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Magic Hate Ball posted:The revelation that he wasn't going to tell her what she said was one of the best moments in the whole season so far. I don't mind the scene all that much. That part fell entirely flat for me, though. I didn't care what that phone call was about in the first place. So, when it turned out that we weren't going to find out, I was just like: "That's fine."
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Aug 2, 2017 22:13
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Your Parents posted:It's the New Fat Trout Trailer Park, in Twin Peaks. His old one was in Deer Meadow. Oh I didn't notice the New on the sign I was going to joke that he followed the pole to Twin Peaks but that is actually possible 
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Aug 2, 2017 22:23
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Mover posted:Carl is the main character this season, just no one has realized it yet its chad
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Aug 2, 2017 22:55
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In s3e18 the audience is going to be startled in the final act when Chad leaps forward with the magical green ring he got from Richard, who is actually the reborn Chet Desmond finally lifted from his vexing Black Lodge curse just in time, and vanquishes Bad Coop, push broom in hand, at the Roadhouse in front of all the townsfolk there for the St Vincent concert. "Don't worry everyone," he yells out as he removes the fake beard he had been wearing all along. "I'm with the FBI."
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Aug 2, 2017 23:02
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In the end Cooper is going to be sent back to Twin Peaks and get immediately mowed down by Richard, who turns to the camera and says "Not again!"
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Aug 2, 2017 23:13
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I would not be surprised if the entire Vegas storyline turns out to ultimately be one long shaggy dog story with no distinct meaning underneath One of the reasons I think this is the way people treat Dougie/Coop, merely reading into him what they want to read into him. It's not exactly new territory though I mean Peter Sellers/Being There was like ~35 years ago or something. So I'm kinda hoping Lynch really does have some sort of novel spin on all of this. Maybe it's because I want to recapture what the first couple episodes felt like, but I'm more than ready to start making some deeper journeys into the "other" world, like in Episode 8. One of the things I like about Episode 8 is that its existence would seem to imply that we WILL be seeing more of The Giant/Fireman, and we WILL be seeing more of... I think you say, Convenience Store? That would be good. I also really believe that at this point, Cooper will be (to some degree) himself before the final 2 episodes, and that he'll reunite with Gordon and Albert (or one or the other) before the final payoff. Why? Because Mark Frost is still the co-writer, and because despite its more experimental moments, Twin Peaks has ALWAYS shown respect for its simple character beats. And I just... Don't think you can call it a wrap without a scene like that.
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Aug 3, 2017 00:29
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OldMemes posted:Some of the subplots seem like they're little slice of life vingettes - Nadine watching Jacoby rvae like a madman probably has no relevance to the plot, it's just funny. Not every single moment has to be some part of the Black and White Lodge battle. In the Log Lady Intros, they introduce the town of 'being full of stories, some funny, some sad'. Like in the original series, did the pine weasal subplot advance the main narrative? Not really, but it gave us some nice character moments and some funny bits. I'm getting pretty bored of the defence of the Audrey scene consisting entirely of posts like this. Guess what? I have loving loved so many of the little vignettes on the show. And I don't think every moment has to be part of the Black and White Lodge battle. But that scene is, to me and many others who have been completely on board so far, a huge swing and a miss. And I think it says a LOT that the majority of people defending it (or actively calling it a great scene) are the holier-than-thou "oh most TV is far too stupid for me!!!!" types, or those who feel they have to explain the show to people who have been watching and loving it the whole time. Intellectualising the reasons behind it doesn't stop it from being by far the biggest drag of the season so far.
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Aug 3, 2017 00:35
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kaworu posted:I would not be surprised if the entire Vegas storyline turns out to ultimately be one long shaggy dog story with no distinct meaning underneath I want it to be this. If Cooper recovers from Dougie he just says Cooper: "well thanks fellas, but I've got to be going." Bradley Mitchum: "But Dougie! We were going to have Candie bring over some pie!" Cooper: "Maybe next time! Bradley. Rodney." Mitchums: "See ya Dougie." Bradley: "Oh Dougie... one more thing. Knock em dead champ." Cooper: 
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Aug 3, 2017 00:35
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How funny is it gonna be if Coop actually does come back in ep 15 tho
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Aug 3, 2017 00:38
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I'm gonna place my bets on end of episode 16, so the last two hours is Coop doing deep Lodge diving and battling his Danzig.
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Aug 3, 2017 00:41
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Cooper isn't coming back. The FBI will eventually find him but he will spend the rest of his life in an assisted living facility.
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Aug 3, 2017 00:46
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I cannot decide which image I like more: - Booper fighting against Cooper in a climactic showdown between clones a la every cheesy 80s action sci fi Cannon Films movie - Booper fighting against Dougie in a climactic showdown between clones a la every cheesy 80s action sci fi Cannon Films movie
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Aug 3, 2017 00:48
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Magic Hate Ball posted:Same, to a massive degree. I know that my not really liking television is a major divergence point between me, and many people who arent liking where this is going. Has come up online and in person frequently. Doesn't mean much, outside of extremely different expectations I guess.
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Aug 3, 2017 00:49
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head58 posted:He was so sleepy! He has a deadline!
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Aug 3, 2017 01:00
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Just because a given scene doesn't really advance the plot doesn't necessarily mean it's wasting time... but some of the scenes do still waste time. I loved the prostitute scene this episode just because it was pretty entertaining. Just watching Albert scowling at Gordon drooling all over the girl, then having that long pause end with Gordon saying, "Albert, sometimes I really worry about you." was pretty hilarious. I also liked all the Nadine/Dr. Amp scenes, the Lucy/Andy chair argument, etc. even though those scenes had zero plot advancement. They were entertaining. But the Audrey scene was terrible and a gigantic waste of time (seriously, it went on waaaaaay too long) and wasting time isn't a luxury the show has at this point. There's only six episodes left. Some people are talking like six hours is some huge, seemingly infinite, stretch of time ("THREE WHOLE MOVIES!!!") when it's barely any time at all to finish up a story of this length. I love David Lynch too but handwaving away poor decisions on his part and insisting that, by definition, the decisions can't be poor since he's the one who made them is weird. There are bad, time wasting scenes and people have the right to be irritated by them. The Audrey scene ruined what was otherwise shaping up to be a decent episode.
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Aug 3, 2017 01:03
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^^^^^ 100% agreed.
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Aug 3, 2017 01:05
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I'm treating this show like a roller coaster, so the scene with the gunshots at the diner and the Audrey scene both stand high in my esteem as I just like to watch this show without analysing the poo poo out of it and just sit in whatever's happening and enjoy whatever the feeling is in the scene.
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Aug 3, 2017 01:09
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wa27 posted:Cooper isn't coming back. The FBI will eventually find him but he will spend the rest of his life in an assisted living facility. The funny thing is, Cooper may never have really ever left. After all, a man who looks identical to him and DOES claim to have been working undercover for the FBI has been around this whole time. I come back to the echoing question of "Is it future? Or is it past?" I always got the sense that both Mike and The Arm used it mockingly - but then most everything they seem to say to Cooper is somewhat mocking, like he (and by extension us) are not 'getting it' at all. We *know* that there is time fuckery... It was central to FWWM and those pages were not revealed until THIS season. I feel obliged to mention that there's one last page we have yet to see from her diary. I don't think THAT is a thread Lynch will leave hanging.
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Aug 3, 2017 01:11
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As someone who recently mentioned that we have three movies worth of TV left in this season, I will also admit that I am watching this because I want to see David Lynch's Twin Peaks season 3. Whatever it looks like at the end of the run, I am happy that we are getting just that. I don't think David Lynch is wasting time, trolling, or whatever, I think he is making the show he wanted to make, give or take a few actors. That said, there would be nothing more Twin Peaks, or Soap Opera, than ending on a cliffhanger.
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Aug 3, 2017 01:14
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Boy of Joy posted:Chiming in to say this season has been infinitely rewatchable. I've watched most of them at least 4 times (often rewatching them with different friends who are seeing the new season for the first time). Maybe I'm too much of a Lynch fanboy but this is some of the best television I've seen in a long, long time; there's nothing else quite like it. This is mostly how I feel. I didn't like e10 when it came on but it had a great followup that made it better. I rewatched the first few episodes this past weekend and they were way better than I thought the first time through. So this past episode is the only one at this point I straight up didn't like.
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Aug 3, 2017 01:15
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Escobarbarian posted:I'm getting pretty bored of the defence of the Audrey scene consisting entirely of posts like this. Guess what? I have loving loved so many of the little vignettes on the show. And I don't think every moment has to be part of the Black and White Lodge battle. But that scene is, to me and many others who have been completely on board so far, a huge swing and a miss. And I think it says a LOT that the majority of people defending it (or actively calling it a great scene) are the holier-than-thou "oh most TV is far too stupid for me!!!!" types, or those who feel they have to explain the show to people who have been watching and loving it the whole time. Intellectualising the reasons behind it doesn't stop it from being by far the biggest drag of the season so far. I didn't like the Audrey scene, it killed the momentum of the episode and ended it on a sour note.
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Aug 3, 2017 01:18
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...! posted:Just because a given scene doesn't really advance the plot doesn't necessarily mean it's wasting time... but some of the scenes do still waste time. I suppose I feel frustrated by people ragging on the Audrey scene because to me, it smacks of impatience. It seems like the same people complained about the Green Onions scene. It's annoying to me because I feel as if people are ragging on scenes like these not because they are good or bad, but simply because "they take too long" or because "they waste time" or because "nothing really happened of importance". I don't feel like words like that have any place in serious art criticism, whether it' a film, a piece of music, a painting, or a structure of some sort. I just don't feel that it is serious criteria, because there is a difference between art and entertainment. Twin Peaks skirts that line, so it's not really surprising that it comes up, but still. For what it's worth, I do think it's a very worthwhile question that deserves exploration. Twin Peaks explores extremely dark, dead-serious themes (especially in FWWM) and therefore I always felt like it qualified - at least certain parts of the series, FWWM, and Season 3 do, at any rate. At the time, back then, this was quite groundbreaking, frankly. And it's just something that David Lynch does, too, sometimes to better effect than other times. When Inland Empire was released, it definitely caused people to really stop and go "Am I watching something that is designed to even be an entertainment at all?" or "Is this even meant to be taken seriously?" and you just have to put your faith in what you're watching and hope it's rewarded. I don't think Twin Peaks: The Return is an entirely different piece from Inland Empire in this regard, in that it does have its audience questioning just what can or should belong in "an episodic television series" in the first place. Now, I really LIKE the scenes that cause me to think "Is this a waste of time...?" or "Is this even entertaining at all, does it even belong here?" because I know that at those moments my tastes and my preconceived notions of how a TV show ought to proceed are being challenged. And I feel I do know the difference between something that is outright bad and something that is good and different. Not everything Lynch does is good and different, and he's made plenty of film/art that I dislike. But this is not one of them, and I strongly feel like Lynch and his team have been really on their game during this series. I've felt that was from the start, and that feeling has not wavered at all in the slightest. I almost think the fact that we're discussing the Audrey scene so much validates its meaning and worth, to a degree. I, for one, can't get over how profoundly sad and melancholy the scene was on second viewing. The way Audrey is dressed, how much makeup she is wearing... The degree to which she just wants to go out and the fact that we haven't seen her until now. The husband, the missing lover, the obviously sad and dysfunctional life she's leading... I just can't for the life of me understand how this is a bad scene, at all. It's a goddamn profound scene, otherwise we'd just be ignoring it like so many other scenes where not much has happened in this series which did not seem to ruffle any feathers. kaworu fucked around with this message at 01:48 on Aug 3, 2017 |
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Aug 3, 2017 01:43
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kaworu posted:I suppose I feel frustrated by people ragging on the Audrey scene because to me, it smacks of impatience. It seems like the same people complained about the Green Onions scene. It's annoying to me because I feel as if people are ragging on scenes like these not because they are good or bad, but simply because "they take too long" or because "they waste time" or because "nothing really happened of importance". You should not take it personally when people don't like a scene you liked. People have stated reasons beyond what you're simplifying to here.
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Aug 3, 2017 01:57
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A True Jar Jar Fan posted:You should not take it personally when people don't like a scene you liked. People have stated reasons beyond what you're simplifying to here. I don't take it personally, and I didn't mean to strawman their arguments. I feel like I go into a broad exploration of my feelings on the subject later on. I just find myself frustrated by the fact that every criticism of the scene includes either a reference to its length, or to it "killing momentum", or something similar that essentially amounts to the same thing - among other valid criticisms, sometimes, yes. But to me, I felt like the scene was rich with details and things going on, honestly.
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Aug 3, 2017 02:02
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A True Jar Jar Fan posted:You should not take it personally when people don't like a scene you liked. People have stated reasons beyond what you're simplifying to here. I honestly don't feel that strongly about the scene but a lot of people have made the arguments kaworu mentioned, and sometimes the arguments have boiled down to "it's just not possible that anybody REALLY liked it because it was just so bad"  To me it was much like a lot of other Lynch, I was reminded a lot of Inland Empire and Mulholland Drive. I get that it's not for everybody but I wonder how anybody can make it this far in to Twin Peaks and then be upset by this scene in particular and not the numerous other scenes that play out similarly.
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Aug 3, 2017 02:48
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Which scenes do you think are most similar to this one? I thought the Cole/French lady scene had a similar style of having an annoyed character waiting on something that just would not end, but Albert sold it so well that it worked great. The tone was totally different, but it "wasted" time in a very similar way. One scene really worked for me, the other did not. A True Jar Jar Fan fucked around with this message at 02:58 on Aug 3, 2017 |
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Aug 3, 2017 02:55
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A True Jar Jar Fan posted:Which scenes do you think are most similar to this one? You don't think Lynch could have been making a point by putting those two scenes side by side, one involving a statuesque young dark-haired woman wearing red and acting pleasant, and the other involving a more curvy older dark-haired woman wearing red and acting unpleasant, and both being.... "time-wasting" from a perspective?
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Aug 3, 2017 03:14
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I absolutely think he's making a point with every scene. That doesn't mean every scene is good. Albert and Audrey are connected by the scenes being juxtaposed, both playing very similar roles. I absolutely felt Albert's frustration and connected to it, and it made the scene funnier. I didn't connect with Audrey in a similar way at all and felt that her acting brought me out of the show, rather than bringing me further into it. People are comparing this with parts of Inland Empire and I think that's valid, but what makes Inland Empire effective for me is Laura Dern acting the hell out of her scenes. A True Jar Jar Fan fucked around with this message at 03:24 on Aug 3, 2017 |
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Aug 3, 2017 03:20
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In all honesty the only scene I can think of that I disliked so far in season 3 was when Bobby sees Laura's picture. I didn't think Dana Ashbrook did a particular good job performing barely restrained grief. Since then I've been blown away by every scene he has been in however, and think he's done great (and his reaction to his mother's message from his dad was particularly well done) so I wonder how I'd feel about the Laura's picture scene on a rewatch.
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Aug 3, 2017 03:32
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I enjoyed the Audrey scene.
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Aug 3, 2017 03:34
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The only part I didn't like so far was the week where we didn't get an episode.
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Aug 3, 2017 03:35
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remusclaw posted:The only part I didn't like so far was the week where we didn't get an episode. 
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Aug 3, 2017 03:37
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All I know is I'd watch a shitload of Dana Ashbrook in other stuff after this. Seeing him play an adult that doesn't require a near constant psychotic expression is great and his face is really emotive. I've watched him staring down that kid about four times and I just smile and smile.
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Aug 3, 2017 03:45
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Jerusalem posted:In all honesty the only scene I can think of that I disliked so far in season 3 was when Bobby sees Laura's picture. I didn't think Dana Ashbrook did a particular good job performing barely restrained grief. Zmej fucked around with this message at 03:57 on Aug 3, 2017 |
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Aug 3, 2017 03:48
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Only a few are coming to mind at the moment. - Jerry discusses research and development with Ben - Random people gossip at the bar - Andy and Lucy discuss buying a chair - Lucy discusses the thermostat with Truman - Wally/Truman - Guy sweeps up the bar None of these scenes really advanced the story and sometimes they mentioned inconsequential names. A True Jar Jar Fan posted:The tone was totally different, but it "wasted" time in a very similar way. One scene really worked for me, the other did not. I guess my question is why one is "good" and the other "bad" then.
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Aug 3, 2017 03:49
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Fenn has been in Shameless for a while and was recently in a few Ray Donovan episodes and her acting was fine. Everything bad about the scene is due to Lynch, who has the uncanny ability to make a good actor seem bad intentionally. In conjunction with his weird ideas, it often works, but sometimes it doesn't. Also, I'm pretty sure that Audrey's husband is the guy who helped Michael Madsen bury the bride in Kill Bill. He's 
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Aug 3, 2017 03:50
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MonoAus posted:Only a few are coming to mind at the moment. I'm kind of 50/50 on the bar scenes but I like the rest of those. I've found every Lucy/Andy scene funny and absolutely loved Michael Cera's awful Brando impression. Every Ben scene has felt compelling too. I watch Lynch for the gut feeling his work gives, because at his best I don't think anyone else comes close. I don't care if a scene doesn't progress the story and I'm honestly not very interested in exploring Lodge mythology. That I felt more watching the dude sweep the bar than Audrey's return feels really wrong, and I wish I could get more out of it.
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Aug 3, 2017 03:58
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I thought the new season was really strong up to and including the episode with the atomic bomb sequence. From that point on, it feels like a lot of the momentum has run out of the main plot lines. When Twin Peaks was at its best, it felt like all of the plot threads were converging full force around a single intriguing main storyline. In the original series, at least in the beginning, all of the disparate events surrounding the various citizens of the town seemed to revolve around the "golden goose" that was the Laura Palmer mystery. Otherwise uninteresting characters were made more interesting because we were seeing how they reacted to the shockwaves that rippled through the town in the wake of Laura's murder. All of the minor stories were essentially focused through one main overarching story and when those small threads advanced, so did the overall story. Of course, when the mystery of Laura's murder was solved, the show lost a lot of the focus that made the happenings of minor characters interesting. The last chunk of the original series is unenjoyable because it killed the "golden goose," the storyline that focused all of the other plots and gave them meaning and momentum. The new "golden goose" is the story of how Cooper regains his old self and how this conflicts with the evil Coop. When this storyline isn't being moved forward, the show feels slow and boring. When characters and plot threads do not contribute to this storyline, the show feels uninteresting. My point is that the last few episodes lack focus and are giving me a late season 2 vibe. Also, it seems logically impossible to criticize David Lynch for some of you. Anything that might be considered unacceptable in other works is hand waved away as being part of Lynch's grand design. If a scene is boring it's apparently because it's supposed to make you feel bored. Can't the scene just be boring and self-indulgent? Can't Lynch gently caress up sometimes?
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Aug 3, 2017 04:12
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OldMemes posted:Some of the subplots seem like they're little slice of life vingettes - Nadine watching Jacoby rvae like a madman probably has no relevance to the plot, it's just funny. The Dr. Amp scenes might not push the plot further (if we take the plot, as in the story arc of the narrative, to be "Will the FBI uncover the secret behind the alternate dimension that has separated Cooper into two split selves, and will he be able to return to his true self?"), but I absolutely think they do a lot of thematic work. His radio show scenes are super visually loaded--old technology mixed with new, patriotic imagery, and electricity is so central that it's in the name of his show. The stuff he rants about is always related to what's happening in the show--people eating manufactured things that are bad for them (Bad Cooper literally stuffs a bag of Cheetos in his pocket) and hints that his listeners should "read in between the lines." A lot of the characters in this show are sick or being mistreated by people more powerful than themselves, and that's what he spends most of his time ranting about. It's also pretty economical, because while he's ranting you can get scenes with Jerry or Nadine. Nadine will almost certainly never be "plot central," but she's another interesting example of the show's running theme of examining how people change or fail to change over time, especially people in bad relationships. You can definitely think of the Dr. Amp scenes as a "show within a show," which as a device usually works as something of a funhouse mirror pointing at the work it appears in, reflecting certain elements in distorted proportions. Thinking along these lines, I guess I never realized that Dr. Amp is season 3's equivalent to Invitation to Love. 
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Aug 3, 2017 04:37
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The Audrey scene is pretty specifically about antagonization, it's like an angry little Beckett play.
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Aug 3, 2017 04:41
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