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Scalding Coffee posted:It looks like the classes get one or two more slots for attacks. Air Raiders will hopefully strap enough turrets on their mechs that it looks like a minute long alpha strike and kill itself when swarmed. Yeah. It's nice that Ranger is apparently getting a limited selection airdop slot. But my heart still desires straight up three weapon slots for Ranger. It would be so loving perfect and round out their "Soldier guy with a versatile selection of comparatively normal weapons" gig. I'd rather be able to bring my preferred Explosives+Bullets combo, alongside the worlds manliest hand grenades or the healing super soaker or other niche toys. Instead of a bargain bin vehicle selection while Air Raider gets all the good ones.
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May 26, 2017 22:08
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running long distances as ranger is terrible and i fully endorse any improvements to that end
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May 26, 2017 22:11
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Scalding Coffee posted:If you say so. Life Pod guns are super useful in multiplayer to keep rez chains going when life pickups are being stingy, and vehicles are fantastically powerful for certain things. A Naegling on a hill a ways away from a fight can kill drones/bees/small dragons en masse while the Air Raider's teammates deal with land-based threats, for example, railgun tanks are death to large single targets like hectors and giant dragons, and the artillery pattern Vegaltas are basically walking spammable nuclear strikes against massed bugs. Certain air strikes trivialize many mission objectives completely safely; Satellite Blasters can kill dropships and bug hives effortlessly from long range and recharge nearly instantly with your teammates killing some random ants. Air Raiders are a poo poo solo class, though. I'm hoping they fix stuff like the wire guns and the limpet launchers to not be a pathetic joke so the class has some personal firepower. Hmm, am I going to spend a slot on a lovely limpet launcher that can't kill a red ant in three reloads, or am I going to bring another Satellite Blaster?
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May 26, 2017 22:15
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Air Raider's "guns" should just be a wider array of deployable turrets that complement his vehicles/defensive structures. Expand on those gun/rocket turrets with wacky laptop guns, AA swarm missiles, tesla coils, and mannable emplacements. Also make those exploding roombas something other than an automatic teamkilling device.
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May 26, 2017 22:36
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Yes. Air Raiders are pure support and should provide lots of buffs to vehicles while hacking satellites with impunity.Kanos posted:Life Pod guns are super useful in multiplayer to keep rez chains going when life pickups are being stingy, and vehicles are fantastically powerful for certain things. A Naegling on a hill a ways away from a fight can kill drones/bees/small dragons en masse while the Air Raider's teammates deal with land-based threats, for example, railgun tanks are death to large single targets like hectors and giant dragons, and the artillery pattern Vegaltas are basically walking spammable nuclear strikes against massed bugs. Certain air strikes trivialize many mission objectives completely safely; Satellite Blasters can kill dropships and bug hives effortlessly from long range and recharge nearly instantly with your teammates killing some random ants.
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May 26, 2017 23:35
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Wish I could get some of my steam friends into 4.1. I find the problem is that it is a tough game to recommend at $50. Don't get me wrong, it is fantastically fun, but it doesn't have $50 game polish or presentation. Makes it a tough sell for the average person. Game seriously needs to hit $20, so I would have a better chance of badgering some friends into buying it. I like all the classes, but I think my favorite overall is probably the plain old ranger. Sure, he is vanilla, but I find his weapons very satisfying. They are effective and easy to use. I usually find myself with a shotgun and a rocket launcher. My favorite is probably the Goliath, because big explosions are awesome. I wish there were a higher level version of it than 50 though. Still, I love the 3000 range on all the rockets. Wing diver is probably my second favorite. Awesome mobility. Fun, unique weapons. The energy mechanic hurts, but it is what helps to balance her. Third is probably the air raider. His vehicles are really cool, and can make the difference. Plus he does offer some nice support options. Not my first personal choice, but I can totally respect his value. Fencer is what I started with. Some of his weapons are pretty fun, and he can be very effective, but I find he takes a lot more effort to play than the others. His results, while good, don't always feel like they are worth all of that extra effort. Probably my last personal choice as to classes. Filthy Monkey fucked around with this message at 15:35 on May 27, 2017 |
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May 26, 2017 23:45
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Scalding Coffee posted:Yes. Air Raiders are pure support and should provide lots of buffs to vehicles while hacking satellites with impunity.  Whale is). Cave missions and then Earth Eater missions in particular were fairly rough on their options.While I'm sure people who spend more time in Inferno get better mileage out of them, in 4.1 at least in casual rear end Hard/Hardest difficulty those cave clusterfuck missions with random pubbies was often salvaged by the Air raider bringing along the healing beacons. It's also one of the few cases I brought the healing super soakers with my Ranger so the Fencers could keep wrecking poo poo longer, and Air raider vehicles actually lasted long enough to use up their ammo rather than watching them explode 15 seconds after their crawler got called in. Though a big appeal of healing beacons is not watching everybody run away from your healing goo, as they ask for healing, while you spam "I want to heal you" chat commands  Come on man, it's a breather with no enemies at the moment, you can stop chain dashing in a circle for two seconds.Filthy Monkey posted:Wish I could get some of my steam friends into 4.1. I find the problem is that it is a tough game to recommend at $50. Don't get me wrong, it is fantastically fun, but it doesn't have $50 game polish or presentation. Makes it a tough sell for the average person. Though I still stand by huge sniper rifles for getting through that one MP only city full of retarius spiders missions. I'm no pro at this game, but god drat did I feel like one every time that mission came up I ended up helping people get through it successfully.
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May 26, 2017 23:53
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sniper rifles are great for flyers because of how fast the bullets are
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May 26, 2017 23:55
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gimme the GOD drat candy posted:sniper rifles are great for flyers because of how fast the bullets are gently caress yeah, a lot of the semi-auto rifle sniper rifles are often my replacement for assault rifles in such levels. While I've gotten very used to shooting up tripod walkers with rockets, there is no denying quick bullets are far more practical for nailing them in their wobbly heads and weakpoints (Though few things are as satisfying as the occasion you can murder them with a shotgun in two seconds). But I always come crawling back to rocket launchers in the end whenever I try other classes. Because I'm so spoiled by their capacity to shoot literally anything in visual range. Dropship in the distance? I Can kill it. Earth eater spawn points and the like? I can kill it. Queen ant in the distance? I can pump some damage into it long before anyone else in the team can. Etc. Then I go without a rocket launcher for particular levels and I'm always dying a little inside every time I have to run halfway across the map to shoot earth eaters or dropships with the longest range sniper rifle I own. Or when I'm walking alongside an Air raider in their fancy railgun tank who isn't allowed to shoot at an alien brain/mothership/etc yet because they can't raise their gun barrel high enough while I'm pumping rockets into it from wherever I want. Section Z fucked around with this message at 00:09 on May 27, 2017 |
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May 27, 2017 00:06
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Yeah, a lot of the sniper rifles feel more like marksman rifle type deals. Good for taking out guys at mid range. The lysander and stringer series rifles are fun. A personal favorite has to be the five card xb though. Good damage, and some real range. Very effective gun.
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May 27, 2017 00:10
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Filthy Monkey posted:
The only reason I even discovered EDF was because the first 360 game launched at $30 and a couple of goons recommended it. I think 4.1 just cost a lot more to make than the others. Agree with you that a permanent price drop is needed.
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May 27, 2017 00:16
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amusingly enough i think air raider has the second best sniping options after ranger.
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May 27, 2017 00:24
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Still holding out hope for an extended dash on Fencer like what the Ranger has now. It's the only thing he desperately needs so I can actually use a different loadout other than javelin launcher+melee weapon.
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May 27, 2017 00:51
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EDF 5 is giving everyone a running option. Even Wing Divers. That happens to zoom in on your booty.
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May 27, 2017 00:59
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Anything that makes Fencer not a complete slog to play is okay in my book.
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May 27, 2017 03:57
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i wouldn't mind fencer being so clunky nearly as much if it actually did more damage. fencer weapons are so huge, unwieldy and dramatic that you'd expect them to do a shitload of damage but they really don't compared to ranger.
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May 27, 2017 05:17
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I'm not sure why people are dissing on air ranger, the class that has a cruise missile call in. And whale in general. Granted the cruise missile is end game stuff but still
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May 27, 2017 05:45
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Fencer's true power is reflection shields.
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May 27, 2017 06:39
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Seriously, they call the class Fencer for a reason. Equip one of the melee options and a reflect shield. Get good at using the shield. Dive into swarms. Be a ridiculous techno-samurai.
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May 27, 2017 06:44
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Psycho Landlord posted:Seriously, they call the class Fencer for a reason. Equip one of the melee options and a reflect shield. Get good at using the shield. Dive into swarms. Be a ridiculous techno-samurai. This sort of falls apart in harder difficulties. Maybe ive been doing things wrong but melee fencer gets me murdered the quickest just because the attacks leave me open to acid balls constantly.
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May 27, 2017 06:55
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Gamerofthegame posted:I'm not sure why people are dissing on air ranger, the class that has a cruise missile call in. And whale in general.  ), and in many cases will leave you jealous when on a team with them.Then you're in another tunnel mission saddled with a poorly scaled depth crawler while the Wing Diver takes advantage of laser blenders and you can't afford to let a single ant get close lest you blow yourself up with you limpet gun  Ranger has the least outlandish equipment compared to the other classes (ESPECIALLY for Normal difficulty scaled weaponry), but they are definitely the least fuss "You can solo any level if you need to/won't feel like a third wheel in certain level types" class. With occasional moments of  when you hear people normally racking up all the close range kills with fencer or wing diver go all "Holy poo poo" when a good shotgun rampage starts mowing down king spiders and tripdods they just can't seem to get the hang of.Fencer I avoid because I've already had mild wrist issues, and given their survival hinges on maximum hand cramping more dashing than I ever did in armored core 4, I get tired of fencer in the literal physical sense when I try them. Wing Diver is more a case of me always and forever being garbage at managing my flight/energy, no matter how loving wonderful lightning shotguns are, I am the problem when it comes to diver (even ignoring their much smaller health scale). Though playing them in levels I can easily spend the whole time in thunder bow and blender range is always super cathartic. All of the classes are amazing, and all the classes do stuff that makes me jealous when I'm rolling with Ranger. But I never worry about if my available weapons or capacity for a playstyle will mesh with a certain level or not (Along with my hard on for being able to shoot anything within draw distances with rockets rather than crossing 3/4 the map to shoot it with a sniper rifle/thunder sniper/man portable artillery cannon). If Ranger can get limited airdrops in EDF5, at least give the Air Raiders shotguns as a weapon option or something. Section Z fucked around with this message at 09:26 on May 27, 2017 |
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May 27, 2017 09:22
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buglord posted:This sort of falls apart in harder difficulties. Maybe ive been doing things wrong but melee fencer gets me murdered the quickest just because the attacks leave me open to acid balls constantly. The acid balls are what you should be reflecting. The melee weapon is for poo poo like higher-elevation wasps and hectors.
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May 27, 2017 10:00
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Vegaltas care cool but holy poo poo they steer like a bathtub. I hope the Nyx is more mobile.
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May 27, 2017 18:46
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Yeah, a fencer at high difficulties should be using their shield almost exclusively. Reflect everything. Acid balls, stingers, webbing, the works. Weapons should only be used to complete objectives or against jerks that don't have projectiles, like red ants.
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May 27, 2017 18:59
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Kaiju Cage Match posted:Vegaltas care cool but holy poo poo they steer like a bathtub. I hope the Nyx is more mobile. Vehicles in 4.1 were weird in general cuz everything was based off of some speed stat; if you use the end game inferno-tier vehicles they turn on a dime, burn down a road and can track flying GIANT INSECTS with ease, to the point it's kinda startling. Like, they control well except for the rocket-sled stuff like the APC (which controls like Fun.) That all in mind I imagine poo poo will function better this time around simply because, hopefully, they would have everything attached to the same speed level value or whatever.
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May 27, 2017 19:44
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It also depends on the Vegalta type. The green ones are by far the fastest while the red ones are the slowest.
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May 27, 2017 19:53
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I don't know much about this game but was always interested, Friends were playing it back on 360. is the 4.1 version that game? like sequels are basically version updates? Is this game fun to play solo? does it go on sale? fifty bucks is kinda steep for an old game.
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May 27, 2017 19:59
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Coolguye posted:Yeah, a fencer at high difficulties should be using their shield almost exclusively. Reflect everything. Acid balls, stingers, webbing, the works. Weapons should only be used to complete objectives or against jerks that don't have projectiles, like red ants. I play Fencer with my bros and I always pack melee weapon/reflector for dash cancel speed and reflection and then a pair of my highest level auto cannons for the real work. The mobility that dash canceling gives me is incredible.
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May 27, 2017 20:01
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Odddzy posted:I don't know much about this game but was always interested, Friends were playing it back on 360. is the 4.1 version that game? like sequels are basically version updates? Is this game fun to play solo? does it go on sale? fifty bucks is kinda steep for an old game. As for solo, it is fine, but the game really shines when played with friends. It is amazingly fun co-op. People will probably disagree with me, but I probably wouldn't buy it purely for solo play. $50 is steep for sure, given the age and presentation. I wish it would get some deep sales. Would make it easier to rope friends in. It honestly should be $20 or $25, with the mission pack DLCs being $5. Filthy Monkey fucked around with this message at 20:18 on May 27, 2017 |
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May 27, 2017 20:14
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Penitent posted:I play Fencer with my bros and I always pack melee weapon/reflector for dash cancel speed and reflection and then a pair of my highest level auto cannons for the real work. The mobility that dash canceling gives me is incredible. Yeah, ironically Fencer is the highest mobility class in the game after you get a fast-reflecting shield. I spent a large majority of my multiplayer matches being the Armor/Weapon picker upper. I only wish that Fencer's long vertical jump was a standard in his kit. It would allow for some different weapon combinations that did not include that. It's a necessity to get around some vertical spaces and sucks that you have to trade that for a zoom function on some weapons.
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May 27, 2017 20:24
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I wish they got rid of dash canceling in favor for something less glitchy. But also I've seen other games with that mechanic where you cancel moves to execute another move, and it's encouraged? Is it a Japanese game thing?
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May 27, 2017 20:55
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buglord posted:I wish they got rid of dash canceling in favor for something less glitchy. But also I've seen other games with that mechanic where you cancel moves to execute another move, and it's encouraged? Is it a Japanese game thing? Kinda, yeah. I think Megaman or Metroid started it. Maybe some fighting game?
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May 27, 2017 21:20
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Yeah, I don't think there's anything glitchy about dash canceling, it's the Fencer's side roll.
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May 27, 2017 21:21
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Animation locking is bad, bad, bad.
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May 27, 2017 21:21
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Dash cancelling is 100% an intended feature intended to make the fencer a deep and complex class to play as. It's not a Japanese exclusive thing either, even call of duty has reload cancelling.
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May 27, 2017 23:28
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Dash Cancelling is a cool mechanic but it needs to not be coupled to specific weapon types because it sort of sucks poo poo to have to bring a spear/javelin or spear/shield setup in half your slots for the class to even be playable. I'd love if they retained the mechanic but decoupled it from weapons in general somehow.
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May 28, 2017 00:19
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Mr Phillby posted:Dash cancelling is 100% an intended feature intended to make the fencer a deep and complex class to play as. On the other, more realistic hand: it's a glitch that only works with certain combinations of weapons, isn't documented anywhere, and the game goes out of its way to tell you that the Fencer isn't a mobile class and every other loading screen has pictures of a Fencer in a troop carrier vehicle. You're definitely overthinking this B-game with wacky broken physics.
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May 28, 2017 00:34
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I'm glad that Ranger is getting their own vehicles to help with mobility. It's one of the things i wished for while playing 4.1; him getting a legit sprint is also nice and the same goes for the Wing Diver's new dash. Honestly I was hoping the Fencer would get an Armored Trooper Votoms type deal where they can deploy wheels/tracks to move around at speed but with a hit to ranged weapon accuracy or out right blocking certain ones. Then use that mode to add some more spice to the melee options.
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May 28, 2017 00:42
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Quote-Unquote posted:On the other, more realistic hand: it's a glitch that only works with certain combinations of weapons, isn't documented anywhere, and the game goes out of its way to tell you that the Fencer isn't a mobile class and every other loading screen has pictures of a Fencer in a troop carrier vehicle. it's half-heartedly documented in the fencer introduction screens. it tells you the mechanic exists, but not how to take advantage of it or how it's supposed to work. this isn't meant to excuse it; if anything i feel like this makes the situation worse.
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May 28, 2017 00:50
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Fencer just feels like it requires too much work to play. A well played fencer can get good results in game, but it doesn't seem to match the level of effort it requires when compared to the other classes. Dash cancelling is irritating, and the weapons are often slightly awkward to use. If I were going to pick classes for a group of three, he is probably the one I would leave out. I do like the thought of some ranger vehicles. Give him some simple weaponless transport options like motorcycles and such. Leave the big gunned weapons for the air raider.
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May 28, 2017 00:58
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