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Maybe they're ditching temperature effects in the game and just having areas where isHot=1 or something? I dunno that does sound like a dumb thing to get rid of.
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Aug 13, 2017 19:48
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For a while, it seemed like they were going to build into extreme cold/heat environments as another management tool, but the only places that really effect you already have bright, smoldering lava to warn you.
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Aug 13, 2017 19:49
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Plek posted:Maybe they're ditching temperature effects in the game and just having areas where isHot=1 or something? I dunno that does sound like a dumb thing to get rid of. Well, the Vehicles still have their thermomoters. And higher/lower temperatures are a big deal for people claiming "You were probably somewhere only 40 degrees, I bet that's why your thermal reactor isn't recharging fast" when you said you were parked outside of the Containment facility built by a lake of lava. On that note. Devs listed in the trello they buffed the Cyclops thermal reactor efficiency by +50% Oh boy! Ion Power cells would take literally 50 minutes to recharge. With your cyclops parked. With the engines off. And no energy sucking larva. over a lake of lava. So any improvement is-Oh wait, they got it backwards. It will take roughly 300 minutes of ramming your Cyclops dick first into hot lava and not using it for anything to recharge now. Yes there are players who defend even the 50 minute not using your cyclops is great, because literally any amount of "Free energy" resembles QoL slightly, which fucks with peoples heads for some reason in gaming. It's so strange watching people say abandoning your cyclops for an hour is good gamplay, in the same post as claiming you're just exaggerating how you could walk to the precursor containment facility and backa gain with a stack of fresh ion crystals before it finishes recharging  Abandoning your cyclops is GREAT! Unless saying so makes the Cyclops look bad, I guess.The increasing pile of  as Launch (for realsies this time) approaches would be far less frustrating, if not for how much of an honest to god good cool game is still here in spite of them.EDIT: Today I learned the exact amount of VR players for Subnaitica is "Less than 0.1%", according to the Devs. It's okay you still can't see your Oxygen meter in your Vive headset, guys. Section Z fucked around with this message at 20:02 on Aug 13, 2017 |
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Aug 13, 2017 19:53
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Wow. Buying a complete license is not a problem if your company exists in a country with normal IP law (aka not Russia/China). They cant hide behind that. It's six-figure expensive sure, but it is a very normal thing to do for a AAA studio. Subnautica's clipping issues has nothing to do with that. Or the geometry of the map for that matter. I'm not entirely sure of the solutions used, but, making assumptions: The Sea Satan is this long, articulated thing, and uses a simplistic collision geometry like everything else to save on physics calculations. Evidently that collision box isn't set up properly for the engine to stop that bastard from going through. You could solve it by just using a gently caress of big box, writing different spawn code that doesn't just spawn completely new loving creatures all the loving time (instead, f.ex., you could remember positions and make creatures static when outside player vicinity), or if you brute force it, make the big ones spawn with different code, checking against a premade table of co-ordinates that says 'not below this depth, because that's the sea floor' (aka A MAP). I think they said that they don't use a premade map but generate it in-engine instead at launch, and I can see how that would make it tricky to write a spawn system if there's no game file to check valid locations against (still, you could fix that with a table of coordinates with maximum spawn depth at that grid point). They've either hosed up the spawn code, hosed up the map generation leaving holes in the collision geometry, or they take things offline at unfortunate distances meaning there might not be geometry for the reapers to collide with in the first place. You don't need source if you modify your design. This isn't rocket science.
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Aug 13, 2017 20:57
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man this game had such potential but it is seeming more and more like the devs are just gutter trash and that potential will never be realized at all. maybe we'll at least get some good tell-all posts online from people on the inside when this shitshow is over.
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Aug 13, 2017 21:00
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Unlike this game no man's sky was a disaster at launch but is actually improving considerably. This game only gets worse as time passes. No issues are fixed and the blame is shifted constantly.
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Aug 13, 2017 21:20
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Theres no way they are gonna have a 1.0 product by October LOL - Lolling On Land
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Aug 13, 2017 21:48
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Yeah they have really convinced me through developer comments and other poo poo at least one of their coders is an absolute moron. I dont have high hopes for things improving from a programming perspective. I really wonder if they had some sort of churn on the team because the code quality seemed way better back the beginning and thats also when they were tackling harder problems like advanced creature behaviour. Also have they given up on genetically modifying yourself and other creatures? I remember that was gonna be one of the big parts of the game at some point but have no idea whats going on with it. I suppose if it isnt in yet its not going in at all.
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Aug 13, 2017 21:53
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Dongattack posted:Theres no way they are gonna have a 1.0 product by October October? Try April. FrickenMoron posted:Unlike this game no man's sky was a disaster at launch but is actually improving considerably. This game only gets worse as time passes. No issues are fixed and the blame is shifted constantly. Subnautica has vastly improved in some aspects. The pace is just glacial. At this speed they'll hit 1.0 sometime 2020.
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Aug 13, 2017 21:54
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GlyphGryph posted:Also have they given up on genetically modifying yourself and other creatures? I remember that was gonna be one of the big parts of the game at some point but have no idea whats going on with it. I suppose if it isnt in yet its not going in at all. It's on the "Maybe after 1.0 list" like a lot of other features such as entire biomes, craftable teleporters, and a working clock. Which a Developer angrily clarified was the "Dumping grounds" list between closing other base attack threads that sprang up around the same time. I guess several players read the roadmap at the same time, saw "Base attacks" on that list, and got worried it would happen given Silent Running? Because people like to point to the roadmap as "Oh my god, why didn't you read this you moron?" as often as they complain when anybody actually reads the roadmap and expect it to mean anything. Serious talk. A mostly functioning well game at some point is a given. The problem is all the clownshoes baby's first videogame potholes marring it despite how often they like to drop sick burns of the "Where is YOUR game? I've been a developer over 10 years!" sort when major pathes and new players seeing the state of the game are on the upswing. Between grabbing softballs to say "SAND sharks don't attack the cyclops! Also don't call me a *****er, you *****er" in the 15th thread full of people bitching about bonesharks. There is the foundation of a great game here, a lot of it still holds up better than the average bog standard starving hobo simulator. But so much of this stuff they probably will never fix while crying that it's totally not their fault, is going to really hurt the game's launch potential. I mean, we are looking at an honest possibility they are going to end up as "Those devs who released the game with gigabyte sized save files", and their rebuttal will be screaming "They ONLY reach 500 megs tops now! And that's your fault for playing too long. Your hard drive can handle it and the Xbone is just too casual to handle cloud saves." And that's just honestly sad to think about, for what should have been the perfect scuba game. Rather than "80% of a perfect scuba game full of 20% falling face first down an escalator and blaming the fact escalators don't change direction to suit their needs" Section Z fucked around with this message at 22:09 on Aug 13, 2017 |
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Aug 13, 2017 21:57
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Also I have serious doubts how much post 1.0 dev work this game is actually gonna get.
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Aug 13, 2017 22:06
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What the gently caress is with you people?
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Aug 13, 2017 22:17
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It's just the anger phase of early access games. We're getting close to the just release it and cut our losses phase. The games pretty rad which is sad this is going to be the last early access game I'll put money into cause 90% have been total letdowns.
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Aug 13, 2017 22:31
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Invalid Validation posted:It's just the anger phase of early access games. We're getting close to the just release it and cut our losses phase. The games pretty rad which is sad this is going to be the last early access game I'll put money into cause 90% have been total letdowns. I've already got more fun out of it than I've got out of games triple its price (looking at you, Ubisoft). It's such a good target for anger because it could be great with just a little more competence and instead lands on "mediocre".
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Aug 13, 2017 22:33
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7c Nickel posted:What the gently caress is with you people? We're playing a game with 2 gig save files that copy/paste them over to ProgramData every time you load your game. How are you doing? I hope you are having a nice day.
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Aug 13, 2017 22:34
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They paid money for an unfinished potential dumpster fire. They've got the right to be pissed.
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Aug 13, 2017 22:46
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Shinjobi posted:They paid money for an unfinished potential dumpster fire. They've got the right to be pissed. If you're retarded enough to pre-order a game, that's what you get. Edit: With the state of the gaming industry in general, that's you get for buying any game.
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Aug 13, 2017 23:22
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I mean, I haven't bought the game but I see a lot of people defend developers when this topic comes up. In general, not just this thread. It's a mentality I just don't understand. While saying "It's early access, it has its risks" is certainly a valid point, this game in particular has gone from imperfect but fun survival story to occasionally fun technically clunky half-finished program, if fan reactions can be believed.
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Aug 14, 2017 00:02
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"Imperfect but fun survival story" is still all it feels like to me 
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Aug 14, 2017 00:13
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Shinjobi posted:They paid money for an unfinished potential dumpster fire. They've got the right to be pissed. Star Citizen?
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Aug 14, 2017 00:17
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Guys! I'm angry I paid money for this game that isn't even out yet and has no post-release reviews for me to base an opinion on but I swear I'm not an idiot for giving my money away to an unfinished game. The pre-order industrial complex.
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Aug 14, 2017 00:23
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In my case I was gifted it, and there are thousands of reviews saying it's still worth playing unfinished right now, but please do continue to pretend that somehow makes complaints about the game illegitimate
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Aug 14, 2017 00:33
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Digirat posted:In my case I was gifted it, and there are thousands of reviews saying it's still worth playing unfinished right now, but please do continue to pretend that somehow makes complaints about the game illegitimate Are... you complaining about something you got for free, really? It's not that the complaints are unjustified, people just look like idiots when they complain about an unfinished game... well, being unfinished.
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Aug 14, 2017 00:41
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Even if they just finish out the story mode and call it quits, I would still call it a good game brought down a bit by technical problems. People acting like this is a raging dumpster fire just baffle me. Especially since there are so many other examples of early access disasters to look at.
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Aug 14, 2017 00:50
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Thor-Stryker posted:Are... you complaining about something you got for free, really? Whether or not I was gifted something has nothing to do with how dumb it is that a subnautica dev accused a player who was reporting their experience of lying (to take one example out of many). There's a lot more to it than "complaining about an unfinished game being unfinished," and you know it. Nobody is complaining about the fact that some items have placeholder 3D models.
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Aug 14, 2017 00:53
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A year ago this was an early access game that was fairly finished, had working mechanics, good graphics (with some place holders), fun gameplay, but had some problems with pop-in, lag, spawning, and no ending. Now it feels less finished, several game mechanics have been updated to being less fun, the graphics don't have placeholders, and the devs and community have become hostile to people complaining about the pop-in, lag, spawning, and huge save files.
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Aug 14, 2017 01:01
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Thor-Stryker posted:Are... you complaining about something you got for free, really? I dunno man people attempting to call out people criticizing something they got for free is waaaayy more goofy. It's just a video game.
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Aug 14, 2017 01:14
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Personally I just find it baffling that the developers seem to be trying really hard to remove the fun from the game. It is a nice game and does some things you don't really get elsewhere but it has barely improved in the past year or so. They just keep faffing about making nonsensical changes while adding in some story content. For a game whose greatest strengths are atmosphere and visuals they seem rather unconcerned about lousy performance and very overly concerned with making you click the most amount of buttons and wait the longest possible to make sure you don't die of hunger or run out of submarine batteries. Like the initial development of the game added good things and now they just seem to have run in circles for a year doing little of substance and having no idea what they want the game to be. It's bizzare. The game isn't bad and I don't think I paid very much for it so I'm not feeling ripped off, but the devs are still idiots and don't seem to have learned anything from their previous game development which did basically the same thing. They have a good art director and an utter idiot with no sense of direction in charge of design, and another idiot with no sense of his own capabilities in charge of programming. OwlFancier fucked around with this message at 01:36 on Aug 14, 2017 |
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Aug 14, 2017 01:32
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For a bit of levity, in experimental they have finally made it so signals are just directly added to your PDA instead of turned into chips. They also erased the infamous "Second lifepod 3", the only lifepod in the game without a signal that is also where they stashed one out of two compas unlock boxes. But in the process seem to have shuffled the compass over to "Lifepod 3 with an actual signal" so new players will actually find it before they are already leaving their nuclear powered base to drive into the final zone of the game. Downsides, making do with the ghetto singular air tanks until you wiki up where the Ultra tank blueprint is. Good drat thing too, my latest test save puts my lifepod landing spot literally 700 meters away from lifepod 3, what with the randomized locations in the safe shallows. I doubt a new player would just stumble across that in short order from such a distance. Which just really highlights how much of a roll of the dice your starting position can be for gameplay flow. First I heard that lifepod was gone, I patched up my game, made a new save, and it was still there. So for once I assumed "I bet the devs didn't just outright erase something as notable as a lifepod". So of course I'm just an idiot who "Clearly didn't patch" because it's currently gone right now  OwlFancier posted:Personally I just find it baffling that the developers seem to be trying really hard to remove the fun from the game. It is a nice game and does some things you don't really get elsewhere but it has barely improved in the past year or so. They just keep faffing about making nonsensical changes while adding in some story content. Speaking of their art direction, I do hope the nice scuba dude model they made has the head exist anywhere but the advertisements. I know it's a first person game and all, but it feels like such a waste to not have that exist at any point of the gameplay experience. So hopefully "You are not a headless scuba man" makes it for launch. Section Z fucked around with this message at 03:26 on Aug 14, 2017 |
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Aug 14, 2017 03:16
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Thor-Stryker posted:Are... you complaining about something you got for free, really? I think he's pretty capable of having an opinion of the game's quality and direction regardless of if he personally paid for it. Zesty fucked around with this message at 07:20 on Aug 14, 2017 |
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Aug 14, 2017 03:32
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Section Z posted:Speaking of their art direction, I do hope the nice scuba dude model they made has the head exist anywhere but the advertisements. I know it's a first person game and all, but it feels like such a waste to not have that exist at any point of the gameplay experience. So hopefully "You are not a headless scuba man" makes it for launch. Build a camera room, put windows in it, enjoy your head in all its glory. 7c Nickel posted:Even if they just finish out the story mode and call it quits, I would still call it a good game brought down a bit by technical problems. People acting like this is a raging dumpster fire just baffle me. Especially since there are so many other examples of early access disasters to look at. No one with brains gets mad or disappointed over a raging dumpster fire. Those games exist to be mocked, but not to be sincerely hated. The fact that it's a good game but so close to being a better game is why people get upset about it. The potential is so obvious and, as others have mentioned, it often seems like the devs are faffing about instead of building on the games strengths. Their art guy is loving on point though and is definitely the strongest part of this game and I wish the art team was actually making more of the design decision because their game loop guys are... not good.
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Aug 14, 2017 03:35
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GlyphGryph posted:Build a camera room, put windows in it, enjoy your head in all its glory. Oh, do camera drones show your head? That's honestly nice to now, because the Free camera still shows you as a headless scuba man. Though "Their game devs are increasingly strange, but their art department is top notch" reminds me again about how they added Ghost Heat to the submarine 
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Aug 14, 2017 03:51
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Thor-Stryker posted:Are... you complaining about something you got for free, really? "If you bought the game, it's your fault and you shouldn't complain" "If you got the game for free, well you didn't pay money for it so you shouldn't complain" It's an ouroboros but instead of eating it's own tail, it's climbing up it's own rear end
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Aug 14, 2017 04:25
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I would be A OK with them just releasing the game as it stood last year, quite frankly. It's was a atmospheric swimming game worth at least 15$ already. But when the devs don't release and go on saying "we're making it betterer! No release till it's good!" at least I can't help thinking of what good-er would look like, and go "Nooo, you're making it worseeee" about the weird changes. Can't help being enticed or critical when the devs keep going. And when the the technical issues seems the most damaging but the team isn't pushing code alterations, you start questioning someones judgement. Why do they keep changing design goals? Focus god drat you! I feel like a toddler eating ice cream while being told grandpa's gonna to make it more fantastic, and then he mixes in old leaves. Like, why didn't grandpa just put more ice cream in. Do you understand what's wrong with us know?
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Aug 14, 2017 14:44
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ThisIsJohnWayne posted:I would be A OK with them just releasing the game as it stood last year, quite frankly. It's was a atmospheric swimming game worth at least 15$ already. But when the devs don't release and go on saying "we're making it betterer! No release till it's good!" at least I can't help thinking of what good-er would look like, and go "Nooo, you're making it worseeee" about the weird changes. Can't help being enticed or critical when the devs keep going. And when the the technical issues seems the most damaging but the team isn't pushing code alterations, you start questioning someones judgement. Why do they keep changing design goals? Focus god drat you! Take one step forward, one step to the side, one step backward and one step to the other side. Now you're doing the waffle about and are more or less ready to develop this game.
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Aug 14, 2017 21:54
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I played it for about a day and then quit for about a month and then came back. I had completely forgot how to do everything and it seemed very unfun to try to restart. I really liked it though.
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Aug 15, 2017 20:11
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Man, reading this thread has made me upset. I remember when I'd load the game to find a lot of updates to the game regularly, or when the devs found a "Why hunger mechanics in survival games tend to be bullshit" article and suggested they'd take the suggestions into account. What went so wrong? 
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Aug 15, 2017 20:43
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MisterBibs posted:Man, reading this thread has made me upset. I remember when I'd load the game to find a lot of updates to the game regularly, or when the devs found a "Why hunger mechanics in survival games tend to be bullshit" article and suggested they'd take the suggestions into account. They've hit a bit of a wall in development, I reckon. They're staring down release and they can't delay efficiency improvements any longer, but they're proving too difficult. They're reaching out for help to Unity and Nvidia and not getting responses. They can't call the game complete in its current state even once they implement the endgame they have planned - low framerate, pop-in and related bugs will kill the experience once they can't be forgiven on early access. While they're struggling with all this, players still expect content updates, but they can't implement whole new features (it's too late in development and it'll only make the efficiency tasks harder) so they overwork their existing ones with stuff like an overwrought damage system for the already unwieldy Cyclops, adding more content without necessarily considering what it adds to the gameplay. Meanwhile their core fans are crying out for more challenge, making judging good changes all the harder - they've already mastered everything the endgame will expect of you and are crying out for something harder to conquer, so adding more recipes to the mid-game or something won't satisfy. That's my guess at the situation, anyway.
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Aug 15, 2017 21:05
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I don't think they've taken any serious steps backwards except for the cyclops. Make no mistake I have a lot of bad to say about that, but I think it's generalizing too much to say the game has been getting worse over the last year. My frustration is more that in the year between my first and second stabs at the game, the performance wasn't improved at all, and then they revealed their grand vision for the cyclops (to make it really unfun and obnoxious) without a word about making the game actually run better than a slideshow on hard drives. So I don't think they're really making the game worse on a broad scale, despite their community doing their loving hardest to steer it that way. But their priorities have felt shockingly out of place, and now that they are focusing on performance, the fact that they need to hire people solely to work on optimization implies that they have dug themselves into some very deep dependency holes that they may not be able to get themselves out of by release. The game inside of the technical mess surrounding it is quite good, but there's a scary number of red flags here, and I don't think optimism is warranted right now
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Aug 15, 2017 21:15
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Tenebrais posted:so adding more recipes to the mid-game or something won't satisfy. Which is where 'We turned the laser cutter and the beacon into things you need to unlock with fragments" comes in! Because having a dozen diamonds before I can find a laser cutter fragment even with the wiki open adds... something I guess. Digirat posted:I don't think they've taken any serious steps backwards except for the cyclops. Make no mistake I have a lot of bad to say about that, but I think it's generalizing too much to say the game has been getting worse over the last year. Like the whole fact save files can still reach 2 gigs in size (promised to be fixed as usual)... But while still in that state, they made a deliberate decision to have the game stop and copy/paste your entire save to a temp folder in programdata when you load it. Because TECHNICALLY, that can (hopefully?) help in game performance, but it's at the cost of punching the game in the dick until it finishes the copy/paste. And it's a problem nobody will notice until well after the two hour refund limit, to go from smooth loading to "Not responding" for a while it transfers 2 gigs from your big ol standard hard drive the game is actually installed on, to your SSD you only wanted to use for your OS. Every time you start the game. Their justification for this is a link to a 2014 TheTechReport website article about how your hard drive totally won't burn out as fast as you think, guys. Also everybody should install evert game on a huge SSD and use 3rd party software these days, duh. We're doing you a favor by not making it use all that Ram you have! But they probably honest to god think they are doing good job best developers at optimizations, because of the fact that technically doubling up on the hard disk space required = marginal game FPS improvements (hopefully).. With the usual promise that save files will be shrunk down tacked onto the end (But no promises they won't be so huge they can't be cloud saved on xbone). That they also honestly think is doing a good job. But no matter how loudly they scream "Your hard drive can handle it!"... It probably won't reflect well on their company if they launch the game with some of, if not THE biggest game saves in the industry for such a small game. Even if they manage to shrink em down to 400 megs tops (down from TWO GIGS), that will be pretty  even without the fact they consider duplicating the entire save folder, screenshots and all, a feature.I mean, obviously the game will WORK. But it will be with quite a bit of strange things that give the impression the Devs are making up their whole "We've been developers for over 10 years!" spiel. "So, we hear you say you finally got optimization improved. How did you pull that off after so much time with bad performance and huge save files" "We made saves take up twice as much hard disk space!" "...I'm sorry, what?" "Your FPS went up! We did good job!" Section Z fucked around with this message at 22:29 on Aug 15, 2017 |
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Aug 15, 2017 22:04
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