Trump Thread II: The man make a tweet

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > Trump Thread II: The man make a tweet

evilweasel: Aug 24, 2002

Russia isn't likely to invade the EU, but it is eager to re-subjugate former Russian imperial holdings/USSR vassal states, and giving Russia the green light for wars in eastern europe is in nobody's interests.

# ? May 31, 2017 00:59

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# ? May 13, 2024 16:09

empty whippet box: Jun 9, 2004; by Fluffdaddy

Mr Ice Cream Glove posted:

HUGE

https://twitter.com/emmersbrown/status/869686954123722754

Incoming republican freakout!

# ? May 31, 2017 00:59

Paracaidas: Sep 24, 2016; Consistently Tedious!

cargo cult posted:

What exactly is Greenwald's deal, besides hating establishment Dems and the security state? I've heard him characterized as a libertarian but him constantly going to bat for the trump administration on the Russia stuff is so irritating.

_{e- tl;dr: Greenwald is loving wrong frequently, but comes by it honestly. You asked a question, so you deserve a more robust reply. Hopefully this is helpful for curious lurkers, at least.}

As one of our resident Greenwald haters, a lot of those responses are somewhere between oversimplified and completely wrong.

Greenwald's core beliefs come down to a few factors

Intelligence Communities are never to be trusted, and should be exposed at any opportunity
Corporate money and rich financiers have corrupted the establishment wings of both parties (but especially Dems) and they will act in service of their funders rather than their voters or their principles
Anyone attacked by those groups are likely not as bad as they're made out to be, and the attackers are willing to lie to conceal their roles.

In a broad sense, none of that is particularly controversial or inaccurate. But it can be a pretty toxic mix when those beliefs intersect and he doesn't engage with context or nuance.

The quoted tweet is actually fairly sensible given his position. He's not a fanatical believer in radical transparency (he dripfed the Snowden leaks, and doesn't mind redacting where he feels it makes sense), so it's not hypocritical to oppose leaks. In this case, his problem is that the American Intelligence Community is breaking its own rules in order to damage a politician it dislikes. In a vacuum, that's incredibly troubling-it's the sort of behavior that precedes a coup in less mature democracies. In context, the IC has watched Trump dismantle the mechanisms meant to keep him in line and has seen their work lied about for political gain (Nunes), sat on for political benefit (pre-election McConnell) or wither and die on the vine (current investigations).

As 1 and 3 interact, they prevent Greenwald from reading the leakers as whistleblowers in a sense-distributing information outside of normal process because normal process has become corrupt- and instead assumes that Russia isn't as active as the IC claims, that whatever ties they've uncovered are not relevant, and that this is their attack against an unfriendly president.

These intersections are evident in a number of cases. The writing was on the wall with Assange after the Swedish incidents (or, if you're inclined to take the word of a lying sack of poo poo over two ~~CIA honeypots~~ women, the Panama Papers aftermath), but Greenwald stuck with his defenses until he started spiraling out in the summer, even after the Turkish fiasco. He helped Bruenig fundraise off a blatant lie, aiming to blame his firing on Palmieri and Clintonworld rather than his unwillingness to apologize for the statement that an insufficiently progressive Bernie-girl deserved the threats of rape and violence from his fans. The immediate, reflexive, and ongoing to paint all Russian critique as Neomccarthyist is another example.

For The Intercept broadly, the Neomccarthyist example is instructive: In many of their stories, they know better but assume you don't. Greenwald (and his whole writing staff) is smart enough to know that McCarthy ran a regime of terror against the powerless based on rumor and innuendo in a desire to raise his own power and profile. The current situation features heavy, credible reporting alongside credible leaks from anonymous sources-aimed at holding the rich and powerful accountable and without a clear beneficiary for pushing it. Other examples are Booker et.al voting against the importation bill that Cruz/Paul/Lee voted for and almost anything relating to the DNC. If you walk into one of their articles assuming that the Democratic Establishment and American Intelligence/Military communities are wrong, you'll come out with a lot of reinforcement for your view... provided you don't think too hard about it or look at other sources.

Paracaidas fucked around with this message at 01:03 on May 31, 2017

# ? May 31, 2017 01:00

Tim Whatley: Mar 28, 2010

Just started House of Cards fifth season and I hope Trump caught a Twitter ad for it thinking nobody knows what it is and he starts openly quoting Frank Underwood at some point soon.

# ? May 31, 2017 01:00

Fojar38: Sep 2, 2011; Sorry I meant to say I hope that the police use maximum force and kill or maim a bunch of innocent people, thus paving a way for a proletarian uprising and socialist utopia

also here's a stupid take
---------------------------->

evilweasel posted:

Russia isn't likely to invade the EU, but it is eager to re-subjugate former Russian imperial holdings/USSR vassal states, and giving Russia the green light for wars in eastern europe is in nobody's interests.

I genuinely wonder if Russia would be capable of even that if they had a guarantee of no European or American intervention

# ? May 31, 2017 01:02

empty whippet box: Jun 9, 2004; by Fluffdaddy

http://www.cnn.com/2017/05/30/politics/michael-flynn-documents-senate/index.html?adkey=bn

quote:

Former national security adviser Michael Flynn will provide documents requested by the Senate intelligence committee -- including an initial batch by June 6 -- a person close to Flynn said Tuesday.

The source said that Flynn's lawyers alerted the intelligence committee Tuesday that he would respond to the two subpoenas sent to his businesses and would also provide personal documents sought via a separate subpoena after Senate investigators narrowed the scope of the request.

Can I assume this means they've doctored them or that they don't have anything incriminating in them? Frankly, I assume that anyone involved in this will literally do anything at all to avoid providing incriminating evidence, so I'm staunchly pessimistic about it. However, it'd be great if there's actually The Good Stuff somewhere in these documents.

Until I see otherwise, though, I'm gonna assume it's yet another stalling tactic.

# ? May 31, 2017 01:04

Mr Ice Cream Glove: Apr 22, 2007

Tim Whatley posted:

Just started House of Cards fifth season and I hope Trump caught a Twitter ad for it thinking nobody knows what it is and he starts openly quoting Frank Underwood at some point soon.

"Power is a lot like real estate. It’s all about location, location, location. The closer you are to the source, the higher your property value.”

# ? May 31, 2017 01:06

Shimrra Jamaane: Aug 10, 2007; Obscure to all except those well-versed in Yuuzhan Vong lore.

A rearmed Germany could probably gently caress Russia up in a non nuclear confrontation assuming it was defensive in nature.

Germany defending Ukraine from Russian aggression would certainly be an ironic twist of history.

# ? May 31, 2017 01:07

OhFunny: Jun 26, 2013; EXTREMELY PISSED AT THE DNC

evilweasel posted:

Russia isn't likely to invade the EU, but it is eager to re-subjugate former Russian imperial holdings/USSR vassal states, and giving Russia the green light for wars in eastern europe is in nobody's interests.

I have strong doubts about Russian's capability to militarily subjugate the Baltic nations which are now NATO members and have US and other European stationed within them.

# ? May 31, 2017 01:08

Grapplejack: Nov 27, 2007

https://twitter.com/davidsirota/status/869040415118417920

OhFunny posted:

I have strong doubts about Russian's capability to militarily subjugate the Baltic nations which are now NATO members and have US and other European stationed within them.

Russia has been focused on economic and clandestine approaches to subjugation and has been doing a fairly decent job at it, given the surge in far-right candidates we've seen throughout Europe.

# ? May 31, 2017 01:12

logger: Jun 28, 2008; ...and in what manner the Ancyent Marinere came back to his own Country.; Soiled Meat

empty whippet box posted:

http://www.cnn.com/2017/05/30/politics/michael-flynn-documents-senate/index.html?adkey=bn

Can I assume this means they've doctored them or that they don't have anything incriminating in them? Frankly, I assume that anyone involved in this will literally do anything at all to avoid providing incriminating evidence, so I'm staunchly pessimistic about it. However, it'd be great if there's actually The Good Stuff somewhere in these documents.

Until I see otherwise, though, I'm gonna assume it's yet another stalling tactic.

This is a subpoena focused on the business he owns which is not protected under the 5th Amendment. He is legally obligated to provide the documents requested and can't delay any longer unless he wants to face obstruction charges.

# ? May 31, 2017 01:12

The Glumslinger: Sep 24, 2008; Coach Nagy, you want me to throw to WHAT side of the field?; Hair Elf

empty whippet box posted:

http://www.cnn.com/2017/05/30/politics/michael-flynn-documents-senate/index.html?adkey=bn

Can I assume this means they've doctored them or that they don't have anything incriminating in them? Frankly, I assume that anyone involved in this will literally do anything at all to avoid providing incriminating evidence, so I'm staunchly pessimistic about it. However, it'd be great if there's actually The Good Stuff somewhere in these documents.

Until I see otherwise, though, I'm gonna assume it's yet another stalling tactic.

It was turn them over or go to jail for contempt of congress

# ? May 31, 2017 01:13

twice burned ice: Dec 29, 2008; My stove defies the laws of physics!

A while back, an article about Ben Sasse's book was posted here. The Vanishing American Adult: Ben Sasse on Virtue in Politics

I saw this response and thought it was a good summary of why many people resort to "Nothing Matters" nihilism. The rhetoric is a bit over the top, but substantively, it delivers.

Someone on Reddit posted:

IT'S TOTAL loving BULLSHIT.

What's vanishing is our society's ability to uphold its end of the social contract. Here's how the loving social contract works: your society says it has things it wants from you, and in exchange for aiming your life toward what they want, you get to LIVE WELL.

I am a retired middle- and high-school teacher, and I saw no lack of kids working their ASSES off, trying to comply with whatever bullshit busywork their school and district and nation demanded of them. They worked their asses off, did the extra-curriculars, got into the good school, gave up on their DREAMS to pursue the loving STEM degree because you HAVE to do it to get a job, and then what?

I'm teaching their younger brother, and apparently this great, great student is back home living with mom, with a masters in electrical engineering.

gently caress YOU, BEN SASSE. My god-drat students BELIEVED in this country, believed that if they really did follow all your bullshit Protestant work-ethic poo poo that their nation, their country, would say, "WELL DONE, and now, for our part of the bargain, here is your secure job, with FULL BENEFITS, with a PENSION, with PAID MATERNITY LEAVE, with job security and pride!"

You see, a nation has to hold up that end of the social contract IF THEY WANT THERE TO BEEEE ANY loving ADULTS! Instead, we have a million studies that less pissed people can post about how wages have stagnated, and nobody gets to have the kind of career my grandfather enjoyed FOR LESS WORK SIXTY YEARS AGO.

gently caress.

HOW loving DARE THESE ASSHOLES think that we are so dumb as to keep putting up with it? 6 out of the 20 most common professions in America are about to be replaced by loving robots in the next generation, and this diposhitz is telling us we need to all come together and study hard and work for.... a future where there aren't any JOBS??? And gently caress jobs anyway! I don't want a job for my students, I want them to have what my mother had, a CAREER, doing something meaningful, that made her believe in her country, because when her kids got sick, we got to go to the doctor. Because her NATION, even maybe 40 years ago, was willing to uphold its end of the deal and make sure that its networks of distribution didn't condemn successive generations to more and more poverty.

The only lack of virtue is on the part of these sanctimonious assholes telling us we have to run their loving rat race harder in the way they tell us, and meanwhile, they're gonna keep funneling ALL THIS NATION'S WEALTH upwards like hot tar through a loving traffic cone right into the asses of billionaires.

gently caress them. I say we rise up and slay them and make a world that holds up its end of the bargain.

And gently caress you, Ben Sasse. I had to watch 6th graders, ELEVEN YEAR OLDS with thousand-yard stares because they knew it didn't matter how hard they worked, the structure of YOUR COUNTRY, which YOU GOVERN, has doomed them to loving penury, you evil, lobbyist-serving piece of poo poo.

STOP loving WITH MY KIDS, with AMERICAN KIDS. Time to loving cough up a shitload of reform or get off your god drat soap box.

twice burned ice fucked around with this message at 01:50 on May 31, 2017

# ? May 31, 2017 01:15

RandomBlue: Dec 30, 2012; hay guys!; Biscuit Hider

Martytoof posted:

Didn't realize it had derailed before. Sorry

I remember that one time the Trump thread derailed and we nipped it the bud two posts later and we've been derail free ever since!

# ? May 31, 2017 01:15

Ague Proof: Jun 5, 2014; they told me
I was everything

Flynn's memory will be shredded.

# ? May 31, 2017 01:16

evilmiera: Dec 14, 2009; Status: Ravenously Rambunctious

cargo cult posted:

What exactly is Greenwald's deal, besides hating establishment Dems and the security state? I've heard him characterized as a libertarian but him constantly going to bat for the trump administration on the Russia stuff is so irritating.

The other explanation given was probably a lot better than mine, but in short Glenn believes some people are his enemies and he will ally with or believe anyone who sufficiently agrees with him on that. Up to and including people you wouldn't trust for a second if you scrutinized their affiliations or past actions in the slightest.

He isn't stupid, nor evil (really). Just incredibly bullheaded and unable to view the world outside of his own lens.

# ? May 31, 2017 01:17

RandomBlue: Dec 30, 2012; hay guys!; Biscuit Hider

logger posted:

This is a subpoena focused on the business he owns which is not protected under the 5th Amendment. He is legally obligated to provide the documents requested and can't delay any longer unless he wants to face obstruction charges.

Obstruction is way better than treason.

# ? May 31, 2017 01:18

mdemone: Mar 14, 2001

The Glumslinger posted:

It was turn them over or go to jail for contempt of congress

Nah, if you read the article they're negotiating for a certain percentage of the documents to satisfy the subpoena.

# ? May 31, 2017 01:18

Mercury Ballistic: Nov 14, 2005; not gun related

empty whippet box posted:

http://www.cnn.com/2017/05/30/politics/michael-flynn-documents-senate/index.html?adkey=bn

Can I assume this means they've doctored them or that they don't have anything incriminating in them? Frankly, I assume that anyone involved in this will literally do anything at all to avoid providing incriminating evidence, so I'm staunchly pessimistic about it. However, it'd be great if there's actually The Good Stuff somewhere in these documents.

Until I see otherwise, though, I'm gonna assume it's yet another stalling tactic.

My understanding is that he cannot plead the fifth on behalf of his business, so business stuff he has no choice. Perhaps his personal stuff was essentially the same or very close so he had no choice, hence the compliance with the first subpoena.

Others have also said that when they subpoena him, they likely have a pretty good idea what they will find and if not he is in hot water for hiding something.

For all these guys, the level of scrutiny they are and will be subject to is probably beyond any previous effort.

# ? May 31, 2017 01:18

RandomBlue: Dec 30, 2012; hay guys!; Biscuit Hider

Ague Proof posted:

Flynn's memory will be shredded.

poo poo, keep him away from the chili guys...

# ? May 31, 2017 01:19

botany: Apr 27, 2013; by Lowtax

Nobody here actually reads what Greenwald writes so you post the same idiotic poo poo over and over again despite the fact that his openly stated position is contrary to whatever you imagine so honestly you should just shut the gently caress up

# ? May 31, 2017 01:21

Rigel: Nov 11, 2016

https://twitter.com/NateSilver538/status/869707796002025473

# ? May 31, 2017 01:24

Zil: Jun 4, 2011; Satanically Summoned Citrus

Rigel posted:

https://twitter.com/NateSilver538/status/869707796002025473

Than the murders began

# ? May 31, 2017 01:26

Propaganda Hour: Aug 25, 2008; after editing wikipedia as a joke for 16 years, i ve convinced myself that homer simpson's japanese name translates to the "The beer goblin"

Rigel posted:

https://twitter.com/NateSilver538/status/869707796002025473

Hahahah Huma's brain must be broken or something. No wonder Hillary lost

# ? May 31, 2017 01:26

HootTheOwl: May 13, 2012; Hootin and shootin

Taerkar posted:

The GOP's new motto is Snitches Get Stitches.

Clearly pandering.

# ? May 31, 2017 01:32

Mozi: Apr 4, 2004; Forms change so fast
Time is moving past
Memory is smoke
Gonna get wider when I die; Nap Ghost

Christ.

# ? May 31, 2017 01:33

Total Party Kill: Aug 25, 2005

Anthony Weiner needs to teach trump a thing or two about making great deals

# ? May 31, 2017 01:35

Bobby Digital: Sep 4, 2009

Taerkar posted:

The GOP's new motto is Snitches Can't Afford to Get Stitches.

# ? May 31, 2017 01:37

John Wick of Dogs: Mar 4, 2017; A real hellraiser

Jesus loving Christ Huma

# ? May 31, 2017 01:42

Shimrra Jamaane: Aug 10, 2007; Obscure to all except those well-versed in Yuuzhan Vong lore.

twice burned ice posted:

A while back, an article by Ben Sasse was posted here. The Vanishing American Adult: Ben Sasse on Virtue in Politics

I saw this response and thought it was a good summary of why many people resort to "Nothing Matters" nihilism. The rhetoric is a bit over the top, but substantively, it delivers.

That's a hell of a good rant. Where on Reddit did you find it?

# ? May 31, 2017 01:44

Ekster: Jul 18, 2013

Boys will be boys!

# ? May 31, 2017 01:44

Ms Adequate: Oct 30, 2011; Baby even when I'm dead and gone
You will always be my only one, my only one
When the night is calling
No matter who I become
You will always be my only one, my only one, my only one
When the night is calling

Rigel posted:

https://twitter.com/NateSilver538/status/869707796002025473

Huma I think you're great but what are you thinking

# ? May 31, 2017 01:44

Rigel: Nov 11, 2016

In case anyone forgot, Hillary would probably be president if Weiner could have just resisted the temptation to send dick pics to underage girls.

# ? May 31, 2017 01:47

Chard: Aug 24, 2010

How is it possible that basically everyone in our government is a loving gibbbering incompetent? It seems like neither side of the aisle is immune. Is this just what happens when you force human beings to live under a magnifying glass 24/7? Are the Illuminati changing our votes to let the reptiles in? Am I losing my mind???

# ? May 31, 2017 01:47

twice burned ice: Dec 29, 2008; My stove defies the laws of physics!

Shimrra Jamaane posted:

That's a hell of a good rant. Where on Reddit did you find it?

Here

# ? May 31, 2017 01:48

Chard: Aug 24, 2010

For real please post some Good Governance, I need a fix

# ? May 31, 2017 01:48

Bobby Digital: Sep 4, 2009

Rigel posted:

In case anyone forgot, Hillary would probably be president if she had had Weiner killed.

# ? May 31, 2017 01:51

Dr Kool-AIDS: Mar 26, 2004

Huma's the dumbest person in the world if that story is true, but this guy might be a close second.

https://twitter.com/MattGertz/status/869608909849464833

# ? May 31, 2017 01:52

Shimrra Jamaane: Aug 10, 2007; Obscure to all except those well-versed in Yuuzhan Vong lore.

Rigel posted:

In case anyone forgot, Hillary would probably be president if Weiner could have just resisted the temptation to send dick pics to underage girls.

Honestly I figure Comey or someone else would have just made up some other bullshit October Surprise instead.

# ? May 31, 2017 01:53

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# ? May 13, 2024 16:09

Raised By Birds: May 5, 2013

Bobby Digital posted:

HIS NAME WAS CARLOS DANGER.

# ? May 31, 2017 01:53

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