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Mysticblade posted:Someone hasn't heard of Johnny Five Aces, huh? Joker is too young for booze!
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Jun 5, 2017 14:45
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Someone brought up earlier how, to coincide with the game's whole theme of rebellion and stuff, the art for the tarot cards in this game is more-or-less making fun of the regular art for them, i.e. the king or whatever in The Chariot has a broken arm, while the Grim Reaper in Death is gleefully chopping off skulls. I should've said this when that was brought up, but I would actually really appreciate if that person could do comparisons like that for the rest of the arcana as well, namely since I'm half-blind and stupid which leads me to miss the most obvious of details.
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Jun 6, 2017 05:39
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Is there a reason that we keep flashing forward to Sae talking about the Social Links? It just seems distracting. It's going to be even more jarring if she winds up being a Social Link and she pauses to talk about how a detective must have been onto him this whole time or something.
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Jun 6, 2017 06:10
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The conceit is that we're talking to her as she interrogates us after the opening scene. It gets a little repetitive in practice. 
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Jun 6, 2017 06:13
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It's a bit silly, especially with some of the links where it's not at all obvious why she should suspect them, but I do like the fact that they try to keep the framing device relevant.
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Jun 6, 2017 06:21
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I never found it that repetitive, even if it was a bit silly at times. Sure, it happens a lot, but each instance is generally spaced out across several hours of gameplay. Getting annoyed about it seems like a pointless waste of emotion.
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Jun 6, 2017 06:22
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serefin99 posted:Someone brought up earlier how, to coincide with the game's whole theme of rebellion and stuff, the art for the tarot cards in this game is more-or-less making fun of the regular art for them, i.e. the king or whatever in The Chariot has a broken arm, while the Grim Reaper in Death is gleefully chopping off skulls. I did that! I can keep going as Confidants come up. The only one we've gotten extra so far is the hierophant (Sojiro). Generally speaking the hierophant is shown as a dignified pope or church father with authority. He holds up a hand or two fingers (quite like Jesus does in Orthodox iconography.)   The hierophant in persona 5, though, gives you a thumbs down.  gently caress you and your crimes, you heretic.
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Jun 6, 2017 06:40
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He looks so happy while he's telling you to gently caress off, too.
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Jun 6, 2017 06:43
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Blastinus posted:I really like what they did for the non-party social links in this game. It actually feels like every character you add to your retinue provides you with a concrete benefit. Ironically, in my first playthrough I ended up blowing off most of my party members in favor of things like better medical supplies, just because the bonuses of party member confidants seemed to pale in comparison to the stuff you got from NPC's.
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Jun 6, 2017 07:53
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YggiDee posted:He looks so happy while he's telling you to gently caress off, too. He really does. Arist, I hunger for updates!
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Jun 8, 2017 11:26
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Part 19: 4/29-5/2: That Is Coffee Music: Beneath the Mask (Instrumental Version)  Let’s go find out, cat.   The original Detective Prince was Naoto Shirogane, but people are excited about this new one! My daughter’s a big fan of the new Detective Prince. He’s a sleuth in high school and sooo handsome!New Detective Prince, eh? Wonder what that’s about. Very, very occasionally, the game will mention a previous Persona character by name, but generally most of the references to the earlier games are a lot more subtle than that. This game taking place in “20XX” isn’t a joke. They’re thoroughly detaching this game from the previous entries in the series, which is fine by me, as I don’t actually like Persona 3 that much and as much as I love Persona 4, it’s had more than enough time in the spotlight.  I finally remember to sell that useless piece of armor we found in the castle, which is good, because we’re running low on funds from that aojiru.  Let’s hang out with Ryuji today. He hangs out at the arcade on days off.   I don’t think my bond with Ryuji will deepen just yet...poo poo. Well, we’ll have to find something else to do with him if we can’t rank up.   Sure thing. Where we goin’? I think I’d prolly pick somewhere with good food if it were up to me…As I pointed out earlier, we can spend time between rank ups gaining points with Confidants at hangout spots, but only certain Confidants like certain places.  “Hey, remember that ramen spot you introduced me to yesterday? Let’s go there.” “Uhh, okay…” “Also you’re paying.” The etiquette here is absurd. Oh, that ramen place!? Sure, I’m pretty drat hungry. Let’s go, then.Ryuji doesn’t seem to care though. Music: What’s Going On?  We’re gonna look like we’re just goin’ for the new fad, but my stomach’s already in ramen mode. C’mon, let’s get in line! Ain’t you totally fallin’ for this soy sauce flavor too!? I love how snobbish these other answers are.  Anyways… thanks for askin’ me here today. I’m all cheered up now ‘cause of you! C’mon, let’s get goin’. There’re tons of people waitin’ for our seats. Here, you can have mine. I’m not crazy enough about ramen to be showin’ that off in my room.“It’s perfect for you, though, you weirdo.” I feel like my bond with Ryuji will grow stronger soon... All right, let’s run to the station and work that meal off!  Another minister has resigned? What is going on... How stupid do you have to be to commit adultery? They must be nuts… Swinging that knife around on a train… There are too many crazy people! Where are all the sane people?Music: Beneath the Mask (Instrumental Version)   It’d be nicer, though, if we had something to put on them… Oh yeah, you have something you can use to spruce up this room, don’t you? Why don’t you try decorating your room a bit?  Why don’t you try decorating your room a bit?This is a totally pointless addition to the game that has no gameplay benefits. That said, it’s pretty funny, so I’m cool with it.  Ryuji was right about me.   Looks like you’re starting to get interested in this. Hey, you’re not trying to impress me, are you? Well, whatever… All right, I’m headin’ out to buy some cigarettes...Music: Break it Down (Elp Version)   Here, I’ll have a sip. ...This must be Guatemalan SHB...  ...The flavor profile is bland. You should practice more to bring out the roast's full potential. You still have a lot to learn, in coffee and in life. Be patient.Thanks, man, that was almost profound. Music: Everyday Days    Not just her looks, but her way of life was also very beautiful...Still one more session needed to finish that book. Music: Beneath the Mask (Instrumental Version)   ...I wonder if Kamoshida really has a change of heart? What if we failed? That’s all I’ve been able to think about... We did what we could. I guess all I can do now is believe… But how strange… I feel a bit better now. Maybe it’s because of your composure? We’ll be able to avenge Shiho, and you won’t get expelled! After break, we’ll all be able to laugh together! That’s what I’ll believe.Music: So Boring   These days, it’s expected that you know colloquial English—even idioms based in other languages. I want you to forget you’re Japanese during this class and make yourself believe you’re a foreigner. What’s important is becoming someone else. In this day and age, being able to swap your mask depending on the situation is a critical talent.Subtle. How will you fare, Mr. Hamiru? Here’s a question. “Are you a wunderkind?” See if you can work out the answer based on what you know. “Are you a wunderkind?”… Well, seems to me like we need to work out what that is, so we can answer her properly. My German is a little rusty, but I’ll give you a hand if I can! First off, the “wunder” part probably means... Duh. Right, wonder! So something… wondrous, I guess, or impressive. Next, the “kind” part. That’s probably... I don’t know much German, but I know at least this much. Oh, huh. If the “kind” in “kindergarten” refers to all the kids in it… Yeah, that’s gotta be it. “Kind” means a child… or at least a young guy, in your case. So a “wunderkind” would be… Real tempting to pick “Persona-user” here, I gotta say. That’s right! I was asking you if you were a wonder child—in other words, a youth of uncommon talent. But I suppose if you were able to think and adapt so quickly, that proves you certainly must be! Oh, the word, “talent” comes from the Greek “talanton,” a sum of money referenced in the Bible. The more skilled a servant was, the more coins they would receive from God—their talent led to wealth. You’re on a roll today!Maaku gains Knowledge +1. The English word “talent” didn’t originally have anything to do with our modern concept of celebrity. But the ability to change one’s mask depending on the situation is surely a talent given to one by God. It’s not too far off calling people who can react to things on the spot on TV “talents.” The talent of changing masks… Does that make us all “wunderthieves”?Music: Butterfly Kiss  >I want to do a clinical trial. I refined the medicine from the other day a bit. Could you come to the back? I’m going to start setting up then. Head into the examination room.   ...Let’s see. Eyes are focused. Look this way. One, two, three, four… ...Nothing yet, huh?   Your weight was the primary reason it took longer to kick in than expected… ...Yes, this is what I expected from a teenager. We’re making great progress. Practice makes perfect, right? OK, hold tight. Once I compile all the data, we can move on...  ...An emergency, huh? But we’re not a designated hospital. ...Besides, the head physician here is Tae Takemi. Ah…?  Oh, he basically just called the wrong number. An ambulance driver was looking for a transfer location. All the designated hospitals are full. But to think they’d accidentally call a general practitioner… Must’ve been a new paramedic. ...He seemed to at least know my name though. Music: Suspicion I’ve been blacklisted by the larger medical community. They call me the Plague… due to a grave medical error I made. This goes back to my old job… I used to work at a university hospital in the city. I was never actually convicted of anything, but I’m still considered a pariah in the medical industry. ...Does that scare you? Participating in clinical trials run by a doctor like that?Takemi, I’m not gonna lie. That sounds dope as poo poo.  It’s for my exams.  I guess we’re both equally shady, hm? Well, that’s fine. Being ostracized has enabled me to focus on my own research and development. Regardless, I look forward to working with you. I’ll be sure to add some additional “medicine” for you, my little guinea pig. It feels like my bond with Takemi is growing even deeper... All right, more healing items at the clinic. Sounds great.   Huh? One order of teriyaki chicken? ...You’re all good for today. You can go home now. Come again soon, if you’re still alive. I feel like cooperating in that shady clinical trial has increased my Guts…Maaku gets Guts +1. OK, take care.Music: Beneath the Mask (Instrumental Version)  Is there any way they can regain their lost memories? Revive and fight, Phoenix Rangers! Next episode… “Don’t Take Three Steps! You’ll Lose Your Memories!”This is just a fun nod back to Phoenix Ranger Featherman R, a sentai show in the universe of Persona introduced back in Persona 2. Ken Amada was a fan of it, you could dress up the party as them in Persona 4 Golden, and in Persona 4 Arena Ultimax, Yukari Takeba, at that point a model, had an acting gig as Pink Argus. Her character design in that game was even based around her still wearing the costume.  Now that we’ve made coffee, we have enough points to hang out with Sojiro again. Then you clean up. I’m going to finish preparing the curry.Music: What’s Going On?  Hey, how’s it going? You getting any better at remembering how to handle different bean types? *nods* Now then… there are three factors that determine the flavor for a cup of coffee: grind, heat, and time. First up is the grind. For the siphons we have here, we’re aiming for medium-fine. ...Are you listening to me? What grind are you supposed to use?  It doesn’t net much profit given the effort it takes, but hey, money is money. I’m not gonna forgive you if you serve our customers crap coffee though. Just remember that.   Music: Suspicion   Now? Where? ...Fine.   ...It’s nothing you need to concern yourself over. Just do the dishes while I’m gone. Oh, and remember to shut off the gas before you close up shop. It’s nice having someone around to help at times like this. Turns out you’re actually a harder worker than I thought. Keep it up. I feel like my bond with Sojiro is growing deeper... OK, I’m off. Don’t eat all our food while I’m gone.Music: Beneath the Mask (Instrumental Version) The board meeting is tomorrow. We’d better hope the Kamoshida situation is sorted out, or we’re hosed.  I sure hope so, cat.  In the course of addressing the accident, the Minister of Transport ended up resigning. Many questions, however, still remain unanswered, as police struggle in their investigation. That accident happened right after you moved here to Tokyo, didn’t it?Hmm, no shopping today. Guess it's not every week like it used to be.   I fail to see the appeal though. Adults swinging bats, screaming their grievances at society... Heh. You don’t need to relieve your stress like that. Not until the hardships of adulthood. And you’re too old to try becoming a baseball player. Even so, it could be a pleasant distraction. Visit the batting cages if you’re ever free. Though, it’s ill-suited to an intellectual like me… Gah…! Aggh, my back...Man, gently caress this dude.  Takemi doesn’t gain much in the way of new medicine, sadly. She gets these items that let you get rid of stat buffs on enemies or debuffs on party members, but they’re pretty cost-prohibitive at the moment.  Time for more aojiru, gently caress my stomach and my wallet. Maaku gets Proficiency +1.  And some more Bio Nutrients, for more Kindness later on.   What are your thoughts on all the recent accidents that seem to have no explanation? Do you hear what he’s saying? The incidents have shocked him and he doesn’t understand what’s going on. He can’t hide his uneasiness! And that’s all for our on-the-spot coverage.  That’s why I’ve poured my soul into this song—to help restore our hope. I give you… “Metropolitan Fire”! Fire say hello to the modern city/Fire say goodbye to the countryside/Light a fire in your hearts now/let this music spark the flame (Ow!) Thanks, bay-bee! Could you feel the passion of my soul? Yeeeaaah, I rock! It’s all finally happening for me!Actually, I was making fun of you.   Yet the investigation into the cause bears no progress! This is evidence of the power behind them! Don’t bow down to the oppressive authority that deceives you all! Break free from its subjugation! Yes! YES! I, the Sun God, will protect you all, blessing you with peace and security!...Let’s just head to the diner. Music: Break it Down (Elp Version)    I can’t believe you stayed this long ordering just coffee. You’ve got some guts.Maaku gets Guts +1. It looks like you were able to focus, even with all this noise.Maaku gets Knowledge +2. Music: Beneath the Mask (Instrumental Version)  Don’t worry. I’m sure the change of heart worked.   He’ll definitely change. It would be a real problem for us if he didn’t. You’re right. It’s a little too early to be giving up now. Guess we’re gonna find out one way or the other tomorrow. We just gotta brace ourselves for all the possibilities. I’m sorry I can’t offer more reassurance, but he should have the change of heart. Let’s just believe in that while we wait for tomorrow. A nice relaxing bath should help distract us. Maaku gets Charm +2. Music: Disquiet   Why couldn’t they give us today off, too? We have the rest of the week off starting tomorrow… Yeah, it’s ridiculous. Speaking of, what’s up with that calling card? The one sent to Kamoshida. Didn’t it say something about “stealing his distorted desires” or something weird like that? Yeah, something like that… I’m sure it’s just a prank. No one’s taking it seriously.  I bet it’s about that girl that jumped the other day. They don’t have to tell us not to commit suicide. There was that weird calling card too, so I guess the teachers are freaking out? We were lucky that morning practice got canceled though. I feel like I may faint if this takes forever.   As you all know, a tragic event took place the other day. Thankfully, we have been informed that she has pulled through, but it will take time until she recovers. Everyone here has a bright future ahead. I implore that you rethink the importance of life and--    That is why I will confess everything to you all...Music: Regret   What’s wrong with Mr. Kamoshida? What’s this about? Confess? Did the volleyball team do something? I have repeatedly done things that were... unbecoming of a teacher. Verbally abusing students… physically abusing my team, and… sexually harassing female students. I am the reason why Shiho Suzui tried to kill herself! Sexual harassment? What? Why would he say that himself? Ugh. He is the worst! The volleyball team, really? Physical abuse? There were even students that I sentenced to expulsion, simply because I didn’t like them… I will, of course, rescind those… I am truly sorry for putting innocent youths through such horrible acts. I am an arrogant, shallow… and shameful person. No, I’m worse than that... Uhhhh What? Did he just say that? Kill himself? Mr. Kamoshida is, um, not well! (The rest is unintelligible and unsubtitled)  Everyone, return to your classes! I--  You have no right to run from this! You’re right… You’re absolutely right… I should be punished under the law and atone for my crimes… I did horrible things to Takamaki-san, as well. In return for giving Suzui-san a position on the team… I tried to force her into having relations. Disgusting. Ugh, for a position on the team? That’s horrible. I feel so bad for Takamaki-san. So the rumors were true. As of today, I will resign from my position as an instructor and turn myself in. The police!? For real!? He’s gonna get arrested!? This morning’s assembly is over! Return to your classes immediately! Isn’t this just like what that calling card said…? Does this mean the Phantom Thieves thing was for real!? Was something done to Kamoshida!? C’mon, there’s no way you could steal someone’s heart! But why else would he start saying things like he’ll kill himself or turn himself in? Maybe because it almost got leaked? Don’t they go easier on you if you turn yourself in? I wonder what happened... Who knows? But man, Kamoshida turned out to be one sick bastard. Hey, is this for real? He’s turning himself in, just like that? This makes no sense! What’s going to happen to the volleyball team? (More unintelligible chatter) Return to your classrooms at once!  Seems like it. But, was this really for the best?I’m not sure I understand the question, Ryuji. This is exactly what we wanted and needed to happen.  Yeah… it’s gotta be. But things’re happenin’ way too fast...  Huh…? We all knew… but we pretended we didn’t. Takamaki-san, I had you all wrong… I’m sorry that I spread rumors about you!I don’t mean to keep harping on the translation, especially because the situation seems to be that the pronunciation was out of the hands of the localizers who were trying to appease Japanese clients, but this girl is the only person in the entire game who pronounces “Takamaki” with the correct emphasis and it’s really weird. I didn’t know at all… Kamoshida was forcefully pushing himself on you… It must’ve been so hard for you…! I’m sure there’s a ton of people who want to apologize to you. We’re so sorry…! No, it’s OK. The same goes for me too… Besides, that’s all in the past now. W-Well, see you later then... ...I swear I’ll make it up to you someday. Man, I’m glad for you. Looks like those weird rumors are gonna go away. My thing doesn’t really matter. We made Kamoshida apologize about Shiho… That’s more than enough for me. You should hurry and tell her about it then. ...Yeah.We changed Kamoshida’s heart. Now to figure out what to do next. Arist fucked around with this message at 21:51 on Aug 14, 2019 |
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Jun 8, 2017 19:44
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Sojiro's smug little grin is absolutely perfect for this line, I love it.
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Jun 8, 2017 20:23
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The moment that Kamo-piece of poo poo confesses is like, the fourth most satisfying thing in the game, and the other three things are lategame events.
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Jun 8, 2017 20:29
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This line is so goofy, but I love the way it's delivered. D.C. Douglas really did a great job making Kamoshida feel like an arrogant rear end in a top hat previously, and someone who knows he's human garbage here.
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Jun 8, 2017 20:30
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I don't really blame Ryuji for being conflicted about this; yes, it's what we wanted to happen, but... seeing somebody do a complete 180 like that is concerning, because of how much it smacks of "brainwashing"- of forcing somebody to accept the "correct" viewpoint without them going through the development necessary to make that change natural. I mean, the way it's portrayed here is most akin to religious epiphany, but it was no God or self examination that brought it about- it was us, actively beaking the evil thoughts out of him. The fact that the game doesn't shy away from presenting that ambiguity, and the question if it really is any kind of solution for short or long term, is something that does impress me, even if they don't really go as far as they could have in grappling with that issue.
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Jun 8, 2017 20:50
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I think the reservation that Ryuji's having here is that, good intentions or not, we did just kinda brainwash a dude. Even if he was the scummiest person on earth, I'd still be asking myself if I should be wielding that kind of power if I was in that situation. And I guess it doesn't help that, rather than the party just chasing after Kamoshida of their own volition, the game puts a personal impetus on them to take him down, otherwise their necks are on the line too. Obviously necessary from a gameplay standpoint, but from a narrative view, it makes the group seem like they're changing his heart to save their own skins, not to see justice done.
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Jun 8, 2017 20:51
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Blastinus posted:I think the reservation that Ryuji's having here is that, good intentions or not, we did just kinda brainwash a dude. Even if he was the scummiest person on earth, I'd still be asking myself if I should be wielding that kind of power if I was in that situation. I'm really hoping the game digs deep into that question. While the team is all about rebelling against authority, what happens when they have the power to *become* the authority? Should they be deciding who gets a brain shattering, just because they can? If Morgana gets too skeevy, should the team jump into his "castle" and destroy that part of him? What about dealing with Ryuji's anger? I enjoy a good analysis of such questions and how to deal with such issues.
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Jun 8, 2017 21:20
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I went and peeked ahead after the boss fight, but Kamoshida's confession was certainly a thing. "Hey kids, I've been abusing male students, sexually assaulting female students, caused Shiho to nearly kill herself, and tried to have sex with Ann over there. I'm gonna kill myself after this." How do you even process someone coming in and saying something like that? I guess just that extreme of a reaction is why Ryuji is reserved about the whole thing, because holy poo poo. And, again, Kamoshida would have killed himself over this.
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Jun 8, 2017 21:45
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Yeah, Ryuji's response basically boils down to "Holy poo poo what have we done" and it's an entirely valid question. Yeah, Kamoshida was a complete piece of poo poo and doing what they did not only saved their own hides but probably the sanity and lives of a good number of their fellow students. On the other hand, they literally invaded someone's mind and changed their very essence. That's a nasty philosophical problem, let alone power in the hands of teenagers.
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Jun 8, 2017 23:10
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OTOH a person's castle represents their distorted desires. It's literally an unnatural state of being, if Morgana is to be believed. It's not so much brainwashing as returning a person to the good self they were before via some rapidly working magical therapy. The idea that kids can invade a person's mind like this is, of course, still one hell of a thing to process. It's a lot of power regardless. I do like the idealistic view that permeates through this concept though. Yes, society is poo poo and worth rebelling against: but this shittiness is not normal. Even Kamoshida was a good man at some point, and can be returned to the good man he is at his core. The guilt and shame that were locked away by self-rationalization and a lack of criticism by his environment are back in full swing, and it happened by healing a person of their inner demons and returning them to a normal state of being. At least that's how I took the explanation of "distorted desires" by Morgana.
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Jun 9, 2017 00:11
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I thought Morgana basically said that this rips out a person's ability to desire to the point that they could end up in a coma.
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Jun 9, 2017 00:15
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GunnerJ posted:I thought Morgana basically said that this rips out a person's ability to desire to the point that they could end up in a coma. I thought he said that only happened if you killed the person's Shadow, but I might be misremembering.
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Jun 9, 2017 00:35
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Shadow Kamoshida said the real him would die if his Shadow did, so they just got the Shadow to feel guilty instead.
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Jun 9, 2017 00:42
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Yeah, if they'd done it exactly the way Morgana told them to, they would have risked Kamoshida shutting down mentally. But it went slightly differently than what Morgana outlined, and that specific difference led to the change of heart.
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Jun 9, 2017 01:08
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Basically: Kill shadow in palace, kill person in real life. Steal Distorted Desires/Treasure FROM palace, And this is just the start of the cavalcade of fuckups we'll wind up meeting over the course of the game. It's AAAAALLLLL down hill from here.
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Jun 9, 2017 01:19
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Kemix posted:cavalcade of fuckups 
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Jun 9, 2017 01:26
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Deltasquid posted:OTOH a person's castle represents their distorted desires. It's literally an unnatural state of being, if Morgana is to be believed. It's not so much brainwashing as returning a person to the good self they were before via some rapidly working magical therapy. The idea that kids can invade a person's mind like this is, of course, still one hell of a thing to process. It's a lot of power regardless. It is remarkably normal for otherwise good people to fall into horrible habits or commit terrible acts due to a lack of self control or reflection. Kamoshida was an awful person but stories like his are depressingly common. A significant percentage of the kids and adults I've worked with (all of them with some form of intellectual and most with physical disabilities) have been sexually molested or faced major abuse at the hands of families, friends, and/or caregivers. When there's a lack of support, responsibility, and institutional control coupled with a high stress environment people will do awful poo poo to other people. The distortion is a natural result of too much control and not enough oversight or accountability, absolute power corrupts absolutely. People naturally want to explore and test boundaries. I don't see this as a rebellion against authority so much as against corruption.
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Jun 9, 2017 01:33
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The way I interpret the change of heart is that these people start out doing something just a little bit wrong. Then they make an excuse for their behavior. Then they eventually do something a little more wrong. Another excuse. They do something more wrong. Other people cover for them, for the sake of avoiding the attention of a scandal. "Oh, it must be okay, what I'm doing" they subconsciously think. This continues on and on, until you build up this giant knot of excuses and rationalizations. The change of heart removes that knot, allowing a person's innate moral fiber to reassert itself, which it does with a vengeance. e: On an unrelated note, in the Japanese language track Ms. Chouno's engrish is the worst. I mean, it's really above and beyond bad, even by the standards of engrish. And she's the English teacher! Feels like it had to have been intentional. Montegoraon fucked around with this message at 03:28 on Jun 9, 2017 |
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Jun 9, 2017 03:25
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McFetusBurger posted:It is remarkably normal for otherwise good people to fall into horrible habits or commit terrible acts due to a lack of self control or reflection. Kamoshida was an awful person but stories like his are depressingly common. A significant percentage of the kids and adults I've worked with (all of them with some form of intellectual and most with physical disabilities) have been sexually molested or faced major abuse at the hands of families, friends, and/or caregivers. When there's a lack of support, responsibility, and institutional control coupled with a high stress environment people will do awful poo poo to other people. Yeah, definitely. I'm just saying I like the way the story presents this, rather than going for "some people are just innately bad, go brainwash them" which they could have taken as an angle, but didn't. I think the distorted desires angle is both closer to reality and serves for a better story. On the other hand, pretty much every person in a position of authority (even one as simple as "I'm an adult and you're a kid") so far has been an absolute jackass to Joker, Ryuji, Ann, or all of them. Only Sojiro is kinda sorta warming up to you now. That does rather imply that any sort of authority, at least in this story, corrupts a person to a certain degree, if only by making them rude and dismissive. Only Kamoshida rose to the challenge of being a completely irredeemable rear end in a top hat though.
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Jun 9, 2017 08:21
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I think the distinction is that while authority seems to "corrupt" everyone to a certain degree, but specifically when it comes to people who challenge authority, not everyone abuses authority. Wonder if there are any people who resent the fact that Kamoshida resigned in disgrace. It seemed to me like there were a number of people, including students, who knew but still wanted to keep him around for the sake of prestige and their academic careers. Maybe the sexual harassment angle changes things.
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Jun 9, 2017 12:36
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Tempest_56 posted:Yeah, Ryuji's response basically boils down to "Holy poo poo what have we done" and it's an entirely valid question. Yeah, Kamoshida was a complete piece of poo poo and doing what they did not only saved their own hides but probably the sanity and lives of a good number of their fellow students. On the other hand, they literally invaded someone's mind and changed their very essence. That's a nasty philosophical problem, let alone power in the hands of teenagers. But do they actually have that power? Someone gave them access to Kamoshida's Palace, via the app. They can't brainwash anyone else unless they can get into their Palace. So is it really Joker and friends who have the power?
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Jun 9, 2017 14:27
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The Lone Badger posted:But do they actually have that power? They've got it and are able to use it, so yes? If you're holding a gun, the fact that it belongs to someone else doesn't change what you can do with it and the actions you would take are still your responsibility. There's some good reasons behind why the team did what they did - but Ryuji asking if it's right is something they should be doing. Theirs or no, it's a lot of power to put into the hands of kids who are, what, 15? 16?
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Jun 9, 2017 14:49
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I'm not sure they actually do know how to use it, though. It kinda activated by accident to get them to Kamoshida's palace. Still not clear how Morgana did it. Or how Morgana knows anything...
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Jun 9, 2017 14:55
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GunnerJ posted:I'm not sure they actually do know how to use it, though. It kinda activated by accident to get them to Kamoshida's palace. He's a cat. He goes where he wants.
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Jun 9, 2017 14:59
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Igor came right out and said that he "bestowed [the Metaverse Navigator] to you as a means to train you as a thief" in like the second visit to the Velvet Room, for those who've forgotten already.
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Jun 9, 2017 15:02
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Igor might have said in the very same visit that he drops it on all potential Phantom Thieves Joker meets, but he does mention it early.
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Jun 9, 2017 15:30
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Tempest_56 posted:They've got it and are able to use it, so yes? What I meant is that they can't choose their target or do it on their own initiative, they have to wait to be given a target. They're the gun, not the hand aiming it.
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Jun 10, 2017 01:09
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The Lone Badger posted:What I meant is that they can't choose their target or do it on their own initiative, they have to wait to be given a target. They're the gun, not the hand aiming it. That's all incorrect, as will be made clear in the next few weeks as the game progresses.
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Jun 10, 2017 02:04
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Yeah, without wanting to delve into spoilers, we're still in the prologue with the crew trying to figure things out.
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Jun 10, 2017 10:08
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Part 20: 5/2-5/4: Guess What You're An Accessory To?  Does this mean that they won’t have a mental shutdown even if their Palace disappears…? I see… So we need to persuade the Shadow without killing it, and then send it back to its real self. Our targets won’t undergo a cognitive collapse if we do that.We lucked into the correct way to solve the problem, huh. That’s rather convenient. So, we can get ‘em to confess with no bad stuff?  Don’t worry about it. So… how’d it go? With Shiho, I mean...Music: Break it Down   For real!? It was only for a little bit, but I got to talk to her…! I was able to tell her that Kamoshida admitted to what he did…! Shiho, she… she told me she was sorry… Looks like she found out that I was flirting with Kamoshida for her sake… And here I was, wanting to apologize to her. Kamoshida’s at fault for all this. I know… Shiho’s mom is thinking of transferring her to another school after she recovers. The whole sexual harassment and attempted suicide… people will label her after that. Sounded like Shiho had the same idea too. It’s gonna get lonely... But, I think it’s for the best… I’m sure it’ll be hard if she stays here. She’s alive. You can see her anytime. *nods* ...I need to change too. That aside, I was surprised you could hold yourself back against Kamoshida’s Shadow. It wasn’t like that… I just wanted Kamoshida to apologize himself. You’re so kind, Lady Ann. No matter how much of a poo poo bag he was, finishing him off woulda left a bad aftertaste, huh? Huh? That’s not it. I think revenge is better served if I make him repent. Realizing what he’s done, he’ll grovel for forgiveness the rest of his life, you know? I just believe there are fates worse than death. A-Anyways, that’s all settled… But you know, there was one more thing I was wonderin’ about that castle. Why was Kamoshida the only one who had that Metaverse thing? It isn’t necessarily limited to him. It’s something anyone could have if their heart became warped from their desires. Anyone... Wanna check it out? N-Not right now. We better lay low for a while. People are still gonna be talkin’ about Kamoshida. Then again, it’s totally impossible for someone to find out what we did at his Palace. Yeah, about that… Weird rumors about you guys are already going around. Stuff like, you got together and threatened Kamoshida with something close to physical violence…Oh no, my sterling reputation!  People aren’t going to easily believe that phantom thieves really exist. The calling card’s being treated like it was a prank by someone who knew what Kamoshida was doing. We’re the ones who did it, and I still don’t completely believe it myself. Let’s wait for things to settle down for the time being. It’d be better if we pawned it off ASAP. Ooh, got a hit! Remember that time in middle school? I lent you some money. Wouldn’t it be around that much with compounded interest? I’m not saying that I’m taking all of it. Hey, that’s not Ryuji’s money to give you, Ann! I’m the one who loving pays for everything. Goddamn, I’ve been spending all my money on lovely vegetable drinks and food for my plant, I need this! Dammit... I agree on laying low and keeping an eye on the situation. However, you dragged me into this. It would be nonsense not to celebrate a successful mission. I guess we could blow this dirty money on something fun.Goddammit. Discussions among phantom thieves are to take place over luxurious food. How about it? Hey, wait-- …Nah, I guess it’s fine. There’s somewhere I want to go then. Where’s that? It’s a place Shiho and I have been wanting to go for a while. I owe money, so I can’t complain… You good with that? Wait no I was being sar-- I’ll leave it to your discretion as well, Lady Ann. I’ll call and check the prices later then. When should we go? Wanna do it soon, like tomorrow? Why don’t we go on the last day of the holidays? It’ll help energize us when school life starts up again the day after. Then… the 5th, on Children’s Day. So, who’s going to sell this? Leave that to us. We know a store that’ll buy anything. Don’t we, Maaku? OK, I’ll leave that to you guys. Music: Beneath the Mask (Instrumental Version)  No, that one is a fake. It’s just a by-product of his cognition. The real medal should still be in his posession. What…? You’re telling me Kamoshida’s still got the medal? Who cares? What matters is that we changed his heart. And anyway, if we had taken the real thing, that’d be stealing!Heaven forbid we phantom thieves steal anything. I don’t think he’ll be proud of that medal anymore regardless. You let go of stuff pretty easy, huh? Wanna forget about my debt? Stop digging that up! Back in middle school, we went on a field trip to the aquarium. But Ryuji had to spend all his money on a souvenir, so I lent him some for the train fare. I said I was sorry… That was for my mom. Well, I guess I can call it even after all we’ve been through. Anyways, we don’t gotta worry about selling that medal off if it’s a fake! End of story! Kamoshida will never be proud of that once-in-a-lifetime gold medal ever again. Depending on how you look at it, that punishment might be even worse than death for him. For me, it just means more customers and even more work.Poor Sojiro.  I-I have an alibi! I was nowhere near there! I wasn’t even close enough to hear the gunshot! ...Funny. I never mentioned anything about a gunshot.Hah, these detective shows are so hackneyed. This is a cop drama, right? It’s pretty interesting. Let’s just take another bath. Maaku gets Charm +3.   You don’t have plans, do you? Come help me out, instead of sleeping your life away.I mean, I kinda do have pla-- We do owe it to him… …We’ll just have to wait. Hurry down and help him out.Music: Alleycat  And now to our next topic… Fall from Grace: The story of a dishonored Olympic medalist. Just recently, a high school coach admitted to his school that he had been perpetually abusing students. Given his prior Olympic achievements, this has caused quite a stir. What caused this habitual offender to suddenly confess these heinous crimes to his entire school? The police are hoping that the upcoming interrogations will bring light to this question. Hm? Isn’t this…? It was scary, but I’m relieved that the abuse is finally going to end now. I’m glad I don’t have to deal with that sexual harassment anymore... Like, I’m totally shocked they were actually true. At least now I can go to school without worrying.  *sigh* Things might be getting turbulent at school, but you need to just keep your head down, all right? ...More importantly, keep those hands moving. I’ve got some more stuff I need you to do.Music: Beneath the Mask (Instrumental Version)   No way the school’s gonna be able to play dumb after that. I saw it too. Shiho’s name didn’t come up, right? Not that I saw. I’d bet they wanted to keep that part quiet. I’m so glad... It’s finally over then… All we gotta do now is eat some tasty poo poo and put all this crap behind us. I’m totally looking forward to this celebration party. I’ll try not to let you guys down! Even if the chief wants your help, make sure you turn him down, OK?The next day...   Just do it. Don’t get cocky with me. ...Oh, hey… Sae. What the gently caress are you doing here?  Am I interrupting something? Not at all. Police are hurrying to solve the matter as it may relate to the rise in psychotic breakdown incidents. Oh, is that the thing everyone’s been talking about? Doesn’t it make you curious? People who were living normal lives suddenly went mad or deranged out of the blue… Not to mention that it’s happening one after another… Could they really be coincidental? Hmm… Leaving that aside… What’ll you have? …… ...I’ll have the house blend please. I’m his slave. Call the cops. Uh, that’s exactly the case… Are you a high school student? Where do you attend? Oh…? Someone I know goes there as well. I’ve heard that things are rough right now. A teacher named Kamoshida confessed his crimes like he was a completely different person supposedly. What? I have no idea how to parse this sentence. Why is “all of a sudden” in quotes? Some of Sae’s dialogue feels like it was almost machine-translated, but the machine didn’t know English very well either. Can a person’s mental state change so easily? ...Huh. Is my drink ready yet? ...Coming right up. Music: Tokyo Daylight  You know some place that’ll buy it off you, right?We can’t actually head anywhere but the one place we can sell this medal or the game gets snippy.  My time with Yakuza 0 tells me this guy isn’t that menacing. Where’s the sweater tied around his neck?  You want a job where you can make stacks without lots of work? Do I!  Hey, don’t listen! And I think we’ve seen him around before… Anyway, pawning off the gold medal should be our top priority right now. Ignore that guy!Why won’t the cat let me ruin my life    Looks like word about Kamoshida spread fast. Anyway, let’s head to Untouchable, in case you couldn’t figure out that’s where we sell poo poo.   Looks like it. Let’s just take care of this. Wait! We don’t have a search warrant yet. Just be patient. I’m sure we’ll get one soon enough. And they’d never think about running off down this narrow alley. I’m sure that’s nothing to worry about. Let’s just head inside. Music: Layer Cake    Huh? A gold medal? Why do you have this? We don’t buy any fake or stolen goods here, kid. ...Hold on a sec. Lemme see it.  Hmph. 30,000 it is then.   Golly, thanks mister.  Sure, this all seems legit.  Glad you’re so quick to understand. Music: Suspicion  ...Go, kid. Maaku isn’t very bright.  I dunno, lookin’ for evidence? You tell me, Detective-san. Well, you guys gonna search me? Go on, do what you gotta do. ...What was that? An upstandin’ citizen’s supposed to cooperate with the cops, right? Hey, you sure that lead was legitimate? I could’ve sworn it was... Can you two hurry it up? I got a business to run here. You bastard...  What’s in the bag, huh? Show me! ...The kid’s just a regular ol’ customer. You can check the tapes if that’ll convince you. They’ll show everything that’s gone down here today. I should leave... I won’t let you get away that easy! Show us what’s in the bag! *chuckle* You piece of poo poo…! Hey, you’re talking to a kid, remember? Besides, he’s not the one we’re here to see. Urgh... That’s right, Detective-san. Maybe next time try not harassin’ my customers, see how that goes. Grrr… Safe trip home, kid. More importantly… aren’t you curious about what’s in the bag?  Come on, let’s open it up.  It’s incredible though! Miles ahead of the one Ryuji had. There’s something weird about that place… Hey Maaku, I just had a great idea… We should totally buy this gun from him later! I mean, it’s perfect. Something this real-looking would work wonders in the Metaverse… Anyway, he told you to bring it back the next time you came, right? You should try striking a deal with him when we go to return it! Music: Break it Down (Elp Version)    I saw the news. You know, about Kamoshida. It’s getting a lot of coverage... I don’t know… The reaction’s been bigger than what I was expecting… I guess I’m just… surprised. I don’t think we did anything wrong though. I wonder if we helped those people speak up about it... That’s pretty amazing, huh? I didn’t think we’d actually be able to do it! And yet look at us now! This calls for a celebration! Let’s meet in front of Shibuya Station at noon tomorrow. Don’t be late! Oh, and did you pawn off that medal? You didn’t forget, right? Good to hear! I already made reservations! You should be really excited about the place I chose, by the way. I’m sure everyone’s gonna love it! Well, see you guys tomorrow! Hey, what do you think we’re gonna be eating? Ooh, I could go for some wagyu beef! It better be Grade-A! In any case, I’m surely looking forward to it! Mwehehehe! Tune in next time to see just how we celebrate our big success. Arist fucked around with this message at 21:55 on Aug 14, 2019 |
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Jun 12, 2017 18:45
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