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Munchables posted:Awesome, thanks! I was thinking about drop pods for the dedicated transport but I suppose those are one-time use anyway. My idea was to drop pod my terms into the enemy and then jump pack my vanguards into em while the rest of my dudes make their way over. So let me expand further on the whys and wherefores of squad design. This is a unit I used in a recent game against my brother's Dark Eldar. Space Marine Captain74 w/ Plasma Pistol7 & Power Fist20 = 101pts Tactical Marine Squad x565, Sergeant w/ Plasma Pistol7 & Power Sword4, Marine w/ Plasma Gun13, Marines w/ Bolters x30 = 89pts Razorback65 w/ Lascannon25, Twin Plasma Guns 20, Storm Bolter2 = 112pts Total Points: 302 This is an expensive combination, but it has a lot of utility. On the turn they debark within 12" of the enemy (and preferably closer) I've got eight rapid fired plasma shots (four from the R-back, two from the P.Gun, one each from two P.Pistols) all re-rolling '1s' and thus unlikely to overheat even when supercharging all of them. There's also a Lascannon for added anti-tank (and/or big monster) killing, and ten Bolter shots between the Bolter grunts and the R-back. That's a lot of dakka that can at least hurt virtually anything I point it at. After that, I'll charge into melee with everyone, including the Razorback. The Razorback goes first, in fact, since it's least likely to be impeded by Overwatch fire, and once it's in contact, the targeted squad can't Overwatch further. Notice that I've got the Power Fist on the Captain instead of the Sergeant. Regardless of who you buy it for, a Power Fist costs 20 points. If I'm paying that much for a weapon, I want the most use out of it and I get that on a Captain with four Attacks instead of a Sergeant with only two. But since I can take a melee weapon for Sarge, I might as well spend the 4 points to get him a Power Sword. Since everyone starts embarked, the whole mess is only a single deployment and thus makes it more likely I'll get to go first, which is important for a shooty army like mine. Thus, I've got a hard hitting unit with mobility from the Razorback that can put out a lot of Plasma and can shield the Captain until he gets in and Power Fists the enemy to death. Is it perfect? Well, no. For one thing if the Razorback gets shot out from under you too quickly, you can end up having to walk the rest of the way and while the unit in that case would have some firepower out to 24", it's really designed to be within 12". For that matter, it's pretty fragile once it disembarks (whether voluntarily or when the R-Back gets killed) since five Marines still die quicker than you think they would, and then all you've got left is the Captain, who admittedly with five Wounds and a 4++ Invulnerable save is fairly robust. The whole mess works great out on a flank where you're only facing part of the enemy line, but if you send it up the middle unsupported they'll all die pretty darn quick. As Marines you'll almost always be outnumbered to one degree or another, but this squad in particular fares poorly against large mobs of enemies. For nit-picks, a Thunder Hammer is clearly superior to a Power Fist and is probably worth the extra 5 points. For that matter, even if it's only 1 in 36, there's still a chance that the Captain will get blown up by his Plasma Pistol and he's the least expendable part of the whole equation. I could save points by going Bolt Pistol & Thunder Hammer. I could even go Thunder Hammer & Storm Shield, but Cap's already got a 4++ Iron Halo, so spending 15 points to go to 3++ probably isn't worth it. The point to all this is that it's best to think about what you want your unit to do. In this case, I have a squad that drives up, unloads, fries the enemy with plasma, then charges in to beat the survivors to death. I can use it on its own on the edges of the battle or with friends (either in other transports or Deep Striking in) in the middle of everything. And generally this group can do what I want them to. tl;dr: Deciding what you want your squads to do and building them with that purpose in mind is the way to go. jng2058 fucked around with this message at 18:59 on Jul 18, 2017 |
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Jul 18, 2017 18:56
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Confirmation here that Successors and DIY chapters can use whatever CHapter Tactics they want: https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/07/18/choosing-the-right-chapter-tactic-for-your-successors/
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Jul 18, 2017 18:56
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Kabuki Shipoopi posted:How in the hell do people edge highlight so perfectly thin and straight? For me, it's all time spent cleaning stuff up. That and practice.
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Jul 18, 2017 18:57
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Kabuki Shipoopi posted:How in the hell do people edge highlight so perfectly thin and straight? One trick for actual edges is don't paint with the tip of your brush but rather hold your brush perpendicular and let the very edge of the brush just barely catch the edge of the model. Like a upper-case T. The top of the T is your brush and the stem is your model. See what I mean? Works wonders. Also stabilized your arms on a table and DO NOT hold the model directly, mount it on something vaguely fist sized.
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Jul 18, 2017 18:57
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Zaphod42 posted:DO NOT hold the model directly, mount it on something vaguely fist sized. If you want, most people I know hold the models directly and do just fine. Personally, the bigger the grip, the harder it is for me to paint something, so I just hold the base and that works fine for me. See what works best for you.
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Jul 18, 2017 19:00
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Kabuki Shipoopi posted:How in the hell do people edge highlight so perfectly thin and straight? Some people have steady hands. I can't claim to be 'good' but going in and doing the best you can, then going back in with your base color and fixing all of your myriad fuckups gives decent results.
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Jul 18, 2017 19:01
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SRM posted:If you want, most people I know hold the models directly and do just fine. Personally, the bigger the grip, the harder it is for me to paint something, so I just hold the base and that works fine for me. See what works best for you. I guess that's fair. My hands are shaky and if I hold the model itself they get shakier and everything is amplified. I mount the models with some sticky tack on a fist sized plastic container, and just rotate that in my hand, and it feels much more natural and my wrist doesn't get so shaky. But yeah whatever works for you.
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Jul 18, 2017 19:03
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Did I understand correctly that people are using Vallejo airbrush flow improver for painting with brushes?
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Jul 18, 2017 19:09
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Zaphod42 posted:I guess that's fair. My hands are shaky and if I hold the model itself they get shakier and everything is amplified. I mount the models with some sticky tack on a fist sized plastic container, and just rotate that in my hand, and it feels much more natural and my wrist doesn't get so shaky. But yeah whatever works for you. Something you can try--press your hands together near the wrist when you hold the model, holding it by the base with your off-hand. When your hands shake, they will shake together (as opposed to different directions and at different times), which can help
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Jul 18, 2017 19:11
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Zuul the Cat posted:I've never been a fan of the Raven Guard, but your models turned me into one. Yours look so, SO good. Thanks, bruh. Beer4TheBeerGod posted:How do you do your black? Abbadon black base, edge highlight of Eshin grey, thinner edge highlight of Stormvermin fur, final corner edge highlight of Administratum grey. SRM posted:That's a handsome Birb Bro make some loving blood ravens so we can be the raven ravens
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Jul 18, 2017 19:16
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goose willis posted:This is probably a stupid question but what exactly is an "army dip" because Google results aren't quite getting me what I want I know there have been a few posts on this matter, but watch this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LMOTmOchKyQ It's not "true" dipping (i.e. "flinging stain all over the place") but I've used the method for my zombies, and it works great. It's literally no different than applying a wash to your models, it just comes from a bigger can. I did a comparison years ago (I can't find the photos) between Minwax Polyshades and Army Painter - Polyshades is pretty much the same stuff for half the price. Here's the breakdown: Pecan = Soft Tone Antique Walnut = Strong Tone Tudor = Dark Tone
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Jul 18, 2017 19:22
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Kabuki Shipoopi posted:How in the hell do people edge highlight so perfectly thin and straight? Using the side of the brush not the tip, watering down the paint enough that it flows but not so much that it stops the brush from forming a blade, not worrying if its too thick and trimming it down with the base colour after the fact.
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Jul 18, 2017 19:27
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JoshTheStampede posted:Confirmation here that Successors and DIY chapters can use whatever CHapter Tactics they want: https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/07/18/choosing-the-right-chapter-tactic-for-your-successors/ It also states the Salamanders stratagem is flamer based.
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Jul 18, 2017 19:32
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Edge highlighting is all about clean-up for me. If a piece is particularly textured/ridged, like wings, it's not needed. Flat areas like power armor always need a bit of cleaning up, otherwise my highlights will sometimes end up too fat or maybe a little sloppy. I'm very familiar with this method as I've been painting a lot of black armor for my 30k Dark Angels. As for shaking, I press my palms together so that my hands shake together, keeping my painting relatively stable. Everyone's hands shake to some degree, but this helps mitigate it.
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Jul 18, 2017 19:33
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Beer4TheBeerGod posted:l use the Vallejo Flow Improver for loving everything. It's basically cheating. I have replaced water with Winsor&Newton flow improver on my pallet. I'll never go back
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Jul 18, 2017 19:35
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https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/07/18/choosing-the-right-chapter-tactic-for-your-successorsgw-homepage-post-4/ Oh hey, the Blood Ravens are getting a mention. That's nice.
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Jul 18, 2017 19:36
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Cooked Auto posted:https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/07/18/choosing-the-right-chapter-tactic-for-your-successorsgw-homepage-post-4/ Give me my goddamn decals!
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Jul 18, 2017 19:37
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Everyone posted:
Thanks bros. I subconsciously do the wrist this already, I stick my models on the back end of an old Vallejo dropper. Haven't tried the perpendicular brush techniques though. I'll give that a shot on my Goon Chapter Challenge. I definitely need some new brushes too. I have a few fine detail ones by Tamiya and Windsor Newton already, but a crisp one won't hurt.
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Jul 18, 2017 19:41
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mango sentinel posted:Give me my goddamn decals!   After doing 20-ish Space Wolf arms by now for a commission I'm starting to notice I'm getting slightly better at thin recess shades and doing edge highlights. Which is a nice feeling to have. Cooked Auto fucked around with this message at 19:45 on Jul 18, 2017 |
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Jul 18, 2017 19:42
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Pendent posted:Did I understand correctly that people are using Vallejo airbrush flow improver for painting with brushes? Yup. I'm sure I'm Doing It Wrong (TM) but I've enjoyed the results and I already have it.
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Jul 18, 2017 19:51
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Zaphod42 posted:Absolutely not. But assembly-line painting isn't dipping. You seem really mad that people want to paint models differently and enjoy the hobby in different ways. Plenty of people play for the game more than painting, but like having a fully painted army out. (And anybody with their poo poo painted should be applauded.) If you're doing a horde, a few minutes a model can save you a shitload of time as well. There is no real functional difference between a full model wash and dipping, apart from the substance used. I've even seen people add future floor polish to washes as a flow aid, as those tend to give a very smooth gradient, which you also get from a dip. A full model wash quickly brings different colors together. Hell, I've seen examples where someone did a dip as a shortcut for a full wash then went back over with highlights. Far from lazy. The floor waxes and dips also essentially varnish the model, meaning you get to skip another step if that is your end point. In the end it's a technique. If the end result of that technique is what you want, or something you are happy with, there's no real reason not to use it.
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Jul 18, 2017 19:51
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mango sentinel posted:Give me my goddamn decals! Come to the freehand side, it makes you feel like a great and powerful wizard.
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Jul 18, 2017 19:55
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Technowolf posted:Pro-painted Space Marine Razorback. Starting bid $50. I bought them from a friend of mine who routinely trawls eBay for whatever cheap poo poo. He's a loving amazing painter, like an actual wizard, so basically anything is fixable. I paid him like £100 and carried out a boxful of stuff like that picture. It'll be an amazing board when it's finally finished in like 2025. Same dude also hooked me up with giant tin cans of from like baked beans and tuna etc. that his school canteen was throwing out. Excellent LoS-blocking terrain.
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Jul 18, 2017 19:56
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 Codex Discipline: Depending on the squad size the Ld boost is either irrelevant or moderately helpful, but being able to fall back and still shoot stuff is wonderful. Flamers anyone? Righteous Zeal: As an Ork player I can tell you that being able to reroll charge rolls is fantastic, but it's also a very situational requirement and I'll be surprised to see how much SM actually want to get into CC. Master Artisans: Free reroll of hitting and wounding in each phase is great, especially for high value weapons like lasguns, meltaguns, and plasma weapons. Probably one of the strongest tactics. Lightning Assault: The extra movement during Advance is fantastic. I consider the charging after falling back ability to require some specialized approaches and may have the same limited utility and Righteous Zeal. Still a pretty strong combination. Shadow Masters: This is great and is far easier to exploit than the assault-oriented tactics. Siege Masters: Meh. Cover seems to be fairly rare outside of infantry, and buildings are extremely situational. The Flesh is Weak: Making your entire army 15% tougher is extremely my poo poo.
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Jul 18, 2017 19:58
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I'm gonna run my Blood Ravens with Master Artisans because they "requisitioned" their munitions from some Salamanders.
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Jul 18, 2017 20:06
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The thought of rerolling the hit and wound of every tactical squads lascannon is downright decadent.
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Jul 18, 2017 20:09
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Main thing that stopped me from previously starting Salamanders was that fluffwise they have a really cool and unique look that you can't really represent on the table. Outside of spending an obscene amount of money on Forge World. This chapter tactic might make me look past that.
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Jul 18, 2017 20:22
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We got an army builder yet, or do I have to keep flipping pages like some kind of page flipper?
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Jul 18, 2017 20:24
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Battlescribe is basically up to date at this point. No official army builder yet though.
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Jul 18, 2017 20:26
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The Sex Cannon posted:make some loving blood ravens so we can be the raven ravens Hey I'm just wringing my hands over what red to use and trying to figure out a solution for transfers since the 3D printed stuff is too fuzzy for me and the Fallout Hobbies transfers are wrong.
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Jul 18, 2017 20:26
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mango sentinel posted:I'm gonna run my Blood Ravens with Master Artisans because they "requisitioned" relics from other chapters. And the Inquistion. And the Custodes. FTFY
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Jul 18, 2017 20:27
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Pendent posted:Battlescribe is basically up to date at this point. No official army builder yet though. Danke.
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Jul 18, 2017 20:29
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You still have to be careful about Battlescribe though. There are some point and rule mistakes.
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Jul 18, 2017 20:30
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SRM posted:Hey I'm just wringing my hands over what red to use and trying to figure out a solution for transfers since the 3D printed stuff is too fuzzy for me and the Fallout Hobbies transfers are wrong. Have you seen the Pop Goes the Monkey icons? I was curious if they weren't as fuzzed as the full shoulder pads. It's not a large image, but the Alpha Legion set looks alright. 
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Jul 18, 2017 20:33
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mango sentinel posted:I'm gonna run my Blood Ravens with Master Artisans because they "requisitioned" their munitions from some Salamanders.  All those fancy relics they have borrowed have to count for something aye
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Jul 18, 2017 20:55
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Artum posted:Come to the freehand side, it makes you feel like a great and powerful wizard. I can free hand text decently well but doing the Blood Raven emblem is a bit too daunting for me right now. mango sentinel posted:I'm gonna run my Blood Ravens with Master Artisans because they "requisitioned" their munitions from some Salamanders. Even if in my case it's mostly Space Wolves. Cooked Auto fucked around with this message at 21:04 on Jul 18, 2017 |
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Jul 18, 2017 21:01
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Beer4TheBeerGod posted:How did you do the purple? Xereus Purple basecoat, Nuln Oil recess shading, then highlighted with a mix of Screaming Skull and Screamer Pink to create Hella Screaming Magenta™ (the pot in the background). I far prefer a warm purple over a more realistic, cold one, plus it makes them look like they just walked off a synthwave album cover. Clearly a win-win situation. mango sentinel posted:I hope there's an Apothecary nearby because this Marine is SIIIIIIICK. There won't be if he costs £22.50 
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Jul 18, 2017 21:27
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 It just occurred to me that the Blood Raven here is a Primaris. Which means some new Primaris guys are going to get handed off to the Blood Ravens...in shiny new armor...with brand new shiny guns.... The poor bastards will be stuck fighting half naked in second hand Scout armor armed with sharpened sticks before a week is out!
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Jul 18, 2017 21:40
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jng2058 posted:Which means some new Primaris guys are going to get handed off to the Blood Ravens...in shiny new armor...with brand new shiny guns.... Not so much handed off as "acquired."
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Jul 18, 2017 21:51
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jng2058 posted:
I wonder how well you can combine the Primaris and Reiver kits once the "advanced" one comes out for the mainline guys. Because that sounds like a great thing to do. 
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Jul 18, 2017 21:56
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