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awesmoe posted:Broadly, yes they are. There are currently intra party arguments about whether to go hard left everywhere or to go centrist in right-favourd districts, much like in the thread. Healthcare-wise that shows up as arguments between single payer everywhere and making the ACA better (or just good at all, if you prefer). There is a lot of debate on whether they should push for Single-payer (left wing solution), Public option (buy in medicare, popular with left moderates), or fighting to bring back the ACA. Some version of public option will likely become part of the platform by 2018
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Jun 26, 2017 22:48
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evilweasel posted:there are a suprising amount of senators who can't even say they'll let mcconnell win on a procedural vote tomorrow: I saw some reporters saying last week that if this was going to die, it would be at the motion to proceed. Not sure how credible that is.
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Jun 26, 2017 22:48
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HappyHippo posted:I saw some reporters saying last week that if this was going to die, it would be at the motion to proceed. Not sure how credible that is. Ehhhh I doubt it.
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Jun 26, 2017 22:49
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evilweasel posted:Oh, whoops. My mistake, you're right. Bevin is an interesting case study in a proto-Trump. Came from a rich family. Made tons of cash as a hedge fund manager and then by taking over his families bell manufacturing business. He attempted to primary McConell in 2014 by campaigning on Tea Party stuff, but was beaten, in part due to the "Cockfighting Incident." quote:Cockfighting rally incident After being beaten he won a four-way primary for the R ticket nomination in part because the next-closest guy was found to be an abuser. He tied the dem candidate to Obama and ran mainly on eliminating a ton of taxes as well as ending the Medicaid expansion. Although he was a little fuzzy on how that worked. quote:In a late July debate sponsored by the Kentucky Chamber of Commerce, Bevin continued to insist that the state could not afford the Medicaid expansion authorized by Governor Beshear.[117] He said he was "appalled that one in four Kentuckians now get their health insurance from Medicaid".[18] He then advocated modifying the state's Medicaid system to require those insured by Medicaid to contribute small premiums or co-payments, citing a system similar to Indiana's.[117] The Kentucky General Assembly would have to effect such changes through legislation, but the debate moderator told Bevin he could end the expansion entirely with an executive order.[117] Bevin responded, "And create what degree of chaos?" Alessi then cited Bevin's February promise to end the Medicaid expansion "immediately", to which Bevin replied, "I said I would address it. I didn't say I would end it immediately. Go back and look at what I said."[117] In the post-debate press conference, Lexington Herald-Leader columnist Sam Youngman confirmed that Bevin had said he would "end" the Medicaid expansion.[117] Bevin then said, "Yeah, well, here's the bottom line: We need to address the situation. We need to effectively come up with a program that works for folks."[117] At a September campaign stop at a local Dairy Queen, Bevin promised only to "tweak" Beshear's Medicaid expansion.[118] Later in the month, he told a reporter "[W]e will not continue to enroll people at 138 percent of the federal poverty level [as allowed under the Affordable Care Act]," adding "The bottom line is this: Even if we don't continue to enroll people at 138 percent, there will be the 850-some odd thousand that were on it before the expansion and the other 400-and some odd thousand that are on it right now. They will continue to be on it until we come up with a solution. But we are not going to re-enroll people at 138 percent."[119] In an email to reporters, Bevin's communications director said, "Matt has been consistent on the issue of Medicaid expansion from day one. What he has called for is repeal of Obama's Medicaid expansion by applying to [the Centers for Medicare and Medicaid Services] for 1115 waivers (as other states have successfully done) in order to better customize a solution to address the healthcare needs of the commonwealth."[119] How did the election turn out? quote:On August 10, Fark.com founder Drew Curtis submitted the requisite number of petition signatures to appear on the gubernatorial ballot as an Independent candidate with his wife, Heather, as his running mate.[136] In early October, the first poll released after Curtis entered the field showed Conway leading with 42 percent support among likely voters, compared to Bevin's 37 percent and Curtis' 7 percent.[137] Fifteen percent of those polled were undecided.[137] Conway's five-percentage-point margin held up a month later; just a week before the election, a Bluegrass poll showed 45 percent support for Conway, 40 percent for Bevin, and 6 percent for Curtis.[138] The Lexington Herald-Leader noted that Bevin had trailed in every publicly released poll, and political analyst Stephen Voss said that, given the consistency of the data, "Bevin needs a sudden shift in voter preferences if he hopes to win this contest, and he may be dragging down some of his Republican ticket mates as well."[139] Sound familiar?
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Jun 26, 2017 22:49
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Hellblazer187 posted:My hope was for JEB, being probably easier to beat than Trump, and also not world endingly stupid. But oh well. I don't know. In a world ruled by common sense, my assumption is that America would have looked at 2 bland options and chosen the one that wasn't the target of a decades-long smear campaign. I was 100% on the Trump train for GOP nom - I thought it was the best comedy option, but also the best option for the world that led to the most decisive Republican defeat. I was a loving idiot you see.
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Jun 26, 2017 22:50
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KickerOfMice posted:Evilweasel are you a senator? You always seem to know all of the government knobs and gears! i have a short attention span and when i get bored i read things, so i have a wide variety of useless knowledge
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Jun 26, 2017 22:51
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evilweasel posted:that's not the vote on the bill itself, that's the vote to let the bill proceed to the floor, a vote you'd expect him to have every republican senator on even if the bill was ultimately going to fail Ultimately, if the bill is looking like it's going to fail to actually pass, it might look better if it instead fails to proceed right now. That's just a guess, but I'd assume the headlines for "vote on GOP healthcare bill delayed" are going to look better for the GOP than "GOP healthcare bill voted down"
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Jun 26, 2017 22:51
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Bizarro Watt posted:Just picture the next big earthquake destroying a major city in California and then Trump's response to it. "Take that Commiefornia cucks haha! I'm sorry what? That city had HOW much infrastructure we need to pay for? It's county provided HOW much of our food?" -His base probably, maybe not the second half I don't think they are that smart
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Jun 26, 2017 22:52
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Nobody thought Trump was a good candidate because he simply wasn't. He was a giant idiot that put his foot in his mouth on a regular basis. There was so much dumb poo poo going on in 2016 that it was a perfect storm of political turmoil, from which our cheeto dictator emerged.
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Jun 26, 2017 22:52
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Still not evil enough for Rand https://twitter.com/MEPFuller/status/879456261422682112 https://twitter.com/MEPFuller/status/879456709546315776
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Jun 26, 2017 22:52
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https://twitter.com/byrdinator/status/879456770271440896 Heller also is unlikely to vote on the motion to proceed. That motion may not pass if any of the others who haven't committed to voting to let this come to the floor (like Johnson) vote to block it.
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Jun 26, 2017 22:52
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Just you wait until the democrats crack and this will pass with 80 votes.
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Jun 26, 2017 22:55
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I will burst into laughter in public if McConnell can't even get this to the floor.
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Jun 26, 2017 22:55
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Rigel posted:Still not evil enough for Rand The doublest of entendre. evilweasel posted:i have a short attention span and when i get bored i read things, so i have a wide variety of useless knowledge Heh, I understand Mr. Franken 
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Jun 26, 2017 22:57
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evilweasel posted:https://twitter.com/byrdinator/status/879456770271440896
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Jun 26, 2017 22:57
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The horribleness of the AHCA being a net positive for the forces of good is a pretty apt metaphor for 2017 thus far. Unrelated: I really hope that Carter Page mehfest isn't the Wittes-leak. I wanted to have some fun with Chris and Rachel tonight 
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Jun 26, 2017 22:58
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If the vote is delayed does the GOP run into a time crunch?
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Jun 26, 2017 22:58
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Shimrra Jamaane posted:If the vote is delayed does the GOP run into a time crunch? There was some reasoning floating around that pushing this bill until after the July recess effectively kills it for the year, but I can't recall why.
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Jun 26, 2017 22:59
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They may back off from this, like children caught with their hands in the cookie chair, whistling nonchalantly. If they do, don't ever let anyone forget that but for their inability to successfully lie and get away with it, these ghouls would happily cash checks on dead children and ruined industries.
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Jun 26, 2017 23:00
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Ok so let me ask a question to contribute a bit. Let's say that the bill fails to make it to the floor. Didn't trump threaten to run attack ads against any republican that votes against him on this measure and Couldn't McConnell make the entire senate's life a living hell if they don't take this up? What is the point as a GOP senator to resist and stay with this train wreck of a party?
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Jun 26, 2017 23:01
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Zophar posted:Dems need simple, catchy, and popular things to actually campaign on. "Medicare for All" and "Restore Democracy" are good ones, IMO. They need to explain that they aren't anti-Trump because of his R next to his name but because of his plan to tear down the republic. yeah like "repeal obamacare"
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Jun 26, 2017 23:01
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https://mobile.twitter.com/Emma_Dumain/status/879459240032825344 Truly a Profile in Courage.
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Jun 26, 2017 23:01
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TheOneAndOnlyT posted:So what happens if the motion to proceed fails? Does debate just continue on the bill until a motion passes? The bill doesn't come to the floor for amendment or debate and the clock for a final vote on it does not start ticking. However McConnell can later bring the bill up for a vote to proceed again if he can get the votes. No debate officially even begins on the bill, though obviously the national debate doesn't go anywhere.
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Jun 26, 2017 23:01
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DaveWoo posted:https://mobile.twitter.com/Emma_Dumain/status/879459240032825344 Yeah, he's a poo poo, but he is a perceptive poo poo: https://twitter.com/GarrettHaake/status/879458848670613507
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Jun 26, 2017 23:03
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mcconnell can't bring the bill to the floor tomorrow: https://twitter.com/McCormackJohn/status/879459679734308864 that's Paul, Lee, and Heller saying they won't vote to proceed. Not even counting Johnson who (now) will also almost certainly vote no.
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Jun 26, 2017 23:05
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Zophar posted:There was some reasoning floating around that pushing this bill until after the July recess effectively kills it for the year, but I can't recall why. There are timing rules for reconciliation, which no one outside of the Senate understands. It is one of the most hilariously complex and convoluted bureaucratic processes in the world, so when a Senator or media says "this has to be passed before August because of reconciliation", we have to kind of shrug and say "ok, I believe you, I guess".
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Jun 26, 2017 23:05
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Always appreciate that we could literally pay for the "savings" that this bill does by lowering the military budget by 5%.
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Jun 26, 2017 23:05
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Until it means white wingers are going to stop voting for Republicans (they won't, because gently caress those librul commies) these polls mean gently caress all. Skippy Granola posted:Wow that is monstrous Someone mentioned the "if your family got driven out of Germany by Nazis you can get citizenship" thing earlier and if I could prove that I'd absolutely grab dual citizenship at the very least. haveblue posted:I take it this is now officially the worst bill that ever stood a real chance of becoming law in US history. Healthcare-related? Probably. Overall? No but it's up there.
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Jun 26, 2017 23:06
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Thank you based CBO score.
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Jun 26, 2017 23:07
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https://mobile.twitter.com/brianschatz/status/879438342504538113
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Jun 26, 2017 23:07
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DaveWoo posted:https://mobile.twitter.com/Emma_Dumain/status/879459240032825344 I actually can't tell if Graham is saying "I won't take the bullet for killing this" or "I don't have to take the bullet for killing this because poo poo's dead anyway." Either seems like him.
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Jun 26, 2017 23:08
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STAC Goat posted:I actually can't tell if Graham is saying "I won't take the bullet for killing this" or "I don't have to take the bullet for killing this because poo poo's dead anyway." Either seems like him. The former, he'll vote for it even if it's going down.
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Jun 26, 2017 23:09
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Let me play devil's advocate here -- how do you respond to what will absolutely be the conservative talking point about the millions of people who will lose coverage based on the CBO report below:quote:CBO and JCT estimate that, in 2018, 15 million more people would be uninsured under this legislation than under current law—primarily because the penalty for not having insurance would be eliminated. The conservative talking point being, 15 million people is big and scary number, but if it's their choice, what's the problem? Trumpcare isn't taking away healthcare, it's people choosing to opt out. What say you, D&D?
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Jun 26, 2017 23:10
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Evil Fluffy posted:Until it means white wingers are going to stop voting for Republicans (they won't, because gently caress those librul commies) these polls mean gently caress all. I dunno, I mean even if it depresses turnout 3-5% that's huge in marginal districts. It won't lead to a bunch of people switching and voting D but they might be more likely to stay home now. Evil Fluffy posted:Someone mentioned the "if your family got driven out of Germany by Nazis you can get citizenship" thing earlier and if I could prove that I'd absolutely grab dual citizenship at the very least. That was me and I'm working on it! Documents are hard to get though. My wife is German so I do have another out as well.
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Jun 26, 2017 23:11
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This is going to be cap and trade again, isn't it? Pelosi whipped her members into getting in line, barely passed the house, and Dem Senators went "oh poo poo, this is way too unpopular, sorry" and left the Dem house hanging on that vote. That was right before 2010.
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Jun 26, 2017 23:11
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DaveWoo posted:https://mobile.twitter.com/Emma_Dumain/status/879459240032825344 e: Oh man, I read this as him saying he's gonna bring this down. Of loving course.
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Jun 26, 2017 23:11
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Evil Fluffy posted:Until it means white wingers are going to stop voting for Republicans (they won't, because gently caress those librul commies) these polls mean gently caress all. They don't have to flip to voting for Democrats or anything. There just needs to be a decent percentage of them that don't bother to show up to vote anymore.
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Jun 26, 2017 23:11
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BetterToRuleInHell posted:Let me play devil's advocate here -- how do you respond to what will absolutely be the conservative talking point about the millions of people who will lose coverage based on the CBO report below: If healthy people leave the exchanges, then premiums go way up.
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Jun 26, 2017 23:12
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I believe, specifically, by 20% based on the CBO report.
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Jun 26, 2017 23:12
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don't let the horror of the senate's dogshit healthcare bill distract from today's trumpy bullshit here, have some trump and modi awkwardly embracing! https://twitter.com/SteveKopack/status/879454246244147202 https://twitter.com/SteveKopack/status/879457919636525056
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Jun 26, 2017 23:12
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