky star" in her terrified voice is also cool, but it would have been undermined if you had Parker or Lambert saying "hey yeah i recognise that song, it's from Broadway Melody". there's a point of confusion for me: how did the second xeno get onto the ship at the end? did the facehugger actually manage to impregnate Lope, and it was birthed out of him? his chest looked exploded but i didn't catch the shot long enough to be sure. again, the amount of time between things happening is all over the place. having some clearer edits and transition shots would have helped tremendously in this regard, i think. overall i think it's as weird a film as Prometheus, but does a better job of joining that film's heady pretensions with Alien's cosmic horror. i'm still thinking about parts of it days after seeing it, so that's good, right? i suspect it'll be similar to Prometheus to me in that if i catch even a few seconds of it on telly, I'll end up watching the whole thing. it's just so odd and visually appealing.
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May 14, 2017 23:43
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Paragon8 posted:I enjoyed it. Thats good. The production values and the visuals are the main reason I liked Prometheus
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May 14, 2017 23:51
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Xenomrph posted:If tie-in merchandise is your thing, we're getting an Alien Covenant prequel novel that's likely going to be about what Shaw and David did for 10 years. Wait. We are? Got a link? What's it called?
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May 15, 2017 02:22
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LionArcher posted:Wait. We are? Got a link? What's it called? SHAW AND THE HEAD: JOURNEY THROUGH TIME
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May 15, 2017 02:29
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Paragon8 posted:Katherine Waterston's haircut was real weird. It was inspired by Ezra Miller in Fantastic Beasts. 
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May 15, 2017 02:48
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Okay, so question for the thread: A friend and I are going to do a marathon of the series before seeing Covenant. She's only seen bits of 1, 4, and Prometheus and I've only seen 1, 2, and Prometheus. Now I know the theatrical versions of Alien/Aliens are the way to go, but since every single one of these god drat films has 2 cuts I was wondering if there's any consensus on the best versions of the others for a first-time viewing. (And yes this includes the AvP films.)
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May 15, 2017 03:30
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Theatrical is the best way to go. However, if you want, make a quick stop at the deleted scenes to check out Ripley finding out her daughter died in Aliens, and the Egg Morph scene from Alien. Everything else doesn't add much.
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May 15, 2017 03:51
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Nroo posted:Okay, so question for the thread: Personally I actually prefer the special editions of the first two. Most people like the special edition of Alien 3 better (see the thread title). Special edition of Resurrection has a really terrible new intro. Prometheus only has one cut, unless you include fan edits (don't).
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May 15, 2017 03:56
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Nroo posted:Okay, so question for the thread: theatrical cut of Alien and Aliens assembly editition / fake director's cut of Alien 3 the version of Alien Ressurection where you just don't watch it
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May 15, 2017 04:10
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I would skip right from the assembly cut of Alien 3 to AVP:R and then onto Prometheus.
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May 15, 2017 04:22
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Must have been nice to see Aliens in the theater, not some VHS copy of a blockbuster VHS.
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May 15, 2017 04:25
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Go from Alien to Prometheus, ignore all else.
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May 15, 2017 04:27
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We watch really bad films all the time so we're not skipping poo poo. We're going the full completionist route. Just want to know the best versions of each, with "best" being extremely relative.
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May 15, 2017 04:36
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Extended AvP has some sorta interesting moments. Extended AvP-R sucks poo poo mostly because it ruins the best scene in the film, where the girl gets pinned to the wall by a flying shuriken, by making her lower half slide off, and adding guts and poo poo coming out. It's too much for that scene.
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May 15, 2017 04:43
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Groovelord Neato posted:last of us hosed em tho it would've been a lot scarier if people just climbed on roofs and poo poo and died instead of turning into another form of generic zombie. That was the plot of a story in Kurosagi Corpse Delivery Service. Just bodies with their eyes pecked out mysteriously turning up in high places, with their souls only able to explain they wanted to be birds. So, it's like regular horrifying parasites, but they get to your soul, too. Just another day in Shinjuku.
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May 15, 2017 04:52
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Nroo posted:We watch really bad films all the time so we're not skipping poo poo. We're going the full completionist route. I know people already said this but just to keep it in one place: Alien -theatrical Aliens -theatrical (I personally prefer the extended version but the theatrical one is tigher overall) Alien 3 -Assembly Cut Alien Resurrection -theatrical Prometheus -There's only one version so that's easy.  Something funny about Alien and Aliens is that if you got the Quadrilogy DVD set (or the Anthology blu-ray set), there's a bit before each where Scott and Cameron talk a bit about the flick you're about to watch. And it's funny because if you read between the lines they're both basically like "Yeah I pretty much created the perfect movie but the marketing people wanted a 'director's cut' of each flick so here's the movie with some poo poo I threw out." That said, the director's cut of Alien and the extended version of Aliens are absolutely loving awesome, but the theatrical versions of each are a bit tighter. Alien 3 though is like night and day, the Assembly Cut is very very good while the theatrical version could be any very generic slasher movie of the early 90s. The dramatic heart of the film is almost completely removed and it ends up feeling cynical and half-baked. Neo Rasa fucked around with this message at 04:59 on May 15, 2017 |
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May 15, 2017 04:55
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CelticPredator posted:Extended AvP has some sorta interesting moments. Extended AvP-R sucks poo poo mostly because it ruins the best scene in the film, where the girl gets pinned to the wall by a flying shuriken, by making her lower half slide off, and adding guts and poo poo coming out. Neo Rasa posted:Alien 3 though is like night and day, the Assembly Cut is very very good while the theatrical version could be any very generic slasher movie of the early 90s. The dramatic heart of the film is almost completely removed and it ends up feeling cynical and half-baked. This is the kind of info I was looking for, thanks.
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May 15, 2017 05:03
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The creature effects in AvP-R are so bad. Everything looks like wet rubber.
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May 15, 2017 05:36
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CelticPredator posted:The creature effects in AvP-R are so bad. Everything looks like wet rubber. the whole movie is so dim and dark and stupid. very frustrating
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May 15, 2017 05:50
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I love ADI but they really poo poo the bed with their Predators. I'm not too excited for them returning for The Predator, but maybe an actually good filmmaker can get something neat out of them.
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May 15, 2017 05:53
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Are there Alien Anthology levels of quality remasters of the non-extended cuts of the first two films? I kind of consider those two the definitive versions because the 1080p remasters looks stupendously good.
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May 15, 2017 06:50
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LionArcher posted:Wait. We are? Got a link? What's it called? It doesn't have a title yet, but it's coming out in September and it's got an Amazon product page: Alien: Covenant 2 - The Official Prequel to the Blockbuster Film https://www.amazon.com/dp/1785654764/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_0vugzbWC9G0HA We really know nothing about it other than that it's coming and who's writing it. Neo Rasa posted:Something funny about Alien and Aliens is that if you got the Quadrilogy DVD set (or the Anthology blu-ray set), there's a bit before each where Scott and Cameron talk a bit about the flick you're about to watch. And it's funny because if you read between the lines they're both basically like "Yeah I pretty much created the perfect movie but the marketing people wanted a 'director's cut' of each flick so here's the movie with some poo poo I threw out." To throw my two cents in, my "preferred" versions of 'Alien' and 'Alien3' would be a mix of the two edits, but if I had to pick from the official releases... Alien - theatrical Aliens - special edition Alien3 - assembly cut Alien Resurrection- director's cut AvP - unrated AvPR - unrated
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May 15, 2017 07:16
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TheCoach posted:Are there Alien Anthology levels of quality remasters of the non-extended cuts of the first two films? I kind of consider those two the definitive versions because the 1080p remasters looks stupendously good. The Blu rays come with both cuts. And they both look incredible.
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May 15, 2017 07:27
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Xenomrph posted:I'm pretty sure you're mis-remembering about Cameron and 'Aliens', he's said the special edition version is his preferred version of the movie and that the theatrical cut is the way it is because the studio was apprehensive about the movie's runtime and made Cameron trim it down. The Aliens special edition has been around for a long time, it originally came out on Laserdisc. I know, I first saw it via someone making a VHS copy of it off their laserdisc very soon after it was released, but I probably am conflating what Cameron said with the regular unjustified hate the extended version gets in this thread.
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May 15, 2017 07:50
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Xenomrph posted:Alien - theatrical The complete chronological story. Predator Predator 2 AvP - unrated AvPR - unrated Predators Prometheus Alien - theatrical Aliens - special edition Alien3 - assembly cut Alien Resurrection- director's cut
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May 15, 2017 08:33
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Tenzarin posted:The complete chronological story. The idea that became Predator started life as a joke sequel to Rocky IV. "We've had Rocky fight everything else. Why not an alien next?"
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May 15, 2017 08:56
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Donnerberg posted:I fixed your post. Add in the Saw Movies also, because after his duel with the predator, Danny Glover tried to stop Saw.
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May 15, 2017 08:57
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Oh wow they didnt even film AVPR in Colorado those jerks
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May 15, 2017 09:11
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So if mankind made the aliens through an Android proxy in the far future, does that make the avp films non canonical?
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May 15, 2017 09:15
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Breetai posted:So if mankind made the aliens through an Android proxy in the far future, does that make the avp films non canonical? i think ridley is pretty content to urinate on whatever fan canons are going on, including those by other filmmakers
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May 15, 2017 09:17
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alf_pogs posted:i think ridley is pretty content to urinate on whatever fan canons are going on, including those by other filmmakers And rightly so because both avp films are garbage fires.
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May 15, 2017 09:19
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Breetai posted:So if mankind made the aliens through an Android proxy in the far future, does that make the avp films non canonical? I dunno. Predator 2 would also be "non-canonical", which is fair enough. But if David made the first Xenomorph (or Protomorph, whatever), then what's going on with that mural in Prometheus? Seems like xenos have been a known byproduct of the black goo for a while and David is just re-discovering it, or at least attempting to improve on those methods. TBH, I can't help but feel everything would be simpler without that bloody mural.
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May 15, 2017 09:42
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Why did David decide to black-goo bomb an entire planet and what was it that caused Daniels to figure out it wasn't the right robot on board?
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May 15, 2017 10:03
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well why not posted:Why did David decide to black-goo bomb an entire planet and what was it that caused Daniels to figure out it wasn't the right robot on board? 1. David wanted to kill those who created humanity which had in turn created him. He also wanted to see what would happen when their creation was turned back on them. 2. She mentioned the house by the lake, a conversation she had with Walter, but he didn't remember it so she figured it wasn't Walter.
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May 15, 2017 10:10
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Plavski posted:I dunno. Predator 2 would also be "non-canonical", which is fair enough. But if David made the first Xenomorph (or Protomorph, whatever), then what's going on with that mural in Prometheus? Seems like xenos have been a known byproduct of the black goo for a while and David is just re-discovering it, or at least attempting to improve on those methods. TBH, I can't help but feel everything would be simpler without that bloody mural. David doesn't so much invent xenomorphs as he breads them to get the exact traits he considers perfect. Sort of like what humanity did with dogs but with greater precision.
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May 15, 2017 10:24
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The MSJ posted:It was inspired by Ezra Miller in Fantastic Beasts. Kind of amused by the amount of Fantastic Beasts actor crossover in this. Also seeing one of the actors from La La Land threw me a little. I almost want to give credit to Scott for trying to have a non-sexualised lead female character in his rape monster film, but it seems undercut by throwing in a shower scene. Seeing Scott diverge so much from "canon" really emphasises the impact of Cameron on the franchise. It'll be interesting to see if Scott addresses things like having a Queen or having a hive going forward. If the next Alien isn't set in a creepy hive-ified Covenant centred around Daniels and Tennessee waking up or having some salvage team discover it they'll be missing a major trick but that'd draw heavily from Cameron's vision
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May 15, 2017 10:45
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Australian here, have also watched. Main impression; if your big criticism of Prometheus was that the "characters made dumb decisions", you are going to hate this movie. Many of the characters in this movie are effectively camp counselors in a Friday the 13th movie. In many ways, this is the movie people who didn't like Prometheus thought Prometheus was, even though it wasn't. This movie is enjoyable, handsomely crafted shlock. It is an extremely campy, Gothic horror movie. Prometheus was littered with dark humour as well, but it was played far more straight-faced than anything in Covenant is, which is far more on the nose. Prometheus aimed to be (and in my view, was) a modern classic that stands on its own as a dark science fiction experience. Covenant is not that, but it is also very, very obviously not trying to be. It is a gory flick that bridges the narratives of the original Alien and Prometheus, but does not succeed or even attempt to be as iconic a standalone film as either of those films do or were. Some standout moments for me in this film were the "backburster" and the scene with Amy Seimetz in the immediate aftermath or that, and the litter of Engineer corpses frozen like Pompeii. At the same time, I don't think either of those scenes match say Elizabeth's self surgery in Prometheus or the exploration of the caves and the Engineer smacking the gently caress out of Weyland and David as moments of shock and wonder. I actually do recommend watching the "Last Supper" and "The Crossing" prologues before seeing the movie, as they add a lot (and I also understand how keeping them in the movie would have killed the pacing), although 'The Crossing' may be a little spoilery in terms of how closely this film is connected to Prometheus whereas Last Supper is 100% safe to watch. I also really don't recommend watching any trailers before seeing this, but hey you probably have already. BOAT SHOWBOAT fucked around with this message at 11:15 on May 15, 2017 |
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May 15, 2017 11:09
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well why not posted:Why did David decide to black-goo bomb an entire planet and what was it that caused Daniels to figure out it wasn't the right robot on board? She mentions the lake cabin she wanted to build upon arrival and he doesnt know what the gently caress. Yes they've spent several hours - maybe days actually - together after they got back to the ship, and she figures it out only after trapping herself in a stasis chamber because of a bullshit talking point. No character in covenant feels real enough that I even thought they were dumb, I was always thinking about the script and how uninspired and lazy it was. Characters are just motivated by the next plot beat. Of course that's not Covenant's biggest offense, which in my mind is the whole sellout thing. Alien is a scifi movie about blue-collar space truckers that get killed by a monstruous organic entity, with disturbing body horror/birth/rape themes sold by amazing creature design perfectly. Covenant... is not that. It's talking points about deism and creation might not be SO lazy, but the ways it ties in to Alien certainly are. (spoilers about themes in Covenant, no plot points) Here creation goes hand in hand with death, which is cool, and it's represented by... black goo. Like ink you know, as in, a writer uses ink on paper. To create. Create a story about death. Aliens sure like to kill people. Ink creates Aliens on paper, but also in the movie. Also black ink can turn into giant gently caress-you-plague-clouds that wipe out all engineers so that's that. So ink can kill even gods, on paper as I create my story. But also in the movie. That's deep. Except it's not deep, it's lazy as poo poo, and thematically has nothing to do Alien. In a scifi series about gods, creation and death, the Xenomorphs are tacked in just to cash in on the franchise. Consider how Scott prefers to talk about engineers in Prometheus, or his droids Walter and David in Covenant. Prometheus and Covenant explore themes that could have done without the Xenomorphs entirely, except Scott would have had to have an actual scifi movie script to back that poo poo up.
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May 15, 2017 11:26
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The MSJ posted:It was inspired by Ezra Miller in Fantastic Beasts. I saw that movie in Paris and the person right next to me kept saying to her friend, "I think that's Jimmy Fallon!" Over and over and over again. She was really excited, too.
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May 15, 2017 12:11
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