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They all want to keep their heads down and just not get past the vote for a motion to proceed. That way they can avoid voting yes or no.
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Jul 14, 2017 20:44
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DAD LOST MY IPOD posted:Any GOP moderate could have come out yesterday and killed the bill. Any of them. They all know it. None of them did. Why? Portman and Heller have all the political cover in the world, both of their governors came out against the bill. Neither of them did. You think after a weekend of relentless leadership and donor pressure they'll be less likely to vote against the bill? They might, they might not. They don't want to be the threshold vote that kills it, but they also don't want to vote for it. They're playing chicken with the vote, and are probably still making up their mind. I'm gonna be phone banking in Ohio about it on Tuesday, so hopefully things like that will push Portman.
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Jul 14, 2017 20:54
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at this point Portman may actually be remotely gettable because kasich is providing cover. I am pressuring Heller, Portman and Capito about it (calls, emails to all three, using in state addresses) but I've also reached out to their governors. They don't want to be the one to kill it so if they can fob off responsibility to someone else they will.
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Jul 14, 2017 20:58
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Portman gives absolutely no fucks, he's safe for 6 and this will be well out of memory by then.
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Jul 14, 2017 21:01
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You can sum up the situation as: nobody wants to face a primary challenger with a no vote on this bill. Nobody wants to face a general election challenger with a yes vote on the bill. Everybody who is waffling on the bill just hopes that McConnell brings back a long lost Republican tradition and just pockets the bill. McConnell can't do that because it would piss off the donors and likely lead to a slap fight with the White House.
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Jul 15, 2017 08:18
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That doesn't make me think they're about to pass it.
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Jul 15, 2017 08:44
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empty whippet box posted:That doesn't make me think they're about to pass it. Never underestimate the capacity of Republicans for kamikaze evil plans.
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Jul 15, 2017 12:57
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DAD LOST MY IPOD posted:Any GOP moderate could have come out yesterday and killed the bill. Any of them. They all know it. None of them did. Why? Portman and Heller have all the political cover in the world, both of their governors came out against the bill. Neither of them did. You think after a weekend of relentless leadership and donor pressure they'll be less likely to vote against the bill? You realize they're all waiting for the CBO score, right? If they direct the CBO to use 2017 ACA enrollment data this time or decide to get the CMS to score it instead, then all the moderates will have cover to vote for it because the numbers will be much more palatable. That's when you need to start worrying. e: here's the CMS score for AHCA, for reference. 12m uninsured vs CBO's 24m uninsured in 2026 The Phlegmatist fucked around with this message at 13:46 on Jul 15, 2017 |
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Jul 15, 2017 13:38
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God McConnell is the worst loving person. As comically stupid and evil as the Trump Regime may be, McConnell has actively sought to destroy every norm to impose his will on everything. He gives no fucks about the will of the people and will burn the system down, if necessary, to please his donors. Ryan is a total prick but at least he's pretty ineffective at his job. McConnell is evil and competent--a horrible combo. I've already prepared myself for the passage of this bill. Hope I don't get sick for the next ten years *fingers crossed*.
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Jul 15, 2017 13:38
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LeeMajors posted:God McConnell is the worst loving person. I'm afraid of the bill passing too, but nothing much has changed about the situation. A bunch of the insane Republicans including Cruz were probably always going to vote yes after some stupid changes/giveaways were made. Another CBO score is coming early next week and there's pretty much no way it's going to be any better than the last. That will give the less insane Republicans their cover to kill this version of the bill.
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Jul 15, 2017 14:10
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https://twitter.com/jonfavs/status/886236414492295168 Shop around, they said Freedom to choose, they said
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Jul 15, 2017 16:55
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Yes, it's your freedom to choose to die of treatable illness. But not assisted suicide. 
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Jul 15, 2017 17:54
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This poo poo really exposes the fact that rip-off artists are a huge GOP constituency. Who the gently caress benefits from the "freedom" to buy completely worthless insurance besides the scumbag con artists who will make bank selling it to poor, desperate and uninformed people?
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Jul 15, 2017 18:15
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But hey, don't worry, I'm sure we'd get plenty of articles from people gushing about how they love their super cheap Cruz plan until it kills them
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Jul 15, 2017 18:22
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http://www.cnn.com/2017/07/15/opinions/cruz-amendment-smart-policy-moore/index.html gently caress you, CNN.
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Jul 15, 2017 18:40
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Rhesus Pieces posted:https://twitter.com/jonfavs/status/886236414492295168 Wow, so this could possibly just kill people that's insane. Have cheap plan , get cancer, not covered, die.
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Jul 15, 2017 18:50
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KillHour posted:http://www.cnn.com/2017/07/15/opinions/cruz-amendment-smart-policy-moore/index.html That garbage loving article posted:Editor's Note: Stephen Moore is an economic adviser to Freedom Works and a CNN economic analyst. He served as a senior economic adviser to the Trump campaign. The views expressed are his own. Hmm yes this is the sort of person we should provide airtime to in order to give a clear and realistic view of the health care bill. Of the not-Fox news networks CNN is the loving worst.
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Jul 15, 2017 19:02
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KillHour posted:http://www.cnn.com/2017/07/15/opinions/cruz-amendment-smart-policy-moore/index.html Yeah this'll work out great. After I buy cheap health insurance for people who don't get sick I'll go shopping for cheap car insurance for people who don't get into accidents.
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Jul 15, 2017 19:14
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KillHour posted:http://www.cnn.com/2017/07/15/opinions/cruz-amendment-smart-policy-moore/index.html I'm surprised the byline wasn't Ted Cruz.
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Jul 15, 2017 19:15
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Rhesus Pieces posted:Yeah this'll work out great. After I buy cheap health insurance for people who don't get sick I'll go shopping for cheap car insurance for people who don't get into accidents. I can't understand why the definition of insurance has seemingly changed. Insurance is designed for risk mitigation by pooling premiums. Low coverage plans with high deductibles are not even insurance plans. High risk pools that concentrate are not even insurance plans. This is a basic loving concept that is intentionally ignored and it makes me feel loving crazy.
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Jul 15, 2017 19:27
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Analysis is showing that the red states that accepted Medicaid expansion will get completely hosed. WV and KY will both have 3-4x increases in number of uninsured.
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Jul 15, 2017 20:00
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Don't both of those states have incredibly problems with opioid addictions?
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Jul 15, 2017 20:03
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Hollismason posted:Don't both of those states have incredibly problems with opioid addictions? Yes. Luckily, addicts are the best at forward planning insurance.
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Jul 15, 2017 20:05
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LeeMajors posted:I can't understand why the definition of insurance has seemingly changed. Oh the insurance companies are well aware of how nonsensical the Cruz plan is: https://twitter.com/topherspiro/status/886015376173268992 This isn't based around the concept of actually insuring people, it's about comforting the comfortable and afflicting the afflicted in every way. Healthy young men who don't even need health care deserve a massive break as a reward for their good fortune, and the sick must be punished further because they must've done something to deserve it.
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Jul 15, 2017 20:07
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Great Metal Jesus posted:Hmm yes this is the sort of person we should provide airtime to in order to give a clear and realistic view of the health care bill. Of the not-Fox news networks CNN is the loving worst. LOL Stephen Moore. My sister used to babysit his kids, his wife would hire her to look after them while he was still in the house watching TV in the basement. His own wife didn't trust the piece of poo poo to look after his own kids.
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Jul 15, 2017 20:45
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LeeMajors posted:I can't understand why the definition of insurance has seemingly changed. This has really only happened to health insurance. It's a long story, but it boils down to fee for service being a terrible system for healthcare and insurers having to take on the roles of managing care to combat the rising costs, which has transformed the insurance companies in to health plan administrators inatead of traditional risk poolers. The only real health "insurance" still sold is stuff like critical illness plans. Also, at some point in there one of Nixon's hideous black tentacles touched the industry birthing HMOs and it took 30 years for those to turn in to something that didn't closely resemble a death camp. Reik fucked around with this message at 21:00 on Jul 15, 2017 |
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Jul 15, 2017 20:52
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LeeMajors posted:I can't understand why the definition of insurance has seemingly changed. Prior to the ACA the shift to consumer driven, high deductible plans have been sold to people with FYGM tendencies. For example, my last employer's HR department would say that instead of subsidizing everyone with a higher premium your new $20/ month HDHP is a pay for what you use plan, unlike before when you were giving sickos and fatties a free ride.
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Jul 15, 2017 21:01
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Reik posted:This has really only happened to health insurance. It's a long story, but it boils down to fee for service being a terrible system for healthcare and insurers having to take on the roles of managing care to combat the rising costs, which has transformed the insurance companies in to health plan administrators inatead of traditional risk poolers. It's happened w home insurance too. Specialty hazard insurance has concentrated risk (esp Flood Ins) and struggles to stay solvent.
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Jul 15, 2017 22:51
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Home insurance is going to get real fun when climate change starts hitting hard in a few decades, but that's a conversation for another thread.Reik posted:This has really only happened to health insurance. It's a long story, but it boils down to fee for service being a terrible system for healthcare and insurers having to take on the roles of managing care to combat the rising costs, which has transformed the insurance companies in to health plan administrators inatead of traditional risk poolers. Trouble is, people in the US start screaming about death panels when the government wants to play the role of a health plan administrator but are seemingly okay with private payers deciding whether they live or die. That's probably the biggest barrier to universal healthcare in the US. After Michelle Obama's healthy school lunch program got such ridiculous amounts of backlash, I'm sure that trying to institute public health measures to control our obesity crisis (sugar tax, calorie or portion size cap for entrees at restaurants) would result in an armed uprising powered by rascal scooters. But stuff like that is important for a UHC system as a cost-control measure.
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Jul 15, 2017 23:17
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The Phlegmatist posted:Home insurance is going to get real fun when climate change starts hitting hard in a few decades, but that's a conversation for another thread.
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Jul 16, 2017 00:38
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I suppose this the best thread to post this, but here's how badly the VA is doing in NH. https://www.bostonglobe.com/metro/2017/07/15/four-star-case-failure-manchester/n9VV7BerswvkL5akCgNzvK/story.html?p1=AMP_Recirculation_Pos1 quote:SPOTLIGHT It's quite the  article.
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Jul 17, 2017 17:21
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OhFunny posted:I suppose this the best thread to post this, but here's how badly the VA is doing in NH. Many people I know like to use the VA as an example of why the government should "stay out" of healthcare. Stories like this do not help.
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Jul 17, 2017 17:44
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More like, why Republicans should stay out of health care.
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Jul 17, 2017 18:00
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Even the best healthcare system will fall in to ruin if it doesn't have appropriate funding.
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Jul 17, 2017 18:07
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Brony Car posted:Many people I know like to use the VA as an example of why the government should "stay out" of healthcare. Stories like this do not help. I have no idea how it happened, but it seems like the VA is staffed with a lot of malicious actors. I've heard stories from veterans about how they'll shred your paperwork and pretend they never received it, so you always need to send them photocopies rather than the originals. And they'll constantly try to make you sign waivers saying that you never worked with asbestos just in case you get mesothelioma. Yeah our healthcare system in the US is a mess but the VA is a special kind of awful.
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Jul 17, 2017 18:09
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Reik posted:Even the best healthcare system will fall in to ruin if it doesn't have appropriate funding. That could be a huge problem for any single-payer healthcare system in the USA. It would be very vulnerable to being starved every 8/16 years by the Republicans.
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Jul 17, 2017 18:13
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BarbarianElephant posted:That could be a huge problem for any single-payer healthcare system in the USA. It would be very vulnerable to being starved every 8/16 years by the Republicans. If it was a system everyone was on though, it would be much harder to get the support. Republicans don't dare try and cut funding to Medicare. Medicaid is only fair game because it's for "the poors".
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Jul 17, 2017 18:23
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The Phlegmatist posted:Trouble is, people in the US start screaming about death panels when the government wants to play the role of a health plan administrator but are seemingly okay with private payers deciding whether they live or die. That's probably the biggest barrier to universal healthcare in the US. For better or for worse, that's not so much an inherent property of the American electorate, but the product of intense partisan identification. Any reform introduced by Democrats, completely regardless of its content (poo poo, it could be further to the right of the Republican plan) is going to receive the exact same treatment by the Republican voter base. So any political strategy going forward basically needs to accept that the right wing of America will literally believe it its policies are Satanic and enact them anyway.
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Jul 17, 2017 18:25
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People should be outside of McCain's hospital room right now, protesting. The fucker has the gall to get sick on our dime then try and take health insurance away from millions. He should burn and any other Republican who wants to do the same should expect the same treatment till the day they die. Actions need to start getting spiteful. Reik posted:Even the best healthcare system will fall in to ruin if it doesn't have appropriate funding. Yea, you have to have healthcare to fail it. Any asshat that makes the argument that we shouldn't have it because it wont work in the future is full of it.
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Jul 17, 2017 21:16
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BlueBlazer posted:People should be outside of McCain's hospital room right now, protesting. Isn't him being in a state where he's still in the senate but can't press the yes button actually helping keep the current system working? I'm not saying the dude isn't a shithead, but his broken brain and huge ego means he won't leave his seat and also can't vote yes (or for cloture on other stuff) in the meantime.
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Jul 17, 2017 21:34
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