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DelphiAegis posted:Would only work if you have super accumulators for the energy buffer. E=mc^2 is a bitch of an equation. Got to have enough capacity to dematerialize, then re-materialize. Why would you need all that energy? If 'chest teleport tech' existed, I'd like to think of it as dumping the items through stabilized wormholes.
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Jul 22, 2017 05:17
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Galvanik posted:How large are the distances between things in RSA? I'm finally getting tired of having enough resources nearby to build rockets with only short trips. Plus I feel compelled to mine up everything before I build, because otherwise I wouldn't be completely extracting every resource, so that limits the speed of my expansion Do you mean RSO? It includes a custom spawning algorithm that's enabled by default which I think operates like the ore patches: once you start getting really far out they aren't necessarily more common, just much more dense. Using the rail world scenario makes them even more spread out. As for not expanding until you mine it out... you'll still drain the first one! Just slower, while you keep your throughput up with extra sources by rail.
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Jul 22, 2017 05:33
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Ambaire posted:Why would you need all that energy? If 'chest teleport tech' existed, I'd like to think of it as dumping the items through stabilized wormholes. Pfft, much easier to go the Star Trek transporter tech: vaporize original, 3d-print a new one on site 
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Jul 22, 2017 08:13
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Galvanik posted:Also how is the biter nest density? The first couple playthroughs I did I'd end up getting discouraged at the late game since whenever I started to expand it would just be a solid endless wall of red. So eventually I just started doing peaceful mode, or very low density. I'm expecting nukes to go a long way to alleviating that in a normal game, but when thinking about RSA I have this horrible mental image of driving for 10 minutes in one direction, grinding through tens of thousands of biters and not finding anything to mine. RSO biter density is unchanged, so you definitely need to clear a lot of nests.
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Jul 22, 2017 11:45
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You must be looking at a different RSO than I am because it says it changes the biter spawns too
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Jul 22, 2017 13:18
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RSO biters are more frequent but smaller bases for the same settings. Standard:  RSO: 
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Jul 22, 2017 14:13
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It's intended to be the exact opposite by my understanding -- fewer but larger biter bases -- so that resource scouting isn't such a giant pain in the rear end, which matches my experience with it. If you particularly loathe yourself, there is an in game toggle to force the vanilla-style biter generation while keeping RSO resources, but I don't recommend it. Interesting map comparison. That seems denser than I'm used to, but I tend to clear out the nests that close to my base. Toadsmash fucked around with this message at 15:30 on Jul 22, 2017 |
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Jul 22, 2017 15:28
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I think its just RSO places biter bases like they are resources, islands of spawners and worms at a specific density. Where vanilla draws from a palette of base archetypes it places at some frequency so you get the infuriating poo poo like the worm seas.
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Jul 22, 2017 15:43
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I don't understand people who put biter settings onto the "painal" option. Biters are worth having in a game, but I put them on low, cause it's only fun to a certain extent before it becomes annoying and boring. I turn biter expansion off ever since it became an option and I've never looked back.
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Jul 22, 2017 18:26
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Is there something wrong with peaceful mode, btw? I'm on .15 and still my first map, but I could've sworn I turned on peaceful mode, yet I'm getting attacked by biters and they're expanding steadily all around me. Does the pollution reaching their bases count as me "attacking" them or something?
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Jul 22, 2017 18:37
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I play with whatever RSO's biter defaults are and I play with enemy expansion on. Biters are an engineering problem.
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Jul 22, 2017 18:40
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Biters got somewhat fun for me again in .15 now that nukes are in the game. Nukes still really, really need a better visual, though.
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Jul 22, 2017 18:45
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neogeo0823 posted:Is there something wrong with peaceful mode, btw? I'm on .15 and still my first map, but I could've sworn I turned on peaceful mode, yet I'm getting attacked by biters and they're expanding steadily all around me. Does the pollution reaching their bases count as me "attacking" them or something? You can check. Hit escape after loading the game, go to options and see if it's ticked or not. I tend to leave them on for my one stock game for the authentic feel but everything else I have them completely off (they don't spawn at all). They're simply a time sink I don't want in modded games.
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Jul 22, 2017 19:14
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Ratzap posted:You can check. Hit escape after loading the game, go to options and see if it's ticked or not. I'll check in a little bit, when I have time to be on the game again. Honestly, I wouldn't mind them at all as long as they weren't assaulting my base constantly from all angles. I'm trying to do Babby's First base, and I don't want to juggle them as well. I'd be happy with taking a tank out and clearing out the bases when i need more ores, but the frequency of attacks means that I'm constantly running around my base reloading turrets and repairing walls and poo poo and it's annoying.
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Jul 22, 2017 19:22
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neogeo0823 posted:I'll check in a little bit, when I have time to be on the game again. Honestly, I wouldn't mind them at all as long as they weren't assaulting my base constantly from all angles. I'm trying to do Babby's First base, and I don't want to juggle them as well. I'd be happy with taking a tank out and clearing out the bases when i need more ores, but the frequency of attacks means that I'm constantly running around my base reloading turrets and repairing walls and poo poo and it's annoying. The trick is to clear all biter bases inside your pollution cloud, then a little further to compensate for biter expansions and/or factory growth.
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Jul 22, 2017 19:24
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neogeo0823 posted:Is there something wrong with peaceful mode, btw? I'm on .15 and still my first map, but I could've sworn I turned on peaceful mode, yet I'm getting attacked by biters and they're expanding steadily all around me. Does the pollution reaching their bases count as me "attacking" them or something? Yes, pollution is the biggest trigger for an attack. There's nothing wrong with peaceful, I played my first month and a half on peaceful until I was more comfortable with the game. Now I play with RSO and keep them on low so the weapon tech is actually useful on some level. With them on low in a rail world I can get a pretty big factory before pollution usually triggers them due to distance (also use a Very Big starting area).
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Jul 22, 2017 19:28
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neogeo0823 posted:I'll check in a little bit, when I have time to be on the game again. Honestly, I wouldn't mind them at all as long as they weren't assaulting my base constantly from all angles. I'm trying to do Babby's First base, and I don't want to juggle them as well. I'd be happy with taking a tank out and clearing out the bases when i need more ores, but the frequency of attacks means that I'm constantly running around my base reloading turrets and repairing walls and poo poo and it's annoying. A few turrets/walls/flamers bunkers with a way to get ammo to them will last hours and keep biters away from anything important. You can have a defense thats in tight to your factory. Generally I pick a direction to expand both my supply lines and factory and just build a defensive corridor as I build that way, throwing down 10 turret installations at choke points. Turrets and ammo are cheep in the long run. Its not until late game where you need to worry about behemoths actually threatening a turret + wall combo. Most players have a tendency to spend hours trying to clear biter nests so they never get attacked at all and it becomes un-fun, or overbuilding defenses by a huge margin, as if you were playing wave defense. I disovered my favorite (hard mode) balance of biters is to turn them to start low, but to have a huge expansion radius with huge maximum expansion party size, so you'll get clouds of them trying to path through your base randomly, but there aren't actually many biter nests on the map.
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Jul 22, 2017 20:20
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neogeo0823 posted:I'll check in a little bit, when I have time to be on the game again. Honestly, I wouldn't mind them at all as long as they weren't assaulting my base constantly from all angles. I'm trying to do Babby's First base, and I don't want to juggle them as well. I'd be happy with taking a tank out and clearing out the bases when i need more ores, but the frequency of attacks means that I'm constantly running around my base reloading turrets and repairing walls and poo poo and it's annoying. You can make your defenses 100% self-sustaining with some planning. Generally, I'll just do a giant, straight wall that cuts across the entirety of a continent. Then I'll run a row of laser turrets behind that wall. Next you put a row of roboports behind the wall/lasers so that every object is within range of the roboports, with construction bots and LOTS of repair packs. This solution is materially expensive but I usually have assembly machines keeping me fully stockpiled with roboports, lasers, and walls. When I decide to build a giant fuckin' wall I'll already have all the materials I need stockpiled. I like to play on maps with huge bodies of water because it creates natural control points where I can keep out biters. After building your giant, self-repairing wall you can just forget about it forever. I don't even look at the warnings anymore about my turrets firing, and only occasionally investigate if I see more than 1 object being damaged during an attack. The only downside is that you need to be especially vigilant about your power situation. If you're powering your base on coal and don't notice that you're coal fields have been exhausted... you are turbofucked as your laser turrets go offline and biters crash through your wall.
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Jul 22, 2017 20:22
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Also to note: Regular turrets cost 40 Iron, 10 Copper Laser turrets cost 132 Iron, 42 Copper, a little over 3 times as much. You need 20 accumulators per laser turret for late game power requirements. A piercing mag is 9 iron and 5 copper. An accumulator is 7 iron and 5 copper. About the same cost. For the price of one laser turret you can have a gun turret and about 30 piercing or DU mags. And i'm pretty sure DU rounds do far more damage than laser turrets. Especially at end game levels of bullet damage. So its a planning tradeoff, if you know an area will experience continual attacks, laser turrets are the way to go. If you wanna toss down a small defensive structure in the boonies to inhibit biter expansion gun turrets have a clear advantage.
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Jul 22, 2017 20:48
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Q8ee posted:I don't understand people who put biter settings onto the "painal" option. Biters are worth having in a game, but I put them on low, cause it's only fun to a certain extent before it becomes annoying and boring. I turn biter expansion off ever since it became an option and I've never looked back. On the other hand, if you're playing with more than two other people, having lots of Biters around gives the additional players something to do. Chances are you've got one planning mastermind who's great at getting things laid out with the least amount of spaghetti, and there are a few ways other players can help out by establishing new mining fields and train stops... but after a certain point, "go kill aliens" is the default task of new joiners.  We did a Death World game with 6 people a while back, and it was kind of fun having a dedicated Alien Eradication Squad.
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Jul 22, 2017 21:11
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M_Gargantua posted:Also to note: Huh, making me consider having a KoS style wall supply station that just trains ammo (and wall materials) from the base and distributing ammo to the individual turrets with a team of logibots. That sounds like a fun way to solve that problem.
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Jul 22, 2017 21:12
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KirbyKhan posted:Huh, making me consider having a KoS style wall supply station that just trains ammo (and wall materials) from the base and distributing ammo to the individual turrets with a team of logibots. That sounds like a fun way to solve that problem. Turrets will feed themselves with chained inverters. I think they fill 12 mags normally. You only ever need logibots for occasional repairs. I've been trying to think of ways to prevent bots from trying to make repairs during combat though. Also I forgot to discuss flame turrets: Flame turrets are awesome. The best.
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Jul 22, 2017 21:17
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M_Gargantua posted:Turrets will feed themselves with chained inverters. I think they fill 12 mags normally. You only ever need logibots for occasional repairs. I've been trying to think of ways to prevent bots from trying to make repairs during combat though. Roboports which are combat aware when connected to radar stations would be cool.
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Jul 22, 2017 21:58
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It seems clearing out bases was the key. I flattened eerything inside my cloud and the constant attacks stopped. Next thing is, does anyone have a good tutorial for the circuit network? I'm trying to set up a smart refinery, based on this post here, and the one thing that's not explained is how poo poo is set up within the network. Googling around doesn't yield much, either.
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Jul 23, 2017 00:39
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neogeo0823 posted:It seems clearing out bases was the key. I flattened eerything inside my cloud and the constant attacks stopped. Next thing is, does anyone have a good tutorial for the circuit network? I'm trying to set up a smart refinery, based on this post here, and the one thing that's not explained is how poo poo is set up within the network. Googling around doesn't yield much, either. I don't have a tutorial but I can explain it. What's going on in that refinery is that a red circuit wire is originating at a fluid tank. This allows other components to read the amount of liquid stored in the tanks that are connected. The wire then travels along power poles. The power poles just provide a place to hang the wire from, since they have a maximum length. They don't affect the power pole at all. (That's why power poles have three prongs -- one for electrical copper wire, and two circuit wires.) The circuit wire terminates at a pump. The pump, when connected, can be set to turn on for a given condition. In this case, the pump is turning on when there's more than a certain amount of fluid. What this does is allow for the refinery setup to always keep a certain amount of (e.g.) heavy oil on hand, for turning into lubricant. Once that need is filled, the heavy oil fills up the tank. Once the tank hits a certain threshold, the pump turns on, pumping the excess heavy oil into a heavy oil cracker. FWIW, if you have construction robots, you can just import the blueprint, and the robots will wire the circuit network for you based on the blueprint's settings, no thought required.
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Jul 23, 2017 00:52
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neogeo0823 posted:It seems clearing out bases was the key. I flattened eerything inside my cloud and the constant attacks stopped. Next thing is, does anyone have a good tutorial for the circuit network? I'm trying to set up a smart refinery, based on this post here, and the one thing that's not explained is how poo poo is set up within the network. Googling around doesn't yield much, either. This is a pretty good video that helped me finally understand circuits a bit better: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MedApxoUuo0
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Jul 23, 2017 01:41
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Gwyneth Palpate posted:I don't have a tutorial but I can explain it. But how do you set up the combinators to make that happen? Like, how are things set up so that the tank begins filling if the level gets below 1000 units, and stops at 5000 units?
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Jul 23, 2017 03:22
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In my personal experience, there's no reason to set circuits up to maintain a level between x and y. You set the network up to check it there's a minimum level of lubricant, and if there is, start fracking heavy oil. Same with light oil, if there's a minimum of a light oil product or light oil in a tank, start fracking light oil to petroleum gas. The second either heavy or light oil become scarce, fracking stops, leaving prodiction of other products enough input.
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Jul 23, 2017 04:46
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neogeo0823 posted:But how do you set up the combinators to make that happen? Like, how are things set up so that the tank begins filling if the level gets below 1000 units, and stops at 5000 units? No combinators. The wire knows how much fluid is in the tank because it's touching the tank. If you wire the pump to the same wire it knows how much is in the tank too. Now just click on the pump and say run if light oil > 2000 or whatever number you want.
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Jul 23, 2017 08:53
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It's also nice to compare two values. You can enable crackers whenever light oil > petroleum gas, and then they will always be roughly equal.
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Jul 23, 2017 09:41
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As someone that returned to 0.15 after a 6 month hiatus, I have to say the addition of nuclear power is FANTASTIC. I spent a couple of hours last night building an excessively complicated and aesthetically-pleasing uranium ore processing center and then spent way too much time just watching it work. I've got a beautiful bright green uranium train with access to about 500k in uranium ore deposits. I also like the addition of speakers so that I could build global alarms if the centrifuges got clogged up in any way (not that they would). I got carried away and probably overbuilt (because why not) and have 4 centrifuges running continuous Kovarex centrifuges. I think this will let me produce 48 nuclear fuel cells every minute. I haven't even looked into building the power plant yet
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Jul 23, 2017 18:05
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neogeo0823 posted:Is there something wrong with peaceful mode, btw? I'm on .15 and still my first map, but I could've sworn I turned on peaceful mode, yet I'm getting attacked by biters and they're expanding steadily all around me. Does the pollution reaching their bases count as me "attacking" them or something? Peaceful mode doesn't stop expansion, and if you damage one it and its neighbors will become hostile (possibly its owned spanwer as well? I don't think so but I"m not sure). If you are on peaceful you should avoid turrets, as they will fire on any random biter that gets close and trigger aggression.
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Jul 23, 2017 18:16
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sharkbomb posted:As someone that returned to 0.15 after a 6 month hiatus, I have to say the addition of nuclear power is FANTASTIC. I spent a couple of hours last night building an excessively complicated and aesthetically-pleasing uranium ore processing center and then spent way too much time just watching it work. I've got a beautiful bright green uranium train with access to about 500k in uranium ore deposits. I find it amusing that, after a while, the shortage for nuclear fuel becomes the dark green U-238, NOT the light green U-235. You should probably circuit yourself some sort of balancer, so you don't eat all your U-238 making U-235.
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Jul 23, 2017 18:45
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XkyRauh posted:I find it amusing that, after a while, the shortage for nuclear fuel becomes the dark green U-238, NOT the light green U-235. You should probably circuit yourself some sort of balancer, so you don't eat all your U-238 making U-235. I've encountered this, where I had 4k of U235 bumming around, without any 238 to run the kovarex, or make 238 tank shells and bullets. The practical answer is to allow you to use U-235 to make shells/bullets for an even more end-game munition 
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Jul 23, 2017 18:50
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Yah, it's trivial to set up a circuit for your Kovarex centrifuges so they only run if your U-238 bank stays above a certain threshold. Although as soon as you get even 2 or 3 remotely decent uranium patches, 238 becomes trivial, too. That doesn't sound like much, but uranium isn't used for anything you need to manufacture at massive scale.
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Jul 23, 2017 18:51
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XkyRauh posted:I find it amusing that, after a while, the shortage for nuclear fuel becomes the dark green U-238, NOT the light green U-235. You should probably circuit yourself some sort of balancer, so you don't eat all your U-238 making U-235. Good point! I'll just wire the Kovarex output inserters to turn off when nuclear fuel rods reach a certain quantity so that the centrifuges stop refining. My next project is to build a totally unnecessary concrete island for my nuclear power plant in the middle of the ocean. I'll have my nuclear train running fuel rods out there and bringing back spent fuel.
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Jul 23, 2017 18:51
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This is a good day for the true grit masochists out there in Factorioland. Sea Block and Hardcorio are back for 0.15 Seeing how much has changed I wouldn't bother trying to migrate saves if I were you. But then if you have an old save you like pain so maybe you should. I had a peek into a new game for each and they're just as horrible as I remember, bon appetite.
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Jul 23, 2017 20:06
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Ratzap posted:Sea Block and Hardcorio are back for 0.15 What's the intention of each of those?
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Jul 23, 2017 21:39
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Brovine posted:What's the intention of each of those? Do you enjoy running a full marathon while the sidelines shoot you with paintballs or tasers?
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Jul 23, 2017 21:54
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I would like a pseudo rts mode where you can build robots that you can send to fight the biters.
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Jul 24, 2017 01:15
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