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just another posted:This is such a nice and oft-repeated sentiment with such an ugly solipsism behind it. Hey, I'm just saying it's possible to look at it that way, not that I do. Although, I'm not quite sure how considering a series as the original creator intended is solipsistic. It's even possible to like new Star Wars stuff without it disrupting your particular idea of the series or the author's idea. Basically I'm saying cannon as a concept is bullshit and it's OK to look at works or a series of works in whatever way you derive the most enjoyment of it.
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Sep 15, 2017 20:35
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Huzanko posted:Basically I'm saying cannon as a concept is bullshit and it's OK to look at works or a series of works in whatever way you derive the most enjoyment of it. I can only enjoy something if it is created by the current legal owner of the copyright as decided and enforced by the government and court system of the nation-state wherein I maintain citizenship. If a work is in a legal grey area concerning copyright I am physically incapable of having an opinion on it.
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Sep 15, 2017 20:58
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galagazombie posted:I can only enjoy something if it is created by the current legal owner of the copyright as decided and enforced by the government and court system of the nation-state wherein I maintain citizenship. If a work is in a legal grey area concerning copyright I am physically incapable of having an opinion on it.
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Sep 15, 2017 21:31
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Headcanon is mocked because it's bringing something which only pertains to copyright law and brand management into your own thought process. It's not silly because shared enjoyment of media is dependent on corporate sponsorship.
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Sep 15, 2017 21:42
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euphronius posted:Vader is not her father . Bail Organa is.
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Sep 15, 2017 21:42
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Vader may have been her father. But he was never her daddy. Wait, that sounds weird here.
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Sep 15, 2017 21:49
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https://twitter.com/raecarson/status/908356525982281728 Screw whether or not Ahsoka lives, I'm just glad to see my droid Skippy again
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Sep 15, 2017 22:26
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Vinylshadow posted:https://twitter.com/raecarson/status/908356525982281728 Wasn't there a comic about this? Also, he loved Big Brother.
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Sep 15, 2017 22:52
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There was an Infinities comic where R5-D4 was Skippy the Jedi Droid, who sacrificed himself to get R2-D2 where he needed to go
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Sep 15, 2017 22:57
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So they're rebooting Tales from Jabba's Palace? Nu EU is the exact same as old EU.
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Sep 15, 2017 23:10
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To be truly enlightened is to recognize that Canon is an illusion, a state of No-Canon. Headcanon is simply making another illusion for yourself.
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Sep 15, 2017 23:16
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That's right boys, JJ Abrams is here.
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Sep 15, 2017 23:27
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Headcanon as the process of picking and choosing which parts of the film you agree with is one of the easiest ways to massively miss the point of all your "favourite" movies.
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Sep 15, 2017 23:31
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Headcanon means dubious inferences from text. It can be fun.
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Sep 15, 2017 23:41
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People into headcannon should build a fanbase on fanfiction.net and then change the names and occupations and write a new version and make some real cheese.
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Sep 16, 2017 00:37
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Hence why my headcanons take bits and pieces from the parts of the Expanded Universe nobody reads - such as movie novelizations - to make my experience a better one Or, in other words: coming to obvious conclusions that the movie doesn't ever point out because it hopes that the audience is not that dense With how many people claim that Rey is a Mary Sue (despite not even fitting the meaning of the word) the movie overestimated the intelligence of most of the people watching it *shrug* Oh well, to each their own, and all that entails
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Sep 16, 2017 03:55
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Mr President posted:Star Wars has fantasy elements but it still generally follows like real world rules and logic. 
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Sep 16, 2017 04:30
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To be fair, Darth Vader generally acts in a way that follows a logical thread that makes some honest sense which in contrast to say, The Force Awakens, feels relatable in comparison to shooting up some grounded X-Wing and gunning down a bunch of villagers. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h6sj89xgnl4 In one of the most iconic scenes of all of cinematic history, our great villain is actually begging our protagonist at his weakest point for aid to overthrow the Emperor of the entire galaxy, the Sith Lord that gave him all of his power. He's playing to his son's logic and reason, as well as his emotional side, begging him to join at his side, begging Luke to not throw his potential away in order to end this senseless conflict, and bring order to the galaxy. It's basically Shakespearean, in the levels of emotional complexity compared to... uhhh... that scene where Rey learns Jedi Mind Tricks from her brother(maybe?) trying to Jedi Mind Trick her. Taintrunner fucked around with this message at 06:29 on Sep 16, 2017 |
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Sep 16, 2017 06:26
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Did the Porg planet get destroyed in TFA?
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Sep 16, 2017 14:39
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After 8 terrible Star Wars movies I'm really hoping that The Last Jedi will be good.
UmOk fucked around with this message at 17:12 on Sep 16, 2017 |
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Sep 16, 2017 15:49
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I just don't understand when film nerds went from complaining about sequels for being cynical cash grabs that destroy developments and themes from earlier movies to uncritically accepting anything done in the name of more content from their favorite franchise. I thought people liked the original characters and story, why do they need to be carted out for a boring rehash that only makes the originals seem almost meaningless to the world they created?
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Sep 16, 2017 16:25
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Beeez posted:I just don't understand when film nerds went from complaining about sequels for being cynical cash grabs that destroy developments and themes from earlier movies to uncritically accepting anything done in the name of more content from their favorite franchise. I thought people liked the original characters and story, why do they need to be carted out for a boring rehash that only makes the originals seem almost meaningless to the world they created? It's entirely possible you were hearing different people. Franchise nerds accepting every sequel as being great have been around forever. My friend in high school loving loved Star Trek Insurrection when it came out, and wouldn't listen to any criticism of it. Basically, film nerds do not necessarily equal franchise fans. And some people can make exceptions for "their franchise".
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Sep 16, 2017 17:16
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Taintrunner posted:To be fair, Darth Vader generally acts in a way that follows a logical thread that makes some honest sense which in contrast to say, The Force Awakens, feels relatable in comparison to shooting up some grounded X-Wing and gunning down a bunch of villagers. Also amazing because of the payoff in Jedi. Vader realizes it's "too late for him," but instead of having Luke join him to overthrow the Emperor, he joins Luke, it's awesome. Jedi is a film I want to love so badly, it has so much cool stuff in it but everything on Endor is lame until the Ewoks get the upper hand in the battle. Like I don't even have a problem with the Ewoks themselves, their village is cool looking, and their traps are super effective but that's just good visual shorthand for them knowing their way around their own world compared to everyone else. Just the film grinds to such a screeching halt when the Rebels meet up with them proper. Especially after the speeder chase. The speeder chase is short but is one of the most perfectly made sequences ever in any movie and is incredible even down to the sound effects. It's a really small conflict, just Luke and Leia chasing down a small group of storm troopers but the stakes are huge and everyone is super desperate throughout it, and each storm trooper gets brutally owned but it cuts back to another part of the chase quickly each time, it's flawless. Like to go from that to our heroes just hanging around chatting with 3PO about talking to folks for what feels like forever, ugh.
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Sep 16, 2017 17:30
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Neo Rasa posted:Also amazing because of the payoff in Jedi. Vader realizes it's "too late for him," but instead of having Luke join him to overthrow the Emperor, he joins Luke, it's awesome. One thing I don't like about the ST so far is how pathetic Kylo Ren is as a villain. He's nothing but a caricature of a pouting, millennial hipster (Adam Driver, are you loving serious?). With Vader, we were in awe of him; which made his final confrontation with Luke in ROTJ emotionally moving as well as his redemption. It looks like TLJ is going to be a spiritual clone of Empire just like TFA is of ANH, and I don't see how a weird looking kid like Adam Driver can pull this off.
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Sep 16, 2017 19:41
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Kylo Ren is the best thing about TFA. He is representative of nerdy Star Wars fans who really don't get Star Wars. He is also in "awe" of Vader.
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Sep 16, 2017 19:48
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UmOk posted:Kylo Ren is the best thing about TFA. He is representative of nerdy Star Wars fans who really don't get Star Wars. He is also in "awe" of Vader. Oh man, I can't wait to hear your explanation of how to "get" Star Wars. 
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Sep 16, 2017 19:56
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in what ways is ren 'millenial' or 'hipster' besides being a young man kylo ren is the one interesting character in tfa specifically because he's pathetic, the force allows him to wield his self-hatred and inferiority like a weapon and that's not something i've seen in a star wars thing before, it's a novel spin on what kind of person the sith philosophy can turn you into
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Sep 16, 2017 19:58
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I think Kylo is an interesting character concept, but like a lot of things in TFA, there's too little information for us to understand what made him the way he is, and that makes it frustrating to interpret what happens in the movie.
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Sep 16, 2017 20:00
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the rawest moment in tfa isn't starkiller base blowing up some no-name planets and it's not the stormtrooper with the cool weapon, it's when kylo ren starts punching at his own bowcaster wound mid-fight to invigorate himself
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Sep 16, 2017 20:00
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Kylo Ren murders a village to further his pilgrimage, works alongside an authoritarian government, is party to a terrorist attack, and proselytizes his faith to his peer. Those aren't the traits of a millennial or a Star Wars fan (OK, maybe that last one). Those are the traits of a radicalized religious extremist.
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Sep 16, 2017 20:12
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I'll just wait for the Prequel Sequel Trilogy that covers Ben's fall, Rey's birth, and the destruction of the Empire and Luke's Jedi Order
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Sep 16, 2017 20:13
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Kylo Ren is interesting and unexpected and he's one of my favorite things about the sequel trilogy to date. The film does sort of invite that audience-meta-commentary reading in which he's The Bad Fan because of its themes of nostalgia, true, but that's only one way of looking at it, and not, I think, a very good one. Here we have someone who idolizes Darth Vader. He's trying to follow in his imagined footsteps, and stumbling, because he doesn't know the whole story. He's like his uncle in that regard, emulating his image of Anakin. To him, Vader is someone who chose to be that way, a man of irresistible power who nearly saved the galaxy from itself. (Recall Vader wished to "bring order to the galaxy," consistent with Anakin's own idealism being centered on desiring a benevolent dictatorship.) If Anakin could choose that path, he thinks, why cannot his grandson, only this time not stray from it? So he learns the ways of the Dark Side and the power of hate, he entombs his old life behind a death-mask, he joins with the faction that would destroy the heirs of Vader's enemies. And he trains himself to resist the temptation that Vader succumbed to, trains himself to not give in to his love. This turns Palpatine from a man into an elemental force. Vader dedicated himself not to the particular Sith Lord sitting in the Supreme Chancellor's office, but to Evil, and his love for Luke, rather than finally freeing him from bondage, is what caused him to renounce his devotion. It echoes Milton's Satan a bit: quote:So farewell hope, and with hope farewell fear, Ben Solo's interpretation of whole Anakin situation is made "from a certain point of view," and is as incomplete and misleading as that of his namesake. It's like poetry, it rhymes.
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Sep 16, 2017 20:28
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Schwarzwald posted:Kylo Ren murders a village to further his pilgrimage, works alongside an authoritarian government, is party to a terrorist attack, and proselytizes his faith to his peer. TFA has amazingly muddled storytelling. Rey spent ~15 years in near-total ignorance, working as a low-level serf on a garbage planet, and then fans conclude that she represents a suburban teen in tune with pop culture. She found a fighter pilot's helmet in the garbage, which means she watches lots of sci-fi fantasy movies...? This isn't entirely their fault; they are left with little recourse but to go 'meta': it's just a movie. Movies represent movies. Rey is not actually poor because she is a character in a movie. Her life is a fun simulation.
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Sep 16, 2017 20:30
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Yeah, I actually think Kylo is one of the only interesting characters in the new trilogy thus far(though I think any of the characters except maybe Snoke and Maz have the potential to become interesting) because the idea of someone for whom embracing their dark side isn't easy is interesting in comparison to how the dark side stuff was depicted in other Star Wars media. However, the "TFA is all about the nerds I like fighting the nerds that are bad" take is such a boring reading that only makes the film even less interesting.
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Sep 16, 2017 20:47
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Brother Entropy posted:the rawest moment in tfa isn't starkiller base blowing up some no-name planets and it's not the stormtrooper with the cool weapon, it's when kylo ren starts punching at his own bowcaster wound mid-fight to invigorate himself Didn't Driver improvise that?
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Sep 16, 2017 20:57
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Mr. Funny Pants posted:Didn't Driver improvise that? i hadn't heard that but i could easily believe it, it's a good character beat without any expository dialog accompanying it in a movie with very few of those
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Sep 16, 2017 21:01
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Descriptions of Ren as a 'millenial' are referencing Adam Driver's breakout role in Girls, the seminal millennial sitcom.
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Sep 16, 2017 21:02
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RedSpider posted:Oh man, I can't wait to hear your explanation of how to "get" Star Wars. You start by not being in awe of a known child killer and space Nazi, like Kylo.
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Sep 16, 2017 21:18
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SuperMechagodzilla posted:TFA has amazingly muddled storytelling. Rey spent ~15 years in near-total ignorance, working as a low-level serf on a garbage planet, and then fans conclude that she represents a suburban teen in tune with pop culture. She found a fighter pilot's helmet in the garbage, which means she watches lots of sci-fi fantasy movies...? I don't recall anyone using the word "suburban" to describe Rey.
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Sep 16, 2017 21:36
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sassassin posted:I don't recall anyone using the word "suburban" to describe Rey. not explicitly but bringing up that rey had nothing near a modern first-world childhood underlines how half-thought the whole 'the bad guys are the bad fans and the good guys are the good fans' talk is
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Sep 16, 2017 21:42
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