|
Fulchrum posted:Lets talk hypothetical here - is there anything stopping a Democrat from putting their name in for a 2018 senate election that may not actually happen? Then if McCain happens to die between the final date to submit and the November 2018, that person would be running for his seat unopposed? It'd look macabre as gently caress, sure, but it could be an easy way to pickup if he dies between March and October, which is a very real possibility. It doesn't work like that. There's an election for the seat if it's vacated, but it takes time to print ballots let alone have primaries. I don't know the AZ statutes but there's probably a date somewhere early in 2018 where if McCain dies after that, the appointed replacement will serve until the 2020 election (more accurately the day in 2021 the Senators elected in 2020 are sworn in), because there isn't enough time to arrange the election. You are describing a scenario where there's an election in 2018 against McCain where McCain dies and the Dem runs unopposed. That is literally impossible because Senator McCain's term lasts until 2022/2023. Robot Hobo posted:At some point, maybe soon, it seems inevitable that it's going to come down to an "It's him or us" choice. Since his mess only seems to be accelerating, waiting it out until 2020 (or even 2018) may suddenly not seem like a realistic option anymore. It's possible that decision has already been made, they just haven't figured out the when and how and who of actually acting on it. I think the difference between us is that I don't believe in the Republicans having this sort of capacity for coordination and evaluation of their situation. I see them as being caught in a cognitive dissonance where turning on Trump means admitting they committed a series of horrific mistakes ever since early 2016 when Trump was the frontrunner the first time in the primaries, and they simply can't bend themselves into admitting that. They're also caught in the vice of getting primaried by the GOP supporters who support Trump until the day they die of opioids; the people who get fed up with Trump are abandoning the party and won't vote in the primaries for anti-Trump Republicans. What might make the dam break in 2018 and 2020 is if there are enough disaffected Republicans who because of their demographics aren't targeted by voter suppression efforts and who can talk themselves into voting against the GOP. But when those voters were supposed to turn out against Trump in 2016 they just voted for him. Sulphagnist fucked around with this message at 07:41 on Jul 21, 2017 |
#
?
Jul 21, 2017 07:36
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 13, 2024 03:02 |
|
|
Hollismason posted:Alright I say Mueller is gone by 2 weeks ? 3 weeks tops. Session will be out as well. Its gonna be great to watch Saturday Night Massacre 2: Orange Boogaloo get live tweeted as he keeps firing people until he reaches the new Bork
|
|
#
?
Jul 21, 2017 07:41
|
|
|
Hollismason posted:Alright I say Mueller is gone by 2 weeks ? 3 weeks tops. Session will be out as well. Sessions fires Mueller, then is fired himself. Trump shrugs and says 'i didn't do it', getting away scott free
|
|
#
?
Jul 21, 2017 07:43
|
|
|
Hollismason posted:Wait, isn't Trey Gowdy in charge of the oversight committee isn't he suppose to be in Trump's pocket I think he realizes that the Democrats are going to extract their pound of flesh in retaliation for Benghazi and you can't really count on Trump as an ally. If nothing else, not being an unrepentant partisan hack may make him less of a target.
|
|
#
?
Jul 21, 2017 07:49
|
|
|
So are we ever going to get to see Trump's tax returns?
|
|
#
?
Jul 21, 2017 07:54
|
|
|
PRobably at some point. It seems like this is all accelerating pretty fast.
|
|
#
?
Jul 21, 2017 07:54
|
|
|
The Trump Train haven't brakes.
|
|
#
?
Jul 21, 2017 07:58
|
|
|
Goffer posted:Sessions fires Mueller, then is fired himself. Session literally can't fire Mueller.
|
|
#
?
Jul 21, 2017 08:00
|
|
|
Antti posted:It doesn't work like that. There's an election for the seat if it's vacated, but it takes time to print ballots let alone have primaries. I don't know the AZ statutes but there's probably a date somewhere early in 2018 where if McCain dies after that, the appointed replacement will serve until the 2020 election (more accurately the day in 2021 the Senators elected in 2020 are sworn in), because there isn't enough time to arrange the election. I think it's pretty simple why Republicans aren't turning on Trump. Right now Trump's approval rating with Republicans is around 85%. They're not going to turn on Trump until that number begins dropping. http://www.gallup.com/poll/203198/presidential-approval-ratings-donald-trump.aspx FWIW, in George W Bush's last year, when he was hideously unpopular, his approval rating among Republicans was in the 60-70% range. And that took a disastrous financial crisis to get to that point. http://www.gallup.com/poll/116500/presidential-approval-ratings-george-bush.aspx
|
|
#
?
Jul 21, 2017 08:09
|
|
|
I've also seen the meme that Trump can't pardon himself because it's "illegal." I think this is one of the rare moments when the Air Bud rule really applies. It doesn't say anywhere the President can't pardon himself. The framers' solution to the President going hog wild with the pardon was Congress impeaching him. Guess what  And even if we accept the notion that it is illegal somehow, who is going to enforce it? It breaks my heart that people are desperately looking high and low for some kind of legal framework that will put a stop to the abuse of power. There is no referee. Even if Mueller returns with a scathing indictment of Trump both in the legal and colloquial sense of the word, it won't do poo poo if there's no political capacity to act on the findings. JesusSinfulHands posted:I think it's pretty simple why Republicans aren't turning on Trump. Right now Trump's approval rating with Republicans is around 85%. They're not going to turn on Trump until that number begins dropping. I sort of hinted at that in my post. The Republican approval % is misleading because these days people are more likely to stop identifying as Republican than continue identifying as Republican while opposing the President. Another reason why the GOP is not going to save us.
|
|
#
?
Jul 21, 2017 08:10
|
|
|
Covok posted:Session literally can't fire Mueller. Pretty sure he can tell Sessions to fire Rosenstein right
|
|
#
?
Jul 21, 2017 08:16
|
|
|
Won't somebody think of those poor poor Trump high office appointees having to wait 27 whole days! before they are cleared by the OGE? Nevermind the fact that it takes around 3 months to a year for an average citizen to get a government job especially due to Office of Personnel Mgmt and Security Clearance backlogs. I just can't believe the US gumbutt puts them through such a degrading process of having to list all of their highly profitable extremely successful LLCs that operate out of a UPS Store PO Box in Rhode Island, Nevada, and New Mexico that employ a single, outsourced IT dude in Ukraine to make sure the 'company' voicemail and website stays operational. Or I dunno... Maybe if you have so much loving financial assets that it takes $200k worth of lawyer fees over the course of only a few days to untangle all of your poo poo that just maybe you have a little too much influence over the public you wish to serve to hold public office. Maybe you should realize that holding office puts you at too much risk of becoming compromised which in turn puts the public you wish to serve at great risk. Actually gently caress that. The rubles must flow
|
|
#
?
Jul 21, 2017 08:20
|
|
|
The President can just rewrite the DOJ regulation so that Mueller is directly responsible to him and then he can fire Mueller. The President can do whatever the hell he wants with the DOJ because it answers to him. The only thing that's stopped previous Presidents is the norm of an independent DOJ which has evolved in the first place because the American executive has terrifying potential and no one wanted to amend the Constitution to fix it. Other countries have solved this by making the executive head of the government only able to make certain political appointments and all officers of consequence are careerists whose termination is a huge clusterfuck of a process. Oh and in a multiparty coalition you don't have the incentive to coalesce around Your Guy so if your allies in government think you're stepping over the line they can pull the trigger on your position of power (and actually have a political incentive to do so). Evergreen tweet: https://twitter.com/boursier/status/802888353851015168
|
|
#
?
Jul 21, 2017 08:22
|
|
|
Hollismason posted:Pretty sure he can tell Sessions to fire Rosenstein right Trump's the one that can fire Rosenstein. He'll probably fire Sessions for good measure if it comes to that, though.
|
|
#
?
Jul 21, 2017 08:27
|
|
|
Hollismason posted:Pretty sure he can tell Sessions to fire Rosenstein right Yea, but no. If Sessions fires Rosenstein he still needs someone that will fire Mueller. So he has to either keep going through career DOJ officials until he finds one that will fire Mueller or he can nominate someone who will, but he will then have to go through the Senate to get his appointee approved. Which I am sure will deter most after seeing what happened to Sessions.
|
|
#
?
Jul 21, 2017 08:29
|
|
|
Trump can remove Mueller but what is that going to achieve? It's not like the issue will go away, he might buy himself a little time, but unless he gets his approval ratings, and thereby Congresses support of him up by a significant margin, there will be a thorough investigation of his dealings with Russia whether he likes it or not.
|
|
|
#
?
Jul 21, 2017 09:06
|
|
|
Hieronymous Alloy posted:In this scenario who exactly is prosecuting Trump and contesting his power to self-pardon? Sessions? Trumps successor since he is immune to being prosecuted while in office anyway.
|
|
#
?
Jul 21, 2017 09:12
|
|
|
I'm sure this has been posted multiple times ITT in the last few days, but just on the off-chance that it hasn't, and for all those who missed it; The best video ever made - Alex Jones Rants as a Bon Iver Song https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uWd6XgBVIcg
|
|
#
?
Jul 21, 2017 09:13
|
|
|
As a reminder Trumps approval rating with republicans is somewhat misleading because it has a selection bias: if you start disapproving of Trump you are much more likely to start considering yourself an independent rather than a republican.
|
|
#
?
Jul 21, 2017 09:18
|
|
|
pkay posted:Yea, but no. If Sessions fires Rosenstein he still needs someone that will fire Mueller. So he has to either keep going through career DOJ officials until he finds one that will fire Mueller or he can nominate someone who will, but he will then have to go through the Senate to get his appointee approved. Which I am sure will deter most after seeing what happened to Sessions. The President can simply rewrite the DOJ rules that say who can fire who and who is responsible to who. I'm not sure why Nixon didn't do it that way, probably because it's even more transparently abusive than the Massacre was and takes a bit more time to have people author it. Edit: http://www.factcheck.org/2017/06/can-trump-fire-mueller/ quote:Q: Can President Donald Trump fire special counsel Robert Mueller? The special counsel regs were probably different during Watergate so it's not worthwhile to draw direct comparisons, anyway. Sulphagnist fucked around with this message at 09:51 on Jul 21, 2017 |
|
#
?
Jul 21, 2017 09:32
|
|
|
Trump's nominee for ambassador to Germany is Richard Grenell, who seems to be one of the less horrible people on the conservative side as far as I can tell. This also makes him the only openly gay man to be nominated by Trump for an official position I think. If you don't remember (I didn't), Grenell was famously run out of the Romney campaign for being gay. Does anyone know more about the man? He seems to be part of the whole "fake media" thing the Trump admin is pushing, but that's about all I know about him.
|
|
#
?
Jul 21, 2017 09:45
|
|
|
I've seen a few "this is accelerating very fast" comments, but not a lot of press? What happened? Was it- Mueller says he can investigate trump money Trump says he wants to see if he can pardon himself and he doesn't like sessions? ??? I'm not trying to "nothing matters" but just want to know what's going on.
|
|
#
?
Jul 21, 2017 10:03
|
|
|
teacup posted:I've seen a few "this is accelerating very fast" comments, but not a lot of press? What happened? Was it- All of those things in a matter of a couple days is a whole lot of acceleration in the investigation.
|
|
#
?
Jul 21, 2017 10:09
|
|
|
teacup posted:I've seen a few "this is accelerating very fast" comments, but not a lot of press? What happened? Was it- that plus several people in the legal representation teams resigning.
|
|
#
?
Jul 21, 2017 10:13
|
|
|
teacup posted:I've seen a few "this is accelerating very fast" comments, but not a lot of press? What happened? Was it- yeah, basically -muller can investigate trump's money, which is a super sore spot for trump as it hits him right in the ego by proving he's not as rich as he pretends to be (still a rich bastard tho) -trump is mad the russia thing is still happening, so he whines about the United States Attorney General which is extraordinarily childish and unprofessional -trump doesn't realize that as the president he has responsibility along with privilege, meaning you can't just go on tv and complain about people without causing shockwaves since your every move as POTUS is scrutinized, seriously, the secret service even bags up your turds when overseas so other countries can't intercept and analyze them -people continually lose faith in trump in a death spiral because at this point basically everyone realizes he's a giant blinking moron with brain problems but it's a contest to see who can endure it the longest and maintain the polite fiction so as to not be responsible for upsetting the illusion of status quo, like when grandma starts ranting about coloreds at thanksgiving dinner -also trumps legal counsel is shrinking which may or may not be a Thing but it's a super bad look and lolworthy
|
|
#
?
Jul 21, 2017 10:13
|
|
|
teacup posted:I've seen a few "this is accelerating very fast" comments, but not a lot of press? What happened? Was it- The news about Trump's lawyer resigning and his raging anger about the investigation/asking about pardoning himself all dropped fairly late in the day, especially on East Coast time where US political news is usually based around. Unfortunately life isn't a neatly cut movie where everything is wrapped up in two hours. There will likely be fallout for this brand new round of crazy news tomorrow, when Trump inevitably does/says something to make things worse. Patience is your friend.
|
|
#
?
Jul 21, 2017 10:14
|
|
|
If trump pardoned a poo poo load of people, including his family, Kushner and himself, would anything actually happen? Would it even matter to the GOP? Would they do anything?
|
|
#
?
Jul 21, 2017 10:19
|
|
|
Ash Crimson posted:If trump pardoned a poo poo load of people, including his family, Kushner and himself, would anything actually happen? A couple days ago they might have been very concerned.
|
|
#
?
Jul 21, 2017 10:20
|
|
|
Ash Crimson posted:If trump pardoned a poo poo load of people, including his family, Kushner and himself, would anything actually happen? nobody knows. it should matter but the GOP is kind of stuck with trump right now because we're in the worst timeline. so far they seem content to complain off the record about how troubling and inappropriate everything is while doing the cowardly thing and siding with trump in public
|
|
#
?
Jul 21, 2017 10:22
|
|
|
It would be real nice if someone with a microphone went up to GOP Senators and asked "If Trump fires Mueller, what would you do about it?" and not take "I will pretend Trump can't fire Mueller" as a serious answer. Same with asking "What would you do if Trump pardoned a member of his administration or his family?" and not taking "He can't do that" as a serious answer. I just want it on record before it happens and we do another round of concern and disturbance.
|
|
#
?
Jul 21, 2017 10:40
|
|
|
If you look at GWBs approval ratings, you'll see he started dipping below 85% after Katrina. Even then it was a slow decline. Guess what season it is?
|
|
#
?
Jul 21, 2017 10:54
|
|
|
Ash Crimson posted:If trump pardoned a poo poo load of people, including his family, Kushner and himself, would anything actually happen?
|
|
#
?
Jul 21, 2017 11:15
|
|
|
Mustached Demon posted:If you look at GWBs approval ratings, you'll see he started dipping below 85% after Katrina. Even then it was a slow decline. Guess what season it is? Fires in the West, sweltering heat strokes and flooding to the south, cops shooting up people all over season?
|
|
#
?
Jul 21, 2017 11:24
|
|
|
Crabtree posted:Fires in the West, sweltering heat strokes and flooding to the south, cops shooting up people all over season? Stretch out your hand toward the sky so that darkness will spread over America.
|
|
#
?
Jul 21, 2017 11:29
|
|
|
Mustached Demon posted:Stretch out your hand toward the sky so that darkness will spread over America. That's next month.
|
|
#
?
Jul 21, 2017 11:32
|
|
|
Right, and then September is the seas going dry and the mountains blowing in the wind like leaves. but not the Appalachians, which are basically just overgrown hills on the east coast of Ohio.
|
|
#
?
Jul 21, 2017 11:38
|
|
|
Appalachians are fake mountains, a lie spread by dishonest mainstream liberal geologists.
|
|
#
?
Jul 21, 2017 11:57
|
|
|
I'm expecting a big day in tweets today, should be the usual insanity, plus maybe a nice fresh scandal for the weekend
|
|
#
?
Jul 21, 2017 11:58
|
|
|
boner confessor posted:-trump doesn't realize that as the president he has responsibility along with privilege, meaning you can't just go on tv and complain about people without causing shockwaves since your every move as POTUS is scrutinized, seriously, the secret service even bags up your turds when overseas so other countries can't intercept and analyze them A diet of KFC, soda and Doritos. Having to touch that... I'd rather take bullet.
|
|
#
?
Jul 21, 2017 12:08
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 13, 2024 03:02 |
|
|
Ash Crimson posted:Would it even matter to the GOP? Would they do anything?
|
|
#
?
Jul 21, 2017 12:24
|
|