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Wheat Loaf posted:I'm not well-up on the old Hollywood accounting but is it possible at the moment that Homecoming will fall short of ASM 2's worldwide box office total? Unlikely. It's only 4 weeks in, probably make about half of what it needs in the US and hasn't opened in China.
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Aug 7, 2017 22:51
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Oh, I see, I hadn't realised it's not out in China yet. That's gonna count.
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Aug 7, 2017 22:54
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Plus it was cheaper to make than ASM2, by anything from $25m to $115m(!)
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Aug 7, 2017 22:57
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Rhyno posted:Didn't it piss off the Russo's? Like, they had a Hawkeye/BW thing planned and they were kind of blindsided by it? I've never heard that at all. And like, the only thing Hawkeye would have done in anything Russo related prior to AoU was for Cap to beat him up in a scene in The Winter Soldier.
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Aug 7, 2017 22:59
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Lurdiak posted:The Black Widow/Hulk romance was such a baffling misstep. The two of them just had no chemistry together whatsoever.
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Aug 7, 2017 22:59
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I think I just got sick of Joss's writing and directing which is why I rank AOU pretty low
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Aug 7, 2017 23:08
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I generally like Whedon well enough, but the way nerds on the Internet make him out to be the ultimate god of writing is hellishly aggravating. He's good, but only by pulp standards, really, and even within that field there's writers in various media I'd be inclined rank higher than him. (That TV Tropes started off as a Whedon fansite and I find TV Tropes really annoying probably has something to do with it as well.)
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Aug 7, 2017 23:10
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Lurdiak posted:The Black Widow/Hulk romance was such a baffling misstep. Can't be said enough.
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Aug 7, 2017 23:11
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The good parts of AOU: Ultron Vision The Maximoff Twins and Ultron dynamic The trying to lift Mjolnir scene The set up it does for Civil War Hawkeye's stuff The bad parts of AOU: Natasha/Bruce romance Traditionally Jewish/Romani characters volunteering to be experimented on by Nazis even unknowingly is... ehhhh... "Language" I see what they were going with for Pietro's death but it lands with a dull thud
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Aug 7, 2017 23:18
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TFRazorsaw posted:The bad parts of AOU: "Thor... You're... bothering me."
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Aug 7, 2017 23:21
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It was a disaster of a movie. Not only was the Bulk romance terrible (and that's even disregarding that very weirdly phrased "Can't have a kid so I'm a monster" thing), the siblings animosity to Stark is dumb, Quicksilvers death has no impact, and the movies antagonists are, once again, faceless drones that are easily disposable. Apparently so fragile that even bow and arrow can destroy them no problem. And while Ultron certainly sounds menacing, this is undercut when he is having a hard time dealing with a guy on steroids with a fancy shield, not to mention his confused speeches. And even Tony's part makes little sense. He wants to create a second AI, despite that being what hosed everything up in the first place, and they're making this a big deal, except loving Thor just pops in and anticlimactically just jams a gem into Vision. It's just baffling from a thematic point of view. Just keep screwing up, and one day your gently caress ups will cancel each other out,I guess? And the stupid "This is what Shield is supposed to be!" bit was also nonsensical drivel. It's just garbage, from start to finish.
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Aug 7, 2017 23:24
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Now I want Scarlett Johansen's Black Widow to be in a romantic relationship with Paul Schrier's Bulk.
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Aug 7, 2017 23:27
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Nah it's fine
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Aug 7, 2017 23:27
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Thor hit the android with lightning, the gem was already in Vision's head.
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Aug 7, 2017 23:29
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McCloud posted:the Bulk 
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Aug 7, 2017 23:41
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Lurdiak posted:The Black Widow/Hulk romance was such a baffling misstep. JT Smiley posted:The two of them just had no chemistry together whatsoever. Strong disagree. achillesforever6 posted:I think I just got sick of Joss's writing and directing which is why I rank AOU pretty low This I get. I love all Marvel Studios movies but neither Avengers movie stands up next to Captain America 2 and 3 or either Guardians of the Galaxy which makes me happy those directors are set to inherit the universe.
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Aug 7, 2017 23:57
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The Black Widow/Banner pairing didn't bother me too much, because it was pretty understated. It came off more as Widow being Hulk's handler and intimacy arising from that, rather than "These two are loving. We will now have multiple scenes hitting you over the head with how much they are loving."
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Aug 8, 2017 00:10
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IT also had the added bonus of Jeremy Renner calling the black widow character a slut for loving everyone in the Avengers, which I thought was rather charming of him.
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Aug 8, 2017 00:14
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I mean yeah I don't think AoU was some sort of loving masterpiece or a classic by any stretch but the backlash to it is hard for me to figure out. It seemed about on par with the first one and I recall being entertained by it. For some reason, Civil War took me three tries to get all the way through though. I think CW was the beginning of my "getting tired of comic book movies overall" phase and the first time I wasn't in a rush to see a new one. There's too many of them for my taste. Obviously the world disagrees so I'm hardly a barometer or the final arbiter of these things.
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Aug 8, 2017 00:27
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I don't think the MCU had any bad movies so far, but AoU definitely lands on the "Forgettable" section, with both Thors and maybe Incredible Hulk. Civil War was a better Avengers 2 than it, IMO.
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Aug 8, 2017 00:34
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BiggerBoat posted:I mean yeah I don't think AoU was some sort of loving masterpiece or a classic by any stretch but the backlash to it is hard for me to figure out. It seemed about on par with the first one and I recall being entertained by it. For some reason, Civil War took me three tries to get all the way through though. It's not backlash, it wasn't well received on day one.
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Aug 8, 2017 00:36
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Rhyno posted:Didn't it piss off the Russo's? Like, they had a Hawkeye/BW thing planned and they were kind of blindsided by it? She had the arrow pendant in Winter Soldier! They probably thought they were helping move that plot line along before Ultron happened. TFRazorsaw posted:The bad parts of AOU: What. McCloud posted:It was a disaster of a movie. Not only was the Bulk romance terrible (and that's even disregarding that very weirdly phrased "Can't have a kid so I'm a monster" thing), the siblings animosity to Stark is dumb, Quicksilvers death has no impact, and the movies antagonists are, once again, faceless drones that are easily disposable. Apparently so fragile that even bow and arrow can destroy them no problem. And while Ultron certainly sounds menacing, this is undercut when he is having a hard time dealing with a guy on steroids with a fancy shield, not to mention his confused speeches. What's dumb about their animosity towards Tony? Iron Man 1 was him going "Man, the weapons I develop are probably really bad for the poor saps that live in those war-torn countries." Then Wanda and Pietro are like "Hey, we live in a war-torn country." That's a solid callback. I feel like Hawkeye's arrows explode or release electricity or some other fantasy poo poo. He was hardly out there with wood, mate. You're very reductive in your analysis and it doesn't serve your point much. It's not just a fancy shield so much as made of literally the strongest things they have in that universe. Thor's intervention wasn't all that nonsensical to me. A discussion wasn't getting anywhere, so a 3rd party intervened. Thor had magic visions of the future, so he knew he was right. It plays pretty directly into Civil War. Turns out our Avengers might not always like each other. I think the point is meant to be that making a mistake should not keep you from continuing to try. Tony built a robot and it went bad. That shouldn't mean he's never allowed to build another robot. It should mean he practices caution and critical thinking before impulsively making decisions is Cap's POV I believe. And Wanda backs him up with the assertion that Tony might be so hellbent on saving everything that he's gonna end up breaking everything. More Civil War.
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Aug 8, 2017 00:38
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SonicRulez posted:Thor had magic visions of the future Chalk that up on the "Bad" Even Whedon hated that bit, didn't he?
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Aug 8, 2017 00:44
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the idea that a villain's inability to kill captain america undercuts them baffles me
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Aug 8, 2017 00:45
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Aphrodite posted:It's not backlash, it wasn't well received on day one. If you say so. https://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/avengers_age_of_ultron/ 7/10 seems about right to me.
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Aug 8, 2017 00:50
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7/10 is not a good movie.
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Aug 8, 2017 00:54
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Aphrodite posted:7/10 is not a good movie. If I give a movie a 7/10 it means I generally liked it well enough and didn't think it sucked but I'm not gonna argue about it.
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Aug 8, 2017 01:19
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What's odd to me is that the MCU movies really nail some of the duo relationships (Cap and Widow, Cap and Falcon, Tony and Rhodey, etc) but the group as a whole doesn't mesh well. I don't know if that's Whedon's direction or just the overstuffed nature of the Avengers films, but it comes away feeling forced. It's partly why my expectations for Infinity War are so low, even though Whedon has nothing to do with that film.
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Aug 8, 2017 01:21
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Samuringa posted:Chalk that up on the "Bad" I thought he hated how much of Thor's Journey into Mystery got cut.
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Aug 8, 2017 02:21
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Doctor Spaceman posted:I thought he hated how much of Thor's Journey into Mystery got cut. Didn't Hiddleston have a cameo?
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Aug 8, 2017 02:47
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McCloud posted:And the stupid "This is what Shield is supposed to be!" bit was also nonsensical drivel.
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Aug 8, 2017 03:00
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Honest question, how many marvel movies end with somebody flying into a giant sky portal? Off the top of my head, Avengers, Thor 2 and Mr. Strange
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Aug 8, 2017 03:09
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Aphrodite posted:7/10 is not a good movie. I don't really think movies, even comic book movies, operate on the same scale of review scoring as video games. Genuinely lovely movies get genuinely lovely review scores, film critics and even aggregators aren't afraid to break out the Forbidden Numbers. Re: Black Widow and Hulk, the way it was handled in the movie was a swing and a miss but I don't dislike the idea in the abstract, however I have to say that I actually think that having Hawkeye be this guy with a normal wife and kids appeals to me more than a prospective BW/Hawkeye romance. Like, to me it helps reinforce the idea that Hawkeye is the most grounded dude in the bunch, just a guy doing his job, and his home life is also the most normal and most functional out of anyone's. Plus I like it when sometimes fictional characters are just really good buds, I think that dynamic works better for Black Widow and Hawkeye than a romance would imo.
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Aug 8, 2017 03:32
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Movies still frequently use 4 star scales, where a 3 or 75% is "okay".
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Aug 8, 2017 03:37
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actually if it isn't perfect it's trash 
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Aug 8, 2017 03:46
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Hawkeye's story in AoU forever ruined the chances of us getting a Hawkguy solo film/series and I'll forever resent it for that
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Aug 8, 2017 03:47
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Sockser posted:Hawkeye's story in AoU forever ruined the chances of us getting a Hawkguy solo film/series and I'll forever resent it for that The actual travesty is that we're never going to get a Black Widow movie.
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Aug 8, 2017 04:00
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Sockser posted:Hawkeye's story in AoU forever ruined the chances of us getting a Hawkguy solo film/series and I'll forever resent it for that ... why? what exactly about finding out he has a family means he can't get a movie?
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Aug 8, 2017 04:09
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TFRazorsaw posted:... why? It's not that there can't be a Hawkeye movie, it's that there can't be a Hawkguy movie. Hawkguy is a fuckup, and AoU Hawkeye has got his poo poo together and is a more well-adjusted person than almost all of the Avengers.
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Aug 8, 2017 04:15
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I'm okay with that, to be honest. But then, I liked Hawkeye before Matt Fraction's run so I'm not really gunning for that to be treated like it's the whole of his character.
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Aug 8, 2017 04:17
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