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The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > C-SPAM > [The Succ Zone] I unblocked you, again, to say this: You don't fucking know me.

«‹›2987 »

Karl Barks: Jan 21, 1981

make massachusetts video game industry great again

# ? Jun 30, 2017 16:51

Adbot: ADBOT LOVES YOU

# ? May 12, 2024 13:12

SKULL.GIF: Jan 20, 2017

Just got an email trying to get me to donate bc of these new polls:

North Carolina 46 D - 41 R
Virginia 48 D - 41 R
New Jersey 57 D - 29 R
Colorado 39 D - 34 R
Texas 39 D - 37 R

# ? Jun 30, 2017 16:52

Karl Barks: Jan 21, 1981

SKULL.GIF posted:

Just got an email trying to get me to donate bc of these new polls:

North Carolina 46 D - 41 R
Virginia 48 D - 41 R
New Jersey 57 D - 29 R
Colorado 39 D - 34 R
Texas 39 D - 37 R

what are these polls of

# ? Jun 30, 2017 16:54

ThndrShk2k: Nov 3, 2009; by Nyc_Tattoo; Bread Liar

GalacticAcid posted:

small brain: hoarding guns
normal brain: owning guns
big brain: using gun as a member of a well-regulated militia
galaxy om brain: using your gun to kill your self

Nono

Galaxy om brain: using your brain as a gun to shoot people with bullets suspended in midair

# ? Jun 30, 2017 16:58

ThndrShk2k: Nov 3, 2009; by Nyc_Tattoo; Bread Liar

Vox Nihili posted:

Buying more than 1 gun per person is a consumerist liberal affectation.

Depends on the type of gun and use case

Having a truck and a car means you can do truckstuff and carstuff if you need to do both without always having the high cost of truck fuel since they're usually more inefficient for transporting people vs material.

# ? Jun 30, 2017 17:00

GalacticAcid: Apr 8, 2013; NEW YORK VALUES

ThndrShk2k posted:

Having a truck and a car

haha

# ? Jun 30, 2017 17:02

GalacticAcid: Apr 8, 2013; NEW YORK VALUES

just 'lol' if you own things

# ? Jun 30, 2017 17:02

ThndrShk2k: Nov 3, 2009; by Nyc_Tattoo; Bread Liar

GalacticAcid posted:

haha

GalacticAcid posted:

just 'lol' if you own things

Lol if you own good things bought new.

Also if you live in the burbs/city you don't need both, if you live in fuckall nowhere having both is good and usually at least one of the two vehicles are a cheap $500-1000 beater that is barely legal to drive.

Go shopping in a car, saves money on gas
Go haul poo poo in a truck, you can actually haul poo poo.

Like literally poo poo, cus you gotta have a garden to save money.

# ? Jun 30, 2017 17:05

Zerg Mans: Oct 19, 2006

gradenko_2000 posted:

Hey so uh who is Brianna Wu

Gamergate victim that internet leftists decided was ok to harass cause she's weird or something.

gradenko_2000 posted:

and why is her congressional run significant?

it's not unless you're a gater internet leftist that gets really mad about that stuff.

# ? Jun 30, 2017 17:05

gradenko_2000: Oct 5, 2010; HELL SERPENT; Lipstick Apathy

zegermans posted:

Gamergate victim that internet leftists decided was ok to harass cause she's weird or something.

it's not unless you're a gater internet leftist that gets really mad about that stuff

thanks. it was the leftist connection that was throwing me for a loop

# ? Jun 30, 2017 17:08

Modus Pwnens: Dec 29, 2004

Karl Barks posted:

what are these polls of

Yours is not to question but to donate

# ? Jun 30, 2017 17:08

TheIncredulousHulk: Sep 3, 2012

SKULL.GIF posted:

Just got an email trying to get me to donate bc of these new polls:

North Carolina 46 D - 41 R
Virginia 48 D - 41 R
New Jersey 57 D - 29 R
Colorado 39 D - 34 R
Texas 39 D - 37 R

Donate to Beto bitch

# ? Jun 30, 2017 17:10

Zerg Mans: Oct 19, 2006

SKULL.GIF posted:

Just got an email trying to get me to donate bc of these new polls:

North Carolina 46 D - 41 R
Virginia 48 D - 41 R
New Jersey 57 D - 29 R
Colorado 39 D - 34 R
Texas 39 D - 37 R

BLUE TEXAS SLAY QUEEN

# ? Jun 30, 2017 17:14

Zerg Mans: Oct 19, 2006

According to Good Nate NC is already in the bag hahaha look at Nate Silver's receding hairline was a dumb ugly nerd what does he know

# ? Jun 30, 2017 17:15

Lastgirl: Sep 7, 1997; Good Morning!
Sunday Morning!

GalacticAcid posted:

just 'lol' if you own things

material excess is a big problem in measuring self worth indeed especially even more so in late stage capitalism where wealth means having a big dick

but i still see that even that is shed, the ego sometimes remains fed with access to materials that provide you knowledge so that you run online and try to prove other people wrong instead of creating content with it

so lol if you own things and double lol if you think you know everything as a consequential result that some inevitably fall into

this is why people get insufferable with their political theorycrafting and fan fiction instead of taking some tenets and seeing what can be done to improve it or modify it instead of treating it like a veritable bible of purity, because if I have to hear about how Das Capital owns Wealth of Nation out of the water, you're only fighting on other dead people's ideas and fighting for a world previous. Relics of a different time that we deign to scry and glean super secret insights that only your trained eyes can pick up the nuances of that passage, as well as if different system models were tested over time, you also cherry pick factors that made it work so that you can try to ram it down other's throats asynchronously in this timeline. We stand on an film of their civilized dust while the up-to-date modern world continues to turn indifferently because you haven't tailored certain elements of those tenets to reflect a modern standard, so you just parrot it instead and thats really sad imo

I mean uhh

lol if you don't take your time to order mcdonalds while you lol about material worth and egoism attached to it

# ? Jun 30, 2017 17:15

jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

zegermans posted:

According to Good Nate NC is already in the bag hahaha look at Nate Silver's receding hairline was a dumb ugly nerd what does he know

The US election was a hair razing experience okay

# ? Jun 30, 2017 17:15

Karl Barks: Jan 21, 1981

SKULL.GIF posted:

Just got an email trying to get me to donate bc of these new polls:

North Carolina 46 D - 41 R
Virginia 48 D - 41 R
New Jersey 57 D - 29 R
Colorado 39 D - 34 R
Texas 39 D - 37 R

just found out guys, this is hillary's latest polling numbers in these states

# ? Jun 30, 2017 17:16

Frijolero: Jan 24, 2009; by Nyc_Tattoo

Beto is a baby but he's supporting single-payer and he's from the solid-blue border so :getin:

:getin:

# ? Jun 30, 2017 17:16

gradenko_2000: Oct 5, 2010; HELL SERPENT; Lipstick Apathy

Karl Barks posted:

just found out guys, this is hillary's latest polling numbers in these states

TURN👏TEXAS👏BLUE

# ? Jun 30, 2017 17:17

BrutalistMcDonalds: Oct 4, 2012; Lipstick Apathy

Lastgirl posted:

material excess is a big problem in measuring self worth indeed especially even more so in late stage capitalism where wealth means having a big dick

but i still see that even that is shed, the ego sometimes remains fed with access to materials that provide you knowledge so that you run online and try to prove other people wrong instead of creating content with it

so lol if you own things and double lol if you think you know everything as a consequential result that some inevitably fall into

this is why people get insufferable with their political theorycrafting and fan fiction instead of taking some tenets and seeing what can be done to improve it or modify it instead of treating it like a veritable bible of purity, because if I have to hear about how Das Capital owns Wealth of Nation out of the water, you're only fighting on other dead people's ideas and fighting for a world previous. Relics of a different time that we deign to scry and glean super secret insights that only your trained eyes can pick up the nuances of that passage, as well as if different system models were tested over time, you also cherry pick factors that made it work so that you can try to ram it down other's throats asynchronously in this timeline. We stand on an film of their civilized dust while the up-to-date modern world continues to turn indifferently because you haven't tailored certain elements of those tenets to reflect a modern standard, so you just parrot it instead and thats really sad imo

I mean uhh

lol if you don't take your time to order mcdonalds while you lol about material worth and egoism attached to it

this is my kind of post

# ? Jun 30, 2017 17:17

Zerg Mans: Oct 19, 2006

Karl Barks posted:

just found out guys, this is hillary's latest polling numbers in these states

POST THE MAP

# ? Jun 30, 2017 17:18

WhiskeyJuvenile: Feb 15, 2002; by Nyc_Tattoo

https://theintercept.com/2017/06/30/california-single-payer-organizers-are-deceiving-their-supporters-its-time-to-stop/

quote:

In the days since California Assembly Speaker Anthony Rendon shelved for the year SB562, which intends to establish a state single payer health care system, he�s been subject to mass protests and even death threats. The bill�s chief backers, including the California Nurses Association and the Bernie Sanders-affiliated Our Revolution, angrily point to Rendon as the main roadblock to truly universal health care.

They�re completely wrong. What�s more, they know they�re wrong. They�re perfectly aware that SB562 is a shell bill that cannot become law without a ballot measure approved by voters. Rather than committing to raising the millions of dollars that would be needed to overcome special interests and pass that initiative, they would, apparently, rather deceive their supporters, hiding the realities of California�s woeful political structure in favor of a morality play designed to advance careers and aggrandize power.

That may sound harsh. It�s gentle.

Amid an uncertain future for U.S. healthcare, California�s overhaul attempt has galvanized the left and received national attention. But the peculiarities of state law and process remain a mystery, allowing advocates to create a serious gap between the expectations of supporters and the very real obstacles in the way.

There�s a reason that every California single payer bill in the last 25 years � and there have been at least seven, two of which passed the legislature and were vetoed, so we in the Golden State have seen this movie before � never includes a funding mechanism. It�s not necessarily because of fear of voting for higher taxes, or even the two-thirds threshold to increase a tax in the legislature.

It�s because you can�t do the funding without help from the voters, because of California�s fatal addiction to its perverse form of direct democracy. The blame, in other words, lies with ourselves.

To figure this out, you need only turn to the actual legislative analysis of the Senate bill, which passed in early June. It states very clearly what Rendon alluded to in his announcement shelving SB562: �There are several provisions of the state constitution that would prevent the Legislature from creating the single-payer system envisioned in the bill without voter approval.�

To cut through the clutter, let�s focus on the biggest constitutional hurdle, known as Proposition 98. Passed in 1988, Prop 98 requires that roughly 40 percent of all General Fund revenues � money the state receives in taxes � must go to K-12 education. If you include community college spending, it must exceed 50 percent.

Prop 98 was itself a reaction to the notorious Prop 13, which sharply limited state property taxes. It was intended to ensure that education received its fair share of funding. But it also created a budgetary straitjacket that affects virtually anything that costs California money.

The actual Prop 98 budget formula is so byzantine, it is said that only the initiative�s author John Mockler truly understood it, and he died two years ago. And a review of Prop 98 from the Legislative Analyst�s Office this January found that it doesn�t even succeed in its intended purpose of increasing funding for schools. But we know this: if you double the state General Fund by putting a single payer system on budget, at least 40-50 percent of those new revenues have to go to education.

As the Senate legislative analysis states, �Any taxes raised to support this bill would be� subject to the requirements of Proposition 98.� That means that, in order to raise enough money to fund single payer in California, under current law you would have to raise twice as much to satisfy the Prop 98 formula.

Substituting a centralized state program for the skyrocketing premiums people pay today would actually be relatively affordable. But if half the money has to be siphoned off to education, that rationale becomes harder to sell.

Self-appointed experts have countered that the state can suspend Prop 98 with a two-thirds vote of the legislature. This has been done twice in the past, during downturns in the economy. But the suspension can last for only a single year; it would have to be renewed annually to keep single payer going. More important, as the California Budget and Policy Center explains, after any suspension, �the state must increase Prop 98 funding over time to the level that it would have reached absent the suspension.�

So legislators would have to vote year after year to suspend Prop 98, but add more money back to cover it in subsequent years. That backfill would grow with every budget, and over time lawmakers would need to vote for ever-increasing giant tax hikes. If this didn�t return Republicans to power in Sacramento within a few years, some enterprising lawyer would sue the legislature for violating the spirit of Prop 98. Suspension is not politically, legally, or financially sustainable.

There are other obstacles, like a long-dormant state spending cap (the Gann limit) that would only come into play with the massive sums single payer adds to the budget. And of course the state would have to get numerous waivers from the federal government to apply Medicaid and Obamacare subsidy funds to its system, which is, shall we say, unlikely under President Trump. There�s also no actual mechanism currently in law to shift Medicare to the states, and self-insured plans from big employers, which would shift to the state under SB562, by federal law can only be governed at the state level. Congress would have to fix both of those hurdles.

But just to stick to one point, in order to fund single payer in California, you must loosen the Prop 98 budget straitjacket. There�s no secret decoder ring or safety valve around that. And the only way to truly get it done is with a ballot measure that either overhauls Prop 98 or exempts single payer from the formula.

Anybody with a day�s worth of experience in California government recognizes this. The Senate version of SB562 stated it in black and white. But every single denunciation of Speaker Rendon�s decision to delay the bill fails to mention this reality, that SB562 cannot become law without voter approval.

Senators Ricardo Lara and Toni Atkins, co-sponsors of SB562, thundered: �California has the chance to lead our nation toward healthcare for all, and we will not turn our backs on this matter of life or death for families.� They never mentioned that their bill is an incomplete step. (They didn�t respond immediately to a request for comment; we will update if and when we hear back.)

The California Courage Campaign pleaded with Democrats in an email blast to �fight for single payer today, not next year.� But Democrats can�t pass single payer today or this year; under state law, ballot measures only occur during statewide elections in even-numbered years. Even the chair of the state Democratic Party, Eric Bauman, insisted that �SB562 must be given the chance to succeed,� even though it, um, can�t succeed.

The California Nurses Association, when not posting �stabbed in the back� imagery in reference to Rendon, called his decision �heartless,� �unconscionable,� and �disingenuous.� But there�s nothing more disingenuous in this debate than failing to level with people that SB562 cannot become law on its own.

Lara, incidentally � or more likely not incidentally � is running for Insurance Commissioner. Toni Atkins, a former Assembly Speaker, wants to become Senate President when the current leader, Kevin de Leon, terms out next year. De Leon wants to run for� something; signs at the recent state Democratic Party convention read �Run Kevin Run� even though he hasn�t declared for any higher office. You don�t have to question their commitment to single payer to understand their motives to kick a shell bill without funding to the Assembly and bathe in the glory of the progressive faithful. Lara and Atkins claimed at one point SB562 would get a funding plan before becoming law, but they�ve continued to hide the reality of the necessary ballot measure.

As for outside groups, it�s clear that they have a strategy to make single payer a litmus test issue politically, while never acknowledging the process hurdles. With so many single-payer supporters in California and across the country unaware of the facts, playing this cat and mouse game is at best a sin of omission, at worst the kind of dishonesty that breeds cynicism in the public when it learns it was conned.

When asked straight-up about the obstacles, CNA Director of Public Policy Michael Lighty pointed to language in SB562 that would stall adoption of single payer unless adequate funding was available. He called it �a failsafe mechanism.�

Lighty is implicitly saying that SB562 can never create a single payer system. The failsafe will always be triggered unless the state constitution gets changed at the ballot, because there will never be enough money under the current iteration of Prop 98. Saying that out loud would depress enthusiasm and lessen CNA�s perceived power. So they hide the ball.

Speaker Rendon is clearly taking the bullet for an Assembly Democratic caucus that is far more moderate than the Senate, and doesn�t want the burden of cleaning up the Senate�s shell bill. On the same day Donald Trump pulled out of the Paris Climate Agreement, the Assembly blocked an extension of the state�s cap and trade bill, and recently rejected legislation popular with progressives to end money bail. Rendon knows his caucus won�t pass anything that looks like single payer, and if they did, Jerry Brown would be likely to veto it anyway.

But those who villainize Rendon without telling the truth to their supporters are not blameless either. The entire debate is one big game of passing the buck, with single payer�s loudest champions earning plaudits from the liberal base but doing nothing to advance universal health care.

If there was real interest in getting single payer done, supporters wouldn�t focus on a shell bill, but would start raising the gobs of money you�d need for the ballot measure, which will come under massive assault from every industry affected by shifting away from for-profit health care (especially because messing with Prop 98 will allow providers to dishonestly claim that single payer �takes money from our kid�s schools�). Just last year, the pharmaceutical industry put over $100 million into stopping an initiative that simply would have limited state spending on prescription drugs to the price paid by the Veterans Administration. Hospitals, doctors associations and insurance companies could spend twice as much to stop single payer. That doesn�t mean it couldn�t win, but advocates don�t seem to want to talk about the fight.

Rendon actually delivered the perfect set piece to shift the conversation to the ballot. Single payer backers could have said, �If we can�t go through the legislature, we�ll go around them to the people.� But the movement for universal health care has instead devolved into political theater, with no strategy for success. For those who support single payer � and that includes me � it�s not only frustrating, the deceit is an insult to our intelligence.

🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔

# ? Jun 30, 2017 17:18

Karl Barks: Jan 21, 1981

republicans need to go about reversing roe v wade before enforcing abortion restrictions! they won't succeed otherwise!!!! *is proven wrong over and over*

# ? Jun 30, 2017 17:23

jBrereton: May 30, 2013; Grimey Drawer

If only they could pass a law stopping people spending $100 million stopping legislation, ah well.

# ? Jun 30, 2017 17:25

Karl Barks: Jan 21, 1981

cause a constitutional crisis, don't they have a super majority? and i'm sure the courts are packed. good lord

# ? Jun 30, 2017 17:26

docbeard: Jul 19, 2011

Oh hey, meanwhile, Minneapolis city council just voted in a $15 minimum wage.

# ? Jun 30, 2017 17:26

Condiv: May 7, 2008; Sorry to undo the effort of paying a domestic abuser $10 to own this poster, but I am going to lose my dang mind if I keep seeing multiple posters who appear to be Baloogan.

With love,
a mod

WhiskeyJuvenile posted:

https://theintercept.com/2017/06/30/california-single-payer-organizers-are-deceiving-their-supporters-its-time-to-stop/

🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔

hmm, this guy sure says a lot of words to try to make excuses for why it's ok that the bill was killed before it could reach debate.

# ? Jun 30, 2017 17:27

GalacticAcid: Apr 8, 2013; NEW YORK VALUES

Condiv posted:

hmm, this guy sure says a lot of words to try to make excuses for why it's ok that the bill was killed before it could reach debate.

david dayen has been the best serious critic of Democratic policymaking for the past 8 years and you should at least give serious thought to his objections

not everybody who isn't actively screeching at the same autistic register as DA SucC ZZooonne is automatically a Bad Dem, jesus christ

# ? Jun 30, 2017 17:33

GalacticAcid: Apr 8, 2013; NEW YORK VALUES

https://twitter.com/mattyglesias/status/880825929798496257

# ? Jun 30, 2017 17:33

Raskolnikov38: Mar 3, 2007; We were somewhere around Manila when the drugs began to take hold

WhiskeyJuvenile posted:

https://theintercept.com/2017/06/30/california-single-payer-organizers-are-deceiving-their-supporters-its-time-to-stop/

i mean the answer is no but does this guy realize prop 98 is why nearly every new ballot proposition specifically excludes the money from touching the general fun

Raskolnikov38 has issued a correction as of 17:40 on Jun 30, 2017

# ? Jun 30, 2017 17:37

loquacius: Oct 21, 2008

Brianna Wu is an Internet personality who got into politics because people kept telling her "you should get into politics" for a very long time, which tbf is probably why most people get into politics

She is running to displace Rep Stephen Lynch, who sucks

She will not win because she doesn't really know what she's doing (she designed her own campaign logo; it is nigh-illegible and looks like a metal album cover) and her message mainly resonates if you are Brianna Wu (her biggest issues are Women In Tech and alt-right cyberbullying). She is strictly better than Stephen Lynch, though, because he is the worst Dem Massachusetts has (Seth Moulton notwithstanding)

# ? Jun 30, 2017 17:38

Squizzle: Apr 24, 2008

Raskolnikov38 posted:

i mean the answer is no but does this guy realize prop 98 is why nearly every new ballot proposition specifically excludes the money from touching the general fun

socialize funhaving imo

# ? Jun 30, 2017 17:42

SKULL.GIF: Jan 20, 2017

Squizzle posted:

socialize funhaving imo

ugh, devs making everything easy for casuals

# ? Jun 30, 2017 17:47

docbeard: Jul 19, 2011

Keith good.

https://twitter.com/keithellison/status/880822739434655745

# ? Jun 30, 2017 17:51

loquacius: Oct 21, 2008

docbeard posted:

Keith good.

https://twitter.com/keithellison/status/880822739434655745

can I vote for him now please

# ? Jun 30, 2017 18:00

Uncle Wemus: Mar 4, 2004

If keith really supported the party he'd have posted a lecture on why this is bad and should have settled for 12.50

# ? Jun 30, 2017 18:01

Frijolero: Jan 24, 2009; by Nyc_Tattoo

docbeard posted:

Keith good.

https://twitter.com/keithellison/status/880822739434655745

:krad:

# ? Jun 30, 2017 18:14

The Little Kielbasa: Mar 29, 2001; and another thing: im not mad. please dont put in the newspaper that i got mad.

I can already see the neolib challenger's campaign ad interspersing shots of Keith singing "money, that's what I want" between Very Serious calls for lower taxes and eliminating wasteful government data centers.

# ? Jun 30, 2017 18:15

anime was right: Jun 27, 2008; death is certain
keep yr cool

docbeard posted:

Keith good.

https://twitter.com/keithellison/status/880822739434655745

remember when mom tried this and no one cared lol

# ? Jun 30, 2017 18:17

Adbot: ADBOT LOVES YOU

# ? May 12, 2024 13:12

anime was right: Jun 27, 2008; death is certain
keep yr cool

The Little Kielbasa posted:

I can already see the neolib challenger's campaign ad interspersing shots of Keith singing "money, that's what I want" between Very Serious calls for lower taxes and eliminating wasteful government data centers.

also yea lol

# ? Jun 30, 2017 18:17

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > C-SPAM > [The Succ Zone] I unblocked you, again, to say this: You don't fucking know me.

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