|
Tender Bender posted:They should have inserted the Jabba deleted scene unaltered with Human Jabba and offered no explanation. Well, Jabba had grown so rich, he wanted to retire. So he took me to his palace and told me his secret: "I am not Jabba," he said. "My name is Ryan. I inherited this palace from the previous Jabba, just as you will inherit it from me. The man I inherited it from was not the real Jabba, either. His name was Cummerbund. The real Jabba has been retired fifteen years and living like a king in Onderon."
|
#
?
Jul 17, 2017 18:15
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 29, 2024 14:00 |
|
|
I don't think Disney will put out a "without the things nerds don't like" version ever but who knows.
|
|
#
?
Jul 17, 2017 18:21
|
|
|
I could see them putting out a limited edition super deluxe box set with originals and SEs together and charge an arm and a leg for it.
|
|
#
?
Jul 17, 2017 18:49
|
|
|
By "originals" you mean the remastered versions with the "bad content " removed right You aren't talking about like the film stock from 1978
|
|
#
?
Jul 17, 2017 18:52
|
|
|
Or by originals do you mean the VHS versions you saw in 1989 or the cut up versions you saw on tv with commercials
|
|
#
?
Jul 17, 2017 18:53
|
|
|
I have a copy of the film stock New Hope... quite a mess but cool for popping on to see.
|
|
#
?
Jul 17, 2017 18:58
|
|
|
Depends on what you mean by "remastered" at that point. Do I think it'll be cleaned up for a pristine-looking Blu-ray, yes. Do I think it'll have all the matte boxes and other imperfections, I don't know. I guess even the current SE Blu-rays still have some of that, so I have no idea what form it would take. I don't think I want to get into raw speculation, but there is probably at least a viable niche market for such a product in one form or another, and I don't know anything about the economic calculations involved, but I'd be surprised if it hasn't been discussed internally at least.
|
|
#
?
Jul 17, 2017 19:00
|
|
|
Vintersorg posted:I have a copy of the film stock New Hope... quite a mess but cool for popping on to see. That is cool. Do you have a projector strong enough to project it somewhere near cinema size ?
|
|
#
?
Jul 17, 2017 19:02
|
|
|
turn left hillary!! noo posted:Depends on what you mean by "remastered" at that point. Do I think it'll be cleaned up for a pristine-looking Blu-ray, yes. Do I think it'll have all the matte boxes and other imperfections, I don't know. I guess even the current SE Blu-rays still have some of that, so I have no idea what form it would take. I don't think I want to get into raw speculation, but there is probably at least a viable niche market for such a product in one form or another, and I don't know anything about the economic calculations involved, but I'd be surprised if it hasn't been discussed internally at least. You've described the problem, everyone has their own ideal of what the idea version of "the originals" should be. Some want completely untouched negatives, some want the matte lines touched up, some want basically the SE but without scenes X,Y, and Z. Not that it's really a business problem, because we know the fans will buy poo poo out of whatever they decide to release. They could release three different sets and people would buy all three just because Star Wars. Basebf555 fucked around with this message at 19:16 on Jul 17, 2017 |
|
#
?
Jul 17, 2017 19:03
|
|
|
turn left hillary!! noo posted:The ghosts are whatever, Hayden is on screen for like 5 seconds. The real good thing about Jedi SE is the new celebration theme on Endor, which is about 1,000 times better than the original. honestly my biggest issue was this. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O3u70WELSEg you ruin one of the best moments of the trilogy because lucas needs to make poo poo "more clear". there was no dialogue and we were only looking at a completely still mask. Yet we could still sense his feelings and thoughts. He was clearly conflicted and you could tell he was about to do something. This is good film making. instead we have to add NOOOO.
|
|
#
?
Jul 17, 2017 19:12
|
|
|
Tender Bender posted:They should have inserted the Jabba deleted scene unaltered with Human Jabba and offered no explanation. Unironically this. If RotJ had Jabba as a human I think I'd also have been fine with it. I think it would have worked just as well with the right dialogue and acting.
|
|
#
?
Jul 17, 2017 19:14
|
|
|
Basebf555 posted:You've described the problem, everyone has their own idea of what the idea version of "the originals" should be. Some want completely untouched negatives, some want the matte lines touched up, some want basically the SE but without scenes X,Y, and Z. I wonder if you could get a branching menu to work with that many options. The untouched negatives would probably need to be on their own disc, but anything remastered could have 3-4 choices and you just go down the Blu-ray menu ticking off whatever you want. Does the Blu-ray format support that kind of thing or is it just like A/B?
|
|
#
?
Jul 17, 2017 19:15
|
|
|
That's not a movie anymore. It's a game or cyoa or something else I don't know.
|
|
#
?
Jul 17, 2017 19:17
|
|
|
Dapper_Swindler posted:honestly my biggest issue was this. About 99% sure that was Lucas trolling you.
|
|
#
?
Jul 17, 2017 19:17
|
|
|
dialhforhero posted:^^^ I think the Jedi Rocks scene 'sucks' because it passes into the depths of the uncanny valley (for humanoid aliens). The original version was puppets and fits the aesthetic of the rest of the palace. Star Wars isn't a puppet show, though. The aesthetic of Star Wars is "bizarre-looking aliens", not "things that look like and obviously are puppets." This is a common misconception. The original intention was for the alien band in Jabba's palace to be part of a bombastic, full-blown dance number. They couldn't do it because the puppets sucked. Also Lucas and Marquand both disliked Lapti Nek and fully intended to replace it but just ran out of time. Jedi Rocks is also better integrated as an ironically peppy, upbeat counterpoint to the depiction of Oola's degradation, struggle against Jabba, and subsequent murder at his hands. In the new version, Oola's desperate cries are actually made to mingle with the chorus at the end. The whole sequence is constructed more like a music video, which is a good thing. Even Oola's little twirl and whip-crack here is tightly integrated with the beat: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2jzZOgLH4KU&t=69s It's pretty much objectively a more skilfully and purposefully constructed sequence than the original, where the music was basically just background noise, rather than being its own dramatic entity which interacts with and adds its own ironic punch to the horror of Oola's situation.
|
|
#
?
Jul 17, 2017 19:27
|
|
|
Cnut the Great posted:The whole sequence is constructed more like a music video, which is a good thing. Why is this a good thing?
|
|
#
?
Jul 17, 2017 19:29
|
|
|
Cnut the Great posted:It's pretty much objectively a more skilfully and purposefully constructed sequence than the original... While agree those two things are true, it doesn't mean the scene is improved. Skill and purpose are good but not a guarantee of anything.
|
|
#
?
Jul 17, 2017 19:33
|
|
|
UmOk posted:About 99% sure that was Lucas trolling you. Actually I hadn't seen the Blu-ray SE until quite recently, and from all the fan outrage I had expected it to be way worse than it is. I actually thought it kind of worked, but maybe I've walked too far down the dark side path of seeing the prequels as good movies.
|
|
#
?
Jul 17, 2017 19:34
|
|
|
It works better as background noise. Now RoTJ stops dead for an awful music video with an awful cgi... thing. I hate it
|
|
#
?
Jul 17, 2017 19:37
|
|
|
euphronius posted:By "originals" you mean the remastered versions with the "bad content " removed right This feels like a weird argument because it quickly reduces to no one has seen the same movie ever.
|
|
#
?
Jul 17, 2017 19:40
|
|
|
porfiria posted:This feels like a weird argument because it quickly reduces to no one has seen the same movie ever. Lots of people saw the original trilogy in the theaters.
|
|
#
?
Jul 17, 2017 19:41
|
|
|
Cnut the Great posted:Star Wars isn't a puppet show, though. The aesthetic of Star Wars is "bizarre-looking aliens", not "things that look like and obviously are puppets." This is a common misconception. He didn't say "The original version fits the aesthetic better because they were puppets", he said "The original version was puppets and fits the aesthetic of the rest of the palace." And he was right.
|
|
#
?
Jul 17, 2017 20:02
|
|
|
Dapper_Swindler posted:honestly my biggest issue was this. You're still looking at a completely still mask, though. You can still sense his feelings and thoughts. He only says "No" at the end right before he grabs the Emperor and his intentions are clear anyway. All the "No" does is make Vader's moment of realization come across as one slightly more of visceral emotion than of serene epiphany. It's just an issue of tonality. Lucas clearly just wanted Vader's decision to have more of a sense of sudden, forceful passion to it. It's not worse, it's just different. I 100% guarantee you no one would ever even think to criticize it if the scene were originally that way. (And it would still be written about in Film 101 textbooks as a popular example of the Kuleshov effect in action.) UmOk posted:Why is this a good thing? Because it means the visual narrative is intricately and overtly tied in with the foregrounded musical accompaniment, in a way that's completely unique for a Star Wars movie, and which adds to the atmosphere of bombastic excess mixed with grotesque horror which defines Jabba and his palace. Why wouldn't Jabba's palace suddenly turn into a pop-jazz fusion music video perversely glorifying sexual violence? I mean, he has his own private band, he's got a half-naked lady dancing for him on a chain...these things tend to happen in those situations. Also, remember that Star Wars is a pastiche of classic movie genres. We hadn't really seen a full-blown musical sequence in Star Wars yet. It was something Lucas really wanted to do in Return of the Jedi but wasn't able to, which is probably why we have the "Anything Goes" sequence in Temple of Doom a year later instead. But when the opportunity for the Special Editions came along he was able to go back and do the caberet-style sequence he'd originally wanted for ROTJ. Jabba's palace is a location where the inclusion of that kind of sequence makes perfect sense. Interrupting the action for a brief musical spectacle set in a night club or palace court isn't exactly something that's unheard of in these sorts of movies, anyway. Basebf555 posted:While agree those two things are true, it doesn't mean the scene is improved. Skill and purpose are good but not a guarantee of anything. Fair enough. I'm not here to tell you what to like.
|
|
#
?
Jul 17, 2017 20:25
|
|
|
Super Fan posted:It works better as background noise. Now RoTJ stops dead for an awful music video with an awful cgi... thing. I hate it It doesn't stop. The plot still advances during the sequence; the dancer is killed during it.
|
|
#
?
Jul 17, 2017 20:28
|
|
|
Bongo Bill posted:It doesn't stop. The plot still advances during the sequence; the dancer is killed during it. It feels like it stops everything dead because it's so tone deaf and the song itself is just the worst thing ever. It's the most objectively bad change Lucas made and I condemn him entirely for it!
|
|
#
?
Jul 17, 2017 21:05
|
|
|
I agree with this completely, every other change, there's one's I disagree with or think are stupid but I still enjoy the movies and the scenes that they happen in. Jedi Rocks is just bizarre and kills the pacing in a movie that already has some serious issues with its pacing.
|
|
#
?
Jul 17, 2017 21:08
|
|
|
euphronius posted:That is cool. I meant someone ripped it somehow and there is a million GB file of what you'd get if you were in the cinemas. It's not cleaned up at all.
|
|
#
?
Jul 17, 2017 21:43
|
|
|
Neo Rasa posted:I agree with this completely, every other change, there's one's I disagree with or think are stupid but I still enjoy the movies and the scenes that they happen in. Jedi Rocks is just bizarre and kills the pacing in a movie that already has some serious issues with its pacing. It's really an interesting peek into where Lucas' tastes were heading at that point and how tone deaf he was to what made Star Wars cool. It's totally unwatchable. I feel second hand shame sitting through it.
|
|
#
?
Jul 18, 2017 01:11
|
|
|
veni veni veni posted:It's really an interesting peek into where Lucas' tastes were heading at that point and how tone deaf he was to what made Star Wars cool. How did you do it?
|
|
#
?
Jul 18, 2017 01:22
|
|
|
UmOk posted:How did you do it? Cnut's monologue about the divine beauty of the scene drowned out the audio.
|
|
#
?
Jul 18, 2017 02:03
|
|
|
Tender Bender posted:Cnut's monologue about the divine beauty of the scene drowned out the audio. If "the visual narrative" and "the musical accompaniment" being tied together is all it takes to make divine beauty then you have incredibly mediocre standards.
|
|
#
?
Jul 18, 2017 02:37
|
|
|
Schwarzwald posted:If "the visual narrative" and "the musical accompaniment" being tied together is all it takes to make divine beauty then you have incredibly mediocre standards. Were you there?
|
|
#
?
Jul 18, 2017 02:38
|
|
|
veni veni veni posted:It's really an interesting peek into where Lucas' tastes were heading at that point and how tone deaf he was to what made Star Wars cool. It's so obnoxious the way he gets right in front of the 'camera' and just SCREAMMMMMMMMSSSSS!! He gets so close we get to see his loving uvula. As bad as the prequels are I don't think anything in them tops the sheer repugnancey of Jedi Rocks.
|
|
#
?
Jul 18, 2017 02:59
|
|
|
As a jizzmeister im offended by all of you trashing the 3rd best jizzing in star wars
|
|
#
?
Jul 18, 2017 03:02
|
|
|
Yaws posted:It's so obnoxious the way he gets right in front of the 'camera' and just SCREAMMMMMMMMSSSSS!! He gets so close we get to see his loving uvula. The grotesque sexuality of the scene is the point of it, along with the fourth-wall breaking that serves as a nod to Temple Of Doom's "Anything Goes" musical number (which took place at Club Obi-Wan). The insectile characters sing directly into the camera with uncannily human lips. Jabba's hedonism is such that even the logic of the film breaks down. And this assertion that 'anything goes' is perhaps a way of justifying the fact that the heroes' plan makes absolutely no sense in literal plot terms.
|
|
#
?
Jul 18, 2017 03:54
|
|
|
SuperMechagodzilla posted:The grotesque sexuality of the scene is the point of it, along with the fourth-wall breaking that serves as a nod to Temple Of Doom's "Anything Goes" musical number (which took place at Club Obi-Wan). The grotesque sexuality and hedonism was already established before Jedi Rocks and Sly Snootles. At best, it's redundant information. At worst it's an objectivity awful song performed poorly. HINT: It's the latter
|
|
#
?
Jul 18, 2017 04:15
|
|
|
Dapper_Swindler posted:honestly my biggest issue was this. Good loving God, that is atrocious. I haven't seen the original trilogy in decades. I tried watching ANH "Special Edition" in 2007 or so (because it was the only version commercially available), but I turned it off about half way through because all the added content was so bizarre and surreal. It completely took me out of the movie to see modern special effects inserted into a film from the 70s. And I refuse to watch a masterpiece like Empire get ruined. I've heard horror stories about not just added special effects, but the addition of entirely changed scenes and 'added' dialogue such as this. gently caress Lucas forever. One day I will want to see the unedited versions again. Hopefully Disney releases it in a few years, or I'll have to get it by a friend with skills.
|
|
#
?
Jul 18, 2017 04:23
|
|
|
I mean how does anyone defend this revisionist bullshit. It would be like James Cameron deciding to replace the practical Alien Queen in Aliens with a digital one. That is the level loving bullshit we're dealing with here with Lucas.
|
|
#
?
Jul 18, 2017 04:27
|
|
|
RedSpider posted:Good loving God, that is atrocious. The SE is indeed a travesty but you can easily find the despecialized editions online. Don't waste your time with the Blu-ray versions like I did.
|
|
#
?
Jul 18, 2017 04:28
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 29, 2024 14:00 |
|
|
Super Fan posted:It feels like it stops everything dead because it's so tone deaf and the song itself is just the worst thing ever. It's the most objectively bad change Lucas made and I condemn him entirely for it! I gotta be honest, I've never been able to wrap my head around this widespread notion that Jedi Rocks is somehow the worst song ever but Lapti Nek is just the tits. Disco is an abomination. RedSpider posted:I mean how does anyone defend this revisionist bullshit. It would be like James Cameron deciding to replace the practical Alien Queen in Aliens with a digital one. That is the level loving bullshit we're dealing with here with Lucas. If he wanted to, he should be allowed to because he made the movie. It's not revisionist bullshit, it's respecting the prerogative of the artist over that of the consumer. You're the consumer, by the way. You pay money for a copy of a work of art. You then own that copy to enjoy whenever you want. You don't own the work of art. The artist does (in a moral, creative sense, at least). Cnut the Great fucked around with this message at 04:32 on Jul 18, 2017 |
|
#
?
Jul 18, 2017 04:29
|
|