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the best job guarantee program is compulsory military service
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# ? May 12, 2017 16:56 |
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# ? May 13, 2024 08:19 |
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H.P. Hovercraft posted:the best job guarantee program is compulsory military service double as good if they let you keep your assault rifle after the end of your tour because what we need in this country is more guns
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# ? May 12, 2017 17:06 |
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whomupclicklike posted:gently caress this "Protestant work ethic" horseshit I am Catholic and I am going to spend my day lighting really tall candles and eating wafers and I WILL be compensated Lol hell yeah
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# ? May 12, 2017 17:07 |
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H.P. Hovercraft posted:the best job guarantee program is compulsory military service I know a few basket cases who ended up pretty cool after the military forced them to socialize so yeah I agree
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# ? May 13, 2017 03:45 |
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Larry Parrish posted:I know a few basket cases who ended up pretty cool after the military forced them to socialize so yeah I agree eh for every one of those there's three who became authoritarian shitheads post service.
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# ? May 13, 2017 04:12 |
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the only argument against ubi that has any traction is that bundling a patchwork quilt of social programs into one makes it easier to cut but the benefits outweigh the drawbacks imo
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# ? May 13, 2017 04:21 |
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Agnostalgia posted:eh for every one of those there's three who became authoritarian shitheads post service. Socialization is a dangerous thing. Cant run with a bad crowd if you never run with a crowd.
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# ? May 13, 2017 04:24 |
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GlyphGryph posted:Socialization is a dangerous thing. i agree, we need more unabombers
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# ? May 13, 2017 06:22 |
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Agnostalgia posted:eh for every one of those there's three who became authoritarian shitheads post service. They were probably authoritarian shitheads going in though. Everyone I knew came out of the Navy with less respect for authority and regulations because it was readily apparent how uninformed the people who were supposed to be in charge were and how restrictive the regulations were because they had to account for idiots. It was also an introduction to favoritism, cliques, and promotion through attrition rather than merit that shook a lot of my coworkers. Then again, I was a technician. Maybe its different if you were in a position to get shot at and/or shoot someone.
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# ? May 13, 2017 06:24 |
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lmao why the gently caress would you pay someone to do work that might not even be needed instead of just giving them the money at that point. like automation and technology have already reduced the amount of generalized "work" that needs to be done to keep society operating normally and this will only continue in the future. we don't need to pay people to dig holes and fill them back up for 8 hours a day, just give them the loving money and let them live a modest yet liberated life. also, kill the rich.
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# ? May 13, 2017 06:50 |
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Why not... both?
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# ? May 13, 2017 06:58 |
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# ? May 13, 2017 09:08 |
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Streak posted:lmao why the gently caress would you pay someone to do work that might not even be needed instead of just giving them the money at that point. like automation and technology have already reduced the amount of generalized "work" that needs to be done to keep society operating normally and this will only continue in the future. we don't need to pay people to dig holes and fill them back up for 8 hours a day, just give them the loving money and let them live a modest yet liberated life. There was a lot of stuff in my military job that pretty much existed just to keep me busy which was a real pain in the rear end
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# ? May 13, 2017 09:56 |
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Larry Parrish posted:There was a lot of stuff in my military job that pretty much existed just to keep me busy which was a real pain in the rear end that was for exercise, so you stayed fit at all times in case of sudden war what op is describing is something far, far, more ludicrous, and lacking in basic reason so it will happen in this timeline without a doubt
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# ? May 13, 2017 10:00 |
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R. Guyovich posted:the only argument against ubi that has any traction is that bundling a patchwork quilt of social programs into one makes it easier to cut but the benefits outweigh the drawbacks imo On a similar note I figured the bundling could appeal to small government doofuses
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# ? May 13, 2017 14:35 |
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got any sevens posted:i agree, we need more unabombers unabomber made the mistake of socializing with government agents that got him into drugs but didnt tell him about it. Talk about falling in with a bad crowd!
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# ? May 13, 2017 19:22 |
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R. Guyovich posted:the only argument against ubi that has any traction is that bundling a patchwork quilt of social programs into one makes it easier to cut but the benefits outweigh the drawbacks imo lol there is basically no precedent for social support programs ever going away and the one currently on the chopping block right now does not affect the entirety of the professional class and the specter of its removal is making people threaten riots and get thrown out of townhalls for getting aggressive with representatives globally the only reason a large scale social welfare project has ever been removed is because the government collapses/goes bankrupt because of it (see: greece, any communist bloc country) all data suggests that trying to revoke basic income or even reduce it in any significant way after it's been the law of the land for ~5 years would probably result in the ringleader getting literally murdered. it would have to bring the entire government down.
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# ? May 13, 2017 19:29 |
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encouraging folks to ride the rly aint cool lins
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# ? May 13, 2017 20:24 |
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R. Guyovich posted:the only argument against ubi that has any traction is that bundling a patchwork quilt of social programs into one makes it easier to cut but the benefits outweigh the drawbacks imo Says who? If everyone gets it everyone will get mad if they try to cut?
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# ? May 13, 2017 20:50 |
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Lawman 0 posted:Says who? If everyone gets it everyone will get mad if they try to cut? It would get stuck forever at the "we should means test it" step like Social Security (which is similar to UBI).
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# ? May 15, 2017 10:59 |
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R. Guyovich posted:the only argument against ubi that has any traction is that bundling a patchwork quilt of social programs into one makes it easier to cut but the benefits outweigh the drawbacks imo UBI is good in the short term but it's just a stop gap solution. If nothing is done to address the massive wealth and power disparity then it will continue to degenerate into a neo feudal society. you get a massive underclass of vunerable serfs that will be permanently at the mercy of the small class of elites who own everything Digiwizzard has issued a correction as of 13:39 on May 15, 2017 |
# ? May 15, 2017 13:37 |
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Hodgepodge posted:It would get stuck forever at the "we should means test it" step like Social Security (which is similar to UBI). Yeah, anyone supporting means testing would be denied ubi until their execution.
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# ? May 15, 2017 13:47 |
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Digiwizzard posted:UBI is good in the short term but it's just a stop gap solution. If nothing is done to address the massive wealth and power disparity then it will continue to degenerate into a neo feudal society. you get a massive underclass of vunerable serfs that will be permanently at the mercy of the small class of elites who own everything That's what taxes and hobbling are for.
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# ? May 15, 2017 13:49 |
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Digiwizzard posted:UBI is good in the short term but it's just a stop gap solution. If nothing is done to address the massive wealth and power disparity then it will continue to degenerate into a neo feudal society. you get a massive underclass of vunerable serfs that will be permanently at the mercy of the small class of elites who own everything UBI does actually address the massive wealth and power disparity. Various particular implementations may not address it enough, but it does address it.
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# ? May 15, 2017 15:49 |
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most economists do not support a UBI that would replace social security payments completely so maybe people itt should stop saying how that particular form of UBI is super good
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# ? May 15, 2017 15:59 |
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Why do they say that goon sir
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# ? May 15, 2017 20:27 |
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Lawman 0 posted:Says who? If everyone gets it everyone will get mad if they try to cut? i didn't say it was a particularly good argument, it's just the only one not coming from a place of "gently caress the poor forever and ever amen"
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# ? May 16, 2017 03:00 |
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UBI is better because it reduces the supply of labor by freeing the wage slaves and therefore it raises wages. Job guarantee just caps unemployment at around 4%. Job guarantee is less vulnerable to racist demagoguery, though.
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# ? May 16, 2017 07:34 |
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mrbradlymrmartin posted:encouraging folks to ride the rly aint cool lins only a thin patina of ice cold fear has kept me from it, unironically i think of my family, and then i resist pullin the trigga, but for those who don't have that... i am definitely no betta than them, and it chills me to my core if i have the sweats, and shakes around you, lock the do and throw away the key, because that means my addictive personality has found yet another thing to help it forget it's inadequacies
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# ? May 16, 2017 08:30 |
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why for it has to be one or the other and not both? poo poo ain't hard you get some income erry month if you want more get a job, if the markets poo poo sign up for a 6 month hitch with the NuWPA or whatever
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# ? May 16, 2017 19:52 |
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what if they just killed all the unemployed people with the grey death?
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# ? May 17, 2017 03:04 |
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Lamebot posted:what if they just killed all the unemployed people with the grey death?
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# ? May 17, 2017 03:10 |
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Lamebot posted:what if they just killed all the unemployed people with the grey death? Why contain it? S'cool
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# ? May 17, 2017 17:07 |
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SHY NUDIST GRRL posted:Why do they say that goon sir The cost of living for anyone anywhere can vary massively from person to person and place to place based on their social and individual circumstances. Does this singular payment aim to provide for a single disabled person raising children in an urban setting or a single person in a rural community (to take two examples)? To say there's one sum paid to everyone which is designed to cover their actual living costs is to either give some far above or far below their actual needs, while having additional programs to offer disability allowance, child allowances, urban top ups or whatever else can be measured and quantified is likely to arrive at an array of programs and payments which will get much closer to giving people what they need. While the act of qualifying for anything will always anger some it's easier and better to justify these additional payments point by point rather than have the whole program be under attack by rightwingers complaining about young and single people wasting their cut or subjecting the most put upon in society to the humiliation of real poverty under a system when there's meant to be a simple solution to it, meaning many will simply ignore them or blame them for wasting what they do get.
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# ? May 21, 2017 15:57 |
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Agnostalgia posted:eh for every one of those there's three who became authoritarian shitheads post service. Yeah I had a lot of friends or acquaintances who went into the military and there were only two who weren't affected mentally in a bad way. One was affected physically instead, and the other had already been insane since he was a kid.
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# ? May 21, 2017 16:44 |
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namesake posted:The cost of living for anyone anywhere can vary massively from person to person and place to place based on their social and individual circumstances. Does this singular payment aim to provide for a single disabled person raising children in an urban setting or a single person in a rural community (to take two examples)? To say there's one sum paid to everyone which is designed to cover their actual living costs is to either give some far above or far below their actual needs, while having additional programs to offer disability allowance, child allowances, urban top ups or whatever else can be measured and quantified is likely to arrive at an array of programs and payments which will get much closer to giving people what they need. While the act of qualifying for anything will always anger some it's easier and better to justify these additional payments point by point rather than have the whole program be under attack by rightwingers complaining about young and single people wasting their cut or subjecting the most put upon in society to the humiliation of real poverty under a system when there's meant to be a simple solution to it, meaning many will simply ignore them or blame them for wasting what they do get. The kids would probably get a UBI, too. UBI will probably cause population redistribution, as you may not need to live in a city to get a job. Cash flow increase in rural areas would likely boost the local economies and make job opportunities there as well. There should also be affordable housing initiatives to ensure accessibility to those only earning UBI.
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# ? May 21, 2017 23:24 |
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ubi is starting to sound a lot like communism - idyllic, won't actually work out as planned, and probably unworkable
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# ? May 21, 2017 23:27 |
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Where did the communism touch you?
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# ? May 21, 2017 23:29 |
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Fansy posted:So we'll have robots making public art, taking care of disadvantaged kids, socializing with residents at nursing homes japans already doing that `
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# ? May 21, 2017 23:32 |
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# ? May 13, 2024 08:19 |
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Bulgogi Hoagie posted:ubi is starting to sound a lot like communism - idyllic, won't actually work out as planned, and probably unworkable You thought that about it from the beginning.
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# ? May 21, 2017 23:32 |