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I think the bottle's just an easter egg, the real point was for the whale to send us to the island where we got the bridle. You can't swim there.
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Aug 20, 2017 18:00
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Nidoking posted:I always climb up the left side of the tongue, so I know it's possible. I'm pretty sure the paths are mirrored. I don't know why it would be easier to climb one side than the other. It's still a pretty garbage series of puzzles, though, and more of the "You can go anywhere you want, but you need to do these specific things in this specific order" that started to dominate Sierra games around this time. Gonna edit this into the update.
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Aug 20, 2017 18:14
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The thing that gets me about the KQ4 "design" philosophy is that the solutions are often random. Just in this update, fishing, avoiding the shark, and finding the whale are all total crapshoots. As a normal player, why would you keep doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results?
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Aug 20, 2017 18:16
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Avoiding the shark I can see just because "go back a screen then come back right away" seems to be the general "How to avoid random deaths" method in the games anyways. But yeah, "Entity you need to interact with to win the game is RNG based" and "Important item is hidden behind the scenery and you're not told its there when you look" is bullshit of the highest caliber. When people lament the death of the old-school adventure games (IE: Pre-"Lucas Arts not killing the player for everything") I just point to poo poo like this and the "Throw the bridle at the snake" "puzzles".
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Aug 20, 2017 18:24
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dead man walking scenarios are the bane of the genre, and LucasArts did a favor by getting rid of them after Zak McCracken and the Alien Mind Benders, even obtuse puzzles are fine but being forced to start over due to not clicking the right pixel is inexcusable.
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Aug 20, 2017 18:41
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I had an aunt who owned this game. She got stuck on the whale. Couldn't figure out how to climb the tongue and just stopped playing.
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Aug 20, 2017 18:50
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Bloops Crusts posted:I had a (friend/family member) who owned this game. She got stuck on (bullshit part). Couldn't figure out how to (solve bullshit puzzle) and just stopped playing. sierra_adventure_games.txt
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Aug 20, 2017 20:04
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ulmont posted:The thing that gets me about the KQ4 "design" philosophy is that the solutions are often random. as a normal player in this time period and genre, you expect that you don't really know what to do most of the time (unlike kids today with their Quest Journals) so you wander around aimlessly going through the same screens again and again, hoping for inspiration to strike, or that some object you picked up somewhere will suddenly react when combined with some other object. Go everywhere, use everything on everything. So you'd probably find the whale eventually by accident. Fishing in most games is implemented as a crapshoot even today, and player logic suggests they wouldn't have an animation for it if it didn't do anything. The shark on the other hand requires you to be a seasoned king's quest player and know that they have a lot of these stupid random death screens so just because it showed up once doesn't mean it always will.
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Aug 20, 2017 23:07
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For some reason it's the fact that the whale has human-like teeth that makes me angry, more than anything game design related.
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Aug 21, 2017 02:19
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DoubleNegative posted:This right here is the "what the gently caress" moment. That little hint wasn't in the original, AGI, version of this game. Indeed, you had to use your psychic powers to guess that there were two items hidden on this screen. Hahaha holy poo poo, I only played this version with the hint and thought your ire was only directed at the whale tongue. That's pretty hosed up, even for Sierra adventure games.
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Aug 21, 2017 03:37
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Bregor posted:Hahaha holy poo poo, I only played this version with the hint and thought your ire was only directed at the whale tongue. That's pretty hosed up, even for Sierra adventure games. Yeah, I was unaware of the difference as well since I had the hint version, so this part never bothered me. Well, the whale tongue was pain, but it was a surmountable pain (for me at least).
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Aug 21, 2017 04:38
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This is in fact the game that taught me the world uvula. I didn't know you could type 'look' and get a description with the proper word (this game came out when I was five, so I probably wasn't older than eight or nine at the time) so I tried a lot of other nouns. The only one I remember now is 'dangling thing'. Also the human-like teeth (and human-like tongue) didn't bother me as a kid, but they sure do now. That's wrong! I remember trying 'kick teeth' as another attempt to get out that is, sadly, completely ineffective. Honestly, now I'm wondering if whales even have uvulas. Edit: They don't. This whole puzzle is a lie! Prism fucked around with this message at 04:53 on Aug 21, 2017 |
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Aug 21, 2017 04:50
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Wait, you visited the fairy godmother's island, and didn't even drop by for a chat? Rude.
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Aug 21, 2017 05:45
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there was a game based on The Black Cauldron? gently caress that must have been dire
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Aug 21, 2017 09:13
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Yeah, there was. http://disney.wikia.com/wiki/The_Black_Cauldron_(video_game)
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Aug 21, 2017 09:21
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If we can see the whale's teeth and tongue then we aren't in its stomach. We're still in its mouth.
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Aug 21, 2017 10:14
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Aces High posted:there was a game based on The Black Cauldron? gently caress that must have been dire It was...odd. Take KQ3, remove the timer and BS waiting, make it darker, and add a few more puzzles. Not the worst thing in the world in comparison to its contemporaneous brethren, but since the source material didn't exactly take off either...yeah.
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Aug 21, 2017 13:49
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OAquinas posted:It was...odd. It still had a timer, just a different one. Despite Prydain not being a desert, you needed to drink every x minutes in order to avoid dying of thirst. Same with food, but at least there was an unlimited food item close to the start of the game that didn't need to be refilled. It was also an AGI game without a parser. Instead, it had a generic "look around" hotkey, an item-selection hotkey, a "use current item" hotkey and a context-sensitive "interact"-key. The interface was remarkably progressive.
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Aug 21, 2017 14:59
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Robindaybird posted:dead man walking scenarios are the bane of the genre, and LucasArts did a favor by getting rid of them after Zak McCracken and the Alien Mind Benders, even obtuse puzzles are fine but being forced to start over due to not clicking the right pixel is inexcusable. Oh man... That game. THAT FLIPPIN' GAME. A friend and I wasted most of a summer trying to solve that one. I still get mad thinking about some of those puzzles.
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Aug 21, 2017 18:23
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Has anyone pointed out the whale's extremely human teeth and general mouth interior? 'Cause it's creepy as hell.
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Aug 21, 2017 21:14
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Walrus Pete posted:Has anyone pointed out the whale's extremely human teeth and general mouth interior? 'Cause it's creepy as hell. Whalemouth makes me think of Disney's Pinocchio, Monstro, as a probably deliberate reference
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Aug 21, 2017 23:54
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Nekomimi-Maiden posted:Whalemouth makes me think of Disney's Pinocchio, Monstro, as a probably deliberate reference A reference to a Disney movie slash fairy tale in a King's Quest game? Such a thing is unthinkable! Yeah, it's pretty deliberate.
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Aug 22, 2017 00:23
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Oh. Here I figured we'd have to randomly dig for something until we found it.
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Aug 22, 2017 01:06
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If you had to dig at least you would have found a shovel first as a clue. Hey, wait a second...
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Aug 22, 2017 02:47
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 Hello and welcome back to King's Quest IV. Today's update is gonna be a nice cool down period after last time's back to back whammies. We've got most of the stuff we need to tame the unicorn, so let's go get the piece we're missing.  The classical architecture pool is our final stop. I mentioned in the first (proper) update that there's a slight element of RNG to this screen.  >look cupid  : Baby Cupid beats his little wings furiously as he flies through the air. In his chubby hands, he carries a golden bow, and two golden arrows.>look pool : The beautiful pool is lined with tall marble columns. Its crystal clear water looks very inviting.Well, we did just climb out of the ocean... but that water... oh to hell with it. Let's go jump in.  >look cupid : Uh oh! Rosella has startled Cupid! He quickly jumps out of the pool and flies away in fear. : Cupid! You forgot your bow.: Cupid only wants to get away from here.If you fall into the pool, then the only way out is to walk to the far side of the screen. Anyway, as you've probably guessed, Cupid randomly shows up here. We need his bow to tame the unicorn, so let's go get it. >get bow  Cue wandering around for a few minutes trying to remember where the unicorn was.  >shoot unicorn  : Rosella aims one of Cupid's golden arrows toward the unicorn. She lets go of the bow string. ZING! Bull's-eye! The creature is now no longer afraid of her. It's now her friend.: Hey there, big fella.: The unicorn softly whinnies in response.>pet unicorn : Rosella gently strokes the velvety, soft nose of the unicorn. It seems as if she has made a friend!Oh man I feel bad about doing this now.  >put bridle on unicorn At least using the bridle makes sense here. : As the beautiful unicorn offers no resistance, Rosella gently places the golden bit into its mouth, and fits the bridle and reins over its majestic head. The unicorn looks at her with curiosity.>ride unicorn : Rosella nimbly mounts the magnificent creature, grabs the golden reins, and sets off toward Lolotte's castle.  : The unicorn seems paralyzed with fear at the sight of Lolotte's henchmen.   : So, I hear you were a good girl and brought me the unicorn. I'm ALMOST convinced you might be innocent after all. But...: Lolotte clears her throat and gives Rosella a smile that sends shivers down her spine.: Not quite. I am desirous of the hen that lays the golden eggs. Currently, the hen is kept by the ogre and his wife. Bring me the hen, and you shall have your freedom and a great reward! Take her away!Am I the only one picturing Marius's fate when Lolotte promises us a reward?   Originally, I was going to end the update there. But an update with 12 images and some dialogue would be short, even for this LP series. So let's just continue on.  So in a previous update, I mentioned the waterfall. This is one of two times we're going to come here. The current is so strong at the base of the waterfall that we can't get through. So we need to go back to one of the first items we got in the game. >wear crown   Yep, if we wear the little froggy crown, we can temporarily turn into a frog. Handy! Anyway, there's two items we need from around here. >look : What's this?! Why, it's a cave behind the waterfall! Rosella sees an old board lying by the cave entrance. She picks it up.The other item we need is just inside this cave here.  This is a tiny preview of what we're going to be dealing with before too long. I know a bunch of you reading this just got very mad. I know. I feel the same way. The rest of you? Just... just you wait. >look ground : Rosella sees a pile of bones by the cave entrance. Let the mysterious growls be another taste of what's to come. This cave is bad news up one side and down the other. We'll be back in a few updates to really get the full experience.  I'm going to call the update there. If I had to estimate, we're around halfway through the game around this point. So  I guess.NEXT TIME: We finish the second of Lolotte's tasks List of Points +2 - Robbed Cupid +4 - Befriended a unicorn +3 - Enslaved a unicorn +7 - Delivered a beautiful, innocent creature to pure evil +5 - The Princess Frog +2 - Old Board +2 - These old bones Total 85/230 Register of Deaths None this time!
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Aug 22, 2017 19:16
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I'm pretty sure the usual way to tame a unicorn is to have a spare virgin laying around. I hope someone at Sierra asked why Rosella, a 17 year old princess, needed a bow and arrow to capture it and was fired immediately. Yeah, I'm twelve.
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Aug 22, 2017 22:03
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Fat Samurai posted:I'm pretty sure the usual way to tame a unicorn is to have a spare virgin laying around. I hope someone at Sierra asked why Rosella, a 17 year old princess, needed a bow and arrow to capture it and was fired immediately. I don't know. Sierra being Sierra, the answer would just have been "but what would the puzzle be otherwise?" 
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Aug 22, 2017 23:22
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Seyser Koze posted:I don't know. Sierra being Sierra, the answer would just have been "but what would the puzzle be otherwise?" The sixth game has a hidden gag where there's literally a box of items that would have solved puzzles from the earlier games. Telltale did that in one of the Sam & Max episodes as well.
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Aug 22, 2017 23:31
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Fat Samurai posted:I'm pretty sure the usual way to tame a unicorn is to have a spare virgin laying around. I hope someone at Sierra asked why Rosella, a 17 year old princess, needed a bow and arrow to capture it and was fired immediately. This was also a 17-year old princess who was recently almost fed to a dragon. Who says she didn't sneak off with some buff knight the night before...
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Aug 23, 2017 02:44
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Fat Samurai posted:I'm pretty sure the usual way to tame a unicorn is to have a spare virgin laying around. I hope someone at Sierra asked why Rosella, a 17 year old princess, needed a bow and arrow to capture it and was fired immediately. There WAS a gag in the fifth Quest for Glory game where a unicorn head was one of the mounted heads on the wall of the Adventurer's Guild. The description said: "Legends say only virgins can see unicorns. You pretend you can't see it." 
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Aug 23, 2017 08:04
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Man, it looks like Roselia's drowning when she heads out the waterfall. I suppose it's the limited animation palette at work.
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Aug 24, 2017 14:37
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That's because she IS being pushed under by the water.
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Aug 25, 2017 08:06
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Man, I played these games but never really felt nostalgic about them, and seeing them with fresh eyes makes me realize why. Just utterly charmless and obtuse. At least Space Quest had a lot of character and humour to mix with its terrible puzzles.
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Aug 26, 2017 03:56
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 Hello everyone, welcome back to King's Quest IV.  We've danced around the house, we've seen it in the distance, and we've even been ambushed by one of its inhabitants once. But this is it. Like the Three Bears in the previous game, the ogre or his wife will randomly be hanging around outside. The game is nice enough to play a tune for you if they're around, so just leave and re-enter until it's safe. >look : Rosella sees a large, thatched-roofe house surrounded by forest; and it looks very formidable. It might be wise to use caution here.>knock on door : Rosella cautiously taps at the door. : JUST A MINUTE! I'M COMIN'!: With a jerk, the door opens to reveal... oh no!... the ogress! : Poor Rosella! It looks like you'll join the deer in the stew pot tonight!Getting caught past this point just gives the same death. So let's get on with it. >open door  : Watch out! A VERY unfriendly bulldog rushes toward you! : You weren't fast enough, Rosella! You were nothing but a bite-sized morsel for that big dog!>throw bone to dog This scene right here makes me glad I didn't play the AGI version. I'm not sure it's possible to type the above command fast enough. The dog starts running the second you enter the house, and if he's too close when you throw, then it's too late regardless. : Quickly, Rosella tosses the bone to the big dog who catches it in mid-air. Happy with his surprise gift, he takes it to his favorite rug, lies down, and begins to gnaw at it. He seems to have completely forgotten about the intruder.  So with the dog taken care of, we need to move relatively quickly here. The kitchen is a danger zone, the "ogress" is in there, and she's cooking dinner. So let's go upstairs instead.  We only need a single thing from up here. Everything else is just pretty set dressing. >look : Rosella has entered the ogres' upstairs bedroom where a huge bed dominates the place. In the left wall, she notices a closed door. Against the right wall, leans the ogre's axe. Rosella takes it.The look command brought up the closet, but we can't open it that I'm aware of. I've tried repeatedly to no avail.  Back downstairs, we need to hang out in the closet for a while.  The kitchen, for what it's worth. : The ogress sees Rosella! She'd like to have YOU for dinner, so you'd better run!If you get caught, you have a chance to run away. But you have to run several screens before the ogre or his wife gives up. So it's better to take the death and reload. >open door  Let's hang out for a few minutes and chill. >look : Rosella has found herself inside the ogres' small closet. For a closet, it's surprisingly empty. She notices a large keyhole under the doorknob of the closet door.You would think there'd be something to find in here, but nope. All we need to do is just chill until something happens outside. According to VDub, we're at 44:30.  45:58. The wait wasn't too bad, thankfully. Don't quote me on this, because I've never stuck around to check, but I'm pretty sure you're on a timer once you enter the house. This IS a product of 1980s Sierra, so I wouldn't be surprised. >look keyhole   : Fe, fi, fo, fum! I smell the blood of a...: Quiet, you old goat! That's just a deer you smell. You know how you get when you're hungry. Here! Eat! : Wife! Bring me my hen! : Lay!: With excitement, Rosella watches the hen lay a golden egg, which the ogre takes. He yawns, then falls asleep on the table. Soon, his snoring rattles the walls.  >open door  : The ogre is sleeping at the table. You'd better be super quiet, Rosella. >get hen I'm surprised Rosella can reach the hen on top of that gargantuan table. Anyway, since we're here... >wake ogre : Thanks for the hospitality.: That was foolish. The vicious ogre grabs Rosella and drags her toward the kitchen. As to what happesn in the kitchen, let's just say she's cordially invited to BE dinner. You might want to save your game at this point. >open door : SQUAWK! SQUAWK! SQUAWK! Uh oh, the hen has woken the ogre! The ogre will not chase you into the living forest behind his home, but he'll follow you to the other screens around the house.  While we're here, let's show these trees who's the boss. >wave axe  : The trees tremble at Rosella's might, and are frightened by her axe. They will not bother her further. We can now use these woods as a shortcut.  This is, I think, the last screen we haven't seen yet. We'll be back here in the next update. We actually want to go back one screen to the left and up, which will put is basically next to the mountain path.     The rocks on the bottom of this screen prevent us from taking a shortcut to the Bokoblin hut. This is solely to enforce the plot sequence. There's a thing in that skull we'll need, and getting it early would throw the plot flags completely out of whack. I could also be wrong, and you may be able to grab the ogre's axe from the word go. Who knows!  Let's get this over with.  : What a good girl you are! I really ought to give you your reward right now!: The evil fairy's voice is all milk and honey, gushing with praise.: She pauses for just long enough to make the moment uncomfortable.: But, I have just the tiniest bit of doubt left. If you do just ONE MORE thing for me, I'll be COMPLETELY convinced of your innocence and you'll receive a wonderful reward!: Somehow, Rosella doesn't believe her.: I want to have Pandora's Box. It is said that whoever owns it would be in possession of the purest evil.: Lolotte's crimson eyes glow with excitement.: With the power and evil of Pandora's Box, I would be UNSTOPPABLE!: Rosella realizes just how deep Lolotte's evil runs, and feels her knees go weak from sheer terror. I can't think of a way to make that work for the narration. Rosella is a pretty smart girl, so I'd like to think she would know from minute one that Lolotte was bad news, and that she shouldn't have started helping her. : I don't know the wherabouts of Pandora's Box. You must search for it yourself. Take her away!  We just have to find the origin of all evil. No pressure, right? NEXT TIME: Clotho, Lachesis, and Atropos. List of Points +4 - Dog treat +2 - You want axe? +4 - The golden goose that's really a chicken +4 - Threatened the forest and the trees +7 - Returned the hen Total 106/230 Register of Deaths Coming to Dinner x2 Making Friends with a Dog Let Sleeping Ogres Lie
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Aug 27, 2017 00:54
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Huh. Never knew you could knock on the door and get Rosella killed that way.
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Aug 27, 2017 05:49
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Aug 27, 2017 12:50
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If this had been any earlier in the series, the golden egg would be a treasure and you'd have to remember to command the hen to lay before turning it in. I'm surprised you don't have to do that, actually. It would have been a more devious way to get a golden ball than "it's hidden under a bridge, you gotta use them eyes Rosella".
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Aug 27, 2017 13:01
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Nidoking posted:If this had been any earlier in the series, the golden egg would be a treasure and you'd have to remember to command the hen to lay before turning it in. I would be ok with that if the gold egg was just for points.
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Aug 27, 2017 16:21
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I believe that if you enter the Skull Cave before you're ordered to retrieve Pandora's Box, it'll simply be empty and there won't be anything to do there.
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Aug 27, 2017 17:23
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What's the ogre even want golden eggs for? Is there a shady merchant who trades with anyone, even ogres?
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Aug 28, 2017 03:37
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