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dflist doesn't auto-update fleets to take advantage of the admiral cost discount, which it looks like you're not getting. If those were put together before they were released then you have to remove and re-add the admiral. EDIT: This is in response to Flipswitch. Unfortunately I can't say more since most of my experience is with Scourge, PHR, and to a lesser extent Shaltari.
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Jul 5, 2017 22:22
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I've only just built the list and it's showing all admirals available (the 2) at the same cost. I need to read the Dropfleet FAQ though, haven't in a while.
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Jul 5, 2017 22:23
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Flipswitch posted:I've only just built the list and it's showing all admirals available (the 2) at the same cost. I need to read the Dropfleet FAQ though, haven't in a while. There was a pretty big update that among other things gives admiral discounts for putting them on big ships (some people were putting them on a frigate that was specifically sent away from the action).
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Jul 5, 2017 22:26
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Sweet. If it works out the way I'm thinking I may just hurl a sixth Taipei into the list.
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Jul 5, 2017 23:29
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Flipswitch posted:Lists So, my biggest problem with Limas is that my enemies tend to silent running and/or hide behind debris fields on the first turn or two, and then once we're turn three and beyond I don't really need the active scan to be able to hit stuff. If you've had success with them power to you, and please share your secrets. My experience is also based on playing on relatively terrain-crowded center zones. I agree they go nicely with our gunships (especially the Atlantis, since you can weapons free from just barely in major spike range, which can really cut down on return fire). That said, you're only spending 75 pts on them out of 1000, so it's not a big deal. As for the lists, I think you're really undervaluing Berlins/New Cairos. They're so good. Unreliable as all get out, but a bunch of Berlins can be a tremendous backbone for a UCM force. In the second list, I also am on the fence about the Toulons. I think they're good as support frigates attached to other stuff, but I don't know how good a wolfpack of 4 + Jakarta is. For that 172 points you could get two Osakas. They're very comparable. The Osakas are: - More resilient to chip damage (no crippling rolls on 2 damage) - Avoid chain explosions that will rip through the whole frigate battlegroup - Just as flexible on orders - Get slightly more crits and do marginally more expected damage against 3+ armor saves - Able to scan for critical locations and better at holding them The Toulons are: - Slightly more hitpoints (20 vs. 16 if we count the Jakarta) - Slightly better off vs bombers (aegis, but the chip damage problem makes this a wash) - Lower strat rating so better for sniping stuff - Probably do marginally more damage against 4+ and higher armor targets Alternatively, instead of the Toulon group you could take two New Cairos! You'd need to free up 2 points elsewhere, but I think that would be a huge addition to the list. You could swap one of the Seattles for a Berlin to get the points. Or use the points from your free commander upgrade. I'll have to play with the list to see if I can swap in two Berlins instead of the New Cairo. I'm not sure what to think about the first list. The Taipei pack is pretty neat, though I haven't tried one out yet. I think you should consider swapping the New Orleans's from the Seattle group to the Atlantis group so you can put the Limas with the Seattles. I think you'll overall be sitting farther back with the Seattles longer than you will with the Atlantis (not needing to WF gives you more ability to zig zag sideways and duck behind cover just enough to get LOS to your target and nothing else), and so the Limas may be viable longer when cooperating with the Seattles than with the Atlantis. Otherwise the list looks pretty good. Four strike carriers and some bombardment seems a little light for 1000 points, especially without any Santiagos, but it depends how your meta goes.
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Jul 5, 2017 23:40
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Yeah the Berlin is my usual go-to. I don't own any NCs but I do have 3x Saratogas on the way, but they're still in the post. Meta wise we're all up in the air because we played some Dropzone for a bit apparently when I went travelling for a few months and we're basically rebooting from a fresh, so I'm curious how it will shape up, we're basically all going in blind and seeing what happens. Im giving the Madrid a go because mine is half painted (and I can get it finished before we play easy), but also Im curious how bombardment leverages vs taking two more strike carriers, denial vs active scoring and the like. How much experience have you had with the Osakas? on paper I was thoroughly unimpressed by them.
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Jul 5, 2017 23:53
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On paper I think the Osakas are kinda poo poo and I would almost always rather have a New Cairo. I haven't had a chance to take any yet. I'm very much not sure I'm right about the Toulon group. As I was writing up the post I started to run some numbers and the Toulons come out really favorably. I just had a bad experience with some chain explosions in a frigate/corvette pile this weekend, so I'm probably overreacting against a mixed group like that. I suppose you can spread them out a lot more than strike carriers on round two. I have a hard time building lists because I love the Seattle. It might not be actually that good, but I really like the idea of it. Plenty of firepower, easy order management, and solid launch asset capability. I just wish UCM bombers were more effective.
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Jul 6, 2017 00:14
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Yeah I see what you mean, I tend to auto pilot 2x Seattles into my fleets because I love them so much, but it really devours those points.
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Jul 6, 2017 00:29
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Bombers can be feast or famine depending on how well you use them. One game two Hydras fail to kill pretty much anything, the next they're a chainsaw of death.
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Jul 6, 2017 00:30
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Yeah, like I say, I really like the Seattle. I have one and an Atlantis built, and am really happy with each. (Though I need to paint some better rims on the launch bays to make them easier to tell apart at upper table height, since my eyes suck.) I can certainly get behind an all-launch asset list, but it makes it really hard to fit in burnthrough lasers. The other problem is that I keep wanting to add more drop assets. I haven't built a Madrid yet - how is it? Does it perform at about 2/3 of a San Francisco, which is what it's priced at? Also, wdarkk, what do you find separates good use of bombers from bad use of them?
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Jul 6, 2017 04:04
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I'm still getting a feel for it, but a lot of it is that critical mass matters, and trying to put your opponent on the defensive is great. One fighter isn't quite enough to counter one bomber, statistically. If you can make your opponent defend a ship from all your bombers using all his fighters, you can get damage through and avoid damage in return since he launched fighters instead of bombers.
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Jul 6, 2017 06:43
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What's the best place to get a 4' x 4' mousepad mat for dropfleet gaming? I don't see a good orbital map on the fat mats website. Deep Cut Studio has some that look good, but international shipping and hassle. Is that the best option? (Please note I have no idea how to go to strange Chinese marketplaces to get mousepad fabrics, so if you have a step by step guide I could do that, but I am fairly incompetent in this space. And I may be asking for a birthday/Christmas present of a mat, so that's harder if we are fussing with strange vendors.)
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Jul 7, 2017 23:23
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Ebay. That's where I got mine and it was brand new.
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Jul 7, 2017 23:37
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Wave 2 is finally shipping, but no maps. Apparently getting someone to print a 4x4 map is impossible? Or just not at the priced the printers said they would do it at? I guess I will take some free store credit but this will probably make some people mad.
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Jul 11, 2017 18:21
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Kickstarter update: for some reason Hawk couldn't find anybody who could make a 4x4 paper mat? Apparently they're compensating us with store credit and open-sourcing of the files to make the maps.
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Jul 11, 2017 18:24
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Honestly i'm much happier with a 5£ credit than a paper map. Especially if it means i'll finally get my station kit.
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Jul 11, 2017 18:38
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I would have loved Hawk-approved paper maps, but this way I can take them someplace local and get them printed, which means I have unlimited maps. So I'm okay with this.
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Jul 11, 2017 18:54
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I'm somewhere between: A) Disappointed it didn't work out. B) Completely unsurprised that Hawk haven't been able to deliver a quality item in the quoted material for a reasonable price. C) Secretly glad I'm getting store credit to spend on Advanced Sectors so I can quietly justify buying a better mat elsewhere. It would have been nice if Hawk could have just called time on it 6 months or more earlier, but once the delays hit and I saw the mat in the starter set I lost hope that they were going to be much good. As I added a map pack to my pledge I should have £20 of credit coming my way which I think I'll be happier with.
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Jul 11, 2017 19:33
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How robust is DFC going forward? I jumped into the game around release and have a bit of fun with my buddy using the boxed set ships and rules - but we're a little on the back foot around the long term longievity of the game. It appears that DZC is getting a little less love but seems less based around the 'gamey' mechanic of landing paper troop counters and dicing off on those to secure victory - am I wrong?
Southern Heel fucked around with this message at 20:25 on Jul 11, 2017 |
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Jul 11, 2017 20:09
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Southern Heel posted:How robust is DFC going forward? I jumped into the game around release and have a bit of fun with my buddy using the boxed set ships and rules - but we're a little on the back foot around the long term longievity of the game. It appears that DZC is getting a little less love but seems less based around the 'gamey' mechanic of landing troops to secure victory - am I wrong? I think a lot of the wind got taken out of DFC's sales by the initial kickstarter delievery issues. I think its a good game and want to play it more, but have been lacking motivation... DZC also is very objective based. Winning games usually revolves around having troops enter buildings and finding and extracting objectives. There is also some zone control stuff though.
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Jul 11, 2017 20:25
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It's a solid system suffering from post-kickstarter woes but tbh it's also a case of Hawk systems (and I say this as a talon admittedly) do not tend towards being mainstream systems, they're always secondary games and now Hawks regular customer base is going to be playing either or at any given time, which makes it look quiter than it actually is.
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Jul 11, 2017 21:26
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I've played more DFC than I have DZC, and I like DFC more. That's largely because I like spaceships more than I like tanks. I imagine if I'd started playing DZC earlier I'd like it almost as much. DFC has the big advantage of being their second game, so they've cleaned up some of the rough edges.
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Jul 11, 2017 21:45
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DFC seems much easier to store and transport, too.
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Jul 11, 2017 22:15
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wdarkk posted:DFC seems much easier to store and transport, too. Not having to set up a billion buildings to play a game is awfully nice...
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Jul 11, 2017 22:20
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One of the things that drew me in to this over other tabletop games, is that you don't need to buy and paint and set up a bunch of terrain to get a nice looking game. Just a couple space stations and some sectors on a decent looking mat and I'm satisfied with the aesthetics of it. The only other thing I did was glue the debris fields on top of small bases with very short stands to give them some three dimensionality. If I wanted to get into DZC, or any of the more prominent tabletop games (besides X-Wing but mehhhh Star Wars), I wouldn't be satisfied until I had spent way too much time and money on scenery.
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Jul 11, 2017 22:36
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Was talking with a couple of Talons at Critical Engagement the other day and there is a feeling that some tweaks need to happen to speed up games for it to be a better tournament experience. The feeling is that it is a good game in need of fine tuning, which is understandable given that it is still new. People seem to be agreeing that the focus was placed too much on ground assets and it needs reigning in a bit to make the game more about the spaceships. I think DFC needs to find some more varied scenarios that shift the focus from spamming troops and more towards control of space. There was a feeling that light ships are maybe too numerous so we talked about tweaking the force organisation chart. Apparently some people find strategy ratings and activation cards are slowing the game down so one idea is to revert to a DZC style battlegroup activation system. I'm not keen on that so much. In short, with adjustments it should be a solid game that can be grown. Once the kickstarter is done Hawk can put efforts back into new content for both games and that will give things a shot in the arm.
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Jul 11, 2017 23:23
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Does the announcement today constitute the kickstarter being "done" or are there any more things that have to be dealt with?
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Jul 11, 2017 23:34
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wdarkk posted:Does the announcement today constitute the kickstarter being "done" or are there any more things that have to be dealt with? Weeeeeeell. We still need the goods, but otherwise I guess?
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Jul 12, 2017 00:20
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Arcturas posted:Not having to set up a billion buildings to play a game is awfully nice... DZC looks amazing on the table though... with a good terrain setup its just wonderful. If I had the time for more wargames (and the people to play them with me...) I would be all over it. Hits what I want out of a sci-fi ground game way more than things like 40k.
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Jul 12, 2017 00:51
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wdarkk posted:Does the announcement today constitute the kickstarter being "done" or are there any more things that have to be dealt with? As I understand it, the kickstarter should be completed within a month based on that announcement barring a few outliers like Russian postal gremlins.
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Jul 12, 2017 10:24
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Just lol at using the Russian postal service. When I lived there even I didn't use it
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Jul 12, 2017 11:26
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Flipswitch posted:Just lol at using the Russian postal service. If it's that bad I guess it's understandable that couriers won't touch it. Wonder why you would dare to back a kickstarter knowing your stuff will just disappear.
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Jul 12, 2017 12:39
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Tbh Russian customers face the issue with the best retailers are within Western Europe so you have to get stuff ordered in. If it's sent via regular mail then it will get log jammed in customs for months on end because the customs officials are poo poo and the postal service is a farce. The only way to get things through reliably is to get them courier serviced, because those go straight through and IIRC Hawk didn't courier service the kickstarters. It's the sort of thing you only know about if you've had to deal with Yevgenny the village idiot kicking your parcel around and trying to find it for months on end.
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Jul 12, 2017 15:01
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New arts for upcoming box sets
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Jul 13, 2017 16:34
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So are these going on the back of the blisters?
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Jul 13, 2017 19:10
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That artwork is utterly gorgeous.
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Jul 13, 2017 21:08
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Ugleb posted:So are these going on the back of the blisters? They didn't specify, it just said sneak peak
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Jul 13, 2017 21:37
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NTRabbit posted:They didn't specify, it just said sneak peak Yeah I'm not sure what else it would be unless they are planning something new like a start collecting box for each faction. Regardless, I'm loving the Shaltari image.
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Jul 13, 2017 23:13
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Just got some swag from Hawk, 3 Saratogas, 2 Athens and the new cluster pack.
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Jul 14, 2017 10:08
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It's been a while since i worked on my custom bases but i had the opportunity to make another prototype today. There's a few minor tweaks that i'd like to incorporate but i'm definitely getting close to what i want. -The dial counts damage (i know, it's a 5hp one). -The yellow thing in the center is swappable to indicate the battlegroup. -Spikes and other status effects will be marked with tokens that go into the slots. -Altitude should be obvious The whole thing is weighed and has satin underneath so it stands surprisingly stable. Last time i noticed that it's much harder to scale down a design than to scale it up so for this round i started with a small base.   
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Jul 16, 2017 17:47
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