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What is going to be your favorite offseason storyline? This poll is closed. |
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| The Big3 Tourney |
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67 | 22.41% |
| Will Lakers draft Ball |
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40 | 13.38% |
| Where will the Pauls go |
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54 | 18.06% |
| Will LeBron jump ship to the Spurs or ?? |
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41 | 13.71% |
| Will every team in the league just pivot towards tanking |
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97 | 32.44% |
| Total: | 210 votes | ||
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Cool Buff Man posted:His stats look underwhelming because he has to cover so much ground for Isaiah. Anyone who watches the team knows how insane he is on d. I mean, I watch the Celtics a lot and I'm kind of surprising myself here. I do think he's a good defender, and he "feels" like a good player. But his offensive stats are plain ole not good. 44th best TS among guards who played 1500 minutes, in part cause he doesn't get to the line at all, not expected to pass much but no indication that he's very good at it when he does, he had a weird blip where he got tons of rebounds before his injury this year but other than that has never been anything but an average rebounding guard, he's not fast, he isn't a great shooter, he just doesn't give you any real options over any random guy on offense. He looks like a great defender, and stats bear out that he's better there than on offense, but of course defensive stats are weird. DPM has him as a negative the last three years, just barely, but then it says the same about Klay Thompson so eeeeh. I think he's good there. I think top 5 on ball defender is ridiculous, he's 6'2" (with a giant 7' wingspan comparatively) and can only really guard 1s and 2s. He's definitely not on in the Lebron/Kawhi/Green/Old Tony Allen kind of tier where he can switch onto and guard anyone on the perimeter, and I don't think he's even quite on the level of Danny Green or Klay or Sefolosha as a pure guard defender. He's specifically quite effective on shooting point guards who are bothered by length and undersized 2s. He reminds me of a shorter but longer Courtney Lee, which is a very nice guy to have but totally replaceable. edit: and he was young but getting a lot of minutes before IT came along and he was no better on offense then either.
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Jun 14, 2017 15:50
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DeimosRising posted:I mean, I watch the Celtics a lot and I'm kind of surprising myself here. I do think he's a good defender, and he "feels" like a good player. But his offensive stats are plain ole not good. 44th best TS among guards who played 1500 minutes, in part cause he doesn't get to the line at all, not expected to pass much but no indication that he's very good at it when he does, he had a weird blip where he got tons of rebounds before his injury this year but other than that has never been anything but an average rebounding guard, he's not fast, he isn't a great shooter, he just doesn't give you any real options over any random guy on offense. He looks like a great defender, and stats bear out that he's better there than on offense, but of course defensive stats are weird. DPM has him as a negative the last three years, just barely, but then it says the same about Klay Thompson so eeeeh. I think he's good there. I think top 5 on ball defender is ridiculous, he's 6'2" (with a giant 7' wingspan comparatively) and can only really guard 1s and 2s. He's definitely not on in the Lebron/Kawhi/Green/Old Tony Allen kind of tier where he can switch onto and guard anyone on the perimeter, and I don't think he's even quite on the level of Danny Green or Klay or Sefolosha as a pure guard defender. He's specifically quite effective on shooting point guards who are bothered by length and undersized 2s. He reminds me of a shorter but longer Courtney Lee, which is a very nice guy to have but totally replaceable. I mean I feel like we're talking about different people here when you're saying he's not as good as Thabo Sefalosha on defense. You're welcome to that opinion of course but I don't think we're going to find much common ground to have a solid debate here. I also don't think there's anything wrong with a 16 ppg 55% true shooting/ 39% from three guard and calling those stats "plain ole not good" is just misrepresentation A very good defensive guard who can shoot ~40% from three and cover up the defensive deficiencies of by far the worst defender in the league is better than what you're painting him as. He's not an all-star or anything but he's not a "JAG" either. And HERE is the undeniable proof that he is something special https://twitter.com/CJMcCollum/status/716107313891778560 Marcus Smart is probably a better defender though. Too bad about the shooting. His hair was cut off though so maybe some strides will be made. Cool Buff Man fucked around with this message at 17:53 on Jun 14, 2017 |
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Jun 14, 2017 16:52
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The SituAsian posted:Is it better for the Celtics to go for it now by signing Hayward and maybe adding Jimmy or try to build around Fultz, Jaylen Brown and the 2018 pick? I might be late to this discussion, but do the Celtics even need Butler? I think IT/Fultz/Hayward/Horford/etc is a pretty good lineup to have.
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Jun 14, 2017 17:11
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pubic works project posted:I might be late to this discussion, but do the Celtics even need Butler? That'd be alright but it's still the worst rebounding lineup in the league. Something's gotta give there or they're going to get bullied the same way they did last year
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Jun 14, 2017 17:14
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I'm not sure what Boston's cap situation is so let's say they get Hayward on a max deal obviously would they be able to get Dedmon?
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Jun 14, 2017 17:19
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Cool Buff Man posted:That'd be alright but it's still the worst rebounding lineup in the league. Something's gotta give there or they're going to get bullied the same way they did last year What nefarious schemes swirl in the mind of Danny Ainge only the  knows
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Jun 14, 2017 17:23
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pubic works project posted:I might be late to this discussion, but do the Celtics even need Butler? They would still need a good center imo and someone to cover for ITs black hole of defence
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Jun 14, 2017 17:24
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Are we all glossing over the fact that Morey is about to trade for Carmelo or what
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Jun 14, 2017 17:59
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Paul Zuvella posted:Fultz is big, long, and athletic. He will make a bigger impact that I think you are making it out to be but I agree that it does almost nothing to close the gap between the Celtics and the Cavs. A few other other big, long and athletic rookies who weren't positive contributors in their rookie seasons: Lebron James, Kevin Durant, Giannis Antetokounpo. Being an effective player as a rookie in the NBA is very rare, and the younger the rookie is, the rarer it is. I can see him being a slightly above average efficiency player for the C's as a rookie, but only because they're a good enough team that they won't throw him out there for 30MPG. They can use him in a smaller role than most #1 picks, but that limits the impact he'll have. However they decide to use him, I think it's likely he's a net negative player as a rookie.
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Jun 14, 2017 18:01
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pubic works project posted:
I think they need to try and ship IT while his stock is high, his offensive production is great but he is basically putting his team through a 4v5 on one half of the ball. Plus if they start calling his carries, he is going to be really screwed on the other end as well
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Jun 14, 2017 18:07
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Lebron shot poorly in his rookie year, but he was most definitely a positive contributor. I'd be happy with any rookie that put up 5 winshares.
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Jun 14, 2017 18:08
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Bush Did Outer Heaven posted:Are we all glossing over the fact that Morey is about to trade for Carmelo or what Usually GMs don't purposefully torpedo their franchise but mayhaps they do
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Jun 14, 2017 18:11
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Are clubs free to make whatever moves they want now or is there a transaction window?
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Jun 14, 2017 18:11
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zoux posted:Are clubs free to make whatever moves they want now or is there a transaction window? july 1 verbal agreements can be made, can begin signing july 6
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Jun 14, 2017 18:13
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Away all Goats posted:Considering the talent on the Warriors Ainge would need 3 superstars at minimum. I don't agree. I think 2 superstars and a excellent defense and coaching could be enough. The Spurs have one superstar and a great defense and coaching and are really, really close.
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Jun 14, 2017 18:15
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Bush Did Outer Heaven posted:Are we all glossing over the fact that Morey is about to trade for Carmelo or what Actually I have it on good authority that 
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Jun 14, 2017 18:20
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Boston would be wasting their time building a roster to beat the Warriors or Spurs or whoever is running the west. Build to beat Cleveland first.
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Jun 14, 2017 18:23
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The B_36 posted:A few other other big, long and athletic rookies who weren't positive contributors in their rookie seasons: Lebron James, Kevin Durant, Giannis Antetokounpo. Being an effective player as a rookie in the NBA is very rare, and the younger the rookie is, the rarer it is. The gently caress? What kind of dumbass revisionist history is Lebron James and Kevin Durant not being positive contributors during their rookie years? Durant earned 2.3 win shares despite being played out of position and Lebron had like a Vorp of 3 and winshares above 5. Yeah Giannis has not great but he spend the better part of his basketball career up to that point playing against 5 foot tall dudes in Greece so you can see why he might struggle out of the gate. Never mind the fact that those dudes are all forwards and Fultz is a Point Guard. If you want to compare him to contemporary players, look at Wall or Kyrie. Wall came out and played pretty well his rookie year, and Kyrie played at drat near All Star levels. Elite Point Guard prospects can do well their rookie years.
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Jun 14, 2017 18:24
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https://twitter.com/darrenrovell/status/875036632377958401 Anyone here?
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Jun 14, 2017 18:26
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if he successfully markets people not liking him lavar is a genius
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Jun 14, 2017 18:30
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I don't think Fultz is the same kind of prospect Wall and Kyrie were. That's not a strike against Fultz, but those guys would probably go ahead of Fultz if there were in this draft class.
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Jun 14, 2017 18:33
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No way Kyrie goes over Fultz. Kyrie is a great player but he barely played in college and while he was the consensus #1 in that class, (if I'm remembering correctly) that class was thought to be very poor. I could see Wall going before him because of how enamored people were of his athleticism/speed. I'd take Fultz over either of them, I think he's a more complete prospect coming out of school. mikeraskol fucked around with this message at 18:46 on Jun 14, 2017 |
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Jun 14, 2017 18:40
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The Duggler posted:I think they need to try and ship IT while his stock is high, his offensive production is great but he is basically putting his team through a 4v5 on one half of the ball. Yep. IT is an inspirational guy who can score, but it's not enough. If you can cash him in for a defensive big and replace him with Fultz in the starting rotation, your team defense immediately improves by leaps and bounds even though Fultz won't be very good as a rookie. Sign in Hayward to pick up some of IT's scoring slack. Trade a bunch of chips for Jimmy Butler. Now you are really creating something scary.
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Jun 14, 2017 18:41
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The Duggler posted:I think they need to try and ship IT while his stock is high, his offensive production is great but he is basically putting his team through a 4v5 on one half of the ball. If they can get a good pick and a defensive big for IT, I'd do it. Fultz/Bradley/Hayward/Horford/new big guy.
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Jun 14, 2017 18:47
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Damnit don't make me like Lonzo I don't want him on the Lakers
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Jun 14, 2017 18:48
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mikeraskol posted:No way Kyrie goes over Fultz. Kyrie is a great player but he barely played in college and while he was the consensus #1 in that class, (if I'm remembering correctly) that class was thought to be very poor. Man, I wonder what European Blake Griffin is up to these days.
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Jun 14, 2017 18:52
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What's the point if you can't get the whole set fam? Not a big baller.
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Jun 14, 2017 18:53
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Cool Buff Man posted:I mean I feel like we're talking about different people here when you're saying he's not as good as Thabo Sefalosha on defense. You're welcome to that opinion of course but I don't think we're going to find much common ground to have a solid debate here. I also don't think there's anything wrong with a 16 ppg 55% true shooting/ 39% from three guard and calling those stats "plain ole not good" is just misrepresentation Bradley I s like a huge mosquito. He is very good at applying pressure to ball handlers. Hi s off ball defense is not outstanding. Drpm hurts twos and threes because they're family ften guarding the other teams most explosive scorer. Klay Thompson and Avery Bradley are not bad defenders. However, Bradley's defense is easier to see, because he's out there at the top and f the key pestering zomeone, like Eric Beverly or Dennis Smith at nc state. Marcus smart is a great defender who needs a haircut
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Jun 14, 2017 19:02
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Dejan Bimble posted:Bradley I s like a huge mosquito. He is very good at applying pressure to ball handlers. Hi s off ball defense is not outstanding. Drpm hurts twos and threes because they're family ften guarding the other teams most explosive scorer. Klay Thompson and Avery Bradley are not bad defenders. However, Bradley's defense is easier to see, because he's out there at the top and f the key pestering zomeone, like Eric Beverly or Dennis Smith at nc state. Marcus smart is a great defender who needs a haircut Smart cut his hair and had that huge game in the playoffs!!!
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Jun 14, 2017 19:06
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Bigass Moth posted:What's the point if you can't get the whole set fam? Not a big baller. For only $12K it's a steal! LOL, Ball probably got $5K for this deal, and that is being very generous. Still, more than our sigs are worth.
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Jun 14, 2017 19:36
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https://twitter.com/KDTrey5/status/2056108193
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Jun 14, 2017 19:42
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Which players from the 2014 draft do y'all think are getting extensions this offseason Wiggins is the only I see guaranteed to get a max extension. Embiid maybe? Would the Sixers really give a max extension to a guy who has only played 31 games? With Parker and LaVine's unfortunate injuries, I see them not signing extensions unless they take a big discount from their teams. There's a bunch of other guys I can see getting extensions (Gordon, Hood, Nurkic) but not for the max. And it's still early but boy that "one of the deepest and most hyped draft classes in recent years" thing is not looking very accurate thus far https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_NBA_draft
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Jun 14, 2017 20:00
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JesusSinfulHands posted:Which players from the 2014 draft do y'all think are getting extensions this offseason Jokic
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Jun 14, 2017 20:03
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Woj posted:"Boston is really the danger for Blake Griffin," said Wojnarowski. "I think Boston's two primary free agent targets, right now, are Gordon Hayward and Blake Griffin. Now they're not going to get both of them, but they're both players that would potentially have interest there. I think Boston looks at in different ways with their future." If Blake could stay healthy for a year I would be on board. I love his passing
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Jun 14, 2017 20:06
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Cool Buff Man posted:If Blake could stay healthy for a year I would be on board. I love his passing Who would you rather have?
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Jun 14, 2017 20:14
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David Stern is going to be one of those old people who doesn't know when to keep his mouth shut. https://twitter.com/Deadspin/status/875035477061009409
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Jun 14, 2017 20:14
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pubic works project posted:Who would you rather have? Griffin for a win now attempt, Hayward for a more stable future. I would love either one obviously and the chances are against signing either of them so it's more about which one would play for Boston
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Jun 14, 2017 20:20
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JesusSinfulHands posted:Which players from the 2014 draft do y'all think are getting extensions this offseason Wiggins, LaVine, Embiid, Jokic are all getting max extensions. The Rookie Max is not as much as the veteran max. For these teams its kind of a no-brainer, and if they don't another team will try to steal them away. Bradley Beal and Harrison Barnes got max contracts last year, to set expectations. Crabbe got almost a max.
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Jun 14, 2017 20:25
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Paul Zuvella posted:Man, I wonder what European Blake Griffin is up to these days. Getting ready for another NBA pay day. This time as a center. "The Brooklyn Nets, Philadelphia 76ers, and Dallas Mavericks have expressed interest in bringing Jan Vesely back to the NBA, league sources told Basketball Insiders...Fenerbahce advanced to the 2015 EuroLeague Final Four for the first time in team history...Vesely was an All-EuroLeague First Team member in 2016, including EuroLeague MVP for the month of January. Vesely averaged 12 points, 6.8 rebounds and one block per game in EuroLeague competition. A few weeks ago, Vesely and Fenerbahce won the EuroLeague championship under coach Zeljko Obradovic, a nine-time EuroLeague champion and one of the most famous coaches overseas. Vesely had a 20.3 PER and shot a career-high 62 percent from the field while averaging 10.1 points per game in 63 combined EuroLeague and BSL games." http://www.basketballinsiders.com/jan-vesely-returning-to-the-nba/ Spacebump fucked around with this message at 20:32 on Jun 14, 2017 |
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Jun 14, 2017 20:29
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Oh god Durant and Kerr on podcasts Kill me
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Jun 14, 2017 20:30
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