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 Crazycryodude posted:"Mines" is Aurora terms are a large missile that flies to somewhere in space (or has no first stage engine and is dropped by a ship), goes dark, and then shoots smaller homing missiles at anything that comes near (near being up to millions of kilometers). It's not a stationary object that you pray they run into, that's just incredibly dumb and bad in the vastness of space (as you have surmised). They're very useful for seeding around jump points if we ever get that far, and are situationally useful in other cases. Situations like dropping them behind you to gently caress with pursuers or scattering them in the general direction of an incoming doomstack to whittle away at them. General designs are fine, don't forget the size limits of launchers. I will let you comandeer a civvie transport to drop off mines of up to size 12 if you really want but you might get a few less of them. MIssle tech if you want to get specific:   Affi posted:With a scout we ought to be able to pinpoint their heading? And if they are arrogant they might not even change it a bit? You could send out scouts but its possible those fighters/FAC/whatever are still looking for your scouts. Cat & Mouse time. Pash posted:Skeleton crews trying to eat missiles might be the best bet assuming they attack before the shipyard makes it and can repair them. Wishing others had gone for the Carrier right about now... The damaged ships have spent the trip home productively with assistance from the support vesel, they are pretty much combat ready except for the holes in their armor and reduced effectiveness from lost crew. Affi posted:Those boxlaunchers only have one salvo before they need to reload? Reloading box launchers will take at best about 12 hours with collier assistance. They don't have to fire them all in the same salvo though and can split fire from different ships however they want. MIght pay to take a look at the missiles your PDC is lobbing as well. code:Crazycryodude posted:E: Pash, it's the Marissa Mayers that are the bullshit missile boxes. We're looking at a 250+ missile alpha strike just from those DDG's, to say nothing of the rest of the fleet. This is gonna be "fun". Pash posted:What was the class of the missile destroyers that shoot the giant waves again? That looks like a fleet that might be intended to attack Neptune... Marissa Mayer are the empty cubes stacked full of box launchers. S/M differences are unkown but nobody has seen M variants light off an active sensor so one theory is they have traded sensor space for even more missiles. Saros fucked around with this message at 23:46 on Jun 27, 2017 |
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Jun 27, 2017 23:43
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Crazycryodude posted:"Mines" is Aurora terms are a large missile that flies to somewhere in space (or has no first stage engine and is dropped by a ship), goes dark, and then shoots smaller homing missiles at anything that comes near (near being up to millions of kilometers). It's not a stationary object that you pray they run into, that's just incredibly dumb and bad in the vastness of space (as you have surmised). They're very useful for seeding around jump points if we ever get that far, and are situationally useful in other cases. Situations like dropping them behind you to gently caress with pursuers or scattering them in the general direction of an incoming doomstack to whittle away at them. Aren't they enormously painful for the player to maintain? I remember Bgreman vetoing them in his LP for that reason... vv oic, that makes sense vv sebmojo fucked around with this message at 00:43 on Jun 28, 2017 |
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Jun 27, 2017 23:59
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BG was using a version like 8 updates behind what Saros is, somewhere in between here and there mines got made way more sane and manageable.
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Jun 28, 2017 00:04
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Im thinking we might swing a few ships in behind our dear friends and attempt to hit their tender the second they attack
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Jun 28, 2017 06:37
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So does that mean the captured box launcher is also combat ready minus armour? If so I definitely suggest we try to use that to bushwack the AKM from behind.
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Jun 28, 2017 10:03
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Pharnakes posted:So does that mean the captured box launcher is also combat ready minus armour? If so I definitely suggest we try to use that to bushwack the AKM from behind. Ah actually no its engine cannot be repaired without a shipyard so anywhere it goes it needs to be towed until it has some yard time.
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Jun 28, 2017 10:19
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Saros posted:Ah actually no its engine cannot be repaired without a shipyard so anywhere it goes it needs to be towed until it has some yard time. Has the mobile repair yard reached our base yet?
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Jun 28, 2017 11:13
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No, its still under tow, you can see it approaching from the south and taking a cautious route in the big maps. There are a pair of destroyers escorting it and it appears to be unspotted thus far so you could request the destroyers leave it behind and speed to the defense of Triton if you wish. However there is a two slipway, 4000T yard already present at Triton base so you can repair and refit destroyer size vessels there already. Saros posted:
Saros fucked around with this message at 11:57 on Jun 28, 2017 |
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Jun 28, 2017 11:54
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Whats the ETA on that Cruiser Division from Mars? (I assume they will be way to late...) Will the captured convoy transports make to to Neptune at the same time as the rest of the fleet? If so do we have time to try to set up those PDCs before the 10 days is up?
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Jun 28, 2017 13:55
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Far too late, they are still at Mars and still shaking down from repairs and refit. At least a couple of weeks is needed to reach the outer system. As for the Freighters they are lagging behind the combat forces as they are significantly slower. It is unlikely they will arrive before the engagement starts so they may have to divert to a safe location until the battle is over.
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Jun 28, 2017 14:17
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Maybe after we deal with incoming force, we can meet the 9th at Uranus for a counterattack.
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Jun 28, 2017 14:20
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Fray posted:Maybe after we deal with incoming force, we can meet the 9th at Uranus for a counterattack. Lets see whats left of our fleet before we plan this...
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Jun 28, 2017 14:25
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They will want to stay at range and will also likely target our larger vessels. Anything we can do to that makes this difficult is a good idea.
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Jun 28, 2017 15:03
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Ok so the ordnance techs have come up with two key designs for the mine project. First up is the main submunition, an emergency battlefield modification of our standard size 2 ASM. code:The second is a design based off of an experimental EWAR drone that never made it into mass production. A few very inventive hours of SpaceCAD fuckery later, and the "Crybaby" has been modified to have an off the shelf engine with a small warhead shoehorned into the space freed up by removing fuel tanks. I'm not sitting in front of Aurora right now, but the basic specs I've got in mind are code:A size 11-12 mine should be able to fit 4 of the ASM submunitions or 2 Crybabies. Deploying mines in clusters, with a ratio of about 3:1 or 4:1 shipkiller mines to Crybaby mines should do the trick, but this is all theorycrafting and we have neither the time nor the facilities to game it out in-depth. Well, nothing's a better simulation than a field test, right? It's not gonna stop them, but if we get lucky maybe something critical gets hit, or at the very least the IC is forced to slow down and sweep for mines in their path. E: Minimum warhead size is 1 
Crazycryodude fucked around with this message at 15:54 on Jun 28, 2017 |
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Jun 28, 2017 15:35
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Out of curiosity, can Triton build fighters and how would more fighters do at loving the attack fleet up vs. mines?
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Jun 28, 2017 15:49
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Triton does have limited fighter factories, and fighters can be total bastards. They don't even use the same production lines as mines do, so we can crank out both with no loss. The only problem is whether or not Triton has any hangars for the fighters to launch from. If we do, then hell yeah let's crank out a few more Deimoses, even just one extra plasma cannon on the line is better than zero.
Crazycryodude fucked around with this message at 15:59 on Jun 28, 2017 |
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Jun 28, 2017 15:57
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Yeah if we can do both, definitely should. I just don't remember if it's possible at this base.
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Jun 28, 2017 15:59
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Triton Fleet Base has fighter maintenance and limited production facilities, there is currently four ready-to-fly Deimos replacements as well as the seven fighters carried by CVL Minotaur in TF Dumbo. Another 1-3 fighters can probably be produced or made ready across the next week.
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Jun 28, 2017 16:01
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Interlude 3; Despair & Disrepair Pluto Archaeological site: Saros posted:A single spacesuited figure waits at the bottom of the shaft. “H-hello... hello?” calls the figure over the radio, “This is Dr Romana Lafever, I am the head of the scientific expedition here. All our people have withdrawn to the domes and we are unarmed. I don’t know who you are but I implore you not to disturb the site, this is the most important archaeological site in the history of humanity and must be handled with extreme delicacy.” One of the marines picks up the figure and gently moves them aside, the low gravity making them bounce and slide along the slick surface of the ice. They doggedly clamber to their feet and come bounding back and another marine moves swiftly to block them but pulls aside at a brief signal from Autoshades. “Doctor” he begins, looming over the figure in his armor, “we are going to breach and inspect the site, we have no wish to harm any of your team but our orders are clear so please stay out of the way for your own safety.” The Doctor stares up at him, helmet visor revealing a woman in her forties with concern written clearly across her face. After a moment's consideration she nods, “very well but I must accompany you, you clearly have no idea how to treat such an important site.” Autoshades considers, “might be good to have an egghead along sir” pipes up his Lieutenant “who knows what's in there?” After a moment more Autoshades tags the Doctor as a civilian VIP in the tac system and a protector drone flashes silently out of the darkness of the shaft and settles alongside her. She jumps in fright, the low gravity turning the sudden movement into and awkward tumble which gets a chuckle from a couple of the Marines. “Very well Doctor, now what can you tell us about the object?” asks Autoshades. The Doctor watches in horror as a breaching drone settles against the surface of the structure, a dozen appendages probing the surface trying to find anything resembling a weak spot. “Over there,” she turns and points, “it seems to be an entranceway or airlock of some sort or at least the structure wall is much thinner. The structure overall is incredibly absorbent of emissions and extends across multiple kilometers under the ice. The ice here is slowly cycling downwards towards Pluto’s inner ocean but at this depth anything on the surface would have taken roughly five million years to sink this far. Ice samples taken from the drilling seem to confirm this. The figure turns back to Autoshades, “do you understand what this means? This... structure, complex, whatever it is has been here on a desolate iceball on the edge of the system since before our ancestors descended from the trees.” Autoshades only response is a slow shrug, exaggerated by the armor automatically rolling his shoulder mounted cannon to stay level. The breaching drone repositions where indicated and fires up its hull-cutters, the blinding glare casting harsh shadows against the walls of the shaft. Cutting progresses with glacial slowness, the structure is impossibly hard and seems to absorb most of the energy applied to it. The drone clatters, shifting position in an almost nervous fashion and throws up requests to use shaped nuclear charges against the structure as its mechanical instincts scream that extended exposure like this is disastrous to any operation. Autoshades rolls his eyes and locks down all the tactical nukes carried by his formation as one of the marines mimes getting blown up and out of the shaft by their own bombs, the Doctor stares in confusion as the massive armored figure bounces up into the sky accompanied by laughter across the general channel. After nearly twenty minutes a section of dark material, barely enough to allow marine armor through gives way and scout drones whip through to survey the interior. “All clear sir” reports a tech, “looks like a cylindrical space maybe twenty meters long and five wide with weird spiraling trails set into the walls, uhh kind of like a giant rifle barrel?”  The Specialist steps through the opening and slowly makes his way to the far side of the cavity. As he reaches out and touches the far wall the combat armor of the entire company screams alerts as sudden, massive surge of electromagnetic radiation pours out from the interior of the structure, seconds later a shuddering rumble shakes the company. “Colonel report! We are seeing a massive EM spike and ice-quakes, what is going on down there?” calls the operations commander from orbit. “Unknown sir”, reports Autoshades, “we have just entered the structure and it seems to have triggered some response.” Autoshades armor throws up an emissions summary, the tactical program is calling it a very muffled reactor overload and subsequent core dump but the readings are all over the place. “What was that, what have you done!” yells the Doctor, fighting with the drone as it prevents her from peering through the hole cut in the structure. “Well…. it sort of looks like something tried to turn on and then exploded,” Autoshades replies, “Oh wow Doc, you don’t look happy?” Saros fucked around with this message at 16:12 on Jun 28, 2017 |
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Jun 28, 2017 16:07
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Please don't blow up the priceless archaeological site 
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Jun 28, 2017 16:14
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Crazycryodude posted:Please don't blow up the priceless archaeological site Can't blow up the priceless archaeological site if it blows itself up
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Jun 28, 2017 16:19
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I haven't dug very deep into this game, but is it possible to set up some 'mines' full of anti-missile missiles to try and blunt the IC's alpha strike? That seems to be our biggest worry and as far as I know AMMs are usually pretty small since they don't need much range.
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Jun 29, 2017 02:16
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I may have missed earlier discussion of it, but in general, are there good defenses against these alpha-strike boats? I feel like the IC is Zerg rushing us, and while I understand if our options are limited now (though obviously I hope we have options), I'm going to be disappointed if this is good practice in Aurora overall.
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Jun 29, 2017 02:37
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Please uncover the giant alien gun.
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Jun 29, 2017 02:48
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Against missiles? The best defense is generally to outrange your opponent by 50% or so. Next best is to have big ships with thick armor and redundant systems. Short of that, you want to have upgraded gauss cannon turrets. Gauss cannons have an explicit rate-of-fire upgrade tree, which makes them the most effective point defense weapons. I like to split my fleet into one long-range missile element and one gauss-and-meson element.
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Jun 29, 2017 02:54
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Lando131 posted:I haven't dug very deep into this game, but is it possible to set up some 'mines' full of anti-missile missiles to try and blunt the IC's alpha strike? That seems to be our biggest worry and as far as I know AMMs are usually pretty small since they don't need much range. FredMSloniker posted:I may have missed earlier discussion of it, but in general, are there good defenses against these alpha-strike boats? I feel like the IC is Zerg rushing us, and while I understand if our options are limited now (though obviously I hope we have options), I'm going to be disappointed if this is good practice in Aurora overall. Even now in the maximum missile fuckery era, those box launcher ships are only good for blowing their load once and running. If we can survive the initial barrage they're useless for the rest of the battle, which isn't exactly optimal when they make up half your fleet. A lot of how this furball ends is gonna be decided in the first few minutes when that alpha strike comes in. Crazycryodude fucked around with this message at 03:09 on Jun 29, 2017 |
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Jun 29, 2017 03:02
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For would-be designers, this is a nice web app for figuring out "optimal" missile designs for a current tech level. It may be a little too groggy for this LP, however, with its weird fractional MSP engines - Saros are you okay with using these designs or would you rather we use existing missile engines? For some reason it adds .00001 to the size when using the arrows, weird. Also I haven't messed with the "reserved MSP" side (to make mines/buoys/specialized missiles), but I assume it works. Anyway a quick&dirty short range AMM for Trident Base: pre:AdHoc AMM Missile Size: 4 MSP (0.2 HS) Warhead: 1 Armour: 0 Manoeuvre Rating: 18 Speed: 20900 km/s Engine Endurance: 16 minutes Range: 20.0m km Cost Per Missile: 1.974 Chance to Hit: 1k km/s 376.2% 3k km/s 108% 5k km/s 75.2% 10k km/s 37.6% Materials Required: 0.25x Tritanium 1.724x Gallicite Fuel x193.75 Development Cost for Project: 197RP MSP allocation: Warhead MSP - 0.25 Fuel MSP - 0.0775 Agility MSP - 1.0625
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Jun 29, 2017 04:15
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FredMSloniker posted:I may have missed earlier discussion of it, but in general, are there good defenses against these alpha-strike boats? I feel like the IC is Zerg rushing us, and while I understand if our options are limited now (though obviously I hope we have options), I'm going to be disappointed if this is good practice in Aurora overall. Early game missiles defeinitely have the edge, I have given all sides higher tech in direct fire weapons than the equivalent missile tech to mitigate this somewhat. That said box launchers are terribly inefficient at actually holding missiles. You get a lot more missiles overall from Magazine + launcher than a giant wad of box launchers. Take a look at the two sides missile destroyer classes: Martian Destroyer: 3150T; 3047kps, 82 missiles code:code:Neophyte posted:For would-be designers, this is a nice web app for figuring out "optimal" missile designs for a current tech level. It may be a little too groggy for this LP, however, with its weird fractional MSP engines - Saros are you okay with using these designs or would you rather we use existing missile engines? Design away and feel free to submit new designs for missile or new classes of ships/fighters you would like to see. Can people start throwing some ideas out about how to position ships for the defense of Triton, I would like to begin playing it out friday afternoon but the actual battle will take a while to resolve so there will be opportunities for adjustments as it progresses.
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Jun 29, 2017 12:40
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So do we drop the mines near the edge of the Neptune system? That way we'll be in striking distance to follow up while they're reeling from the mines.
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Jun 29, 2017 13:21
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Here's the Neptunian system with the ranges of your missiles in light blue. Uranus is (way off at this scale) to the left side.
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Jun 29, 2017 13:55
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How do the relative missile ranges stack up? Especially with our faster DDGs, we might get some real mileage out of kiting the enemy fleet with volleys of missiles and letting the fact that they're closing and we're retreating adjust the ranges enough that they can't hit us in return. May as well use some of that missile capacity.
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Jun 29, 2017 14:06
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Saros posted:Here's the Neptunian system with the ranges of your missiles in light blue. Noting this is the size for missile there from our PDC or is that one of our ships range? Plan Porcupine: First have the manufacturing facilities make as many mines and fighters as they can before the IC gets here. Lets try to deploy the mines a bit outside of Neptune where their wont be a risk of them targeting our own ships. For fleet deployment ball up the ships near Triton to make sure the enemy has to engage us inside our PDC range (was it a missile PDC?). If the PDC is a missile pdc (I forget) then position our fleet so that our own missile ships will have about the same range as the PDC missiles. That way all our missiles should hit around the same time to try to overwhelm the enemy point defense. I say ball up particularly because I want to try to get the box missile ships to launch their alpha strike while we can bring the largest amount of point defense to bear. For this reason I believe we should keep our ships fairly tightly grouped with anti missile and anti fighter ships near the front. We should, however, try to keep the carrier and fleet support ships a little further from the action. If the box launcher ship makes it back in time tug it to a point where its range would equal that of our PDC missiles (if they are that). Reload it and tell the skeleton crew to target the largest enemy warship. If we can put a good dent in its armor before combat starts that will help our brawlers a lot. Have our fighter hold back if they can until the engagement begins, then have them strike at the enemy capital ships. Have the anti-fighter ships focus on the enemy fighters.
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Jun 29, 2017 14:21
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Well its probably safe to assume that the IC will keep on targeting our bigger ships. They will benefit from us being defensive. (They'll get to reload their destroyers) but we benefit from having a PD close by. So do we let them come to us or do we go after them? They will probably keep their tenders and troop ships a fair bit behind the action. But if we could nab them that'd be very very good. So at least have our snoopships try to find their fleet tenders once the battle has started. Affi fucked around with this message at 14:24 on Jun 29, 2017 |
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Jun 29, 2017 14:22
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Affi posted:Well its probably safe to assume that the IC will keep on targeting our bigger ships. They will benefit from us being defensive. (They'll get to reload their destroyers) but we benefit from having a PD close by. We have a strong PDC on Neptune, if we can I say make them come inside its range to fight. Plus if we can get the captured box launcher tugged back in time we can load it up and have it fire even if its engines are shot.
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Jun 29, 2017 14:23
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Pash posted:We have a strong PDC on Neptune, if we can I say make them come inside its range to fight. Plus if we can get the captured box launcher tugged back in time we can load it up and have it fire even if its engines are shot. The risk is: They can gently caress up our fleet yard. Our main objective.
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Jun 29, 2017 14:25
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Oh, 100% let them come to us, we've got the PDC to play with. Combining xthetenth's idea of a missile screen kiting them in with Pash's porcupine is probably the best way to do things. Although on second though, if we try and kite them in during Porcupine our missile ships are gonna have to fly right through the minefield, so we can't really do both. Porcupine is about what I would propose, except with the minefield farther away from Neptune (if there's time to deploy it out farther). If the mines get lucky and cripple something important or they get spooked by a wall of missiles and turn around, that's way better for us than trying to fight this bloodbath. Even if we win it's gonna suck, and if we lose it's game over for the whole theater. I'd rather take a chance at defusing it before it happens, and if the mines are right on the edge of the Neptuinian system that's a little too late. E: Good point about letting them in range of the fleet yard, but I think the PDC is absolutely necessary to have a shot against that many capital ships, and our PD should be good enough to stop (most) leakers. E2:Saros can hiding behind a moon (like Psamathe) help reduce our sensor return in-universe? I remember that the SB ship managed to hide during the attack on S-T by going dark and lurking near the surface - can we do the same? (I know it doesn't do anything in Aurora terms, but maybe you're fluffing sensors as working ever so slightly different in this universe and can just act like the IC don't see us until later than they actually do? This of course works both ways, they can hide from us whenever it's convenient for them, too.) Crazycryodude fucked around with this message at 14:39 on Jun 29, 2017 |
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Jun 29, 2017 14:28
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Maybe a fleet yard is worth less then their entire taskforce. What should be our targeting priorities? The battle ought to be over by the time their destroyers can relöad? So target big ships and then their support elements?
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Jun 29, 2017 14:55
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I think things depend on the relative ranges. Whats the range of our PDC compared to our longest range ship missiles?
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Jun 29, 2017 15:00
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xthetenth posted:How do the relative missile ranges stack up? Especially with our faster DDGs, we might get some real mileage out of kiting the enemy fleet with volleys of missiles and letting the fact that they're closing and we're retreating adjust the ranges enough that they can't hit us in return. May as well use some of that missile capacity. The Size 4 are only carried by the PDC and the Size 2 are our standard ship to ship missiles carried by most of our missile ships. The S3 missiles carried by the IC box ships are expected to reach at minimum 50m km. They do have trouble targeting ships under 3000T however thanks to their fire control resolution. The IC Missile cruiser was observed firing large, slow moving (4-6000kps) missiles from 100m km+ which then split into multiple independent seekers at a few hundred thousand kilometers so it's primary purpose seems to be saturating ground defences from beyond their range. Pash posted:Noting this is the size for missile there from our PDC or is that one of our ships range? Looks promising, only thing lacking is any attempt to scout the approaching fleet (with or without escorts for the scoutship) and targeting priorities. Pash posted:We have a strong PDC on Neptune, if we can I say make them come inside its range to fight. Plus if we can get the captured box launcher tugged back in time we can load it up and have it fire eve)n if its engines are shot. If possible in time the captured DD will be moored to the fleet base and loaded with standard anti-ship missiles (40m km range) as a final line of defence. Affi posted:They will probably keep their tenders and troop ships a fair bit behind the action. But if we could nab them that'd be very very good. It's unlikely they will leave them unescorted but the troopships are only about 2/3 the speed of their slowest combat ship (the box launcher DD's) so they may send the fighting force on ahead. Also the IC doesn't know it but our PDC likely significantly outranges their box launcher missiles. Crazycryodude posted:Although on second though, if we try and kite them in during Porcupine our missile ships are gonna have to fly right through the minefield, so we can't really do both. It's trivial to dodge your own minefields at the scale Aurora operates at. I'll allow this hiding with smaller ships, say destroyers and smaller but bigger ones are pretty drat obvious to scanners thanks to the surefeit of TNE's used in their construction. Incoming friendly ETA: TF Dumbo has split in response to the IC move. The Support vessel and the captured missile boat are slower at 2000kps and lagging behind while the others race ahead. Support vessel: 5 days 8 hours. TF Dumbo: 3 Days 19 hours. Good news! In light of this the Triton fleet base estimates that they can patch the armor and return the CAA Don't forget to breathe to full combat readiness in three days after arrival and at least plate over the worst of the holes in BC Victory's armor. Saros fucked around with this message at 15:18 on Jun 29, 2017 |
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Jun 29, 2017 15:09
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Saros posted:
Oops. Add use fleet scouts at range to track the enemy movements, trying to stay out of missile and fighter range. For targeting priority I will take suggestions from others, I would say target their presumed brawler types, as wasting shots on the box launchers is not a great use of our missile if they have already fired. Therefore I guess target the Steve Jobs and the Bill Gates class ships first. Do we know what the Zuckerberg's do? They appear to be similar in size to the Bill Gates Class brawlers, so it might be worth targeting them as well, especially if they are a more classical missile ship. Also probably set some conditional commands. I believe it was estimated that the box launchers would take about 12 hours to reload from the enemies fleet support ships. If it looks like the engagement will give them enough time to reload our fighters should move to attack the Marissa Mayers and support vessels. Pash fucked around with this message at 15:36 on Jun 29, 2017 |
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Jun 29, 2017 15:31
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