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fnox posted:So you have nothing to contribute. You have nothing to say to the Venezuelan people other than that they're idiots because you think they're all right wing paramilitaries. You have absolutely nothing of worth to add to the conversation other than any combination of the words "right-wing", "CIA", "IED" or "Trump". So you're doing nothing but stir poo poo for no reason. Nah I think it's fairly reasonable to point out that your proposed replacements, the Venezuelan right, have no meaningful solutions to the problem that couldn't be delivered by the government. I'm not obliged to provide my own. I'm not trying to control Venezuela, whereas the all of the people who currently are have zero policies that can actually fix the economy. It's not true that if some random internet leftist can't solve Venezuela's economic problem then we should hand it over to rightists.
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Jul 31, 2017 07:52
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Have fun with your civil war, Venegoons
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Jul 31, 2017 07:52
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fnox posted:Then, what should they do? Tell me, what should the Venezuelan people do? It's obvious. They should lie down and submit.
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Jul 31, 2017 07:52
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If you were half as tough with your leaders as you are with me, maybe they wouldn't be murdering cops in the street. Ask them for the answers on how they're going to fix the country, rather than saying I'm full of poo poo because I don't want them and their thugs to rule.
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Jul 31, 2017 07:54
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Thug Lessons posted:Nah I think it's fairly reasonable to point out that your proposed replacements, the Venezuelan right, have no meaningful solutions to the problem that couldn't be delivered by the government. I'm not obliged to provide my own. I'm not trying to control Venezuela, whereas the all of the people who currently are have zero policies that can actually fix the economy. It's not true that if some random internet leftist can't solve Venezuela's economic problem then we should hand it over to rightists. Some solution is better than no solution. You mean to tell me that the Venezuelan people should listen to you after you tell them you have no idea how to fix any of their problems? Why should anybody listen to anything you have to say then if you're so hopelessly uninformed about the situation? Why should anybody care about what you have to say?
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Jul 31, 2017 07:54
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fnox posted:Some solution is better than no solution. You mean to tell me that the Venezuelan people should listen to you after you tell them you have no idea how to fix any of their problems? Why should anybody listen to anything you have to say then if you're so hopelessly uninformed about the situation? Why should anybody care about what you have to say? No actually "some solution" in the form of wide-scale privatization and mass immiseration is not actually better than no solution.
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Jul 31, 2017 07:56
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Thug Lessons posted:No actually "some solution" in the form of wide-scale privatization and mass immiseration is not actually better than no solution. Yes, anything is better than you proposing literally nothing to solve the crisis. Leave the thread, you're completely useless.
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Jul 31, 2017 07:57
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fnox posted:Yes, anything is better than you proposing literally nothing to solve the crisis. Leave the thread, you're completely useless. No, your demands that I somehow solve Venezuela's economic crisis on my own where everyone else has failed are fairly ridiculous, and I'm perfectly within bounds to oppose a right-wing force that has no solutions either. I'll be sticking around 
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Jul 31, 2017 08:01
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Thug Lessons posted:No, your demands that I somehow solve Venezuela's economic crisis on my own where everyone else has failed are fairly ridiculous, and I'm perfectly within bounds to oppose a right-wing force that has no solutions either. I'll be sticking around What do you mean everyone else has failed? The only ones who have been give the oppurtunity to try are the PSUV.
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Jul 31, 2017 08:04
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Thug Lessons posted:No actually "some solution" in the form of wide-scale privatization and mass immiseration is not actually better than no solution. 1) The MUD isn't a neo-fash or neo-lib party. It's an often loose organisation of parties which are largely leftist. 2) The Option of "keep the PSUV in power just with another leader" is a garbage option - of the candidates, several are actual drug lords, and the rest have serious legal question marks over them as well. 3) Why do people keep acting like Venezuela is on the verge of being Caudillo'd? Because they have oil? The current government would probably sell all their oil to the US at a price the US could name and would also throw in a free handy to all of Exxon Mobil's executives/be involved with piss play with Donald Trump just to keep the money rolling in. The amount of trouble getting involved with Venezuela currently is on the level of rebuilding Iraq post 2005, a task the US washed it's hands of very clearly. So I don't really see where the Caudillo talk is coming from.
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Jul 31, 2017 08:06
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Thug Lessons posted:No, your demands that I somehow solve Venezuela's economic crisis on my own where everyone else has failed are fairly ridiculous, and I'm perfectly within bounds to oppose a right-wing force that has no solutions either. I'll be sticking around I am not telling you to solve the economic crisis yourself. I'm asking you, as a Venezuelan, what I should do. I don't want to back the government that has so thoroughly destroyed my future, and according to you I shouldn't back the opposition either. So again, simple question, what should I do? Should I stay home, sit down and wait to die? Should I go out and protest? What should I do?
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Jul 31, 2017 08:10
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Schlesische posted:1) The MUD isn't a neo-fash or neo-lib party. It's an often loose organisation of parties which are largely leftist. They are absolutely a neoliberal coalition, and one which will drift further toward the right and authoritarianism were they to take power.
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Jul 31, 2017 08:14
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fnox posted:I am not telling you to solve the economic crisis yourself. I'm asking you, as a Venezuelan, what I should do. I don't want to back the government that has so thoroughly destroyed my future, and according to you I shouldn't back the opposition either. So again, simple question, what should I do? Should I stay home, sit down and wait to die? Should I go out and protest? What should I do? It depends what you mean. If you want an endorsement of a political party, I can safely say none of them have offered compelling solutions to the crisis. If you want general political advice, join a leftist section, so at least you will be on the right side.
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Jul 31, 2017 08:19
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Thug Lessons posted:The point is more that when you're looking at Venezuela the choice really is between lovely Chavistas and fascists who want to kill the poor. They executed a government candidate today and later they set an IED to kill cops. They are not nice people who are going to restore democracy or whatever you hope for, they are violent reactionaries. I hope you're not still in this thread by the time I skip 100 posts to get to the mots recent one, but I'd just like to say: you're a real scumbag. If what you say is true, and you've been in Venezuela for Vice, I've (a) lost a lot of respect for Vice, which I'm generally a huge fan of, and (b) you're a fuckwit for trying to fit everything into your paradigm of "anyone who claims they are leftist = good; anyone who is against someone who claimed to leftist first = right wing = bad". Just because you talked to some people attacking police doesn't mean they represent the entire opposition. loving 80% of the country is against Maduro. How the poo poo is Maduro a leftist? He's a kleptocrat to end all kleptocrats. He makes most of the Arab dictators look like good people. Also what the gently caress, saying "you'll be eating out of trash" to a Venezuelan dude posting in the thread? I literally don't even know what that means. Is that some turn of phrase I'm not familiar with? Edit: God dammit, I skipped 100 posts and it's still you.
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Jul 31, 2017 08:30
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Thug Lessons posted:They are absolutely a neoliberal coalition, and one which will drift further toward the right and authoritarianism were they to take power. That statement implies a belief that they're more closely aligned than they are and a level of understanding that is less than even mine.
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Jul 31, 2017 08:30
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Thug Lessons posted:It depends what you mean. If you want an endorsement of a political party, I can safely say none of them have offered compelling solutions to the crisis. If you want general political advice, join a leftist section, so at least you will be on the right side. Again you don't understand, every time I've done nothing, the government has only become more powerful and corrupt. I can't wait any more while my family dies of hunger and disease. So again, as a Venezuelan, what should I do?
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Jul 31, 2017 08:35
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Saladman posted:I hope you're not still in this thread by the time I skip 100 posts to get to the mots recent one, but I'd just like to say: you're a real scumbag. If what you say is true, and you've been in Venezuela for Vice, I've (a) lost a lot of respect for Vice, which I'm generally a huge fan of, and (b) you're a fuckwit for trying to fit everything into your paradigm of "anyone who claims they are leftist = good; anyone who is against someone who claimed to leftist first = right wing = bad". Just because you talked to some people attacking police doesn't mean they represent the entire opposition. loving 80% of the country is against Maduro. How the poo poo is Maduro a leftist? He's a kleptocrat to end all kleptocrats. He makes most of the Arab dictators look like good people. He's not a Vice reporter, he's a common variety D+D shitposter.
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Jul 31, 2017 08:35
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fnox posted:Again you don't understand, every time I've done nothing, the government has only become more powerful and corrupt. I can't wait any more while my family dies of hunger and disease. So again, as a Venezuelan, what should I do? Uh, obviously you should stop opposing the PSUV and put your faith in Maduro and the PSUV as you slowly starve to death. It's all a capitalist war to force Venezuela to become capitalist again anyway, and only the PSUV can stop it! EDIT: In all seriousness, they're a troll and nothing you say will convince them that anyone other than Maduro (or whichever PSUV criminal gets "nominated" to take a lifetime appointment as supreme leader from the Constituent Assembly) is an acceptable choice. They're not worth responding to, and I don't intend to reply to any post they might make quoting this one, because they are a person with garbage opinions that they don't actually intend to defend when attacked. EDITx2: The same goes for the guy below I guess. Sure are a lot of "leftist" trolls who have never posted before in this thread but then suddenly come out of the woodwork when Venezuela actually tries to stand up for itself, huh? ComradeCosmobot fucked around with this message at 08:56 on Jul 31, 2017 |
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Jul 31, 2017 08:43
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Wow so now the right wingers are using IEDs? If these terrorists take over a whole lot of poor/black Venezuelans are going to get murdered. I saw that video the other day of a black chavista being set on fire by right wingers. Insane
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Jul 31, 2017 08:52
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A lot of trolls going around huh.
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Jul 31, 2017 08:59
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orange sky posted:A lot of trolls going around huh. Yeah. Venezuela's mentioned on the front page of RT and a bunch of times on Sputnik News right now, so of course the tankies have come out to play.
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Jul 31, 2017 09:02
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ComradeCosmobot posted:EDITx2: The same goes for the guy below I guess. Sure are a lot of "leftist" trolls who have never posted before in this thread but then suddenly come out of the woodwork when Venezuela actually tries to stand up for itself, huh? I'm a troll for caring about the lynchings of afro-latinos? What's the success rate of US-backed regime changes? There is no way these reactionaries are going to play nice if they come into power through US intervention. They are going to get revenge and they will target the black and poor.
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Jul 31, 2017 09:20
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Scent of Worf posted:I'm a troll for caring about the lynchings of afro-latinos? What's the success rate of US-backed regime changes? There is no way these reactionaries are going to play nice if they come into power through US intervention. They are going to get revenge and they will target the black and poor. You are troll because you have put zero effort into educating yourself about the racial and social structure of Venezuela or the opposition parties, yet you come into this thread shouting about how the opposition is lynching blacks and poors
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Jul 31, 2017 09:28
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To be honest I thought he was satire
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Jul 31, 2017 09:33
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Oh whoops, you're right. Imagine I'm replying to Thug Lessons instead.
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Jul 31, 2017 09:38
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Arzachel posted:You are troll because you have put zero effort into educating yourself about the racial and social structure of Venezuela or the opposition parties, yet you come into this thread shouting about how the opposition is lynching blacks and poors I'm not an expert but i'm gonna go ahead and say it's similar to the other kinds of racism found throughout countless other latin american ex-colonies where descendants of european whites control all the wealth and power while the afro-latino population lives in squalor.
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Jul 31, 2017 09:38
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Scent of Worf posted:I'm not an expert Obviously
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Jul 31, 2017 09:41
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Scent of Worf posted:I'm not an expert but i'm gonna go ahead and say it's similar to the other kinds of racism found throughout countless other latin american ex-colonies where descendants of european whites control all the wealth and power while the afro-latino population lives in squalor. You guessed wrong you loving moron, 2/3rds of the population are mixed race. Do you pretend to tell me that Maduro and his cronies are white? Because those are the oligarchs here.
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Jul 31, 2017 09:42
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fnox posted:You guessed wrong you loving moron, 2/3rds of the population are mixed race. Do you pretend to tell me that Maduro and his cronies are white? Because those are the oligarchs here. What does that have to do with what I said? Do you think Venezuela is unique in this aspect? Or that it somehow stops the whites from hoarding all the wealth and power? Of course Maduro isn't white, but the right wing opposition who plotted the coup against Chavez and are currently trying very hard to get the CIA to intervene on their behalf sure are. Venezuela is unique in that the afro population was able to rise up and gain power. Many people ITT seem eager for the CIA and the white right wing opposition to strip them of that power. e-VVVV I'm not white nor am i misapplying anything because i am very familiar with latin american race relations, but don't let that distract you from your rant. The Ol Spicy Keychain fucked around with this message at 10:03 on Jul 31, 2017 |
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Jul 31, 2017 09:47
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White people ethnocentrically misapplying their own domestic problems to Venezuela never gets old. I've lurked this thread for over a year and it never ceases to amaze and bewilder. Usually they don't realize they're talking to a thread that has a bunch of actual Venezuelans posting in it.
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Jul 31, 2017 09:59
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Scent of Worf posted:What does that have to do with what I said? Do you think Venezuela is unique in this aspect? Or that it somehow stops the whites from hoarding all the wealth and power? Of course Maduro isn't white, but the right wing opposition who plotted the coup against Chavez and are currently trying very hard to get the CIA to intervene on their behalf sure are. Venezuela is unique in that the afro population was able to rise up and gain power. Many people ITT seem eager for the CIA and the white right wing opposition to strip them of that power. No, I want the oligarchs who stole billions of dollars that were supposed to be for the future of my generation and of my people to be ousted. That's what I want. I don't give a poo poo if they're black, white, moreno, mestizo or purple, they stole our people's money, and they deserve to be thrown into a prison cell.
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Jul 31, 2017 10:02
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Scent of Worf posted:. Many people ITT seem eager for the CIA and the white right wing opposition to strip them of that power. The power to eat one meal a day?
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Jul 31, 2017 10:10
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fnox posted:No, I want the oligarchs who stole billions of dollars that were supposed to be for the future of my generation and of my people to be ousted. That's what I want. I don't give a poo poo if they're black, white, moreno, mestizo or purple, they stole our people's money, and they deserve to be thrown into a prison cell. And you want them to be ousted by violence and US intervention, despite the fact that such methods have historically resulted in even more devastation for the countries unlucky enough to attract America's attention?
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Jul 31, 2017 10:12
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Scent of Worf posted:And you want them to be ousted by violence and US intervention, despite the fact that such methods have historically resulted in even more devastation for the countries unlucky enough to attract America's attention? I want them ousted by any means necessary because if I have to pick between my family continuing to die in the hands of governmental negligence, and revolution, I'll pick revolution. You don't understand because you don't know how desperate we are, because you only care about us when Telesur tells you to.
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Jul 31, 2017 10:15
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It's honestly kind of sick when you're trolling someone about the dire situation in their own country. Isn't FYAD supposed to exist so idiots like you can get drawn into the black hole of shitposting?
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Jul 31, 2017 10:22
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fnox posted:I want them ousted by any means necessary because if I have to pick between my family continuing to die in the hands of governmental negligence, and revolution, I'll pick revolution. You don't understand because you don't know how desperate we are, because you only care about us when Telesur tells you to. I too hope the situation improves and for someone much better than Maduro to win the election, but not through CIA intervention and that the people who are burning black Venezuelans alive don't get into power.
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Jul 31, 2017 10:28
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Scent of Worf posted:I too hope the situation improves and for someone much better than Maduro to win the election, but not through CIA intervention and that the people who are burning black Venezuelans alive don't get into power. Until you have any solutions that I can use right now, you can shut the gently caress up and stand aside.
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Jul 31, 2017 10:33
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Ah, we have entered the AND YOU ARE LYNCHING NEGROES phase of tankie shitposting. Tankies never change.
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Jul 31, 2017 11:10
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The anti-anti-PSUV posters should probably sit down and establish a clear argument that a new government must be both* rightist and authoritarian, since that's the fundamental disagreement underlying the shouting match. Vague appeals to the CIA or the existence of violent groups among the opposition aren't sufficient. *you need both, because otherwise an obvious anti-PSUV proposal is to soak a short-lived right-wing government as a step to a different left government that isn't trying to abrogate democracy
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Jul 31, 2017 11:27
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I also find it really hard to believe that even a noticeable minority of the protestors are "right-wing". Nor, I imagine, are they "left-wing". They're not fighting for some loving ideology, even the ones using "IEDs" to attack the government's armed forces. They just want the government to collapse. Maybe some of the MUD's politicians are genuinely right wing (but certainly not a majority), but I am especially incredulous that one could pick up any right-wing expressions from the people on the streets. For that dude claiming to be a VICE reporter, how about giving us some pictures or proof of that, that you're not completely making poo poo up to fit your illusionary narrative? Post some of your own photographs. Edit: Lol, I did a search and see that it was a "joke" that you were a Vice reporter and were on the ground. So actually you don't know a loving thing about Venezuela and have never been there and are unwilling to listen to those who have spent their entire lives there. Not every aspect of Something Awful is a comedy thread. Thug Lessons posted:Yes. I'm a Vice reporter embedded in the right-wing paramilitary units who are setting IEDs to blow up cops, and I can assure you they're great people who will do an even greater job governing the country. Yeah what a great joke dude. Hilarious. Saladman fucked around with this message at 11:40 on Jul 31, 2017 |
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Jul 31, 2017 11:31
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