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The Cheshire Cat posted:The national focus trees exist to kind of force more variation than would likely occur with just the basic game mechanics by making big dramatic shifts in national identity just a matter of completing a 70 day focus tree node. Since in the other games, those shifts are already possible by engaging with the mechanics over a longer period of time, they aren't really necessary.
I think the above would do a lot to deepen the mechanics of government in Vicky III compared to II, while still being very intuitive. It would give countries a sort of inertia too, so for example a communist revolution in a tsarist autocracy would have a harder time breaking from the authoritarian tendencies of its government than one in a country with some traditions of democracy.
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Aug 13, 2017 07:34
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Patter Song posted:Yes, Hearts of Iron takes place over a decade, not a century like Vicky or a third of a millennium like EU3 or three quarters of a millennium like CK2. The contingency in the game is supposed to be "what if the results of the war were different in way X," not "What if a fascist UK wanted to reconquer the United States" or something. There's an achievement for the UK to conquer the entire world. It's not even a particularly hard achievement. I love the game though, just wish the AI was a bit better at it. Currently their unit designs, naval strategy, and dealing with resistance are really bad, their willingness to engage in attacks they won't win is too high, and their willingness to advance into empty territory is too low.
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Aug 13, 2017 07:48
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If Vicky 3 can have an economy that makes sense, Ill declare it GOTY even if it somehow wipes my hard drive if I play it for more than 6 minutes. I love Vicky II and it is my second most played Paradox game but I still don't understand how the hell I'm supposed to manipulate the economy and I basically ignore it most of the time.
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Aug 13, 2017 09:51
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I'd like to see heads of state/government being modeled, so that different governments get a little bit of a different personality. After all, it's ineptitude of various monarchs that made turn of the century politics such an exciting affair.
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Aug 13, 2017 10:01
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What's wrong with having your government form be determined by laws which in turn you can activate when your population pressures you enough? Why does it need to be political mana instead?
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Aug 13, 2017 11:53
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Vicky does a particularly poor job of answering 'who does the player represent?' and therefore the powers you have available always seem a bit weird.
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Aug 13, 2017 13:10
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GrossMurpel posted:What's wrong with having your government form be determined by laws which in turn you can activate when your population pressures you enough? Why does it need to be political mana instead? Alchenar posted:Vicky does a particularly poor job of answering 'who does the player represent?' and therefore the powers you have available always seem a bit weird.
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Aug 13, 2017 13:27
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Alchenar posted:Vicky does a particularly poor job of answering 'who does the player represent?' and therefore the powers you have available always seem a bit weird. Are you saying us Paradox fans' power representatives wouldn't be weirdos?
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Aug 13, 2017 13:47
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Mans posted:Are you saying us Paradox fans' power representatives wouldn't be weirdos?
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Aug 13, 2017 14:04
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Constitutional Monarchies (HM's Government) ended up massively overpowered in V2 because it has all the trappings of democracy yet still lets the player arbitrarily dismiss the government and replace it with the ruling party of his/her choice. By the time royal authority diminishes to the point where HM's Government applies, royals don't just randomly dismiss governments anymore. Your people are happy because of their Universal Suffrage with Secret Ballots and Free Press and all the rest...and you just say "nope, I think the Reactionaries are going to run, sorry about your Liberal landslide."
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Aug 13, 2017 17:58
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Patter Song posted:Constitutional Monarchies (HM's Government) ended up massively overpowered in V2 because it has all the trappings of democracy yet still lets the player arbitrarily dismiss the government and replace it with the ruling party of his/her choice. By the time royal authority diminishes to the point where HM's Government applies, royals don't just randomly dismiss governments anymore. It's a shame you can't mechanically appoint the Communist party as a way for your king to sneakily abdicate the throne
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Aug 13, 2017 20:06
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Patter Song posted:Constitutional Monarchies (HM's Government) ended up massively overpowered in V2 because it has all the trappings of democracy yet still lets the player arbitrarily dismiss the government and replace it with the ruling party of his/her choice. By the time royal authority diminishes to the point where HM's Government applies, royals don't just randomly dismiss governments anymore. Doesn't appointing a ruling party cause a militancy boost in all the pops that didn't vote for them, though? It seems like it should.
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Aug 13, 2017 22:37
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The Cheshire Cat posted:Doesn't appointing a ruling party cause a militancy boost in all the pops that didn't vote for them, though? It seems like it should. Yeah it does, that's why you boost liberal popularity in elections and then put in a party that doesn't have loving laissez-faire so you can get a better economy AND reap the militancy for more reforms. Duh.
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Aug 13, 2017 22:39
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I think paradox games need less mana tbh
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Aug 13, 2017 23:30
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I have a hankering to play a mapgame about modern (at least post WW2, can be immediately post, Cold War, or 2000s) times. I've played Shadow President too many times, and I'm burnt out on its bugs. Realpolitiks is shallow and frustrating. What other options do I have? I'm okay with full games or mods of any Paradox game.
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Aug 14, 2017 02:00
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Cantorsdust posted:I have a hankering to play a mapgame about modern (at least post WW2, can be immediately post, Cold War, or 2000s) times. I've played Shadow President too many times, and I'm burnt out on its bugs. Realpolitiks is shallow and frustrating. What other options do I have? I'm okay with full games or mods of any Paradox game. If you're okay with playing a game that's complete poo poo, there's always Superpower.
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Aug 14, 2017 02:21
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Cantorsdust posted:I have a hankering to play a mapgame about modern (at least post WW2, can be immediately post, Cold War, or 2000s) times. I've played Shadow President too many times, and I'm burnt out on its bugs. Realpolitiks is shallow and frustrating. What other options do I have? I'm okay with full games or mods of any Paradox game. Soup du Jour posted:If you're okay with playing a game that's complete poo poo, there's always Superpower. I've been looking at both of these games on Steam but can't really find out a lot about them - can anyone give a detailed breakdown of how they play, and how they would compare to Paradox games?
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Aug 14, 2017 02:26
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Soup du Jour posted:If you're okay with playing a game that's complete poo poo, there's always Superpower. Yes, or Power & Revolution
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Aug 14, 2017 02:50
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I played Superpower 2 when it came out. At the time it was a looker (which is funny looking at screenshots of the interface now), but it was filled with half baked systems with easy exploits and AI that didn't know how to use them (I found a formula for infinite economic growth at like hour 2.)
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Aug 14, 2017 03:24
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The Cheshire Cat posted:I've been looking at both of these games on Steam but can't really find out a lot about them - can anyone give a detailed breakdown of how they play, and how they would compare to Paradox games? I haven't played Superpower since probably 2006, and yet even then as a middle schooler I thought it was complete garbage that didn't make sense at all. You basically play as any given nation ca 1997 and most of the game is throwing your armies at other nations in semi-realtime battles and then hope you don't gently caress up. There's trade and politics but they're so rudimentary you'd think EU2 is the Matrix.
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Aug 14, 2017 03:40
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Phi230 posted:I think paradox games need less mana tbh This
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Aug 14, 2017 20:59
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Enjoy posted:This In V3 we've done away with the confusing simulation-like systems and replaced it with extremely abstracted points for all the things you'd want more detail and control in, and added ridiculous levels of micro-management and meaningless choices to other areas of the game. Capitalists now generate capital points in relation to their percentage size of your population which spend to invest in development slots in provinces which are then filled with factories. Each country has a hand-crafted ideology tree which nicely pigeon holes them into a few pre-defined options, most of which are only any good if the countries around you take certain choices them selves and are unlocked by generating Ideology Points, which are generated based on the % of clergy in your nation because we couldn't think of something else for clergy to do and need everything to be symmetrical. Special buildings generate new Loyalty Gems which are spent on policy cards, and a new deck-building system that's replacing the confusing reforms from earlier versions, but be careful, if another country plays a card before you that card becomes more rare unless you hire special Great Person characters which allow you to "stack the deck" in a fun mini-game. Great Persons have up to 30 customizable special slots ranging from shoes to hats to medals and awards that level up their effectiveness in an exciting game of rock paper scissors (note: scissors are useless and in fact a swarm of naked leaders generates the most policy bonuses) In future DLC as we realize the game's core mechanics are kinda boring or not working as intended we'll just keep tacking on more and more forms of slowly ticking mana for you to spend on things, or sweeping changes that just change stats but don't really address the core problems.
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Aug 14, 2017 21:34
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Baronjutter posted:In V3 we've done away with the confusing simulation-like systems and replaced it with extremely abstracted points for all the things you'd want more detail and control in, and added ridiculous levels of micro-management and meaningless choices to other areas of the game. Capitalists now generate capital points in relation to their percentage size of your population which spend to invest in development slots in provinces which are then filled with factories. Each country has a hand-crafted ideology tree which nicely pigeon holes them into a few pre-defined options, most of which are only any good if the countries around you take certain choices them selves and are unlocked by generating Ideology Points, which are generated based on the % of clergy in your nation because we couldn't think of something else for clergy to do and need everything to be symmetrical. Special buildings generate new Loyalty Gems which are spent on policy cards, and a new deck-building system that's replacing the confusing reforms from earlier versions, but be careful, if another country plays a card before you that card becomes more rare unless you hire special Great Person characters which allow you to "stack the deck" in a fun mini-game. Great Persons have up to 30 customizable special slots ranging from shoes to hats to medals and awards that level up their effectiveness in an exciting game of rock paper scissors (note: scissors are useless and in fact a swarm of naked leaders generates the most policy bonuses) In future DLC as we realize the game's core mechanics are kinda boring or not working as intended we'll just keep tacking on more and more forms of slowly ticking mana for you to spend on things, or sweeping changes that just change stats but don't really address the core problems. Sold.
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Aug 14, 2017 22:20
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Phi230 posted:I think paradox games need less mana tbh I was fine with EU4 when it was just monarch points. I thought that was a solid system, really. Then they added power projection. Then they made prestige and legitimacy much more fluid and expendable. Then they added splendor. Then they added three new point pools to the Russian states. Not gonna lie, it's gotten a bit silly.
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Aug 14, 2017 22:27
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Baronjutter posted:In V3 we've done away with the confusing simulation-like systems and replaced it with extremely abstracted points for all the things you'd want more detail and control in, and added ridiculous levels of micro-management and meaningless choices to other areas of the game. Capitalists now generate capital points in relation to their percentage size of your population which spend to invest in development slots in provinces which are then filled with factories. Each country has a hand-crafted ideology tree which nicely pigeon holes them into a few pre-defined options, most of which are only any good if the countries around you take certain choices them selves and are unlocked by generating Ideology Points, which are generated based on the % of clergy in your nation because we couldn't think of something else for clergy to do and need everything to be symmetrical. Special buildings generate new Loyalty Gems which are spent on policy cards, and a new deck-building system that's replacing the confusing reforms from earlier versions, but be careful, if another country plays a card before you that card becomes more rare unless you hire special Great Person characters which allow you to "stack the deck" in a fun mini-game. Great Persons have up to 30 customizable special slots ranging from shoes to hats to medals and awards that level up their effectiveness in an exciting game of rock paper scissors (note: scissors are useless and in fact a swarm of naked leaders generates the most policy bonuses) In future DLC as we realize the game's core mechanics are kinda boring or not working as intended we'll just keep tacking on more and more forms of slowly ticking mana for you to spend on things, or sweeping changes that just change stats but don't really address the core problems. Where do I sign up?
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Aug 14, 2017 22:47
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Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:I was fine with EU4 when it was just monarch points. I thought that was a solid system, really. Then they added power projection. Then they made prestige and legitimacy much more fluid and expendable. Then they added splendor. Then they added three new point pools to the Russian states. EU4 almost sounds like an idle clicker game now.
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Aug 14, 2017 22:50
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Baronjutter posted:In V3 we've done away with the confusing simulation-like systems and replaced it with extremely abstracted points for all the things you'd want more detail and control in, and added ridiculous levels of micro-management and meaningless choices to other areas of the game. Capitalists now generate capital points in relation to their percentage size of your population which spend to invest in development slots in provinces which are then filled with factories. Each country has a hand-crafted ideology tree which nicely pigeon holes them into a few pre-defined options, most of which are only any good if the countries around you take certain choices them selves and are unlocked by generating Ideology Points, which are generated based on the % of clergy in your nation because we couldn't think of something else for clergy to do and need everything to be symmetrical. Special buildings generate new Loyalty Gems which are spent on policy cards, and a new deck-building system that's replacing the confusing reforms from earlier versions, but be careful, if another country plays a card before you that card becomes more rare unless you hire special Great Person characters which allow you to "stack the deck" in a fun mini-game. Great Persons have up to 30 customizable special slots ranging from shoes to hats to medals and awards that level up their effectiveness in an exciting game of rock paper scissors (note: scissors are useless and in fact a swarm of naked leaders generates the most policy bonuses) In future DLC as we realize the game's core mechanics are kinda boring or not working as intended we'll just keep tacking on more and more forms of slowly ticking mana for you to spend on things, or sweeping changes that just change stats but don't really address the core problems. Sounds great, where do I submit a flag design.
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Aug 14, 2017 22:53
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Funky Valentine posted:Sounds great, where do I submit a flag design. Your rear end in a top hat
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Aug 14, 2017 22:55
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I think a sphere grid (bidirection focus graph?) system might work well in a Paradox game. Like maybe Russia starts off in one part of the grid, but you could still try to tech straight into the Chinese grid section if you really wanted to (or just start the game in International Zodiac mode).
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Aug 14, 2017 23:00
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Fortuitous Bumble posted:I think a sphere grid (bidirection focus graph?) system might work well in a Paradox game. Like maybe Russia starts off in one part of the grid, but you could still try to tech straight into the Chinese grid section if you really wanted to (or just start the game in International Zodiac mode). this sounds crazy and i love it path of paradox
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Aug 14, 2017 23:14
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Fortuitous Bumble posted:I think a sphere grid (bidirection focus graph?) system might work well in a Paradox game. Like maybe Russia starts off in one part of the grid, but you could still try to tech straight into the Chinese grid section if you really wanted to (or just start the game in International Zodiac mode). Oh jesus christ if johan is paying any attention, unironically do this.
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Aug 14, 2017 23:33
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That is actually no jokes a great idea
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Aug 14, 2017 23:49
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The sphere grid was the solution HoI needed all along. How did we never notice this before?
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Aug 15, 2017 01:09
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Another good quarter for Paradox! https://www.paradoxinteractive.com/en/interim-report-january-june-2017/ Also some hints that they might announce a new game during gamescon next week.
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Aug 15, 2017 13:29
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Super Jay Mann posted:EU4 almost sounds like an idle clicker game now. It is in single-player. In MP it is a graphic Excel usersheet that you carefully curate to smash on the others players Excel sheet until only one is left standing.
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Aug 15, 2017 13:48
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ZearothK posted:It is in single-player. In MP it is a graphic Excel usersheet that you carefully curate to smash on the others players Excel sheet until only one is left standing. All while being either a backbiting, over dramatic tryhard, or being a verbally loose, babbling comedic fool. I guess you could also be good at diplomacy and session chat, but that seems less fun.
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Aug 15, 2017 13:52
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Fortuitous Bumble posted:I think a sphere grid (bidirection focus graph?) system might work well in a Paradox game. Like maybe Russia starts off in one part of the grid, but you could still try to tech straight into the Chinese grid section if you really wanted to (or just start the game in International Zodiac mode). What, you mean like in Path of Exile?? I like it! That's elegant and awesome. It gives some constraint and focus so you can do gamelike things, but doesn't pigeonhole players in a top-down fashion.
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Aug 15, 2017 14:05
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DrSunshine posted:What, you mean like in Path of Exile?? I like it! That's elegant and awesome. It gives some constraint and focus so you can do gamelike things, but doesn't pigeonhole players in a top-down fashion. It is possible to overdo it though, like in Path of Exile where the concept of a "simple, normal playthrough" doesn't exist, because every character is a Frankenstein's Monster made out of at least half a dozen different systems intersecting and the game is designed around the idea that you will be actively attempting to break it as hard as you can all the time.
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Aug 15, 2017 21:37
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i need a lovely mspaint drawing proof of concept before i can condone this idea
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Aug 15, 2017 21:56
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Aug 16, 2017 02:03
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