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Tae posted:Kaden, Peri, Orochi, Subaki, Shura are gone permanently. At least Ryoma can't fall behind in levels and stats
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Jul 21, 2017 18:41
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Also, at least you have Jakob, who is both a healer and a debuffer. And possibly the only reason Corrine doesn't die instantly in combat.
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Jul 22, 2017 03:41
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This is Rev though. You want all the flyers you can get, so the upcoming chapters are less painful. A lot of gimmicks can just be skipped by flight in Rev. This makes me super sad Subaki got dropped  :
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Jul 22, 2017 05:27
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EDIT:  This isn't the heroes thread!
The man called M fucked around with this message at 07:17 on Jul 22, 2017 |
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Jul 22, 2017 06:56
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The man called M posted:How vital are Blade tomes for Horse Emblem? My horse team is the three on the Calvary Banner (Plus Kagero until I get a horse healer) wrong thread, but blade tomes are the payoff for restricting yourself to only running cav units. Reinhardt and Xander aside, cavalry just aren't very good and the buffs only take them up to the same level as a buffed infantry unit--unless they have a blade tome, in which case they just loving explode
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Jul 22, 2017 07:00
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  So this is the map philosophy of Revelation, now that we're finally doing the drat point of the DLC. It's gimmicks galore above all else, in many forms.  Kaden, Peri, Orochi, Subaki, and Shura are gone forever. RIP to those that never promoted.   I sense Dragon Veins nearby...in the eight forts. Use those to remove the barrier. Be careful. We'll need to split up in order to activate each Dragon Vein.  The team starts in the middle island, with six teleporters that link to the six across the map. Left corner to left corner, middle to middle, etc.   This is where Revelation really punishes you for either not grinding or not picking the royals. Every single enemy is promoted and has a combination of speed, defense, and power. The average attack of my guys is like 16. That's not good.   Due to the severe lack of strength, especially with only one healer and no Azura, I'm sending all my forces to this left corner of the island and enacting the longest grind session in the world.   Let me tell you about a Chinese legend named Zhang Fei, who held a bridge against a force of thousands of soldiers. It was not 1000 enemies, but it sure felt like it.  An unpromoted Hana is doing as well as you'd expect by this point. Consider that paralogue kids would be promoted by now when recruited.    That's one Dragon Vein activated. Seven left to go... So that's the goal of the map, despite being a Kill Boss objective. I can't actually reach her until I take over an island and Dragon Vein that area's fortress seven more times. Then a teleporter activates that transfers to her secluded box.   This bridge stalemate takes a long, long time because reinforcement waves come every other turn for 20+ turns.   Ryoma is here to take out a few enemies that are too troublesome for Benny and Corrine to handle (mostly Master Ninjas). Unfortunately even with an Umbrella he's s till one-shotting enemies because of his high crit.   Benny eventually gains enough levels to become a General, which skyrockets his already impressive defense to 30 for battle.   Keaton also promotes, turning into a decent physical tank that can actually double and kill stuff.   After many, many turns, Corrine and Benny unlock their true potential and soften up the enemies so that everyone else reaches or nearly reaches level 20. Hana was NOT fun to do this with.   I want to say the rest of the map was meaningful, but it isn't. At some point, the reinforcements do eventually stop, so it's just slowly crossing across the map and activating Dragon Veins to unlock the teleporter.   I do speed things a bit once everyone reaches at least level 20, since I don't have money for Master Seals. Ryoma and Reina fly over to the top corner veins, while the rest of the party works on the middle and bottom corners. Items gained via enemies: -Steel Axe -Steel Bow -Steel Naginata -Tiger Spirit -Sun Festal -Mend   The current nightmare is over.  Those two circles near the statue are the ticket into the boss room.   Just planning a final blitzkrieg to milk some EXP before the battle's over.   Just realize that Hana has a 49% chance avoiding after factoring in Duelist's 30% bonus.   The boss doesn't move, has horrible stats, and doesn't even have a top shelf magic spell.   Although I guess surviving this map's tedium was the true boss?   And she drops her Rabbit Spirit as a reward. Unit Update:  --> Benny obviously isn't as strong as Effie was, but he's a much better defensive wall and he's not competing with Xander or Percy in the tank department.  --> Beruka gained speed, gained jack all else. But she's a flier, and that's still useful. Also probably the most reliable at hitting ninjas with her axes and high Skill rating.  --> Corrine finds herself as a mixed tank that can occasionally snipe with the Levin Sword and debuff targets. Not a mainstay fighter, but now an important support role to help the D-team roster.  -->   Jakob's the only reason why this operation works at times, since he nullifies magic users which are the biggest obstacles for this group.  --> Setsuna in actual use is not as strong as Revelation's buff growths would leave you to believe. That said, she's still going to double most enemies once promoted and Quick Draw solves everything.  --> Unfortunately, Niles has no crutch to fall back on for his piss-poor attack. His saving grace is that his promotions are better utility-wise but yeesh. The bad thing is that he's pretty inaccurate for a bow user which is extra damning.  --> Nyx is really good if you need someone to hit a target without being hit back. Outside of that, good god she will die instantly to a stiff breeze. Especially since Hayato is basically as speedy as her but way more durable.  --> Keaton is going to be really good once I pick up a Beaststone+, so he can fully convert into a bruiser that eats physical attacks for breakfast.  --> I mean if you squint, Hana is basically Kaden with WAY less HP but better skills and has Kodachi range access. Also minus the anti-Cavs bonus but...I'm trying to look at the positives.  --> He just loving sucks
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Jul 23, 2017 02:05
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Tae posted:
That tends to be my experience with Hinata, yes. I mean, his base growths are pretty good... for a Knight, not a frickin' Samurai! Who's ever heard of a Myrmidon (or whatever they're called in the current game) with more Defense growth than Speed growth, even AFTER factoring in class growths?! Basically: Like Subaki, Hinata has the potential to be SO much better, but is instead complete trash due to being trapped in a class that doesn't fit his growths. They even share a class that they'd do better in!
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Jul 23, 2017 03:17
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I've never had a good Hinata. I've barely ever had a somewhat passable Hinata. I once gave him steroid redemption, and he was still my worst unit of the run.
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Jul 23, 2017 03:28
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Weeble posted:I've never had a good Hinata. He is the only Myrmidon-type I have ever heard of who would actually benefit from Wary Fighter. Just another reason he'd do better as a Knight, I guess. I mean sure, his accuracy would still be pretty shaky as a General, but at least he'd tank like a champ. Instead, we get the worst swordsman ever.
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Jul 23, 2017 03:38
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Hinata seems to be modeled after Dieck and Gerik, a swordsman with good bases and bad growths. the difference is that dieck and gerik were in games with way worse growths, so the other units didnt lap them as quickly.
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Jul 23, 2017 03:54
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Endorph posted:Hinata seems to be modeled after Dieck and Gerik, a swordsman with good bases and bad growths. the difference is that dieck and gerik were in games with way worse growths, so the other units didnt lap them as quickly. They also didn't have a unit show up in their class a couple chapters later with better bases, growths, and a custom weapon that would be broken even if 1-2 hadn't been nerfed.
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Jul 23, 2017 04:04
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Endorph posted:Hinata seems to be modeled after Dieck and Gerik, a swordsman with good bases and bad growths. the difference is that dieck and gerik were in games with way worse growths, so the other units didnt lap them as quickly. As I said, Hinata's growths aren't so much bad as they are wholly unsuited to his class. According to the Serenes Forest site, his base growths are as follows... HP: 55 (REALLY high by this game's standards) Str: 35 (okay, a high-Str Samurai has the potential to be quite good, but Hinata lacks the rest) Mag: 0 (pretty much the only thing he got right) Skl: 25 (god-awful) Spd: 15 (calling this bottom-tier is NOT an exaggeration- the only characters we've seen so far with worse are Gunter and Benny) Lck: 45 (meh, in my experience Luck tends to be a low-priority stat) Def: 45 (told you he'd do better as a General) Res: 15 (well, it's a bit low, but mages tend to be Knight-killers anyway in Fire Emblem) Unfortunately, he has literally no access to the class he needs to redeem himself unless you purpose-build your Avatar for it, and there're better things to do with your Avatar than redeem a bad unit.
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Jul 23, 2017 04:13
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I've had the best success with Hinata by promoting him straight away to Master of Arms, giving him weapon triangle control and excellent stats for his join time, particularly useful in Birthright because IMO the game's 'hardest' chapters are all around his joining time. He doesn't stay good for the whole game, but who cares lol Ryoma joins when he starts to falter.
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Jul 23, 2017 10:53
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Yeah, Hinata's true value isn't as a long term unit. He's an early promote that can turn into a decent enough stat stick. He can give speed in Swordmaster or STR/DEF in the Oni line. If Hinata was in Knight, he'd be worse since his speed would actually be awful, he needs the speed base. It's the same story as Saizo. I'm not a huge fan of him, but I did use him on a Rev Hard run and I did appreciate his bulk. A good speed pair up is all he needs to start doubling stuff and a forged weapon can handle the damage. Ryoma may be better but I'll take Hinata over Hana. Not a fan of Hana's paper durability.
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Jul 23, 2017 14:34
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 Hi again    Disappearing into thin air. How unnerving...  At least it looks like we have a break from fighting. So, where are we? Is this the bottom of the Bottomless Canyon? Yes, it is.   Valla? So, what are the limits of this curse? They have all but basically said there's invisible forces hidden somewhere, and they wouldn't have believed Corrine or Azura anyway without coming here. This curse is kinda useless, except for randomly killing Azura's mom for...reasons we're not given details. *Moments later*  Oh, right. She just kinda left Scarlet's corpse by itself.  Scarlet! Where are you?!  Ryoma...*Ryoma turns around*  *A moment later*    How could this happen?  The flower she'd pinned on... It's been burned away. What are you talking about? We were the last ones to jump, so no one saw... Ryoma... Scarlet died protecting me and— Just...promise me. Promise me you will not let her sacrifice be in vain. Yes. I promise. I vow on the Yato. Just gonna sweep this random death under the rug. Thanks, Revelation.
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Jul 23, 2017 16:24
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"Quick everyone, pinky-swear that we won't talk about how dumb that was."
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Jul 23, 2017 17:38
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Somebody put out a name for Jakob's wife. Early bird gets the worm for the next hour.
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Jul 23, 2017 17:55
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I chose Peri so I guess I'll go with that.
Kay Kessler fucked around with this message at 18:04 on Jul 23, 2017 |
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Jul 23, 2017 17:57
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yeah Peri sounds good
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Jul 23, 2017 18:16
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While I like Peri, isn't she off the table? I vote Corrine
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Jul 23, 2017 18:17
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Everyone is on the table. Being voted off doesn't mean anything for paralogue purposes.
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Jul 23, 2017 18:23
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Let's give Azura a shot. But yikes, this thread really wants to use Hinata for some bizarre reason.
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Jul 23, 2017 19:27
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Nyx... I've had pretty good success with Jakob's son as a Dark Knight.
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Jul 23, 2017 22:43
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  But I don't wanna be executed! Killing isn't fun when it's happening to me!Jesus christ, Jakob   Eh, we'll see if Jakob or anyone sees more than one turn of combat.    Hmpf. As always, that lazy lout is probably snoring away somewhere.  Clearly, his bad attitude has infected this whole village. What a sleepy place. Why do I even bother fetching Dwyer his favorite coffee beans? How did I come to buttle my son, when he should come running to serve me?  Of all the… My son can’t even have me greeted properly on my arrival? Oh, now this all makes sense. Theory time, what if kids were locked behind Revelation so it would make a tiny bit more context. Wait. Nope. Still doesn't make sense. What? How’d you get here? Did you follow me? Speak, villain. Now! Or I’ll cut the answer out of you! … *leaves* Eh? Where’s that fiend going? No! There are more of them, and they’re breaking into Dwyer’s house! SON! THEY’RE COMING FOR YOU!   So on paper, this mission is to rush towards Dwyer and fend off the Valla soldiers while Dwyer helps healing the General NPCs. Keeping them alive gets you extra stuff. OR  Just bait the boss and kill him basically on turn one because this is a Kill Boss map. So here's a different poll for this. There are 10 more kids after Dwyer. Do you want to do like 2 every other chapter, or do them all at once so there's no interruption in the Revelation story train ride? http://www.strawpoll.me/13514920 Side note, if all at once wins, I'm going to turbo-beat the boss.
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Jul 23, 2017 22:45
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You know, I couldn't for the life of me remember why exactly I had paired Jakob with Peri. But then I started reading those Supports and it all came rushing back.  Certainly helps make up for the Beruka-Saizo glower hour.
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Jul 23, 2017 23:42
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Get the kids, if only to give you some good units to deal with the shitshow that is the second half of revelations. Plus the conquest kids have interesting maps.
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Jul 24, 2017 01:40
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You'd think there'd be some Valla-only classes we'd be running into or could recruit. Then I remember it's this game.
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Jul 24, 2017 01:50
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Whelp, might as well just rip that bandaid off in one go; sure, it'll smart, but at least you won't have to deal with the slow agonizing peeling process.
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Jul 24, 2017 02:12
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Gilgamesh255 posted:Whelp, might as well just rip that bandaid off in one go; sure, it'll smart, but at least you won't have to deal with the slow agonizing peeling process. The kid maps aren't really all that bad. Nothing special, just okay.
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Jul 24, 2017 03:30
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There's a typo in the poll, an extra e in "every"
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Jul 24, 2017 06:20
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All at once, if nothing else then because several of the kids start in dangerous positions and don't scale past level 20 unpromoted.
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Jul 24, 2017 19:39
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  Urrr, is that my father? Of course he’d have to show up in the middle of all this. Well, forget him. I’ve got enough to worry about, keeping us all alive in here. Everyone! Stay close! I’ll heal you up if you get hurt! Hanging back? Letting others do the fighting for him? It’s a disgrace!   The intent of this map is reaching Dwyer while he heals the Generals from all those nasty valla soldiers. The Generals are pretty drat tough, so it's not too much of a challenge. Jacob to Dwyer Dwyer, I’ve found you. Father! What a surprise. I’d fetch you a glass of my finest whatever. That is, if I wasn’t busy with my other uninvited guests. Of all the… Uninvited?! I’m your father, Dwyer! And just look at the way you’re conducting yourself in your own household! I taught you martial arts! And you’re dillydallying in the background? Healing, not fighting? Oh, Father, there’s no shame in standing by to help when needed. Isn’t that what a good butler does? Serve, not show up his masters? What was that? Are you slighting my profession? What? Not in the slightest. But if you expect me to jump into battle… then I think you’ve got the wrong son. I’m a healer, not a fighter. Dwyer, Dwyer… You always did run from a fight.  Go on then. Let your father do all the work. Give me a break. You never did see me for who I was. Perhaps I was a tad idle as a child. But now, I keep people alive. Don’t bother. I’ll keep everyone alive… by defending them with MY life. So, unless my Little Lord Lazybones wishes me to fetch his slippers… No? Or a cup of warm milk? Then stand aside and watch how it’s done, Son. Hmm. Go on then.   So the option to do all the paralogues now won out, so here's Corrine basically winning the map in two turns via bait and counter-attack.  *after the battle*  And that, my son, is why your remaining servants just left. Huh? They did? Hmm. Even your caretakers too. I’m not surprised, the way you run this household. It’s a den of a sloth. Oh no… They really are gone! Who will bring in all the dirt? Or feed hair balls to the dust bunnies? I can't do it ALL by myself! Hmpf… Pulling the same rope-o-dope like his mother. Ha! We all pull our weight in our group. I’d never vouch for you. You’re going to stew here for the rest of your days in this mess of a place. … Father? You missed one. Oh, never mind. I’ve got it. Dwyer?! What in— Well, take this! SLAPPYFACE! …*dies* Whew! Who knew? Victory! But your slappyface is unparalleled. Have you been… in training? I guess so. Wait, are you kidding? Because I don’t always laze around here. Well, how irksome. Here I had you pegged for a complete loafer. But if you could fight, even a little, why did you make your servants do it for you? Hmm? Wasn’t it their job to watch over me? I would never rob them of their work. With that sort of attitude, I’m afraid that you’ll never be good for much. Do you expect me to find you fresh caretakers to abuse? This guy is a plot twist every second. What?! If you can buttle, I can buttle. I bet I’ll buttle better. Hey, did you bring those coffee beans I wanted?  But that’s MY job! What’s the matter? Afraid of a little competition? This should be fun. En garde, Father. I declare this battle of buttling begun! Hmpf. You don’t stand a chance. Keeping the Generals alive gives a Friendship Seal and Talisman.  Also, Fuga joins the party as Revelation's Upgrade Hotspring guy. Because...Izana died, so someone has to??  It's true that I didn't plan on helping anyone from Hoshido or Nohr, but...I think your desire to save both while siding with neither is very noble."Noble" or "naive." What's the line here. Knowing our true enemy is out there. I can't stay on the sidelines any longer.Fuga, how did you even get here.  HOLY poo poo Units Joined Dwyer  Class sets: Starts as Troubadour, Cavalier, Dark Mage PSkill: Born Steward-When fighting in My Castle, Hit rate and Avoid +20, damage +2 and damage received -2 Growth Rates HP: 37.5 STR: 47.5 MAG: 27.5 SKL: 45 SPD: 50 LCK: 47.5 DEF: 27.5 RES: 55 Dwyer has literally the most useless PSkill in the game. Peri basically gave him some extra speed and resistance aaaand that's about it. He would actually make a decent Butler because of his high strength growth as one, but that's about all his strength. Maybe a Cavalier with high resistance to fight mages? Fuga  Class sets: Samurai, Monk, Oni Savage PSkill: Wind Disciple-When user’s HP is not full, Hit rate and Avoid +10 Growth Rates HP: 40 STR: 35 MAG: 0 SKL: 25 SPD: 15 LCK: 30 DEF: 20 RES: 10 His growths are absolutely godawful, but his bases are so good that they're almost already endgame material. Factor in his PSkill which contributes him to be above average at all times, and you have by far the best "upgrade" unit of the bunch. You know I make better coffee than you. Admit it.
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Jul 24, 2017 20:39
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Well, Fuga looks strong. 29 DEF and Strength and 25 Speed looks like a potent combination. Enough Def to take little damage, enough speed to not get doubled, and enough strength to hit hard.
I can have moments of... eccentricity and sometimes be quite curious about things. Please forgive me if I do something foolish or rude.
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Jul 24, 2017 21:18
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Fun fact: "fuga" is actually the noise enemies make when he hits them.
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Jul 24, 2017 21:19
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"I'm just better than you in every way. It's simple fact" Daaamn. Dwyer with thug life right there.
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Jul 24, 2017 22:00
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There are many faults to be found in the localization. "Slappyface" is not one of them.
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Jul 24, 2017 22:08
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Huh. Peri made an unexpectedly appropriate choice of mother for this guy.
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Jul 24, 2017 22:13
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Dwyer is even funnier if you have a mother with black hair, because then he ends up looking EXACTLY like L from Death Note.
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Jul 24, 2017 22:54
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That scene was pretty cavalier about the guys who presumably raised Dwyer just... leaving.
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Jul 24, 2017 23:02
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I don't know a site where you can just write in an answer, so for now just give me someone for Silas.
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Jul 25, 2017 01:49
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