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So these last pages have been terrible, and apparently Laci is going full on TERF. At the rate she is going lets see how long the F part lasts.  I hope Contra is okay, (s)he seems to be struggling recently and that debate can't have been fun for. Edit: amazing way to start a page.
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Jul 16, 2017 02:09
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SHY NUDIST GRRL posted:This tweet thread is great Asking people like Lauren to openly state their opinion on Jewish conspiracies is a fun one. She can't answer either way or half of her audience will evaporate
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Jul 16, 2017 02:14
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WampaLord posted:I notice you didn't respond to my question that seems like reason enough to be offended by him, though not reason enough to hate him/wish death upon him it's not nice to hate people on account of a bad joke they made, and in fact it's not nice to hate people at all and if you're in an environment such as d&d where hate is normalized and encouraged, that might not be a healthy environment
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Jul 16, 2017 02:25
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can you retards stop having page long slap-fights with the lambic guy? visiting this thread to see Sargon and other idiots step on rakes, self-owning constantly is much more entertaining than whatever crap you're on abt.
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Jul 16, 2017 02:32
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it shaun posted:Asking people like Lauren to openly state their opinion on Jewish conspiracies is a fun one. What's she doing now anyway? Didn't she get canned for being in support of abortion by the powers that be?
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Jul 16, 2017 02:36
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SSNeoman posted:What's she doing now anyway? Didn't she get canned for being in support of abortion by the powers that be? No, you're thinking of the other blonde, neo-nazi, that's also named Lauren.
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Jul 16, 2017 02:44
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One of them is like 20, right? Or is that another still?
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Jul 16, 2017 02:48
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Yall should question whether the guy doubting that loving Sargon of Akkad is actually as racist and sexist as his many, many racist and sexist videos portray him to be is arguing in good faith or not. It should not be this easy to get trolled.
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Jul 16, 2017 02:50
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Deified Data posted:Yall should question whether the guy doubting that loving Sargon of Akkad is actually as racist and sexist as his many, many racist and sexist videos portray him to be is arguing in good faith or not. It should not be this easy to get trolled. I'm not being trolled, I'm having fun dunking on an idiot, that's half the point of this subforum.
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Jul 16, 2017 02:57
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Why attribute to malice what can be amply explained by stupidity?
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Jul 16, 2017 03:03
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Zedd posted:So these last pages have been terrible, and apparently Laci is going full on TERF. Laci's not a TERF yet. She just keeps trying to grab for a nonexistent center where trans people, TERFs, pepes, anti-feminists, and feminists can have respectful discussion and concede sensible points to one another--which for some reason advantages some of those groups while leaving others at a disadvantage. She kept meekly trying to challenge the TERF on her stream about trans women not being men, but obviously the TERF just ignored her.
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Jul 16, 2017 03:03
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WrenP-Complete posted:One of them is like 20, right? Or is that another still? Actually they're both in their early 20s ...man, they really ARE interchangeable 
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Jul 16, 2017 03:05
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Mr Interweb posted:Actually they're both in their early 20s Considering that's how Fox News hires them, I'm not surprised.
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Jul 16, 2017 03:06
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business hammocks posted:Laci's not a TERF yet. She just keeps trying to grab for a nonexistent center where trans people, TERFs, pepes, anti-feminists, and feminists can have respectful discussion and concede sensible points to one another--which for some reason advantages some of those groups while leaving others at a disadvantage. She kept meekly trying to challenge the TERF on her stream about trans women not being men, but obviously the TERF just ignored her. I can't say I really understand people so committed to non confrontation that they will try to make peace with utterly abhorrent positions.
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Jul 16, 2017 03:08
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OwlFancier posted:I can't say I really understand people so committed to non confrontation that they will try to make peace with utterly abhorrent positions.  Or it's also a self-satisfaction of appearing "rational" and "above it all".
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Jul 16, 2017 03:15
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The aggressively passive variant on passive aggression
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Jul 16, 2017 03:18
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Pittsburgh Lambic posted:that seems like reason enough to be offended by him, though not reason enough to hate him/wish death upon him Shouldn't you be making transphobic jokes in your favorite PYF thread? Did it get closed again? Is that why you're here?
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Jul 16, 2017 03:21
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mojo1701a posted:
Neither of those seem to fit super well with someone who seeks out conflict and tries to get in the middle of it. That takes effort, and the "above it all" people tend to regard the arguments as beneath them in my experience.
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Jul 16, 2017 03:25
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Okay, I have to ask. What exactly is a TERF?
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Jul 16, 2017 03:27
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Mr Interweb posted:Okay, I have to ask. What exactly is a TERF? Trans exclusive radical feminist. Basically, a feminist who is convinced that trans people are their gender assigned at birth, and somehow trans women have a dramatic advantage in life, despite all evidence that the exact opposite is true.
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Jul 16, 2017 03:31
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rkajdi posted:Trans exclusive radical feminist. Basically, a feminist who is convinced that trans people are their gender assigned at birth, and somehow trans women have a dramatic advantage in life, despite all evidence that the exact opposite is true. now i'm even more confused than before
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Jul 16, 2017 03:45
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rkajdi posted:Trans exclusive radical feminist. Basically, a feminist who is convinced that trans people are their gender assigned at birth, and somehow trans women have a dramatic advantage in life, despite all evidence that the exact opposite is true. To be more charitable than perhaps may be merited, I understand they believe that owing to the fact that transwomen have appeared, or may currently appear male to outside observers, they are the recipients of male privilege and thus their current position in life is as a result of that privilege, making them fundamentally, not women, as women are people who do not experience male privilege. They have not truly lived as women because they were not born being recognized as women by society and thus do not possess the experiences that women who were, do. It... maybe slightly halfway makes a iota of sense if you tilt your head and accept that agonizing specific definition of "woman" but I find it to be painfully reductive given that I think it projects an excessively uniform experience on both trans and cis women and blatantly ignores the enormous disadvantage transpeople are at as a result of their status and frankly a lot of its proponents don't tend to give a poo poo about transpeople even from that perspective despite it being not even remotely contingent on believe that transwomen are "real women", they still patently suffer for their status and should still elicit empathy from someone who, as a feminist, should be excruciatingly aware of the damage that prejudice can do. But instead they trend towards just being basically transphobic and functionally indistinguishable from any other transphobe, whatever their reasoning. It's irritating because there are some otherwise worthwhile feminists out there who just refuse to budge on that point so anyone coming at it from a third wave all-inclusive kind of perspective tends to end up having screaming fits with them because it's really annoying when it's coming from someone you should agree with. Like if you meet an ardent socialist who refuses to acknowledge racism because it isn't part of the economic class war. OwlFancier fucked around with this message at 03:49 on Jul 16, 2017 |
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Jul 16, 2017 03:46
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Mr Interweb posted:now i'm even more confused than before IIRC, the original TERF was someone who had relationship problems after her partner transitioned, which culminated in the end of the relationship. So at least originally there's a lot of bitterness about getting dumped being added to all the rest of everything. But yeah, it's a nonsensical philosophy. In practice, it's just a cover to let people claim to be feminists while making GBS threads on trans people.
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Jul 16, 2017 03:52
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Or even if it's sincere I have not yet seen it result in what I would consider a proper response, which is still to support transpeople on a simple humanist basis even if you can't get your head around the specifics.
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Jul 16, 2017 03:54
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They feel that the existence of trans women delegitimizes the category of woman as distinct and separate, and their political project entails liberation through disentangling the category of woman from all its political and cultural baggage. Basically, they need a blank foundation of sex difference onto which cultural construction is projected, because then they have a position from which to undo culturally conditioned ideas of gender. Pointing out that the absolute binary between man and woman is already fraught and prone to collapse without constant policing basically cuts the legs out from under their whole philosophy. So they get really mad about anything that critiques the naive positivism of biological sex vs. culturally-conditioned gender. It's a shame, because so much of their analysis is useful and incisive, but they're like people from the 60s who just woke up yesterday.
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Jul 16, 2017 03:56
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OwlFancier posted:Or even if it's sincere I have not yet seen it result in what I would consider a proper response, which is still to support transpeople on a simple humanist basis even if you can't get your head around the specifics. Like, even if you believe that there is some ineluctable maleness attached to the body or that trans people act out of socially-constructed femininity or whatever, you have to be crazy to look at a trans woman and see how she's received and treated by society and say that she's still a man. To the degree that one's sex is created by how one is perceived and treated by others (a very second-wave notion), it's obvious that they can't be men because nobody sees them as men, however they are seen.
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Jul 16, 2017 04:00
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Obviously I much prefer the third wave approach of sex being a stupid idea for babbies and let's just do whatever.
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Jul 16, 2017 04:03
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There's also people who criticize the TERFs for being essentially being a trojan horse for anti-feminism, since they use patriarchal ideas in order to back-up their beliefs.
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Jul 16, 2017 04:35
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And end up acting rather patriarchal in the end also.
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Jul 16, 2017 04:36
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Deified Data posted:Sargon of Akkad is actually as racist and sexist as his many, many racist and sexist videos portray him to be nobody in this thread has ever pointed to any of the videos in question i find myself increasingly doubting that said videos exist how can you keep failing so drastically for so many pages Who What Now posted:Shouldn't you be making transphobic jokes in your favorite PYF thread? Did it get closed again? Is that why you're here? making wild, baseless accusations of transphobia does nothing to refute the notion that your wild accusations of racism and sexism are also baseless Pittsburgh Lambic fucked around with this message at 05:38 on Jul 16, 2017 |
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Jul 16, 2017 05:27
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Pittsburgh Lambic posted:i find myself increasingly doubting that said videos exist Anyone who doubts that this is now an obvious troll needs some serious time for self-reflection.
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Jul 16, 2017 05:45
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Lambic, it's all of his videos. Just pick any.
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Jul 16, 2017 05:49
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Pittsburgh Lambic posted:nobody in this thread has ever pointed to any of the videos in question Because no-one accepted your challenge because we questioned its validity. Like, there are a lot of videos in this thread, and a lot of videos referenced by the videos posted in this thread. The least you could do is actually take in the content in this thread before you accuse it of not existing. E: Can you post proof that you did in fact watch all of the videos that have so far been posted before you accuse us of not posting a video which contains the proof you're looking for, TIA Somfin fucked around with this message at 05:58 on Jul 16, 2017 |
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Jul 16, 2017 05:56
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It is really being argued that Sargon, the person endorsed by the EDL and Richard Spencer, is not a proven racist?
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Jul 16, 2017 06:02
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CANON posted:It is really being argued that Sargon, the person endorsed by the EDL and Richard Spencer, is not a proven racist? Not by anyone who isn't a troll. Also, in before "sending gay porn to racists on twitter means Sargon isn't a racist" argument.
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Jul 16, 2017 06:06
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Pittsburgh Lambic posted:nobody in this thread has ever pointed to any of the videos in question Dude, watch some of his videos. The guy is dumb as poo poo and pretty fuckin racist, at least in the sense of "denying or heavily underplaying the impact of racism." Like, just looking at a random selection of his videos: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fg0rTlq0u7A - In which he condemns BLM with such brilliant points as "HEH YOU SAY YOU WANT TO END THE CRIMINALIZATION OF BLACK PEOPLE, SO DOES THAT MEAN YOU WANT A BLACK MURDERER TO GO FREE?!" and just denies that black people are treated that badly in general (like saying higher black crime rates are just due to the breakdown of the nuclear family and absence of a father figure, which is a really common racist talking point) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X3Opc41Vr9w - In which he makes the brilliant point (among many, many others) - "40% of white Americans support BLM while 65% of black Americans support it; this means more white people support BLM than black people and therefore it's a white movement!" (which is something that would always be true unless the vast majority of white people disliked the movement in question) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Qgb9Davqo8 - In which he tries to rules-lawyer the concept of racism by linking to the dictionary definition and arbitrarily deciding it is "more correct" than the the idea of racism involving the combination of prejudice + power (among many, many other dumb points) I honestly find it fascinating that this guy has any following at all. It's not just that his political ideas are terrible, but he's also just genuinely really stupid. Like, in a "does not perform well with cognitive tasks" sense. All his points are the sort of thing a random 16 year old might come up with, but a bunch of people take him seriously because of his accent.
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Jul 16, 2017 06:36
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Zedd posted:So these last pages have been terrible, and apparently Laci is going full on TERF. Maybe I need to go back and relisten to some vlogs. She didn't seem like she was going TERF.
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Jul 16, 2017 06:51
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OwlFancier posted:To be more charitable than perhaps may be merited, I understand they believe that owing to the fact that transwomen have appeared, or may currently appear male to outside observers, they are the recipients of male privilege and thus their current position in life is as a result of that privilege, making them fundamentally, not women, as women are people who do not experience male privilege. They have not truly lived as women because they were not born being recognized as women by society and thus do not possess the experiences that women who were, do. I think the other component of TERFs is that they want to create "safe spaces" for women who have suffered domestic abuse and they feel that transwomen aren't not-men enough to not cause some of those victims anxiety.
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Jul 16, 2017 06:58
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fallenturtle posted:I think the other component of TERFs is that they want to create "safe spaces" for women who have suffered domestic abuse and they feel that transwomen aren't not-men enough to not cause some of those victims anxiety. Fuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuck TERFs.
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Jul 16, 2017 07:06
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Pittsburgh Lambic posted:that seems like reason enough to be offended by him, though not reason enough to hate him/wish death upon him
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Jul 16, 2017 07:09
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