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Keeshhound posted:It's not really cryptoracism; Ashley is advocating judging persons based solely on their species as opposed to their character. She might have more sympathetic motivations for that racism, but she's still just being racist, full stop. Or "speciesist," if you want to be anal. I'd peg it as cryptoracism mostly because she equates species with nation-state allegiance and the latter is what she purports to be chiefly concerned about - the idea that a Turian, any Turian, might be ready to "sell you out" for a foreign government. But there's clearly some actual racism underneath there, it's just veiled in political anxiety.
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Jul 16, 2017 18:28
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People are up their rear end about Ashley's pragmatism-couched prejudices meanwhile Navigator Pressley and that Admiral on the Citadel are just straight up "what's up with all the loving aliens you're enlisting?"
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Jul 16, 2017 19:33
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Chill Nazi Frog posted:People are up their rear end about Ashley's pragmatism-couched prejudices meanwhile Navigator Pressley and that Admiral on the Citadel are just straight up "what's up with all the loving aliens you're enlisting?" But you see pressley died during mass effect 2 and you should be sad about that.  A tasty burger orange juche fucked around with this message at 19:43 on Jul 16, 2017 |
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Jul 16, 2017 19:34
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Milky Moor posted:what is with people losing their minds when there's a character who can't be summed up as 'slavering xenophobe' or 'beacon of tolerance' People today like it when everyone fits nicely in a box, it makes it easy to know who to dogpile/Otherize. 
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Jul 16, 2017 20:06
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Salad on a bun
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Jul 16, 2017 20:10
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ultimately the reason they dropped the ball on ashley's characterization in me3 was because skepticism over how much an 'ally' the council races, and indeed all others, are to humanity or any group aside from their own becomes 100% vindicated - the games' an exercise in sifting through everyone's dirty laundry and you can piece together a condensed history of the milky way's time-honored tradition of selling others short to cut yourself ahead for the slightest, most short-sighted of reasons i guess ash getting day drunk alone in her quarters maybe makes sense in that context but not much else she does works
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Jul 16, 2017 20:42
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Chill Nazi Frog posted:People are up their rear end about Ashley's pragmatism-couched prejudices meanwhile Navigator Pressley and that Admiral on the Citadel are just straight up "what's up with all the loving aliens you're enlisting?" The funny part about Pressley is his prejudice line is basically one throwaway line and if you pick the paragon line he basically admits to overreacting and it never comes up again, but then Bioware decided to give him a behind the scenes character arc in the free mass effect 2 dlc
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Jul 16, 2017 20:44
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Norns posted:Salad on a bun Sounds good post a picture.
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Jul 16, 2017 23:07
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Arglebargle III posted:Sounds good post a picture.
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Jul 16, 2017 23:10
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wanna eat dat meat
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Jul 16, 2017 23:20
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those are some very ok-looking burger
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Jul 16, 2017 23:27
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I mean they are fine but definitely should be doubles
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Jul 16, 2017 23:28
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flamebroil yourself scrub
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Jul 16, 2017 23:42
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Flamebroil a burger or myself?
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Jul 16, 2017 23:43
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The best part of this derail was someone inventing scenes in ME1 to make Ashley seem worse.
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Jul 17, 2017 00:17
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Android Blues posted:Well, I mean, Shepard gives Garrus clearance to begin with, this isn't an issue of "a guy without clearance is wandering around here". Ashley is suggesting that his clearance should be revoked for the express reason that she does not consider Garrus a depoliticised citizen, but as a possible agent of the Turian Hierarchy. Quote: Now, I either had a stroke and became illiterate, or that quote doesn't actually say anything about Ashley considering him "a possible agent of the Turian Hierarchy". You can do better than this.
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Jul 17, 2017 00:23
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also lolling at ashley being ~*~cryptoracist~*~ for equating species with nation state allegiance when 1. is there even one government in ME that isn't single-race 2. its one of the oldest tropes in sci-fi that there's one government for each species 3. she's also completely right because the salarians of all people end up stealing the normandy's stealth tech and using it to make stealth dreadnaughts
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Jul 17, 2017 00:27
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Milky Moor posted:also lolling at ashley being ~*~cryptoracist~*~ for equating species with nation state allegiance when 1. is there even one government in ME that isn't single-race 2. its one of the oldest tropes in sci-fi that there's one government for each species 3. she's also completely right because the salarians of all people end up stealing the normandy's stealth tech and using it to make stealth dreadnaughts The Turian government is sort of multiracial, but only because it has subject species answering to it, so another good reason to be suspicious
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Jul 17, 2017 00:39
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I fail to see how it's racist to say 'Hmmm, so there was this race of guys who attacked us with no legitimate (to our minds) provocation or warning, who are specifically a militant state who subjugate other species. They work with a pair of other races who very clearly, specifically, and forthrightly, engineer the governance of the galaxy to keep themselves on top, and everybody else, not. Maybe we shouldn't assume that they have our best interests at heart, and just make sure that we're watching out for ourselves, because nobody else is going to.' Or, put another way, is it 'racist' for the Afghan peoples not to be welcoming Westerners with open arms?
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Jul 17, 2017 01:20
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Milky Moor posted:also lolling at ashley being ~*~cryptoracist~*~ for equating species with nation state allegiance when 1. is there even one government in ME that isn't single-race 2. its one of the oldest tropes in sci-fi that there's one government for each species 3. she's also completely right because the salarians of all people end up stealing the normandy's stealth tech and using it to make stealth dreadnaughts I thought the Turians had a low conflict succession movement going on from the main gov't? Quarians probably come closest. Isn't participation in the migrant fleet completely voluntary? It's a ship by ship social democracy kind of thing. I honestly think the idea of Earth being a single gov't is hardest to believe.
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Jul 17, 2017 01:44
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Earth doesn't have a single government. The Alliance is specifically 'The UN, but for Space'. Various Earth governments still exist and still run poo poo on earth, they just never talk about it outside the codex.
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Jul 17, 2017 01:49
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fruit on the bottom posted:The best part of this derail was someone inventing scenes in ME1 to make Ashley seem worse. She expressed what might be construed as a conservative opinion on dealing with the paralytic alien hegemony that governs all of "lawful space", therefore she is loving scum and anything goes.
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Jul 17, 2017 02:19
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Ash is basically a neonazi when you think about it.
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Jul 17, 2017 03:42
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Ash is a legacy military baby and a loving idiot and her armor is dumb and she'd probably rather be murdering little Turian children on Palaven.
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Jul 17, 2017 03:45
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I don't see why you wouldn't trust a Council that approved the genocide of the Rachni and unleashing a sterility plague on the Krogan.
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Jul 17, 2017 04:17
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Good point, but on the other hand 
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Jul 17, 2017 04:18
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These street fighter finals are really loving good edit: whoops wrong thread. they are though! PantsBandit fucked around with this message at 04:28 on Jul 17, 2017 |
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Jul 17, 2017 04:21
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PantsBandit posted:These street fighter finals are really loving good If the street fighter finals were a kind of pudding, what kind of pudding would they be?
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Jul 17, 2017 05:39
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Butterscotch
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Jul 17, 2017 08:09
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monster on a stick posted:I don't see why you wouldn't trust a Council that approved the genocide of the Rachni and unleashing a sterility plague on the Krogan. Wow I can't tell the animals from the racist space nazis
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Jul 17, 2017 08:23
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If you want to derail this thread with some irrelevant game franchise talk then at least post some tasty pictures of food or describe the latest meal you enjoyed. I had some cute little Korean burgers in Berlin: 
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Jul 17, 2017 08:32
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Those look good. The problem I have with Vietnamese restaurants is that they always seem to have the craziest hours. Like 5 a.m. - 2:30 p.m. Tues/Thurs, closed Mon/Fri/Sun. Open all day Saturday (but on the day you go, they're closed). I love some banh mi, get it with radishes and mayo/chili sauce. (The ends were bad)
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Jul 17, 2017 08:58
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Palpek posted:If you want to derail this thread with some irrelevant game franchise talk then at least post some tasty pictures of food or describe the latest meal you enjoyed. Where are the burgers at in that? I only see buns with rabbit food and no meat.
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Jul 17, 2017 09:39
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Equating species with nation-state allegiance is in fact manifestly incorrect in the super liberal, globalised world of Mass Effect, where (for ex.) the Citadel is effectively a hypercosmopolitan nation-state unto itself, and Council space is a melting pot of various species and cultures, with places like Noveria, Ilium and Feros having residents from various species who don't divide themselves along ethnic lines, but just live as residents of a shared society. The implication Ashley's making when she talks about "engines, sensors, weapons" being spied on by aliens is that one of them could be a spy. She does not complain "we shouldn't have civilians on the ship", she has a specific problem with those civilians being aliens, because aliens = agents of a foreign culture in her reckoning. It's pretty clear cut. Actually suggesting that she's right to think this because all the aliens in Mass Effect really are unthinking adherents to their ethno-static homeworlds (they aren't, and ethno-states do not in fact appear to be the rule outside those homeworlds) is a pretty funny misreading. Here's a nice cake. 
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Jul 17, 2017 10:40
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orange juche posted:Where are the burgers at in that? 
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Jul 17, 2017 12:56
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A few years ago, my brother gave me his used copy of Fallout 4 for Xmas. I think he's getting my copy of ME:A this year
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Jul 17, 2017 13:00
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Iron Crowned posted:A few years ago, my brother gave me his used copy of Fallout 4 for Xmas. I think he's getting my copy of ME:A this year why do u and ur brother hate each other?
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Jul 17, 2017 13:31
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Iron Crowned posted:A few years ago, my brother gave me his used copy of Fallout 4 for Xmas. I think he's getting my copy of ME:A this year Woah there, brush the glass out of your hair and shallow cuts before you huck your own stone back at him.
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Jul 17, 2017 13:34
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TEENAGE WITCH posted:why do u and ur brother hate each other? I don't, hate my brother, he's got some kind of jealousy thing going on despite the fact that we live in different states.
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Jul 17, 2017 13:41
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Android Blues posted:Equating species with nation-state allegiance is in fact manifestly incorrect in the super liberal, globalised world of Mass Effect, where (for ex.) the Citadel is effectively a hypercosmopolitan nation-state unto itself, and Council space is a melting pot of various species and cultures, with places like Noveria, Ilium and Feros having residents from various species who don't divide themselves along ethnic lines, but just live as residents of a shared society.  councillor, some quarian robotics scientists accidentally made some illegal AIs and there was a revolution ban all quarians but very few quarians are actually robotics scientists, yet most quarians have had to abandon their planet because of something they didn't do and literally billions of others have even died during the revolution, and even the scientists only did this in error, surely a more measured response- send no aid to quarians, ban all quarians and every time a quarian comes aboard the citadel use C-SEC to interrogate them to uncover their intentions, if this indiscriminate reduction in status causes racial bigotry just look the other way
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Jul 17, 2017 18:02
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