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SHY NUDIST GRRL posted:I have seen him exactly twice since the welcome back event. And it was the impotently basic attacking people and some ults I remember from beta. There doesn't need to be more heroes that are only good at a professional level of play. Tyrael is good at every level of play. Just because you don't like him/aren't good with him doesn't represent an actual problem with him. Unlike he most heroes, he actually has 2 very good ults, and has a robust ability set. The only reason he needs a rework is that he has a bunch of generic talents still left (which they are rightly determined to get rid of) and that too many of his talents buff him while dead, so may as well not exist.
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Jun 19, 2017 16:32
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Raynor, however, is someone who ACTUALLY needs a rework. His Trait is basically something other people would get for free, his E isn't actually an ability unless you take a specific talent for it, and he sees almost 0 competitive play.
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Jun 19, 2017 16:34
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Toshimo posted:The only reason he needs a rework is that he has a bunch of generic talents still left (which they are rightly determined to get rid of) and that too many of his talents buff him while dead, so may as well not exist. So then he does need a rework?
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Jun 19, 2017 16:40
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Yeah I think he needs a talent rework not something as dramatic as I'd like to see happen to Raynor or Lucio. Even when I'm doing well and making MVP as Lucio I feel like I'm doing nothing.
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Jun 19, 2017 16:44
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Coolness Averted posted:So then he does need a rework? Technically, every hero needs a rework, because none of them are perfect. But if you look at specific areas of improvement for heroes:
Tyrael ticks like 2 things on this list, so while he "needs" a rework, it's only a priority insomuch as they care about the legacy generics. There are at least a dozen heroes who tick many more of the boxes and "need" a rework much sooner.
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Jun 19, 2017 16:45
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Maybe it's just randomness but he seems crazy unpopular. If no one is picking someone they should be considered for changes. Tyrael doesn't have a really niche kit like Mehdiv or Vikings. Actually Rehgar is a guy I never see too. I tried him again and it felt real bad but it was probably a team comp thing. But it's possible that the changing cast has left him behind too. With how much some of the characters have changed I'm surprised others are so stagnant
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Jun 19, 2017 16:51
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Tyrael is a fantastic diver, and really facilitates other dive heroes. I just hang out with butchers and kerrigans and the like, help them kill if I need to, and help them bug out.
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Jun 19, 2017 16:59
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No one picks Tyrael because he's boring as poo poo and not even in a way where you get lots of kills like Raynor
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Jun 19, 2017 17:00
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A hero can be awesome and also boring
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Jun 19, 2017 17:01
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SHY NUDIST GRRL posted:Maybe it's just randomness but he seems crazy unpopular. If no one is picking someone they should be considered for changes. Tyrael doesn't have a really niche kit like Mehdiv or Vikings. Actually Rehgar is a guy I never see too. I tried him again and it felt real bad but it was probably a team comp thing. But it's possible that the changing cast has left him behind too. With how much some of the characters have changed I'm surprised others are so stagnant He's 18th in popularity for QM out of 67 heroes in HotsLogs. He's middle of the pack in popularity in HL. YOUR ANECDOTE IS NOT DATA. JUST STOP.
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Jun 19, 2017 17:07
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I just sort of think Nazeebo feels like he's not my style, you know, and I only saw him once in the three quick match games I played last week. Let's rework him.
No Wave fucked around with this message at 17:16 on Jun 19, 2017 |
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Jun 19, 2017 17:11
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KillerQueen posted:Tyrael is a fantastic diver, and really facilitates other dive heroes. I just hang out with butchers and kerrigans and the like, help them kill if I need to, and help them bug out. This. He's one of the few tanks I do well with because I'm a support-minded player and his kit is awesome to complement an actual damage dealer like Greymane or Kerrigan. Dive in + slow the enemy with Q, shield your buddy with W, Bug out/chase survivors with E, panic R when things start going FUBAR or you hear the sound cue for ring of frost/mosh pit/whatever.
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Jun 19, 2017 17:11
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Toshimo posted:He's 18th in popularity for QM out of 67 heroes in HotsLogs. He's middle of the pack in popularity in HL. This is a dumb loving statistic because he's one of the oldest heroes
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Jun 19, 2017 17:15
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frakeaing HAMSTER DANCE posted:This is a dumb loving statistic because he's one of the oldest heroes I don't think you understand how hotslogs works.
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Jun 19, 2017 17:19
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bamhand posted:I don't think you understand how hotslogs works. I don't think this is a useful post
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Jun 19, 2017 17:21
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Toshimo posted:He's 18th in popularity for QM out of 67 heroes in HotsLogs. He's middle of the pack in popularity in HL. Hotslogs is a compiler of anecdotes 
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Jun 19, 2017 17:22
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 EU vs EU finals here we come!
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Jun 19, 2017 17:25
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frakeaing HAMSTER DANCE posted:I don't think this is a useful post Hint: The stats are only based off of the most recent few weeks.
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Jun 19, 2017 17:25
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Toshimo retire bitch
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Jun 19, 2017 17:48
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I mean he's an insufferable rear end in a top hat but he's actually right in this case. e: just like TCJimbo and JakeP usually are. By the way, want to know how I got this av? 
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Jun 19, 2017 17:57
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BrianBoitano posted:I mean he's an insufferable rear end in a top hat but he's actually right in this case. Yeah but he always posts everything in such a miserable insufferable way that I don't care?
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Jun 19, 2017 18:07
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Tyrael's problem is his attack animation is really limp. Arthas has a similar issue. There's no pop to it at all.
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Jun 19, 2017 18:30
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SKULL.GIF posted:Tyrael's problem is his attack animation is really limp. Arthas has a similar issue. There's no pop to it at all. Yeah but at least when Arthas smacks em with Trait it looks painful
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Jun 19, 2017 18:44
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SKULL.GIF posted:Tyrael's problem is his attack animation is really limp. Arthas has a similar issue. There's no pop to it at all. I have a friend who feels that Tyrael doesn't have a sword, he has a breadstick.
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Jun 19, 2017 18:57
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Tyrael's aesthetic is awesome and most of his skins look badass too, I wish he wasn't so boring to play
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Jun 19, 2017 19:44
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garthoneeye posted:I have a friend who feels that Tyrael doesn't have a sword, he has a breadstick. You think this bread doesnt do damage well whats it called in French bitch??
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Jun 19, 2017 19:48
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Ristolaz posted:You think this bread doesnt do damage well whats it called in French bitch?? Hahahaha
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Jun 19, 2017 19:53
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Ristolaz posted:You think this bread doesnt do damage well whats it called in French bitch?? 
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Jun 19, 2017 19:55
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Ristolaz posted:You think this bread doesnt do damage well whats it called in French bitch?? 
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Jun 19, 2017 19:58
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I can kind of understand that a hard engage dive tank that wants your entire team to stack up on top of the enemy in a giant ball of death and murder isn't necessarily everyone's preferred playstyle, but "boring"..?
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Jun 19, 2017 19:59
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Gustav posted:I can kind of understand that a hard engage dive tank that wants your entire team to stack up on top of the enemy in a giant ball of death and murder isn't necessarily everyone's preferred playstyle, but "boring"..? When people have a 5th grade vocabulary, they just toss words in that seem to fit.
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Jun 19, 2017 20:03
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Toshimo posted:When people have a 5th grade vocabulary, they just toss words in that seem to fit. lol "Clearly this fool is uneducated to have an OPINION about a video game! Also I am a rational human being that simply rages and condescends about a video game all day every day."
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Jun 19, 2017 20:11
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Gustav posted:I can kind of understand that a hard engage dive tank that wants your entire team to stack up on top of the enemy in a giant ball of death and murder isn't necessarily everyone's preferred playstyle, but "boring"..? There's plenty of dive characters. Regardless of their quality Tyrael's abilities feel kind of limp.
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Jun 19, 2017 20:23
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Really nice to see HOTS in the top 5 on twitch tbh. Mid-season brawl even has more views than the last day of Dreamhack for Hearthstone. Truly the tale of the little game (by one of the world's most popular studios) that could.
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Jun 19, 2017 20:24
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dead game for casuals EleGiggle
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Jun 19, 2017 20:24
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Watching that last game on HGC was both extremely exciting because goddamn did Dignitas play and react well but also very depressing because I cannot come anywhere close to that level of play. Watching people who are actually good at the game play always makes me want to improve.
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Jun 19, 2017 20:33
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Doesn't "hard engage dive tank" basically describe Anubarak to a tee? Watching Grubby play probably doesn't give the broadest view of the game but Anub always winds up a first draft or ban in most of the games he seems to play while Tyrael is a relative oddity.
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Jun 19, 2017 20:38
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Anub is one of the most powerful heroes in the game, quite possibly the actual strongest, and since his main gimmick is CC he slides into pretty much any comp you can dream up. It's not really a fair benchmark to compare other heroes to Anub.
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Jun 19, 2017 20:54
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Tyreal's problem is design-related, and the majority of the complaints stem from the experience the average player gets from playing him:
2) His damage output is moderate to low, making him feel like more of a nuisance than a threat most of the time. This is opposed to characters like Arthas, Sonya, or Zarya who put out a lot of damage for being Warriors. 3) He's not insanely durable like other tanks are/can be. This is opposed to characters like Chen, Stitches, or Johanna, who are all well-suited to taking a beating on the regular. 4) His talents (excluding an amazing few like Holy Ground) are really boring. Tyreal has probably suffered from Best Build Syndrome probably the longest out of any other character in HOTS. Tyreal lacks a "wow" factor. That's not to say he's not good - he wouldn't be as popular as he is if he wasn't good - but he has trouble standing out. When Blizzard did a pass on all of the Warriors and tried to give them unique identities and purposes, all Tyreal got was some Spell Armor and the removal of Imposing Will (a change that, to this day, still smells like piss), while others got major overhauls and many talent functionalities baked in. Of course, it doesn't help that he effectively has an anti-trait, compared to so many other characters that have cool and good things that they get for free while all Tyreal gets is the ability to blow his load post-mortem. Basically my point is this: Bring back Cast Aside and bake in half of Holy Ground.
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Jun 19, 2017 20:54
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Tyrael's very difficult to use well but he's one of the most engaging tanks in the game, I really enjoy playing him. Works best with another warrior, if you find him boring try playing him more aggressively than you are currently (but also without trying to die), it's challenging but really rewarding. Power Bottom istotall right about Imposing Will, though, that was bullshit.
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Jun 19, 2017 20:57
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