|
KickerOfMice posted:It's wouldn't seem that way if you were one of those 30 million. I'm not saying that it's a *small* number, just that I had assumed that more than 10% of the population was on social healthcare.
|
#
?
Jul 19, 2017 22:39
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 27, 2024 14:51 |
|
|
DreamShipWrecked posted:I'm a bit confused by the numbers here. Repealing Obamacare would lead to 30 million people losing insurance. Does that mean only 30 mil rely on Obamacare now? Because that seems really low. Obamacare expanded insurance by: * creative a sustainable individual market, allowing people to get insurance outside employers * expanding Medicaid (not in all states, thanks to SCOTUS saying that it wasn't mandatory and GOP governors in states bein' shitlords) These people would lose their insurance if Obamacare goes belly-up-- and that's a lot of folks, roughly a tenth of the country. Much of the heavy lifting in Obamacare that helped folks outside those avenues was implementing standards and protections-- no more pre-existing condition barriers to coverage, no more lifetime limits, a required minimum ratio of total expenditures to medical expenditures. People wouldn't lose their insurance necessarily if those go away, but you'd see all insurance plans nationwide get shittier and costlier if it goes away.
|
|
#
?
Jul 19, 2017 22:39
|
|
|
If Forfeiture relied entirely on charges against someone then it might be defensible. "We're charging X with selling crystal meth and seizing this money because we have reason to believe it came from the sale of those drugs. If they're found not-guilty they can have it back." vs. "We think X sells drugs, we're taking this money because we think it's drug money and spend it on ourselves. Can they have it back even if we don't charge them? LOL no gently caress off with your legal rights bullshit." Hieronymous Alloy posted:I wonder if Sessions is preparing to move against the high finance legal marijuana growers. I wouldn't doubt it for an instant. BiggerBoat posted:Not really, no I can't. I can seek out left wing articles that make me feel good and pump up my inner liberal animal if I feel like it but none of them deny science Feel free to seek out some anti-nuclear articles written by far leftists, especially greens, if you'd like to find some science-ignoring garbage. I'm sure there's plenty of leftist anti-vax garbage from those same people. Shifty Pony posted:He would love to do that, but there is language in the last appropriations bill prohibiting them from spending any money on mj enforcement in legal states. He could probably get away with claiming that none of that funding is being spent on it, because they're spending the money they're stealing from the growers. Who's going to stop it? Congressional Republicans? Donald Trump? The conservative-held SCOTUS who'd punt on it and say it's Congress's problem? Al Borland Corp. posted:I'm thinking like Fire Emblem Heroes. This here is my Ragnell Special, I use it to take down targets from a distance.  The "super gun owner" groups might be 17 on average but the reality is that half or more of that group are families that hunt and so they have half a dozen rifles/shotguns and maybe a handgun, while a small set of that group are the literal "has a basement like Burt in Tremors" crazy gun buying assholes and preppers.
|
|
#
?
Jul 19, 2017 22:41
|
|
|
Teddybear posted:Obamacare expanded insurance by: Fair points, Obamacare's biggest boon was fixing some of the broken parts of standard insurance. It was just surprising to me considering that a lot of small businesses rely on socialized medicine, and the unemployment rate is 4.5%.
|
|
#
?
Jul 19, 2017 22:42
|
|
|
Robot Hobo posted:Oh poo poo, the President Fart City demanded all of the state voter records under obviously false pretenses, and he's going to find out who voted for Dubs instead of Subs. I'm sure that data won't be used against me, rig- "I never thought I would be stabbed by a katana" says the man who voted for the Katanas Stabbing People party
|
|
#
?
Jul 19, 2017 22:43
|
|
|
DreamShipWrecked posted:I'm a bit confused by the numbers here. Repealing Obamacare would lead to 30 million people losing insurance. Does that mean only 30 mil rely on Obamacare now? Because that seems really low. That's probably more than are on Obamacare now actually. That number is the difference between the number projected to be uninsured if Obamacare is the law in 2026 vs if it's repealed. That difference can come from people being priced out of the market, plans not being available, etc but it's relying on projections, not current numbers, for both the Obamacare.
|
|
#
?
Jul 19, 2017 22:43
|
|
|
Lamar Alexander just said that he doesn't think there is even 40 votes for "repeal and maybe replace later". If true, that makes McConnell's plan to have the vote anyway make more sense, it would tell Trump that it wasn't just a couple senators.
|
|
#
?
Jul 19, 2017 22:44
|
|
|
Repealing Obamacare would immediately withdraw an enormous amount of money from the health care system, as it would eliminate the expanded eligibility criteria and coverages that comprised the medicaid expansion. It would also eliminate the subsidies and therefore policies for the working poor and middle class, as they'd either lack coverage at worst or at best have less coverage under less generous plans. This assumes, though, that people aren't underinsuring or witholding potentially discretionary income or savings they could otherwise spend on health coverage. The scope of these two changes would effectively drain the risk pool locality by locality and cascade to a national crescendo. Thinking through just how bad the straight repeal would land in policy terms is truly sobering and horrifying.
|
|
#
?
Jul 19, 2017 22:44
|
|
|
there was a story of civil forfeiture where it was i believe a mother and son had just sold a house and had several hundred thousand in a safe or something in their car and since sometimes drug runners used that highway the cops took all their money. i'd legit suicide if that happened to me.
|
|
#
?
Jul 19, 2017 22:44
|
|
|
Democrats should drop all gun control legislation and start spreading propaganda that the Republicans are eyeing registration avenues after that congressman was shot
|
|
#
?
Jul 19, 2017 22:45
|
|
|
DreamShipWrecked posted:Fair points, Obamacare's biggest boon was fixing some of the broken parts of standard insurance. Well there's another 26 million who don't have coverage currently. Repealing Obamacare adds another 32 million to that. So you're going from about 10% to about 20% of the population without coverage.
|
|
#
?
Jul 19, 2017 22:47
|
|
|
Mantis42 posted:Even Obama liked to shoot skeet. Shooting guns is a perfectly normal hobby and only weird goons think differently. Also most of the rest of the world.
|
|
#
?
Jul 19, 2017 22:48
|
|
|
Guess what happens to care prices, and as a direct result, premiums, when providers have to bake in the cost for one of every five patients being unable to pay?!
|
|
#
?
Jul 19, 2017 22:49
|
|
|
was the cruz amendment where there'd be a pool for healthy people and a pool for sick people. how do these people not even grasp the basic concept of insurance??
|
|
#
?
Jul 19, 2017 22:50
|
|
|
Where are the leaks? Trump do something incredibly offensive or something. Tweet that it's ok to gargle piss. Something.
|
|
#
?
Jul 19, 2017 22:50
|
|
|
Mister Adequate posted:Also most of the rest of the world. True story, my Canadian relative was telling me about two guys planning to shoot up an place being caught and arrested because they were driving around wearing tactical webbing. Which is standard uniform for a significant amount of our population.
|
|
#
?
Jul 19, 2017 22:50
|
|
|
It makes perfect sense if you view insurance as a luxury good.
|
|
#
?
Jul 19, 2017 22:51
|
|
|
Blitz7x posted:Democrats should drop all gun control legislation and start spreading propaganda that the Republicans are eyeing registration avenues after that congressman was shot
|
|
#
?
Jul 19, 2017 22:51
|
|
|
my dad's buddy from montreal thinks virtually every american owns a gun and that we all love them (i think only 30 percent of households own guns, down from 50 percent in the '70s).
|
|
#
?
Jul 19, 2017 22:51
|
|
|
Ague Proof posted:Where are the leaks? https://twitter.com/adamgoldmanNYT/status/887791213541289984
|
|
#
?
Jul 19, 2017 22:52
|
|
|
Also this is bad https://twitter.com/anitakumar01/status/887790155226075136
|
|
#
?
Jul 19, 2017 22:52
|
|
|
Bear in mind that millions of health insurance policies means economic activity. This is not like right wing economics where you lie about numbers and fraud, but real old proper labor economics. 32 million insurance policies is 32 million people going to doctors, getting surgery, having medical supplies, filling prescriptions. 32 million insurance polices is doctors nurses orderlies therapists counselors psychologists receptionists billing people sales people marketing people on and on. 32 million insurance policies are jobs that stay filled cause people aren't dead, or because grandma has a nice home and goddammit dignity, it's business, and it's life. To effectively cut that much life and activity from the economy is of itself a massive depression. And that's just by foreword.
|
|
#
?
Jul 19, 2017 22:52
|
|
|
https://twitter.com/JNicholsonInDC/status/887791927097217024
|
|
#
?
Jul 19, 2017 22:53
|
|
|
Reverand maynard posted:I think if we passed a law that required people to wear an anime shirt when purchasing guns the problem would just sort itself out in a generation or so https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Golgo_13
|
|
#
?
Jul 19, 2017 22:54
|
|
|
Why don't they just get jobs
|
|
#
?
Jul 19, 2017 22:54
|
|
|
Groovelord Neato posted:there was a story of civil forfeiture where it was i believe a mother and son had just sold a house and had several hundred thousand in a safe or something in their car and since sometimes drug runners used that highway the cops took all their money. I've never understood how Americans can possibly stand for this scheme. I just cannot see this sort of thing being tolerated anywhere else in the West, everybody would go mental in the UK if this sort of thing happened.
|
|
#
?
Jul 19, 2017 22:54
|
|
|
Groovelord Neato posted:was the cruz amendment where there'd be a pool for healthy people and a pool for sick people. how do these people not even grasp the basic concept of insurance?? It isn't written that explicitly, which makes it a bit of a fig leaf. The Cruz amendment would allow for separate plans that didn't abide by the Obamacare regulations so long as they had at least one plan that DID. On the face of it, it sounds fine-- but if you give it even thirty seconds of thought, it would inevitably result in everyone with pre-existing conditions and a need for health insurance on the regulated plans, spiking premiums sky-high, while leaving healthy folks on the lowest-cost plans. Plus, when they get sick, they can't switch to a plan that covers them for six months, since the low-cost plans don't qualify as health insurance under the bill's own definitions.
|
|
#
?
Jul 19, 2017 22:55
|
|
|
Ignore the CBO scoring, let's go back to talking about how collecting stuff is a mental disorder.
|
|
#
?
Jul 19, 2017 22:55
|
|
|
Well yeah. If you get rid of the ACA, employers are under no obligation to insure full time workers anymore.Deptfordx posted:I've never understood how Americans can possibly stand for this scheme. I just cannot see this sort of thing being tolerated anywhere else in the West, everybody would go mental in the UK if this sort of thing happened. Well, you see, they were darkies.
|
|
#
?
Jul 19, 2017 22:55
|
|
|
Randbrick posted:Bear in mind that millions of health insurance policies means economic activity. This is not like right wing economics where you lie about numbers and fraud, but real old proper labor economics. 32 million insurance policies is 32 million people going to doctors, getting surgery, having medical supplies, filling prescriptions. 32 million insurance polices is doctors nurses orderlies therapists counselors psychologists receptionists billing people sales people marketing people on and on. This matters far less to Republican donors than the opportunity to cull the unworthy.
|
|
#
?
Jul 19, 2017 22:56
|
|
|
Deptfordx posted:I've never understood how Americans can possibly stand for this scheme. I just cannot see this sort of thing being tolerated anywhere else in the West, everybody would go mental in the UK if this sort of thing happened. To be clear, you can take the police to court, and bring documentation of your employment, papers showing you sold the house, history of paying for it, etc and get your money back. But that takes a lot of time, money for lawyers, and if there is ANY evidence at all that you actually were selling drugs, the DA will not so subtly discourage you by letting you know that they are still thinking about charging you.
|
|
#
?
Jul 19, 2017 22:57
|
|
|
Groovelord Neato posted:there was a story of civil forfeiture where it was i believe a mother and son had just sold a house and had several hundred thousand in a safe or something in their car and since sometimes drug runners used that highway the cops took all their money. Wouldn't documentation of legitimate acquisition of the money be a complete defense? You can't really sell a house without a lenghthy paper trail.
|
|
#
?
Jul 19, 2017 22:58
|
|
|
Chef Boyardeez Nuts posted:Wouldn't documentation of legitimate acquisition of the money be a complete defense? You can't really sell a house without a lenghthy paper trail. Yes, the cops will then go down the rabbit hole of saying maybe you are a long-time drug dealer and the house was paid for over time with drug proceeds, etc. So then you have to show your work history, how much you made, and look that matches up with my assets, I don't have an unaccounted for pile of money or gold chains laying around, so please give me back my loving money.... please? Before the end of the year?
|
|
#
?
Jul 19, 2017 23:03
|
|
|
Who cares about Russia or guns when there is a scandal involving Hillary Clinton and her quote:A government investigation concluded that the United States Postal Service "improperly coordinated" with a postal workers union that supported Hillary Clinton's campaign. Prepare for your next right wing talking point about how CNN refuses to cover Hillary Clinton illegally using union thugs!
|
|
#
?
Jul 19, 2017 23:03
|
|
|
Chef Boyardeez Nuts posted:Wouldn't documentation of legitimate acquisition of the money be a complete defense? You can't really sell a house without a lenghthy paper trail. it's more that the cops should have to prove the money is illicit, you shouldn't have to prove it's legit. also they bring charges against the property itself it's utterly insane. although that did lead to the greatest course case of all time: United States v. Approximately 64,695 Pounds of Shark Fins https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_v._Approximately_64,695_Pounds_of_Shark_Fins
|
|
#
?
Jul 19, 2017 23:04
|
|
|
Chef Boyardeez Nuts posted:Wouldn't documentation of legitimate acquisition of the money be a complete defense? You can't really sell a house without a lenghthy paper trail. Not at all! You can use your legally aquired funds to buy drugs. Sure you say you're driving to the dealer to buy a used car, but your skin tone says otherwise.
|
|
#
?
Jul 19, 2017 23:06
|
|
|
Trabisnikof posted:Not at all! You can use your legally aquired funds to buy drugs. Sure you say you're driving to the dealer to buy a used car, but your skin tone says otherwise. well, the theory is not that you are buying drugs, its that you are selling them. But yeah, if your skin is too dark, we're taking the money, but if you are old and white, hey congrats on your lucky jackpot! You are driving home from a casino, right? OK, take care.
|
|
#
?
Jul 19, 2017 23:09
|
|
|
https://twitter.com/NBCNightlyNews/status/887793981718974464 https://twitter.com/ChadPergram/status/887796382291177473 
|
|
#
?
Jul 19, 2017 23:09
|
|
|
lol there's no way trump jr doesn't gently caress up his testimony royally.
|
|
#
?
Jul 19, 2017 23:10
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 27, 2024 14:51 |
|
|
Are they gonna do the pre executive privilege thing that sessions did
|
|
#
?
Jul 19, 2017 23:11
|
|
